C'jais Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 Ok, here are some from the top of my head... I'll keep posting in this when I find/remember more: -Learn to fight crouched, especially with blue and yellow stance, your opponent has trouble parrying low blows and his sideways swings (which normally are the most effective) will simply zip over your head.... BTW, you can also quickly do a blue lunge from a crouching, fighting position. -Use downward hacks (not piracy reference btw, hehe) to hit a person crouched, or go crouch yourself. Another trick is to do a sideways red swing then crouch to hit him really hard. -If you go for maximum damage with yellow, a trick is to quickly do 3 or 4 sideways (horizontal) slashes in sequence. On an unprotected back, this can cause upwards to 90 damage in the space of 1.5 secs. -When fighting red users, dont be afraid of their range, move in quickly from the side if they do a big horizontal swing or wait till they have *just* finished their slash(or sequence). It's a bit of risky to play it that way, since you have to stepdance right at the edge of their maximum range allowance, but it can be done. -Though not very courageous, simply bail out when something unexpected comes your way by jumping high, backwards, don't try to look cool by blocking something you can't. -Keep your eyes on your opponent, or know where he is at least, all the time. -Block what you have time to block, and what you KNOW you can block. *Never* trust your blocking 100%, it can fail due to lag etc, especially when that red swing comes your way. The better way to avoid getting hit is simply not to be where your enemy is swinging his saber. This does, of course, not mean you have to be a chicken. -A tactic can be used against manic blue-users which requires you to do a backwards retreat, but never leaving your opponent out of sight. Do this, while employing the best swings necessary to hit him, (I'm still pondering over the best swings here, help needed). Spinning blue users can knock you dead in seconds if you let them near you, so don't try fighting them in close quarters while rubbing elbows with them, unless you know what you're doing (Which I still don't LOL).... -Avoid using the spinning moves in yellow and red stance, except maybe in very close quarters where your opponent *might* get mauled by them. These spinning moves take far too much time to do (very true for yellow ones) and they can only hit your enemy once in that timeframe, not more times just because they're neat to look at. -Avoid using the yellow finisher or DFA, unless you're sure of what you're doing: Use a blue lunge on an immobile finisher, and also on the DFA if you have the time. Otherwise, kick or slash them. The same can be true for lunges, where it sometimes is easy to get to the back of the lungist and strike him. Or simply sidekick him. -The *slightest* GLANCE of a lunge is enough to disable your enemy's saber, since it will be knocked away from him and he has to recover for some time. Use this to your advantage to simply rush him while he is in recovery and unable to strike. -Don't try to lunge unless you are sure that your opponent cannot get behind your lunging a** and strike you. Appendix: Lunge: Blue special, "uppercut" Yellow finisher: Yellow special, "Yellow DFA" DFA: Red special, "tasty looking übermove that fails to hit most of the time, but which people use anyway like there's no tomorrow" The "Be absolutely sure"-mantra, should be taken with modesty of course, since it's a hectic fight and it's impossible to do so. It's merely meant to be taken as a sort of warning. Important EDIT - People, donate your own tips to this thread, I didn't intend to keep this thing to myself... Sorry if it got misunderstood that way... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jah Warrior Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 Cjais gotta agree on all points made mate, they are dead right! If its cool with you can i add a little? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 7, 2002 Author Share Posted August 7, 2002 Originally posted by Jah Warrior If its cool with you can i add a little? (FFS, I forgot to write this...) Hell yes Jah!!! Damn, ok, everyone is of course allowed to come with their own tips.... Christ, I realize I shouldn't have written the part about me coming with more tips..... Bring it on people! YAY! EDIT - Credit where credit is due: All of these tips I learned fighting against other people of course, and the forum people here knows already if they have contributed to this thread by teaching me something new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Blackrose Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 cjais, good players can lunge while running (without scripts, might I add), and I am one of them. All it requires is a little manual dexterity, and a little luck. While running, tap duck and attack at the same time. For those who are not too nimble on the fingers, hold shift for a nanosecond to slow down so you don't roll. It seems to be easier to do on JediMod as well as 1.04. Also, a little bit of things I have picked up on: Blue spammers, aka n00bing blue: Use medium stance against these idiots and you should be fine. Keep your distance, loop around to his back, and plug him. Rolling is always a good option. Roll a lot: Rolling past strong attacks as well as faking someone out is always a good technique to pick up on. Backstab - It is still useful!: At least in the light stance, it is. If you know that someone just jumped behind you or you are rolling across that strong stancer that just opened himself up, switch to light stance and lance that saber out backwards. The attack is still pretty effective and catches people off guard to this day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 7, 2002 Author Share Posted August 7, 2002 Originally posted by Rad Blackrose cjais, good players can lunge while running (without scripts, might I add), and I am one of them. All it requires is a little manual dexterity, and a little luck. While running, tap duck and attack at the same time. For those who are not too nimble on the fingers, hold shift for a nanosecond to slow down so you don't roll. It seems to be easier to do on JediMod as well as 1.04. Now, I've heard about this thing, and thought it was a sort of urban myth.. Thanks for clearing it up, and revealing it. Jah, you might want to take a look at this... About rolling: I thought about doing a thread which discusses things you should *not* do in a duel, like fleeing or jumping all the time so no one can hit each other. Of course, rolling in a modest amount is cool, but doing it to an excessive amount (clem, I know you're reading this LOL) is a bit annoying.... Just a warning so as not to piss people off. BTW, when people see ME roll a lot, I'm actually trying (and failing miserably) to *crouch*... It's just that I'm not very good at pausing during a run and therefore end up rolling all over the place like a moron... Clem, is that the same you do? Curious.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jah Warrior Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 I thought it'd be fine but didnt want to hijack the thread. Anyways my tips are more to do with the positioning in the game. When attacking someone never ever run straight at them, if you run to the left of the opponent it gives you longer reach. (similar to forehand swing as in tennis) If you see players that use Red almost exclusively, they will want a lot of space usually, always look for this, and simply steam in with blue stance, and crowd them. Red stance takes so long to wind up a swing you will get two hits or more before the red player can even get a shot off. and as cjais says, you can duck any incoming red horizontal swings. Jumping, can be a good way to get yourself killed. Remember that while jumping blocking is far less effective, and an experienced player will take advantage of this. Use the arena to advantage if you can. if there are obstacles, make them work for you, for example in the pits in the pit map and carbon map, remember that they are easily rolled over, and you can get up close to your enemy very quickly. Use posts and pillars to enable you to jump in unexpected directions which will certainly disorientate the opponent, Use the momentum. yellow and red stance seem to feel as if they have weight and you can use this feeling of momentum to time a roll at the end of a yellow or red combo, It literally sends you flying, and well out of harms way at a potentially vulnerable moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 Very impressive Jais. I couldn't have said any of it better myself. Apparently you and I think the same way when it comes to dueling. The only thing I can add, is never assume your opponent will show any honour at all. Once the sabers have been lit (with the exception of chat killing) anything and everything goes. Caius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark_ZONE Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 I have a question . . No FORCE means no kicking or throwing or excessive height in jumping . . is this right? . . Oh and of course no walking up walls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 7, 2002 Author Share Posted August 7, 2002 Originally posted by Dark_ZONE I have a question . . No FORCE means no kicking or throwing or excessive height in jumping . . is this right? . . Oh and of course no walking up walls. Well, I'm in a hurry.. but here goes... It certainly means no throw, but jumping can be enabled for all I care, it gives it that "crouching tiger feeling" when you're both flying around.... Add to that, that you can wallrun and flip away from pipes etc (like jah said, I reckon) and the fight generally gets cooler looking. I didn't include kicking tips, but I might add them later... It's just I feel kicks doesn't prove anything, anyone can do them and win because of it. Jah's server has it right IMHO (You can do kicks, but they only give 1 dam ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
<>Phant0m<> Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 Most of my tactics in NF duels are purely psychological. Example 1- - These are my 1st rules in my book of dueling Never underestimate your opponent! Doing this leads to fatal consequences as you would treat him as somebody thats quite new to the game, performing moves that you wouldnt try on an experenced player. Never overestimate your opponent! This isnt as bad as underestimating, but still can be harmful especially when most newcomers to this game seem to choose Light stance, this being the most random stance is easy to defeat but if you dont keep your cool they will get the upperhand by being in your face swinging and slashing slowly weaning your health away. Expect the unexpected! If it looks like they will do a Dfa, charge a red attack and let them fly past you gracefully while following them down with your sabre, that equals a good 60 or more health removed. If they are experenced and you know this, let them test you with Dfa bluffs, but be prepared to attack when they do perform the Dfa and look for the signs in that players style of how and when he is most likely to do it again. Example 2- Test your enemys knowledge of sabre dueling, if you are both standing still opposite eachother, get as close as you can to him while showing wot sabre stance your currently using, seeing how he reacts to you being so close in a certain stance shows his knowledge of the sabre, or he could bluff you in to thinking hes new so you would underestimate him, that in most circumstances is fatal. Example 3- Getting the enemy angry is a plus for you as they will do things without thinking about the consequences, like Dfa in pure rage, a kick to thier behind will increase thier random attacks. Unless he/she is an experenced player and realizes that rage will not help you unless its combined with tactical play. This happenes to me every so often when i fight an experenced kick spammer or Sabre script user, the key is too calm down but keep the agressive attacks continuous, dont give them time to breathe. Example 4- Countering stances. Countering Red I personally have mastered red so i can usually counter red with red, but recently i met a person that countered my red with yellow (never happened b4, so i can only think it will happen again at some point) to beat this new nemesis i had to match his style and find weaknesses. In the end if i remeber correctly he left himself open occasionally to yellow strafe attacks (continous Horizontal attacks) and i beat him everytime after that. But learning your enemys Technique and Routines quickly saves you health, if hes very good with red stance either match it with red or try to counter it with the speed of yellow or blue, be sure to choose the option that you're most comfortable with, as you dont want to make any mistakes due to fumbling with your keysetup. Countering Yellow or Blue Im putting these both together only cus of thier speed compaired to red. I handle these people with care as they can work quickly, an experenced Yellow user could hack you down fast due to skill and speed. I try to place them in a path where you could predict where they are going to be when your sabre reaches the peak damage point, getting this right is a skill alone, and proves most deadly as it only takes 3 or 4 hit and thier killed. I would add some more but i dont wanna give away too much Plus i got a train to catch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 7, 2002 Author Share Posted August 7, 2002 Excellent tips everyone! I'd write a better reply, but right now I'm off to hermes to test out the techniques! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twins of Doom Posted August 7, 2002 Share Posted August 7, 2002 i'd say something but most of them have already been said.... but maybe this page will have a couple (don't blame me on spelling i never bothered to spell check it:P) http://jkhq.ath.cx/tips.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Blackrose Posted August 8, 2002 Share Posted August 8, 2002 Well, I play a loose counter style, which exclusively means (me vs player) red vs yellow, yellow vs blue, and blue vs red. Once in a while I change stances, but the counter style has done well for me. It also involves a lot of reading slashes and stationary positions. It also feels good to nail a person who gives their move signals away... *cough lunge cough* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thehomicidalegg Posted August 8, 2002 Share Posted August 8, 2002 just dont fight in a pattern, cuz when your opponent figures out that pattern, you are stuffed. Be unpredictable but not without a plan. personally i like to switch alot between yellow and red. the difference in speed surprise alot of the players especially when the change in stance is undetected. dont use red stance if you are going to spam the attack button and use yellow to surprise and counter or to push an opponent back. Also its good to make your opponent believe you are doing something you are not, for example try crouching in blue stance and tricking your opponent in believing you are gonna lunge then hit him with something totally different. This sometimes also makes your opponent feel over confident and do something stupid:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leXX Posted August 8, 2002 Share Posted August 8, 2002 Great tips there Jais! I used them last night and I must say, my game has very much improved! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 8, 2002 Author Share Posted August 8, 2002 Thank you guys for all the input, greatly appreciated! Rad, about that running lunge of yours: You don't have to be a good player to do it, and I'm here to prove the point ... It's a very well guarded secret, but not all that hard to do, once you get the trick. It's all about key setup, or using the walk technique you described. But I believe the move somewhat ruins the risk element of lunge, since you can just spam it, and your opponent will never see it coming.... Again, I must say I don't believe in using a specific stance against another specific stance, and then sticking to the idea like glue, but that's purely my opinion -don't get flamy. Another tip: Since this isn't 1.03 anymore, try getting behind your enemy at all costs! Not only will he be unable to block your attacks, he also won't be able to strike back at you. A good example is when fighting very close to your opponent, try employing a mutated version of the old "circle-strafe" to get behind him: Twist your mouse and try getting to the fleshy, unprotected back of your enemy by strafing around him like mad... Hard to describe, but I'm sure most of you have already done this unconsciously. I've somewhat given up on the idea of using only medium stance, and can only recommend using all the stances guys - this goes double to you red junkies reading this *lol*. It gives more flexibility, and your enemy will be more confused, since he doesn't know what to expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rad Blackrose Posted August 8, 2002 Share Posted August 8, 2002 Since this isn't 1.03 anymore, try getting behind your enemy at all costs! Not only will he be unable to block your attacks, he also won't be able to strike back at you. A good example is when fighting very close to your opponent, try employing a mutated version of the old "circle-strafe" to get behind him: Twist your mouse and try getting to the fleshy, unprotected back of your enemy by strafing around him like mad... Hard to describe, but I'm sure most of you have already done this unconsciously. Actually, this is true only based on the server settings. I know one server had certain g_ commands flipped to on and thus almost 99% of all attacks were blockable, even from behind. So it wasn't 1.03 to blame, it was in fact server fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted August 8, 2002 Author Share Posted August 8, 2002 Oh, I was just referrering to the constant backstabs in 1.03 (you might have heard of them ), but I see your point... It actually IS possible to block attacks from the rear, and that is disgusting in my humble opinion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jah Warrior Posted August 12, 2002 Share Posted August 12, 2002 A point i would like to raise in regard to NF SO duels etc with the jedimod1.2 mod is fighting different size players. Fighting yodas is a tricky affair, they are so damn tiny its really hard to land a normal swing on them. So I find myself using many many power moves so that when i finally do manage to hit the little beggers it at least takes a good whack of damage from them. Backstab doesnt really work too well on them, but in the rare occasion that one actaully lands on them it will all but kill them. If the server admin has skill mode set to 1 (headshots count for more) then using a tall model against these titchy terrors is a good idea as they will find it hard to attack you in the head area and if you do hit them it most likely will clip them in the head top. Which is always nice! When fighting giants like Chewie for example, I usually go for low hits, and used crouched attacks, this is because most swings a wookie model makes will fly above your head, and the spinning blue move is extremely effective for dealing with these huge walking carpets. Also its a lot weasier to roll round the back of the larger lumbering models so that you can fairly easily get a few hits on them from the rear. Also the overhead yellow finisher works very well against tall models, the reason being that the blade really does make a great deal of contact and therefore a heck of a lot of damage. Take advantage of the fact that these large models are slower and make your attacks swift and deadly. when i think of more I'll add it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
druid Posted August 12, 2002 Share Posted August 12, 2002 *LOL* Jah...this most certainly brings back some good memories - hehe. Good points you made.....remind me not to use walking carpets again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodrodius Posted August 13, 2002 Share Posted August 13, 2002 A few well timed diagonal retreating red slashes when a Blue Spammer begins to sping wildly will almost always take care of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jah Warrior Posted August 13, 2002 Share Posted August 13, 2002 Originally posted by Woodrodius A few well timed diagonal retreating red slashes when a Blue Spammer begins to sping wildly will almost always take care of them. good point there, i use the spinning blue style, and those are the swings that get through and kill me LOL. The yellow retreating swings also work wonders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LivingSacrifice Posted August 13, 2002 Share Posted August 13, 2002 Lots of good things here. My game has also improved quite a bit I must say. Although yellow is my style of choice, I have been practicing the red and am getting better: TIMING is everything with red. Peace Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teutonicknight Posted August 13, 2002 Share Posted August 13, 2002 Wow, very good tatics cjais ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harkonnen Posted August 14, 2002 Share Posted August 14, 2002 Hi guys. I just read this thread and i have to say a few things. Some of the tips here are in deed very usefull but most of them are really crap if we have the kicks enabled. Still havent figured out if you guys are talking about strategies without kicking but as far as my exp. goes.... the championships have kicks enabled and i really dont care much about strats without kicking (i hate kicks but have no other choice). I have to admit, i am a red styler. I hate yellows and blue stance. Acording to some of the tips here i should loose most of the time. the fact is... i don't. Now, of corse we all loose. Time to time, its pretty natural. Even the champion does. Red style, yes. The slow movements. To play a decent red style nothing is more important as practice. Any fool can play a blue stance and lucky win the fight. Just spam attacks all over the place. But to beat with red, you will need more than luck. Ill jut post one strategie i have found recently that is not dangerous against experienced players but it is really very funny. In red style we can make easy the 360 degrees movement after a swing. Now, imagine that you're opponent is far away from you and you want to do the unexpected. Make a swing and jump torwards you're opponent (doesnt matter the distance) (at this point you have to calculate the timing you use for the 360 attack move (right or left + crouch + attack)). Time for the surprise. You will make the same movement on air, wich means a 360 degrees flying attack against you're opponent. Of course, it will be extremely dificult to hit him but we wont be expecting the movement and shorelly he wont be expecting the next step. Just before hitting the ground make the DFA attack. The difference bettwen a dfa after a normal strike and a 360 degree attack is that you will control better the dfa in the 360 attack right? So imagine a flying DFA..................................................... Try to make that one. Its extremely dificult to pull but it can make serious damage. Now for the rest of the strats... you can crouch... you can hide... what ever you do. The thing that have ruined this game haves a name... it is 1.04 and none of those strats can deal with a serious kicker that can make kicks in diagonals, etc.... In fact in this days to win champs... thats the first thing you need to dominate. Once again.... i hate kicks but i was forced to train them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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