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Revan or the Jedi counsel, who's right?


Aristotélēsticus
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Well I think that Revan was right coz if he didn’t act quickly to the Mandalorians attack the Order would be vanished and so is the republic, yes the Jedi were right when they saw something dangerous beyond the Mandalorians which is reveal to be Revan him self as the Dark lord of the sith but Revan saw beyond all this, he saw the true danger of the real sith and he wanted to deal with this matter but he was corrupted by the dark side before he do this. In the end I do believe that Revan's decision was right, just think of it: if he didn’t choose to fight we wouldn’t play Kotor.

 

So what about you?

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I have to disagree i think the council was right. They was going to help but they did only ask for some time from the republic. But Revan then goes out and act as soon as the republic plees for help. I think that if revan wasn't so impulsive the war would have ended with less death and the jedi civil war never would have happened.

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It is a question to which you cannot know the answer because it contains the "What if" equation.

I personally feel that Revan was right to do what he did. Perhaps not the way he did it, but the fact that he had the sack to step up and be the Jedi everyone expects them to be and save the galaxy from impending doom. His methods sucked, but his original intent was well founded.

 

Had he not found the star maps and the Star forge, I dont think things would have been as bad as they were. But I think its what he discovered that also prompted him to put things into motion. A reason behind the Mandalorians going to war. If he had shared this knowledge with the council they may have acted sooner, but he kept it to himself because he knew that what he was researching was considered taboo and off limits to Jedi. He would have been exiled had they known. But had he known, he wouldnt have fallen to the darkside.

 

All of this of course means little, because the Force has its own will and uses force sensetives to carry out its will. Thus I don't think everyone really had much of a choice in the matter. Yes they had a choice, just not much of one.

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Originally posted by Boba Rhett

But all the options weren't undesirable to them. They were perfectly happy with sitting on their hands.

 

The Republic would have been lost if not for the fast action of the few that went to help.

 

 

I was speaking specifically from the perspective of the exile. She had two choices - do nothing, and watch the Mandalorians destroy the galaxy, or defy the Jedi Council.. neither option seems particularily desireable, do you not agree?

 

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Originally posted by Boba Rhett

Yoda wanted Luke to let his friends die too. Yoda's an evil evil midget who should have been smothered in his sleep by the ghost of Kreia. :(

 

XD

 

Sorry I just HAD to respond to that. :D

 

I'm rushed as I write, but simply put, Revan was right, I support him all the way.

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Originally posted by Korfredonn

Well I think that Revan was right coz if he didn’t act quickly to the Mandalorians attack the Order would be vanished and so is the republic, yes the Jedi were right when they saw something dangerous beyond the Mandalorians which is reveal to be Revan him self as the Dark lord of the sith but Revan saw beyond all this, he saw the true danger of the real sith and he wanted to deal with this matter but he was corrupted by the dark side before he do this. In the end I do believe that Revan's decision was right, just think of it: if he didn’t choose to fight we wouldn’t play Kotor.

 

So what about you?

 

First off: Type more slowly, it helps when you try to comprehend what you typed.

 

But no, Revan was not right. The Jedi could have taken care of the mandalorians easily when they decided to go into the war.

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Revan made the correct decision. The Jedi Council has been known for being indecisive because they are too uncertain--not because they know bad things will happen. They feel that any uncertainty is dangerous, but they are not mature enough to realize that there will always be uncertainty.

 

Revan's crusade could have gone perfectly--as we hear from Juhani, it did in the first game. The problem was when...

 

Revan decided that he had to bring down the Jedi Order, for yet unknown motives

 

 

...then it was the beginning of the end. The Jedi mistakenly believe that all those Jedi fell because of the war itself.

 

No. It was strictly by Revan's design.

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Well I think that Revan was right coz if he didn’t act quickly to the Mandalorians attack the Order would be vanished and so is the republic, yes the Jedi were right when they saw something dangerous beyond the Mandalorians which is reveal to be Revan him self as the Dark lord of the sith but Revan saw beyond all this, he saw the true danger of the real sith and he wanted to deal with this matter but he was corrupted by the dark side before he do this. In the end I do believe that Revan's decision was right, just think of it: if he didn’t choose to fight we wouldn’t play Kotor.
I dont think you understand the big picture.

 

 

Revan was manipulating everyone.Revan used the mandalorian war to corrupt young jedi.Revan used HK 47 to assasinate jedi who he didnt think could be corrupted.

 

and

Revan wasnt really evil.He needed to strengthen the republic to prepare for the true sith.Revan knew that the jedi in their current form would be no match for the sith,so he taught them sith ideals,inorder to make them warriors.

and then he went through the plot line of kotor.

Soon after his victory over the republic (or the sith)he recoverd a large chunk of his memory.Revan instructed Bastilla to look after his army,and flew out to space with T3 to bolster his forces in preparation for the sith empire,but something goes wrong so T3 flys the ebon hawk back to korriban to find bastilla,but she already left to find revan,so T3 goes to find the exile,and thats how kotor 2 starts

So um yeah Revan was right.

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Revan vs the Jedi Council

 

Both were right but if anything, most of the fault falls on the Council.

 

Here's my take on it:

 

Saying the Mandalorians were whipping the Republic badly is a huge understatement. For anyone that knows military history, it's probably like the opening of Operation Barbarossa x3 on a galactic scale.

 

The Republic was dying by the millions. "Cities turned into glass" and whole planets being lost. The Republic was desperate and needed the Jedi Order more than ever before. It was practically begging for their assistance. The troops were wondering where in the heck the Jedi were. While the Council debated the Republic was down on its knees with the Mandalorians raising their swords for the final swing.

 

Only the actions of Revan and the Jedi joining him (which included the soon-to-be-exile) saved the Republic from a quick doom.

 

However, the Council was right in believing that there was a hidden threat from the invading Mandalorians. Caution was warranted, yes.

 

But what good would any Jedi investigations/inquiries have been if the Mandalorian forces are bombarding and invading Coruscant?

 

Like I said, both sides were right, but the Council was too black in white in their nice and tidy buildings in Coruscant.

 

What they should have done, even WITHOUT hindsight is this:

 

* Organize a detachment of Jedi to be led by maybe a small group of Masters to aid the Republic military.

 

* The Jedi Council will hold back whatever number of Jedi it needs as a reserve to investigate the hidden threat and to act upon it.

 

As Mace Windu said in AotC, the Jedi are "peacekeepers, not soldiers." But the Jedi were also pledged to protect the Republic. A duty they chose to neglect when the Republic was on the verge of collapse from the Mandalorian invasion :fett:

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We also know that Revan's crusade was used as an excuse to turn people to his side. Combined with what we know of the Mandalorians being coerced to invade by an outside power...

 

...that brings several interesting possibilities to mind, doesn't it?

 

The Council was fooled completely: those pawns.

 

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Originally posted by Anasazi

Who cares, I was hoping for a Mandalorian victory all along...:D

 

 

 

I really liked how KOTORII gave us a chance, even as a Light Side character, to work with the Mandalorians. I like the Mandalorians, but they were on the wrong side of the Republic many times.

 

The moments in KOTORII where the elite Mandalorian troops were fighting a common enemy with a Jedi alongside them kicked alot of ***! Best of both worlds!

 

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revan was right. And as revealed in the plotline of KOTOR, he still had good in him enough for the playable character to make a choice, even after he found out his identity. he wasn't some crazy leader hell bent on the destruction of the jedi and the republic but he was more concerned about reorginizing, reforming, and reestablishing the order and republic. his decision may not have been the best but his intentions were for the benefit of the galaxy.(or so he thought). but i believe that the bad link in the chain was malak and his overzelous takeover of all that revan had built and planned and turning it into to a much worst scenario.

 

on a sidenote, the whole meaning behind the genahoradan(sp) (bounty hunting guild) from KOTOR was a little odd, i can't make a decision on whether it was good or bad. any opinions?

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Another thing I want to add.

 

 

I beat the game with my first character recently... wasn't a flawless run, though.

 

I beat it as a Light Side Jedi Weapon Master.

 

Like I said in my earlier reply, both sides were right, but the Council's decision was deeply flawed.

 

I haven't seen the Dark Side ending, but close to the end when the Exile meets with the 3 Jedi Masters and is being punished, Kreia interrupts and lays some serious law down.

 

When she was done with her great set of lines, you realize just how screwed up the Jedi Council was. The only one worth anything was Master Kavar, but even he was against the Exile in the end.

 

The Jedi Council from the Mandalorian Wars and the Jedi Civil War (which was pretty much the same throughout) saw things in black & white and was much too inflexible. Even the screwed Jedi Council from the Star Wars prequels/Late Republic/Clone Wars era wasn't this indecisive (the Senate was corrupt and indecisive). Master Yoda, though he really tried to avoid war, dealt with it and didn't hide from it when war finally found him, the Order, and the Republic.

 

The Jedi Order rightly got what it deserved in KOTORII, IMO. With the good ending, the Order was reborn with the new, true Jedi.

 

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i believe Revan was right ,the jedi council would sacrifice a lot of worlds so that the darkness they felt would not be unleashed Revan disbanded the mandalorians and ended the biggest threat to the galaxy, except the sith, but also uncovered his dark side but Revan could control his dark side and under his rule the galaxy would be balanced centralized and the dark side would rule but not destroy. the true human nature is dark so it be all right

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The Jedi would argue that they try to combat this human nature.

 

Of course, Revan saw it as their great failing.

 

An interesting thing that the Council failed to consider was this: was not the rising death, misery, and destruction caused by the Mandalorians of the Dark Side as well? Were they not letting evil spread?

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To add again:

 

If the Jedi Council sent a detachment of Jedi, led by a Master or two, they could have drastically lessened the likeliness of the Jedi Civil War.

 

Their Jedi could maintain contact with the Council. There would be more Masters around at the frontlines to lend guidance to the younger Jedi who are facing war.

 

Instead, the Council cast out every Jedi who left for the Mandalorian Wars. With the war over and the participating Jedi cast out, what were they supposed to do?

 

The Jedi Council did this:

You have sprained your ankle. Do you:

a) Nurture it back to health.

or

b) Cut it off.

 

Take a wild guess what the Jedi Council did! They deserved everything they got in KOTORII.

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