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Remove Artillery from Game


{DHU}Screed
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The only thing I find myself having trouble with is Artillery in space and ground campaigns. In space, the ability to hit your space station with enormous destructive capability from all the way on the other side of the map is rediculous. Same goes when you are attacking that space station. To just send in Tie scouts and have 4-5 Broadside cruisers bombard the hell out of the station w/o ever worrying about a reprisal is rediculous.

 

Sure you can rush some fighters in to kill the missile frigates, but all you need to do is have 3 Tartan or Corellian Corvettes sitting around them with just one ISD to ward off the bigger capital ships. The fact is, the attacker or defender with alot of Broadside Cruisers can completely dominate the map w/o ever worrying about losses.

 

Now for ground campaigns, Artillery is ungodly. There isn't a single unit in the game that can stand a chance against 5-6 Artillery pieces. Your only hope is to bomb the hell out of them or rush in alot of units and take MASSIVE losses. I know when I do a ground assault and see the enemy has artillery, I basically play a very long and BORING waiting game. Most of the time I tip toe around calling in bombing strikes on the enemy and when I get the the base I call in that bombing strike to take out any artillery and do a massive rush with all my units into the base and take out the Heavy Engineering facilites before it spawns more artillery in.

 

My biggest complaint is the Artillery's capability to completely wipe out hordes of infantry within 1 or 2 volleys. You can bring in some AT-AT's to take out the Rebel artillery, but you cant back the AT-AT's up with ANYTHING else, therefore the AT-AT's get completely raped due to the fact that a smart player will have plex soldiers standing by the Artillery. You try to support the AT-AT's with infantry and they will die in 1 volley. You try to support them with Maulers/AT-ST's/Tanks anything, and you will suffer MASSIVE losses making it a Pearic victory.

 

Artillery needs to be removed from the game period.

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Or have a magnapulse cannon,also imperial artillery isnt very good at all. fires two shots and is way to innacurate.

 

Im telling you, if you try to go on the offensive against anyone that is even remotely smart and has loads of artillery, you WILL NOT win w/o taking massive losses.

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And I'm telling you that you may need to rethink your tactics. Artillery is supposed to be destructive. It also happens to be fragile as hell, immobile and expensive to boot. Killing artillery is incredibly easy, just as it is in any other RTS. I fail to see what exactly you have problems with.

 

As for space battles. Missile cruisers are made of paper. They crumble under any kind of turbo-laser fire. Which is how I tend to kill the things, turbolasers, not bombers. An Acclamator can tear several of them to shreds just by rushing in there. Considering the cost of the things, taking out a few of those for the price of one Acclamator is an exceptionally good deal.

 

TB.

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My biggest complaint is the Artillery's capability to completely wipe out hordes of infantry within 1 or 2 volleys. You can bring in some AT-AT's to take out the Rebel artillery, but you cant back the AT-AT's up with ANYTHING else, therefore the AT-AT's get completely raped due to the fact that a smart player will have plex soldiers standing by the Artillery. You try to support the AT-AT's with infantry and they will die in 1 volley. You try to support them with Maulers/AT-ST's/Tanks anything, and you will suffer MASSIVE losses making it a Pearic victory.
you do realize that utilizing Darth Vader to attack groups of artillery will wipe them out very easily. the arty units can't take much damage, and given the ungodly amount of damage Vader can take, he should be able to easily outlast 5-6 arty units. besides, if somebody does start spamming arty units like crazy, the Imperial Repulser tanks are excellent counters. ;)
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you do realize that utilizing Darth Vader to attack groups of artillery will wipe them out very easily. the arty units can't take much damage, and given the ungodly amount of damage Vader can take, he should be able to easily outlast 5-6 arty units. besides, if somebody does start spamming arty units like crazy, the Imperial Repulser tanks are excellent counters. ;)

 

I have noticed that Darth Vader can withstand hundreads of shots of laser fire, but when it comes to artillery he drops pretty fast imo.

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you do realize that utilizing Darth Vader to attack groups of artillery will wipe them out very easily. the arty units can't take much damage, and given the ungodly amount of damage Vader can take, he should be able to easily outlast 5-6 arty units. besides, if somebody does start spamming arty units like crazy, the Imperial Repulser tanks are excellent counters. ;)

 

Except Darth vader isn't everywhere. I agree with Screed, the Rebel Artillery is pretty powerfull. I can send in artillery with anti troopers and vehicles and win the map. Send the Artillery to a repair build pad and open them up, and then slowly work your way towards the enemy base.

 

When I was playing as empire, I was attacked with 2 tank groups and artillery. My turbolasers took out the tanks and 1 artillery, but the other survived. I tried rushing it, but anything I sent got killed pretty much instantly. If it weren't for the spawning inhabitants, I would have lost. I finally got bored trying to kill it and just selected autocomplete and actually won.

 

You shouldn't be able to win a map with mostly artillery units, heck even 1 unit.

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With the SMALL maps, I do not enjoy the Artillery fire. It is too busy for me. I feel it seems difficult to justify their presence on a small map.

 

I think I am going to remove Artillery and play a land skirmish and see how it is.

 

Then replace the Arty units with something else with a new AI routine. "Secret Weapons of the Empire".

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I was attacked by a Rebel raid fleet comprised of airspeeders, a heavy tank unit, and artillery. I beat them with indiginous infantry and speeder bikes, losing only a couple indigs. Speeder bikes are great against the Rebel artillery--they can get in under the minimum range umbrella too quickly for the MPTLs to hit them, drop some thermal detonators, and take down most of the MPTLs' health before rushing to safety. Rush in once more and the deal is done--or just stick around, wait for the detonators to explode, and let the speeders finish the artillery off with blasters. Alternate 2 squads of speeders and you can blast the MPTLs in one hit-and-run. Use the speeders' insane speed to damage artillery and paint them for bombing runs.

 

In space, your strategy of four missile cruisers, three anti-fighter corvettes, and one destroyer banks way too heavily on the opponent not having more than one or two ships of cruiser level or higher. What would happen to your fleet if several assault frigates and Calamari cruisers zoomed in? The Broadsides would crumble instantly and you'd be left with one Destroyer and a few Tartans, which are basically gnats to capital ships.

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To people that are saying Rebel artillery is fine:

 

Did you actually PLAY the game? No offense, but they're not just unbalanced, they're BROKEN. All this advice is nice on paper, but here's the problem:

 

AT-AT: nice counter. Too bad its so slow that by the time it turns around, aims, fires a few shots, and kills the artillery, your entire force is dead. Gone.

 

Rushing: seems to be the best way. By "best" I mean losing "80% of your ground forces between the time you see the artillery and the time you reach it with your fastest units" type of best.

 

Bombing runs: Would be nice... if it happened immediately. Takes about 10 seconds to get there guys, and it takes half that to wipe out your entire force.

 

scout bikes: they're ok except chances are they're among the first units to die and by the time you see an MTPL artillery, well, its too late.

 

 

My point is this: the Rebel MPTL artillery does unfair damage against EVERYTHING (tanks, troops, structures, etc), has unfair splash damage, has incredibly fast firing rate, obscene range, and is an otherwise generally broken unit that adds nothing but frustration to the game. Honestly, as soon as I see one of the battlefield I know there'll be an endless wave of them and just quit the game and go do something else, and believe me, being the computer nerd that I am, when something makes me do that... well, its beyond frustrating. Know why I'm not complaining about the Imperial artillery? Because its a reasonably damaging unit that has minimal splash damage and a slow fire rate. The Rebel version is none of these things.

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We can fix that in XML files no need for dev team for that :)

 

As for space arty it is the knd of tactic that I was talking about in my thread "DEV team plz read this".

 

BTW I was looking in Empire's Arty and its inaccuracy for infantry is 80 out of 100. The problem is the spalsh area which is wide. But then again if you reduce it there is no more use for arty.

 

On the other hand rebel arty has no innacuracy entery specific for vehicules troops and structure. It does only single dammage. As it is now all we can do is

 

1. Reduce the general accuracy (this means for all)

 

2. Reduce the splash area and the dammage done

 

3. Increase the reload time

 

And just for Wedge

 

What the AI is doing on hard/medium is the next thing.

 

It builds up usualy 3 or 4 arty pieces. Sends tanks to attack you and block you with them. While you are trying to find your way through all this troops you get raped by the arty and you don't even have time to react.

 

Moreover when you are attacking the planet in GC the AI sems to have boosted unit production which means that you can eventualy win the batle but only if you brought along with you a massive amount of units for planet invasion.

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Ok..

 

I increased the recharge time of the arty but I didn't touch the dammage is making. Now it seems to be ok because you have the chance to approach it. However there is still a problem with the AT-AT. It is so slow to react that by time it turns to fire it got raped .

 

Only solution I can see for that is to increase the attack range of its lasers.

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Orao, I *was* playing on medium. The situation did happen to favor me because the Rebels sent a fairly unbalanced force against me (heavy on artillery, light on close-combat units). But I was able to pull their heavy tanks away from the MPTLs with indigenous infantry and then keep them distracted there while I zoomed in along an alternate route with my speeder bikes. See? Tactics.

 

My point is just that the artillery isn't unbeatable. It has weaknesses that can be exploited. I think decreasing the MPTL firing rate would probably balance the game a lot better (especially since the Imperial artillery is relatively short-ranged). It's just not a game-breaking flaw.

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Sure Wedge. If you read my previous post you will see that is what I've done.

 

However when I was blocked as imperial by those light tanks it was on Mon Calamari. On that planet the locals support the rebelion not the Empire. So I had to retreat because I lost 3/4 of my forces to the arty. I want to mention that when I launched the attack only 1 infantry squad was garisoned on the planet. The rest was produced by rebel structures during battle.

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Ground artillery is good, realistic and sensible.

 

Space artillery is just a bad idea in the starwars universe. It doesnt fit with anything seen in the films and in game is dam annoying when missles from a ship on the other side of the map start hitting you. It also makes the space and land battle too similar.

 

maybe you could mod the 2 missle boats to use turbo lasers/ torps and concussions instead of ultra long range missles.

 

I prefer having big cap ships sluggin it out at close range rather than hiding in a corner hoping not to get noticed.

 

my thoughts...

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Artillery should be slower. the ground artillery unloads and loads its gun back up very quickly, espcially if you are trying to rush it. It should take artillery longer to unload for shots, not 5 seconds. I think the space artillery is great, it can pack a punch but will fall quickly under attack. The rebel ai seems to do a great job with its corvettes and gunships rushing behind my front lines and taking out my broadsides, which i like to see. I try to return the favour also ;)

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ummmm have u guys actually tried using strategies of killing the arts....?

i have no problem of killing them either against AI or a human.y dont u guys try splitting up ur at-st, tie maulers, or 2m tanks. The arts cant fire at both groups at once. I'm not saying this to be mean but, why dont u ppl stop complaining and actually use ur brains and figure on how to destroy the arts.O and if u didnt know there are heros in skirmish.

 

Theres my 2 cents....wanna try for a dollar?

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Very articulately said.

 

Yes, I've done said tactics, but I still maintain that the rebel artillery tanks are overpowered. Perhaps if they were made slower (movement and deployment wise), it'd offset the whole part about them being able to kill things quickly. I'm not always playing skirmish mode where I can just build units as I need them.

 

I have tried splitting the inhabitants (from situation in my previous post) into 2 groups and rush the single artillery, but it is able to reload and fire at both groups before they even got close enough to fire.

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2M tanks don't last long agains the Rebel artillery, I don't know what gave you that impression. One salvo takes down your shields and maybe half your life, this has happened to me a dozen times so I know that for a fact.

 

I figured out a temporary solution by doubling the fog or war clearing ability of AT-ATs, that way I can usually see them coming.

 

Anyone know how to decrease the damage done by the Rebel artillery though in the XML files?

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Imperial 2M repulsor tanks' shields are very resistant to rebel artillery. The shields can survive several rounds of torpedos before failing, and by then the artillery is already destroyed.

 

Yes, and the Plex troopers will rape the 2m Tanks faster than you can blink. 'Oh but, why not rush them with Tie Maulers." Maulers will also die faster than you can blink.

 

ummmm have u guys actually tried using strategies of killing the arts....?

i have no problem of killing them either against AI or a human.y dont u guys try splitting up ur at-st, tie maulers, or 2m tanks. The arts cant fire at both groups at once. I'm not saying this to be mean but, why dont u ppl stop complaining and actually use ur brains and figure on how to destroy the arts.O and if u didnt know there are heros in skirmish.

 

Theres my 2 cents....wanna try for a dollar?

 

Oh, how stupid of me! Oh wait..... now if that player is smart, won't he layer his Artillery, so if you do manage to rush the first group of artillery, the second group behind it will be able to hit the first group? Ah, yes. The brains of a human opponant are such wonderful things.

 

Petroglyphs argument "AT-AA's are counters to Rebel Artillery" is folly as well. You rush in some Rebel tanks which move far faster, and are FAR cheaper than the AT-AA's and they will die VERY quick.

 

There's just no CONCEIVABLE way to attack a group of supported artillery short of a bombing run.

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