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Sick of this BS [All Whiners Read]


Yoojin
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I am totally sick of people calling this cheap and that cheap and you're a fag etc.. etc... I backstab....SO F'ING WHAT?!?! It's in the game, if you actually learned to backstab you would know that there is alot of skill involved in a duel with backstabbers. Force pull, force absorb, run up turn backstab, run up kick, so many options. Walk up blue sabre lunge.

 

I don't understand how people can say its cheap. If i knock you down with a force pull what am I supposed to do? Go for a less damaging move bcause you get frustrated? If you're dueling with no force and you get backstabbed Im sorry but you deserved it. Next time, dont be there next to him if he has his back turned. Or better yet KICK THE GUY TO KNOCK HIM DOWN AND THEN BACKSTAB HIM YOURSELF. THERE IS A COUNTER TO EVERY MOVE IN THIS GAME LEARN. Just because you DON'T know the counter to a backstab doesn't mean its cheap. Learn the game.

 

It might just be human nature to call whatever you can't beat cheap. I was on sabre only no force duel server, and I was kicking people down. People were saying kicking is cheap. EVERY PERSON SAYS SOMETHING ELSE IS CHEAP. I guess I'll just pick blue style, hold down the F'ING BUTTON AND RUN AROUND LIKE A N00B?!?! THAT'S PROLLY THE ONLY WAY YOU WON'T GET CALLED CHEAP IN THE GAME. Raise your skill level people. Have you ever seen a fight between 2 backstabbers? It's awesome. DO YOU KNOW WHY? Because we have to fight extremely well since we know 1 mistake can lead to death. 1 bad kick, 1 bad force pull, 1 bad dfa, 1 bad rush, 1 bad lunge. It's a GREAT thing.

 

And you know what? When people kill me I say GF. When I win people say you're a fag. Who's the one with no class? I'm sorry if you don't have the skill to adapt and learn the game. I've moved on to higher skill things in this game you're stuck on blue sabre hold down button rush. WOW THATS SO FUN. THE WHOLE GAME IS BASED ON LUCK!!!! I might as well play with my eyes closed.

 

Final words.... LEARN IT OR LEARN TO DEAL WITH IT. IT'S IN THE F'ING GAME, I'M GONNA DO THE BEST OF MY ABILITIES TO WIN. IF IT'S SO CHEAP AND I'M A 1 MOVE WHORE, HOW COME IF YOU KNOW MY 1 MOVE IS COMING YOU CAN'T BEAT IT?!?!?!?!?! YOU HAVE NO SKILL END OF STORY. I beat other backstabbers all day. WHY?!?! Cuz I use my entire arsenal!!!!! DEAL WITH IT IT'S IN THE GAME. <FIN>

 

 

Yoojin

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learning a single move and running all over the map spamming it is not skill. Okay, sure, you spent a few minutes learning the timing, and how to lure people in.

 

But it ignores so much of what the game has to offer that I see no problems calling backstab whores no skill losers.

 

Real skill comes from being able to take down an enemy a dozen different ways. Using the same tactic every damn time just paints you as a one trick pony, and that's not a good thing.

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Wait a sec, why should we change our tactic, if people lose to it constantly? That makes no sense. We'll do other things when they actually beat us. Geez, real skill comes from winning a dozen different ways. Sigh. Why should we bother using the dozen different ways when all you guys do is whine, flame us, then vote to kick? Lets not turn this into a flame war, but it seems its ALWAYS the guys that complain about the backstabbers on a server that are the most inconsiderate, flaming, cursing people there. Sorry, but you would see the skill if you actually did it. Try watching a duel between 2 backstabbers, that understand lunging, dfa, kicking, rolling, and other things. It's a great thing. Sorry, but you can't say it takes no skill if you can't beat it. I'm not gonna limit myself in wins because you feel I do one move too many times. If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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> Wait a sec, why should we change

> our tactic, if people lose to it

> constantly?

 

because it implies you are a thinking, judging rational being with the capacity to alter their actions based on the circumstances around them.

 

The only real reason "changing tactics" causes people to lose is beacuse the "dominant tactics", ie backstabbing, are so disproportionatley powerful that people are unwilling to try anything else.

 

> I'm not gonna limit myself in wins

> because you feel I do one move too

> many times.

 

See your first problem is assuming that the only way of measuring success is by frag count.

 

> but it seems its ALWAYS the guys that

> complain about the backstabbers on a

> server that are the most inconsiderate,

 

Please pick a debate and stick to it.. are you starting this thread to complain about people hating you for your tactics, or are you starting this thread to state that backstab spamming requires skill?

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I'm really torn on this subject. When 1.03 first came out I hated backstabbers, then I learned how to do it (thanks to Artifex). Then I hated those who whined about backstabbers. So, I learned and developed my kicks and the medium finisher and avoided using the backstab, just to quiet those who feel the backstab is cheap. Now I have folks complain that I kick too much and use the medium finisher too much. I can’t win. (PS I still can’t do DFA on purpose) :confused:

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Xyzzy is right.

 

You're wrong.

 

Pull/Backstab takes ZERO skill.

 

I know, because *I* can do it.

 

Its overpowered, ergo its cheap.

 

Any saber strike that does 150+ damage in one hit and is so easy to land (again *I* know what I'm talking about) is overpowered and people that CONSTANTLY use it (I mean those that spam it) are by definition

 

cheap.

 

Thanks for playing.

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seriously guys, theres a whole lot of types of player out there

 

I'm more of a kicker/backstabber , I've seen people use force pull/backstab a lot, and Yes, I have fallen to this tactic too(force absorb can run out in the worst possible times!), but no, i don't call it cheap. Something is ONLY cheap when theres no way to counter it. Backstab has counters, like every move on JK2. that patch was the best thing to happen to this game. some people are just sore losers so they call people name or accuse em of cheating or scripting

 

one time, i was in a ffa server in a private duel( the "k" duel) we both jumped toward each other and I kicked him in midair and ran in for the blue backstab, the guy started yelling "CHEATER" and initiated a vote to kick me, but it failed, so he wants a rematch, we go at it again, I abide my time, while he's running around backward trying to backstab, he gets it off a few times, but i always kick him away, one time he falls down and I backstab again, he said "fag" and disconnected. Don't whine about whiners, they are everywhere on the internet in every games

 

Live with them, they won't go away, besides, its fun to kill those guys, they are usualy newbies or disgruntled 1.02 players :)

 

anyway, thats my take on the issue, if you see a blue swamptrooper called cYbErDuD on a saber only server, thats me! :)

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Originally posted by Yoojin

I am totally sick of people calling this cheap and that cheap and you're a fag etc.. etc... I backstab....SO F'ING WHAT?!?! It's in the game, if you actually learned to backstab you would know that there is alot of skill involved in a duel with backstabbers. Force pull, force absorb, run up turn backstab, run up kick, so many options. Walk up blue sabre lunge.

 

I don't understand how people can say its cheap. If i knock you down with a force pull what am I supposed to do? Go for a less damaging move bcause you get frustrated? If you're dueling with no force and you get backstabbed Im sorry but you deserved it. Next time, dont be there next to him if he has his back turned. Or better yet KICK THE GUY TO KNOCK HIM DOWN AND THEN BACKSTAB HIM YOURSELF. THERE IS A COUNTER TO EVERY MOVE IN THIS GAME LEARN. Just because you DON'T know the counter to a backstab doesn't mean its cheap. Learn the game.

 

It might just be human nature to call whatever you can't beat cheap. I was on sabre only no force duel server, and I was kicking people down. People were saying kicking is cheap. EVERY PERSON SAYS SOMETHING ELSE IS CHEAP. I guess I'll just pick blue style, hold down the F'ING BUTTON AND RUN AROUND LIKE A N00B?!?! THAT'S PROLLY THE ONLY WAY YOU WON'T GET CALLED CHEAP IN THE GAME. Raise your skill level people. Have you ever seen a fight between 2 backstabbers? It's awesome. DO YOU KNOW WHY? Because we have to fight extremely well since we know 1 mistake can lead to death. 1 bad kick, 1 bad force pull, 1 bad dfa, 1 bad rush, 1 bad lunge. It's a GREAT thing.

 

And you know what? When people kill me I say GF. When I win people say you're a fag. Who's the one with no class? I'm sorry if you don't have the skill to adapt and learn the game. I've moved on to higher skill things in this game you're stuck on blue sabre hold down button rush. WOW THATS SO FUN. THE WHOLE GAME IS BASED ON LUCK!!!! I might as well play with my eyes closed.

 

Final words.... LEARN IT OR LEARN TO DEAL WITH IT. IT'S IN THE F'ING GAME, I'M GONNA DO THE BEST OF MY ABILITIES TO WIN. IF IT'S SO CHEAP AND I'M A 1 MOVE WHORE, HOW COME IF YOU KNOW MY 1 MOVE IS COMING YOU CAN'T BEAT IT?!?!?!?!?! YOU HAVE NO SKILL END OF STORY. I beat other backstabbers all day. WHY?!?! Cuz I use my entire arsenal!!!!! DEAL WITH IT IT'S IN THE GAME. <FIN>

 

 

Yoojin

 

He does have a point. As I've learned in many duels. Two players who know their pull well defensively and offensively will have some of the best duels against eachother. The people usually complaining, or usually being defeated by this, are those who don't know the manuever well enough defensively. You may say you do, but if you are constantly being killed by it, and complaining, you might wanna rethink your answer. After much observing and playing in duels, I've learned to use pull well both ways. I'm not pulled down early, and I'm not dying. I'm having a good duel with another good player which involves alot of thinking, and proper movement. More kicks are involved. You find yourself rolling to get into position. You read your opponent. If he's not moving, don't charge him, OR, run towards him, turn on absorb at jump range, and give him a kick for standing there. As the fight progresses you can't always tell when absorb is on, and you can't just keep pulling consistenly or it'll blow your mana. This is where more of the arsenal comes into play. DFA, kick, lunge, basic swing, saber toss. Then when an opponent is off gaurd, you drop them at the right angle. A good player has his options. Alot of the time I don't see the backstab finish. I see a Medium Finisher victory, in order to avoid the dreaded "Stab Back" manuever.

 

What I'm trying to say is that "Backstabbers", "Assfighters", "Backstab Whores" whatever you wanna call them are fighting in a different style, an art so to speak. They live by a style where getting caught off gaurd means death. When you aproach them, and you aren't ready for that, they've got you...

 

These people aren't neccasarily going for the quick frag either. Most of the time they're happy to see that one guy who absorbs their push, and obviously is prepared for a good battle.

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wait for someone to get close and attack you, then use force pull, turn around and backstab. repeat 999999999 times.

 

and you call this a difficult technique to pull off? sorry to disappoint you but if i can do this and get tons of kills then IT IS A SKILLESS MOVE.

 

i dont know, maybe i'm even more of a n00b than the guy running backwards all day, but tell me why this move must be practiced in order for it to be effective?

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turn on absorb, watch him give you 3 bars of force and saber his outstretched hand. perhaps next time he wont be so eager to lower his defenses when you're in good range for a nice hard saber smack.

 

but the main problem with this move is people spamming it. running into combat backwards?! i mean wtf is going on here, that's really taking it too far. or when two players have their sabers lowered and are trying to duel, perhaps not noticing the message at the top of their screens about waiting for the current duel to stop, and some idiot backs up into them and sweeps them both to their deaths.

 

the increasing number of wankers who run around backwards are proof that this move is being spammed. sure, it's easy to counter them when you know they're there, but if you're having an awesome duel with another player (not a private one let's say), and are both on low health, looking for that last edge to win, and 3 newbies spamming backstab at each other manage to destroy the two of you, it gets annoying, and is a huge anticlimax for people who play the game for the 1 on 1 fights.

 

i agree, a perfectly executed backstab on a moving target requires skill, but running into combat backwards is getting lamer and lamer ...

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Just like to say that I think both sides of the argument are correct here. It`s generally human nature to stick with a winning tactic; It`s only when you`re consistantly beaten that you have to start thinking about an alternative.

On the other hand, the fact is that a move that`s capable of 340 damage is quite obviously massively overpowered and ought to be re-evaluated in the next patch.

No move should be capable of more than 125 damage, and such a move should be difficult and dangerous to apply.

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sorry to say, but ppl walking backwards in blue stance aren't even hard to counter.. everybody who can't deal with those ppl.. well... you get the idea..

 

Pull backstab is a diff story, it's harder to counter, but it can be done.. abrorb for one.. I don't know an effective dark side counter but I'm sure there is one.

 

Ppl call things cheap they can't deal with. I personally get called cheap a LOT of times because I exploit my opponents weakness. I watch them in duels, and if they can't deal with kick I kick. If they can't deal with backstab I backstab, and if they can't deal with blue lunge I do that etc etc etc. If that's cheap, guess I'm a cheap ass then. This game is about killing your opponent, and in the end the person with the most frags is the winner. Anyone claiming something else is a fool

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people in blue stance running backwards are easy to counter IF YOU KNOW THEY'RE THERE! i hate it when they just back up into me while im talking to someone :(

 

"This game is about killing your opponent, and in the end the person with the most frags is the winner. Anyone claiming something else is a fool"

 

i'd like to claim something else ... this game is about having fun, and in the end, the people who are still smiling at the end of the map are the winners. anyone claiming anything else is a cs-kiddie cyber-athlete.

 

i got to the stage where i had perfected the backsweep pretty much, i could hit 75% of moving targets, and everytime when they were down. i got bored, and started dueling with yellow stance, which is way more fun. if someone lightning spams me, or tries to pull/backstab me, or something else that just irritates me, i simply lay the smackdown on em, and keep looking for another duel. if they keep it up after the first "warning", then i'll just kill them on sight, rather than wait for them to be "lame" first.

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> everybody who can't deal with those

> ppl.. well... you get the idea..

 

 

The point of this debate isn't that there are no coutners against backstab/slash spammers.

 

The point is whether or not it's lame to spam the tactic, and whether or not it takes any skill to do it.

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walking backwards blue stance doesn't take any skill, I agree, but it isn't very effective either.

 

and big mexican, it doesn't sound like you're having a whole lot of fun. And are you claiming that counterstrike isn't about having fun?

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I would never accuse Nolan Ryan of having no skill because he "spammed" fastballs or Micheal Jordan in the later stages of his career for "spamming a crossover followed by a jumpshot"

 

In competitive activities it is the opponents responsibility to force someone to change their game, not the person "spamming" a move

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I think we have to keep in mind the mindset of the bulk of the players out there...

 

MOST of them are between the ages of 12 and 17, and that is NOT the most mature of age groups.

 

The other thing that makes me laugh sometimes are those same people who go on and on about their 'skillz'. Granted, this game takes some effort to learn the moves, but after a couple of hours of practice you can pretty much hold your own in a FFA.

 

Skills sometimes take a lifetime to perfect, and most people who are skilled at something (Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Ross Perot) are all willing to admit they have more to learn.

 

Think to yourself, is a video game aimed at pre-pubescent males REALLY going to require a superior set of skills to master?

 

I don't think so.

 

Now the fun part is with those who play this game for hours and hours on end, and really get the moves down, who are then killed repeatedly by people spamming the backstab. Then come the cries of, "That's Lame", "You cheap fag", "Is that all you can do?"

 

As a slightly older representative of the demographic playing this game (shock, gasp, I'm 29!!!) what I CAN say is that when a particular weapon/move is so easy to learn and perform, and it is unblockable, it will be used and used and used and used. By whom? Those who just want to win, who don't have the patience to try and kill their target another way, and by those who DON'T want to invest hundreds of hours mastering moves that can't beat the one simple one everyone knows.

 

This move is a problem with the GAME, not the people playing it. I hope it will be corrected in the next patch...assuming there is enough outcry about it.

 

To that end, here is the email address for Ravensoft:

 

www@ravensoft.com

 

Make your feelings known, maybe we can get this corrected.

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i'd like to claim something else ... this game is about having fun, and in the end, the people who are still smiling at the end of the map are the winners. anyone claiming anything else is a cs-kiddie cyber-athlete.

 

ya....last time i checked the point of EVERY game is to have fun, sure it's nice to win and everybody loves to win....but if you don't have fun what's the point?

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Originally posted by da_rat

im sorry that u feel that way about being called names...you f**#@$@%#$$#@%@#%$@%$%T^ $%$# %$#$ *inhale* $#@%% $#% # %$^%^&%$ ^%$^&$%#& !@$#%

 

Well, well, well.

 

Mr. Potty-mouth...

 

;)

 

(remember to breathe, you gotta remember to breathe)

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THERE IS A COUNTER TO EVERY MOVE IN THIS GAME LEARN. Just because you DON'T know the counter to a backstab doesn't mean its cheap. Learn the game.

 

Hmmm wel ok. Done that. But the problem is. THE COUNTER AIN'T FUN!!!!! They ruin the whole gameplay cause it forces you to a very limited aspect of the game (the backstab countering). When playing on a duel server and you find someone doing the backstab thing. All normal saber tactics are becoming USELESS! Come on. Just try it. A smart backstabber just waits until you attack and then pulls you on the ground. So attacking the normal way is no option. Well use absorb then n00b. Ok tried that also. But then the smart backstabber will just avoid battle until your out of force and then pulls you on the ground.

Tssss never heard of kicking before? Yes I did. But then most of the times it endes up in a kicking duel, wich is boring. Or you could just be pulled on the ground just when you began your kick animation.

Man I could just go on and on and on about it. Just to make a long story short. THE BACKSTAB COUNTER TACTIS ARE NO FUN AT ALL!!!!! SO THATS WHY STICKING TO BACKSTABBING ONLY SUCKS! :barf:

 

note: backstab in a nf duel is some other story since you can't pull. Kicking is far less worse the pulling.

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> i'd like to claim something else ... this game is

> about having fun, and in the end, the people who

> are still smiling at the end of the map are the

> winners.

 

That's not neccessarily true. Put it this way.. who is more skilled, the guy who at the end of 20 minutes has 8 kills and 1 death, or the guy who has 30 kills and 20 deaths?

 

It's really a shame jk2 doesn't track deaths, because there's been dozens of situations where I spend 20 minutes fending off attackers, dying perhaps once or twice. Sure my kill rate sucks, but for every one or two kills I do get I survive another half dozen fights.

 

My personal best is holding off four attackers on a saber only ctf for five minutes solid. I scored no kills myself, but then again, I'm the only one that actually survived (some guy with lightning ran through and mowed everyone down, heh).

 

I've been dead last for frag count many many times and still left the server having had fun.

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