C'jais Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by Dark Cloak Well hey, if the dualblade and dual sabers are going to be more powerful...perhaps it will force the single saber people to have to rely on skill rather than random blocking. They can't really do anything apart from random blocking, can they? Not when Annie and his two sabers come flailing at them. We're not Dooku, fer chrissakes. Tell me, what would pick of the three different kinds of sabers, if winning was your goal? Why should I pick one saber, if I can have two at the same time? Why would I want to get voluntarily owned each and every time I played multiplayer, even if it meant I could use a single saber? You know, just moving the mouse around and autoblocking everything. Blocking, exactly, for that's all you can do against some newbie with two sabers. How about attacking? How do you expect us to hit a guy with two sabers for blocking? Here, I can do the math: 1 saber = X blocking ability and X damage capability. 2 sabers = 2X blocking ability and 2X damage capability. In short: why would I want a single saber, when I can have twice the damage and twice the blocking power by simply picking two? I personally can't wait to use a double-bladed lightsaber...WOOOO! Neither can I, but I still wanna know how Raven intends to balance all this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Cloak Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 *hops* Why do you hope single saber has advantages? it's like...not supposed to. Wouldn't the idea behind have two sabers and a double bladed one be that those are MORE advantageous? I like single saber, too...but balance isn't everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Dogg Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by HertogJan I liked the way they implemented the two sabers in EPII: only a few seconds. I really hope a single saber will have many advantages over the duel/double sabers. My thoughts exactly. By the way, there's obviously a pattern of saber gimmicks in the movies - EP 1: Darth Maul's double saber, EP 2: Anakin wielding two sabers. Both in the duel scenes. I wonder what George & Co. come up with for EP 3... Wielding two double sabers, perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by Dark Cloak *hops* Why do you hope single saber has advantages? it's like...not supposed to. I see your point, man. It's for the same reason that the main character can always take more damage than the baddies - it's not realistic, but otherwise he'd be badly overpowered and there'd be no point to playing the game. Like this. There's no point in even make a single saber an option, if all people are going to do is exploit what works best. And trust me, people always do that - backstabs, kicks, red stance etc. Wouldn't the idea behind have two sabers and a double bladed one be that those are MORE advantageous? I like single saber, too...but balance isn't everything. I admit it, I'm a balance nut. Sorry for flaring up like I did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HertogJan Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 This is an idea: Ppl with two lightsabers can't use forcepowers that require your hand, like pull, push, grip, lightning, drain, mindtrick etc. Only passive ones and powers like speed. Ppl with a double bladed saber can choose two stances: one strong with two hands on the hilt (no hand free for force powers), and one light stance where you weild the saber with 1 hand, and you're able to use force powers. This light stance does less damage though. Oh and it's not so much the singleplayer I'm worried about, but the multiplayer. You know why SP saber fights where cooler? Because your enemies were weaker. Online everyone has the same health to begin with. When you put an über weapon like duel lightsabers there, everyone's going to use it, like they did with the DFA and then it isn't very fun to fight anymore... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
possumking Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Im guessing that jk3 is going to have an online session also. Correct me if im wrong. If it does will you choose which kind of saber you will use (2 sabers, 1, duelsaber) or will you have to get it some other way? :saberb: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 As far as i'm concerned, they can do what they like with the multiplayer saber system provided it remains balance. But I don't want to see a repeat of Guns vs Sabers like in JK2. I played JK and JK2 for Full Force Guns, its what I like, and its what I do best. I occasionally used the saber when the situation demanded, and it was fun, but nothing beats the adrenaline of mid-air force-enhanced gunfights. So, make the saber combat great, but don't forget about the gunners, and please don't make a class system where Gunners can't use the force like a certain mod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteShdw Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Thanks for all the answers you've been giving here ChangKhan. I was also wondering one thing. Will you be tweaking the AI on some of the gun users at all? I really loved fighting the saber wielders in JK2. They AI on those guys was just so much fun. I spent endless hours just spawning and fighting reborns. But there was one thing missing in JK2 and that was a gun user that could hold his own against a Jedi with his lightsaber. With the increased focus on saber battles in JKIII it might be a nice change of pace to have some gun users with the same type of intelligence of saberwielders. Something along the same lines of Jango Fett in Episode II. A bounty hunter NPC or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK_Nutritious Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I haven't really posted on jk3 yet, but seeing as how this thread is going I thought I'd throw in a few thoughts of mine: 1. Make the demo viewer so you can use keyboard buttons without exiting the demo. I've made several videos using jk2 and the most frustrating thing is not being able to use commands during demo playback. It would be a great help if just the esc button would exit the demo instead of every button. 2. More of a gameplay issue: push/pull in gametypes like ctf can get rediculous at times as you only have to aim in the general direction of the enemy (most likely flag carrier) for it to take effect. I think it would be a lot more balanced if you had to aim at the enemy (inside crosshair) for the push/pull to take effect. At least now it takes some practice and effort to do correctly. 3. Perhaps have separate saber system in ctf (maybe just all weapon ctf) than duel or other gametypes. What happened in the patches in jk2 was at 1.02 any weapon, including saber, was viable to get kills in a fast-paced game. Later, in 1.04, saber's damage was scaled way down making it a totally obsolete weapon in ctf except for the occasional blocking of blaster bolts if you're the flag carrier. That's all I can think of for now. I really did enjoy playing jk2, I just feel these are some important issues brought about by it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by DeTRiTiC-iQ So, make the saber combat great, but don't forget about the gunners, and please don't make a class system where Gunners can't use the force like a certain mod. I don't know if we should apply this to multiplayer as well, but they do mention that the game will be primarily focused on the saber - something about 70% to 30%, I believe. Make of it what you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Dogg Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 That bounty hunter (or some other gun wielder) NPC -idea's pretty cool, WhiteShdw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Com Raven Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 CVG is not very reliable... According to them, Microsoft has by now bought Sega, Vivendi and BioWare.... And none of it is true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by C'jais I don't know if we should apply this to multiplayer as well, but they do mention that the game will be primarily focused on the saber - something about 70% to 30%, I believe. Make of it what you will. my entire post was referring to multiplayer. I'm perfectly happy to just use the saber in singleplayer, that's where the saber is fun. But multiplayer Jedi Knight has always been a completely different ball game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by DeTRiTiC-iQ my entire post was referring to multiplayer. I'm perfectly happy to just use the saber in singleplayer, that's where the saber is fun. But multiplayer Jedi Knight has always been a completely different ball game. Time for a change? I don't know, but I'd prefer if guns still played a part in multiplayer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarteX Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 I think the advantage for using a single saber is that u hit harder with it bcoz u wield it with 2 hands, which makes it easier 2 break somebodys defense. This seems logical 2 me. Try breaking a crate with a stick, weilding it like a single saber and then try 2 break it while holding ur hands in the middle of the stick, using it like a double bladed saber. The crate will probably break better while using it like a single saber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ro D'Jinn Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 i find it highly amusing reading this thred, i mean, i just play the game, all this technobabble, i just sit here giggling to myself but the oooooohhhness of double sabres, the screen shots are sooooo good, from the sounds of it it's gonna be a bit morrowind-ish from the shots of choosing your chariters race/sex etc, and the whole you do some missions whenever you want but some you have to do in a certain sequence thing, but i love morrowind so i'm not complaining! Ro D'Jinn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacky_Baccy Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Posted by Com Raven CVG is not very reliable... According to them, Microsoft has by now bought Sega, Vivendi and BioWare.... And none of it is true! I honestly can't tell if you're kidding or not CVG seem to have got their info about JK3 from Activision Europe, so I'd be pretty confident of it ...And have you got a link to this "Microsoft buys Sega, Vivendi and BioWare" article? I'd love to read it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeTRiTiC-iQ Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by WarteX I think the advantage for using a single saber is that u hit harder with it bcoz u wield it with 2 hands, which makes it easier 2 break somebodys defense. This seems logical 2 me. Try breaking a crate with a stick, weilding it like a single saber and then try 2 break it while holding ur hands in the middle of the stick, using it like a double bladed saber. The crate will probably break better while using it like a single saber Except lightsabers just cut through pretty much anything, so the power of the blow shouldn't make a lot of difference... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKPiggott Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Mike, any chance you could keep a lot more elements soft-coded for us SP editors? It'll be great if the player model, saber colour and other little bits could be modified in some sort of DAT file or through ICARUS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T-Dogg Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by DeTRiTiC-iQ Except lightsabers just cut through pretty much anything, so the power of the blow shouldn't make a lot of difference... ...except when fighting against an opponent who also has a saber. Think about it: against anything else, the swinging power doesn't matter, since the saber cuts through everything, but against another saber - they're equal, just like hitting a metal stick with another identical metal stick. Who swings his/her stick with more power, wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wardz Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Hey Mike Will you be making the film locales for MP? Things like Cloud City and a carbon freeze chamber that actually lets you freeze people? -W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anakin1607 Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 This game is a dream come true! RPG like character creation! One, two or double lightsabers! Better graphics! 70% saber fighting! New and improved force powers! A new Dark Jedi like threat! This is going to rock! Oh, I did have one question for the developer. Will we see a greater number of "special" saber attacks in addition to the basic ones? The moves like (Lightstance, face away, stab straight back), (Middlestance, face away, spining one hand slash), and (Heavystance, move, jump, attack, HUGE cut down) were among the most stylish and powerful moves. It'd be so cool to have moves like that for the dual and double saber! And will the realistic saber option still be availible? That ruled! Thanks for making this game! You guys are heroes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryudom Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 In short: why would I want a single saber, when I can have twice the damage and twice the blocking power by simply picking two? why wouldn't there be advantages to having a single blade? if anything, i single blade should be more powerfull then others, if your going for RL effects. you can EASILY parry and push through peoples blades if you have one saber instead of two. you have twice the power, more speed and way more control. i'm sure raven will balance things out, i myself am planning on using single bladed most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 Originally posted by ryudom why wouldn't there be advantages to having a single blade? if anything, i single blade should be more powerfull then others, if your going for RL effects. Well, I'm expecting this really isn't a problem, and that Raven will make balance changes, but I was merely curious about said balance changes would consist of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
possumking Posted April 1, 2003 Share Posted April 1, 2003 what im wondering is if you can use force push, pull, choke or any other force power that you need to have a free hand to do, while using i double bladed saber or 2 sabers. If your hands are occupied could you really do those? maybe thats the catch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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