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[Spoilers] Chris Avellone reveals the identity of the "True Sith"


Pavlos
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Who built the Malachor 5 Temple?

Who created the teaching that made Kreia, Sion en Nihilus Sith Lord?

 

I think there presence was always there...

 

I think you're correct.

 

The ironic thing is that this was what most people immediately thought the "true Sith" would turn out to be back in 2004, and it was quickly dismissed as too simple and unlikely. Most fans thought something more complicated and creative would be revealed and began to theorize endlessly as to what that may have been. To top it off, Obsidian said that they intended the enigmatic "true Sith" to be an entirely different geographical group from the Empire of Ajunta Pall, Marka Ragnos, et. al. (which would mean either that they were lying then or they're lying now about this having been the intention all along).

 

Well, PR deception is a tactic used often when there will be fervor and intensified interest on a large scale in the public eye. They could be lying now or they could have been lying then; ultimately it will not matter, for all they need to do is stall. Now that there is a contradiction, it will generate all that much more interest in the upcoming release. Similarly it is used as a war tactic as well--in a relative sense.

 

However it is ironic, I agree, that the initial guess which is strange and simple is too often or easily dismissed.

 

I personally didn't really get around to playing TSL fully until last year--I had played parts of it here and there since its release. (though odd I downloaded all those mods from PCGM almost instictively hoarding them for later which has proven useful) And with what I had seen in wookieepedia, in the Darth Bane novels, and just in general lead me to the conclusion that it couldn't be anything BUT remnants from the past, 1000 years prior @ ~5000BBY. In K1 you can even see loading screen text "True sith died out long ago, today's followers are little more than followers of an ideal"...well, there no hard evidence or anything about the last recorded "true sith" species going extinct.(Least so far that had been published!) So, I thought something was amiss, there.

 

 

And now it turns out that the "true Sith" come from the most obvious and unimaginative connection to Star Wars lore that everyone was quick to dismiss because there were just so many better theories out there. I, for one, can't help but feel disappointed.

 

 

Fact/truth is often stranger than fiction, is it not? Just what were you expecting? Perhaps your disappointment stems from your expectations?

 

Ah interesting, it seems like most of us who guessed it would be remnants of the Sadow Sith were correct :)

 

My only question is if this "true sith" plot is supposed to be on a much larger scale than Sidious' (which was pretty damn large considering Clone Wars/Order 66/Empire/etc.) is how did they plot for so long without ever being discovered or stopped? I'm guessing that the True Sith are already in control or at least have made themselves known by the settings of TOR.

 

I'm sure the plot will be revealed soon enough.

 

Subtlety. Cunning. Rather than going out and beating your chest. Remaining just out of reach, just out of sight, and being patient. Not trying too hard either way (making a move or hiding) and being absolutely sure your enemy cannot "see" you. Never be so arrogant as to assume your enemy cannot destroy you nor assume it cannot see things as you do. Unknowns can be used against you.

 

The reach of the republic only extended so far.

 

tbh

 

i was hoping for something somewhat more original than this.

 

So what did you have in mind, exactly?

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In K1 you can even see loading screen text "True sith died out long ago, today's followers are little more than followers of an ideal"...well, there no hard evidence or anything about the last recorded "true sith" species going extinct.(Least so far that had been published!) So, I thought something was amiss, there.

 

True, but "true Sith" seems to be a rather liberal term that could be applied to many different trains of thought, depending upon the context. Kriea meant it one way, and it's clear that Bane meant it in an entirely different way when referring to Revan. Sometimes when descussing the various Sith organizations in the Expanded Universe after the deaths of Sidious and Vader, I will throw around the term "true Sith" so as to differenciate the line of succession that ended with Palpatine and, say, Lumiya's Sith or Darth Caedus (though now I can't help but find myself trying to use different terms as substitutes, knowing that as soon as "true Sith" is uttered everyone will automatically think of KOTOR 2, regardless of the context in which the term was used).

 

Fact/truth is often stranger than fiction, is it not? Just what were you expecting? Perhaps your disappointment stems from your expectations?

 

The truth be told, I really don't know what exactly I was expecting all this time. I suppose I was open to anything new or imaginitive that I myself and others may or may not have thought of previously.

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To a large degree, this sucks. I thought the True Sith were gonna be a whole race within themselves. i thoguht maybe they were gonna be from way back when the Sith were first created, maybe a whole Secret Colony that broke away from the very first Sith Order as a back-up paln, keeping Malachor as a flagpost in the known galaxy. That Built up a whole empire and wait for the signal to overrun the Republic, from Exar Kun, or Revan, or Nihilus or whoever.

 

Having said that bioware have returned triumphant with tor, and the trailer is the most badass bit of star wars ive seen since the dueling finale in episode three, so all things considered im not gonna complain. Naga Sadow was the coolest of the old lords anyway.

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...but rather that MCA intelligently placed the elements for the sequel in KotOR II's plot -- ready for their significance to be "activated" in the player's mind by moments of exposition in the next game -- and the idea of people manipulating galactic events from behind the scenes; people whose method of manipulation rather makes Kreia's echoes and precise choice of actions at critical moments look like child's play.

OH GOD, it would have been such freaking awesome game!

 

Why, LA? WHY?

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH

 

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH

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Ah screw this noise. It's just a cross between Knights I's big ole' army of sith soldiers and Knights II's little ole' army sith assassins. Gimme something creepy.

 

See this MMO shoulda been entirely comprised of Revan and Army vs Republic and Army. You got horde, you got alliance. KOTOR I hasn't started yet, KOTOR II doesn't have plotholes yet, and the MMO is just the jedi civil war we all know and love. What's happening here is just the designers recreating the same environment as KOTOR I for TOR.

 

Us RPG gamers meanwhile should have been exploring worlds laid to waste by Sith Alchemy in the Unknown Regions as Revan tracks the True Sith in an expansion for a slightly more finished TSL (NWN has plenty, thanks, Obsidian).

 

Ah, what do I know... I'm just a scruffy nerfherder with my head in a wormhole. :p

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True, but "true Sith" seems to be a rather liberal term that could be applied to many different trains of thought, depending upon the context.
To be fair, I had ahold of the (or at least one of the) first revelations that there was an ancient sith species in star wars insider. So I sort of knew where it was headded all along. It is a term liberally used now for thought processes as you say, but I have a feeling we've only seen the tip of the iceberg thus far into its origins.

 

 

Kriea meant it one way, and it's clear that Bane meant it in an entirely different way when referring to Revan.
That is to be expected given 3000 years time and all the sith artifacts either recovered by the jedi order, destroyed, smuggled off, used up, or still elusive (Lady Xoxxan, and her master Khanis Muurr, for instance).

 

Also, Kreia knew Revan personally whereas Bane did not. While that is debatable to an extent (Referring to Path of Destruciton of course),

artifact proxy is only an extension. In this case only an extension of Revan prior to K1.

I would not say entirely different. Evolved, but essentially still based upon earlier writings

of Revan's

.

 

Sometimes when descussing the various Sith organizations in the Expanded Universe after the deaths of Sidious and Vader, I will throw around the term "true Sith" so as to differenciate the line of succession that ended with Palpatine and, say, Lumiya's Sith or Darth Caedus (though now I can't help but find myself trying to use different terms as substitutes, knowing that as soon as "true Sith" is uttered everyone will automatically think of KOTOR 2, regardless of the context in which the term was used).
True, it will have 2 meanings and the ancient species will be the one that springs to mind first in fans now. I'm not entirely sure this wasn't intended, though.

 

It will, however, necessitate some other term be used to differentiate.

True ancient/core species of sith. True contemporary/lords of the sith. Remember, before any of this Sith was simply a name of a system in which a moon had its own native inhabitants. Dark Jedi were exiled or chased out there by the order. Look it up on wookieepedia if you don't believe me.

 

The truth be told, I really don't know what exactly I was expecting all this time. I suppose I was open to anything new or imaginitive that I myself and others may or may not have thought of previously.

 

Would you care to give some example? :)

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  • 6 months later...

Returning from exile to say that I'm glad that Chris Avellone finally spilt the beans. Yeah, I'm disappointed, but I rather be disappointed than wait for the end of KOTOR III to find out they reused the same plotline of KOTOR II.

 

Anyway, it does make Bioware's plotline more interesting. Remember, in TOR, the "True Sith Empire" (or at least what is likely to be the True Sith Empire) won. Not only that, but the True Sith, at its moment of trimpuh, decided, instead of extermination, to sign a a peace treaty. I have a hard time thinking that Kreia, or Obisidan's True Sith would even consider something like that. These are not your regular Sith here. They're still very generic, but at least they got some heretical ideas going on here. You could spend, what, ten minutes, examining their motives carefully.

 

Going back into exile. Good job Palvos.

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Returning from exile to say that I'm glad that Chris Avellone finally spilt the beans. Yeah, I'm disappointed, but I rather be disappointed than wait for the end of KOTOR III to find out they reused the same plotline of KOTOR II.

 

Anyway, it does make Bioware's plotline more interesting. Remember, in TOR, the "True Sith Empire" (or at least what is likely to be the True Sith Empire) won. Not only that, but the True Sith, at its moment of trimpuh, decided, instead of extermination, to sign a a peace treaty. I have a hard time thinking that Kreia, or Obisidan's True Sith would even consider something like that. These are not your regular Sith here. They're still very generic, but at least they got some heretical ideas going on here. You could spend, what, ten minutes, examining their motives carefully.

 

Going back into exile. Good job Palvos.

 

I think in those video histories you find out they were locked in a stalemate against the Republic and launched all out assault against Coruscant (as seen in the cgi trailer) moments before it was signed since the treaty allowed the Sith to keep any territorial holdings they had gained since the start of the war.

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