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roots

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Everything posted by roots

  1. roots
    It would certainly help, but I think the issue is more deeply ingrained than just the abruptness of the ending. It depends. I think it's definitely possible to weave in meta-commentary, but it needs to defer to the conventional narrative. Don't get me wrong, it's not that I think it's impossible to deliver a meta-commentary in a game, or that there is an intrinsic issue with the specific commentary in RTMI. My issue is that the game assigns priority to the meta-commentary to (in my opinion) the detriment of the conventional narrative. I say there was no journey for me because I never found myself particularly immersed in the narrative. Rather than exploring a world and the story that ties it, I felt dragged along through a series of lectures about something that never applied to me in the first place. (Obsession with "the secret") Again, I don't think the themes that RTMI explores are intrinsically problematic. But I do think that had the game been more focused in its themes, and allowed the messaging to take both a subtler and appropriate second place to the conventional narrative, it wouldn't have been an issue for me. The best analogy I can think of is how the anachronistic elements in MI1/2 are brought into focus by MI2's end; they were always there, but are entirely recontextualised afterwards.
  2. roots
    Technically neither. I'm referring to the games themselves. RTMI didn't feel like a Monkey Island game to me, it felt like a commentary on them above all else.
  3. roots
    That is my problem. RTMI is a meta-commentary on the franchise, to the extent it leaves the conventional narrative as little more than a vehicle to carry said meta-commentary. My issue isn't that the "the secret" was underwhelming, or that it doesn't tie up every loose end. I'm well aware of the value of maintaining some basic level of mystery within a setting. My issue is that there is no journey. What I wanted from RTMI was more Monkey Island. Not commentary on Monkey Island.
  4. roots
    As someone that also struggles with severe anxiety I fully appreciate how you feel. I spend a lot of time thinking about games because my issues constrain my life, and thinking about games is preferable to the alternative. In part it is probably a non-trivial portion of why RTMI frustrates me so much.
  5. roots
    It's the intrinsic flaw of endings that are intentionally laid open in this manner. From a dev perspective I can see how it might seem like the benevolent move; you're graciously allowing the people to make up their own mind on what happens. But I think the reality of such an approach is it just leaves people feeling unfulfilled. People want to see the author's take on the story, and RTMI robs the player of that due to how insubstantial it is in terms of conventional narrative.
  6. roots
    I think you misinterpreted my post. The reason I say the eyes pose a problem is because I was spinning my own narrative that the park we see in RTMI is the product of a curse by Big Whoop itself, rather than going down a path of assuming that LeChuck's own curse attempt was successful. Meaning that both Guybrush and LeChuck are trapped by it, and are equally helpless. It was a exercise to brainstorm a take on events that fits RTMI in the tone of MI2's ending, regardless of RTMI clearly taking it's own direction.
  7. roots
    My current pastime is trying to figure out how best to work RTMI into a canon where MI2's ending takes narrative precedence. Chuckie's eyes at the end of MI2 pose a little bit of an issue, but the rough notion that RTMI is the product of a "Curse of Big Whoop" that has ensorcelled both Guybrush and LeChuck (And potentially Elaine) equally is an interesting one. A curse that messes with the mind to the extent that it not only convinces you you're someone you're not, but that you're your own son and reality is the fantasy is particularly hellish.
  8. roots
    I wonder if it's less a case of difficulty and more a case of RTMI lacking equivalents to certain non-American vexing pumps, or even infamous goats. Qualifying as difficult in terms of puzzles makes me think of something like Riven.
  9. roots
    I think given the themes of RTMI's metanarrative, in my opinion it would be better if any prospective new MI games be they official or fangame explicitly choose to *not* be deferential to the other games in the series. Which is to say, RTMI should be interpreted as the opening of the "Monkey Island Multiverse". No more central linear timeline or canon. Do you have a compelling interpretation of the franchise and the resources to make a game? Then have at it! There is a lot of latent narrative potential within the franchise that shouldn't be allowed to go to waste.
  10. roots
    One particularly dark interpretation of MI2's end that I've been quite fond of is that the world of MI is a catatonic delusion created as a result of a severe childhood trauma, namely Guybrush witnessing the murder of his parents at a theme park. Stemming from the presence of the skeletons and the reference to "murderers and ne'er do wells". There is something oddly compelling about the comedic taking a dark twist.
  11. roots
    To speak of a meta is very apt. Every forum has one, but Reddit's is particularly toxic and prone to extremes due to the voting system. It's a fascinating topic, particularly if we contrast against a forum such as this, given the smaller and more insular nature, the closer dev relationships at the top etc. But I won't derail further. While describing it as "teehee" was admittedly a little hyperbolic, I personally didn't get the impression that Elaine was especially bothered by what Guybrush had done (contrary to appearances in the cutaways) despite the impact of his actions both individually and as a whole. Guybrush's continuing obsession with the Secret at that point also made him seem insincere. I don't think this is particularly helped by the break in continuity and reality that the ending brings. We see the "destination" with an "enlightened" Guybrush, but the "journey" is missing contrary to the prevailing theme. It just doesn't really add up for me.
  12. roots
    Reddit doesn't intrinsically give preference to either side of the dichotomy. Rather the prevailing opinion will reign and contrary viewpoints will be downvoted into oblivion. I've seen subreddits go from castigating the mildest criticism to essentially de facto outlawing the slightest expression of positivity. The "screw the megathread, MY opinion is Sooooo special it needs it's own thread" behaviour is a separate phenomena. (Megathreads do suck on Reddit admittedly, they really only work on these kinds of forums) The cutaways in the leadup actually gave me a lurching sense of foreboding that things were heading into a temporary mini-break of the relationship, it was a little perplexing when it culminated in Elaine essentially going "oh guybrush you're so silly teehee", particularly given Elaine's strong-willed and socially minded characterisation. I presume the intent is that Elaine is the sole "real" person that we encounter throughout the game, and she's not bothered by Guybrush's trail of destruction as everything else is cutouts and imagination. But again that feels iffy to me.
  13. roots
    The TWP take could just be me to be fair, I don't disagree with what you say about the game. Some of the not-lucasarts references felt rather self-congratulatory to me, but admittedly it's been some time since I've paid the game any heed. The codewheel was a cute touch, and on reflection I think you've hit the nail on the head for what in particular jars me - it's the lampshading of callbacks in general, particularly when there is a lot of them. The moments that really jarred for me was the shipyard, and the aforementioned Sea Monkey - which while arguably appropriate in context felt still obnoxious to me in the moment. I get what you're saying, but it feels like a cop out to me all the same. I absolutely agree that nostalgia as a theme plays a large role in the metanarrative, but it shouldn't (in my opinion) come at cost to the actual narrative.
  14. roots
    I would agree that it is relatively more restrained than TWP, but I think the big difference between the two is that RTMI's nostalgia is more germane to the player. The target of TWP's nostalgia is more of a broad concept, and feels like it's more its creator's nostalgia, rather than the player's. (And stands out more as a result)
  15. roots
    My issue wasn't the inclusion of nostalgia so much as the overbearing/unsubtle way it was leveraged. I'll grant that something like the Sea Monkey was a fitting use of it, but elsewhere it felt more like my copy of the game had a memberberries infestation.
  16. roots
    Yeah, I feel more or less the same. The meta-commentary repeatedly ruins any sense of immersion that started to build for me, and the ending is a perfect microcosm of that.
  17. roots
    Did anyone else feel the nostalgia-baiting was incredibly obnoxious and overdone in RTMI? I played the original game as a child back in the day, and still felt beaten over the head with the overt callouts.
  18. roots
    This principle is a lot more far reaching than many realise. It applies universally, and is the reason why many older games have an impact that modern high-budget Triple-A games do not. Less is more, purely because there is a greater interface with the player's imagination which customises the experience. Unfortunately, the common response is nostalgia/rose-tinted glasses strawmen.
  19. roots
    On the topic of music, a very niché iMUSE-related curiosity I've noticed: The Dinky beach theme has two layers, the base which plays all the time and an extra layer that doesn't activate until after Guybrush has stood up post initial arrival. The part where this becomes a curiosity is that the rendition of the Dinky beach theme in the Special Edition was composed without the extra layer, similarly the various soundtrack compilations on youtube also lack the extra layer.
  20. roots
    Realistically seeing it in motion was only ever going to tip people that were on the edge. For those that dislike the art, it's a fundamental issue rather than a superficial one. I think it's fair to say it is a very polarising artstyle, and in a way that is a very fitting with the franchise's legacy.
  21. roots
    Some wild kneejerk speculation based on the new blerb on the Steam page. RTMI takes place exclusively within the "Dimension of Infinite Pain" that LeChuck was supposedly trying to send Guybrush to in MI2's ending sequence. The eponymous "infinite pain" not being so much one of physical torture and mutilation, but an insidious psychological torture of trapping the person in a world where they're at rock bottom, as the blerb says "adrift and unfulfilled".
  22. roots
    A narrative with timeskips which needs to recap all the other games in the series seems like it'd be an utter nightmare to write without contravening the stated goal of not explicitly contradicting or de-canonising the games post-MI2. It also feels like it'd potentially make for a really exclusionary game for casual fans that aren't heavily invested in the series as a whole. Seems unlikely to me after the criticism that was levelled at TWP for being heavy-handed with in-jokes and references.
  23. roots
    If by legitimacy you mean something like "Ron wasn't involved so it's not a real MI game" then I would absolutely agree, I'm not concerned with who made what. But I do strongly feel that Curse is a a very literal interpretation of the previous games that misses out on the elements that make the first two games rise above for me. (Credit where it's due, EMI came pretty close with the Mysts o'Tyme)
  24. roots
    Unsure if this is an unpopular or more of a factional opinion but... I personally view the games that followed MI2 as being the skin of the series draped over new bones. Curse took the series at face value and went down a very literal path that completely missed out on the sense of mystery and exploration the original 2 have. I don't think Curse is a bad game in a vacuum, but I do think it's a bad Monkey Island game. Exceptions being the VO and Murray.
  25. roots
    Seems a little strange to be fearful of some ephemeral copyright risk where it doesn't really apply, while ScummVM distribute copy protection circumventions, regardless of any "reasonable justifications" that would be unlikely to hold up legally. That aside, it's strange but I honestly find myself preferring the originals here. I don't know if it's a matter of contextualisation (i.e. chunky UI) or simply a preference for the more saturated and lower fidelity representation. The go to response would probably be to put it down to nostalgia, but given the roaring success of games like Undertale I'm not so sure.
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