[MOD] EAW: Open Conflict

[rocketeer]

Umh your aware that in a unmodded game the nebulon is as strong as a acclamator, and the assault frigate actually quite capable of fighting the victory? Not to mention that the rebels advance faster cause there is less tech to steal? You cant compare this to a vanilla game, compare it to the current version of the mod, cause it has a hell of a lot different ship stats.

 

Just tried a unmodded game, a single nebulon wipes the floor with a level 1 station, i dont think we can compare that with our situation now can we?

 

Edit: And victory cruisers where barely bigger then acclamators, 3 nebulons could probably kill one easily in a unmodded game, tbh i remember killing them with 2 nebulons if i managed to get behind them. In any case its just a completly different situation.

 

And now im really out of this. This discussion is pointless, because we simply have a difference pov and would keep arguing forever.

[Tal Odo-ki]

@Tal: You can't compare the unmodded game to the one we have now using my mod. Every ship has been tweaked, some quite drastically. And to be honest... I think I'm out of this too...

Well, since the AI in GC is so lame, and patch 1.03 won't fix the AI, the issue is moot. Guess I'll be playing Oblivion next week. Since I don't play MP games, and I'm not fond of one-off skirmishes, I've just exhausted the replayability of this game. sigh

 

Thanks, Adonnay, for all the very hard work you've done. One look at the hardpoints file is enough to see the massive amount of effort you've put into this.

[shadoe]

Oh my god I just made a propostition of what I see as a logic tech tree. I said that the Assault frigate Mk2 should be made a better battleship as the Venator, being able to defeat a Venator not counting the Venator's fighters. Keeping in mind the rebels have separately buildable fighters, the Mk2 with fighter support should be more than a match for a Venator.

I mean the rebels should be focuse on fighters and the Empire on Cap ships. But now, the rebels have: corvette, gunship, nebulon, mk2, venator, mc80, liberty vs tartan, acclamator, victory, interdictor and ISD. That is 7 vs 5 for the rebels and the interdictor is a specialised ship with no real fighting power. That is too many bigs ships for the "fighter-oriented" rebellion.

Plus I feel strongly that the Venator has its place in the "stardestroyer" type imperial wedge-shaped vessels line. We should not forget, the Galactic republic transformed into the Empire, and we see Darth Vader and the Emperor in the last scene of ep 3 on venators which now have the plain white colours of the Imperial Navy instead of being couloured like in the Republic Navy.

 

But this was only my opinion and u should not take it personally. Please Addonay, do not give up the great work u put into this Mod.

[Adonnay]

I didn't really take it personally... it's just that I only realized that there will be no end to this. There's always something that must be done to ensure a good balance, or someone complaining the balance needs work (while others say it's good as it is). And I don't really want to change the balance over and over again... each time you have to change your playstyle a little and can't really get used to the balance as it is since it changes again in the next release. I think I will leave the ships as they are now for a while so people can get used to it (and probably notice that the balance isn't that bad).I'll concentrate on fixes and smaller issues and implement new stuff, if I can think of anything that is...

[Meethos]

I didn't really take it personally... it's just that I only realized that there will be no end to this. There's always something that must be done to ensure a good balance, or someone complaining the balance needs work (while others say it's good as it is). And I don't really want to change the balance over and over again... each time you have to change your playstyle a little and can't really get used to the balance as it is since it changes again in the next release. I think I will leave the ships as they are now for a while so people can get used to it (and probably notice that the balance isn't that bad).I'll concentrate on fixes and smaller issues and implement new stuff, if I can think of anything that is...

Wow, looks like I missed an interesting week.

 

Well, now that balancing is done for awhile, it will make it easier to finish the tables.

 

Been playing 009, I like the changes, specifically to the fighters.

 

Um one small inconsistinecy I noticed, was that all the fighter squadrons have 12 in them now except Red Squadron. Perhaps this was intentional. I'd say give them some regular X-Wing wingmates to bring them up to 12.

 

Keep up the great work.

[rocketeer]

Oh my god I just made a propostition of what I see as a logic tech tree. I said that the Assault frigate Mk2 should be made a better battleship as the Venator, being able to defeat a Venator not counting the Venator's fighters. Keeping in mind the rebels have separately buildable fighters, the Mk2 with fighter support should be more than a match for a Venator.

I mean the rebels should be focuse on fighters and the Empire on Cap ships. But now, the rebels have: corvette, gunship, nebulon, mk2, venator, mc80, liberty vs tartan, acclamator, victory, interdictor and ISD. That is 7 vs 5 for the rebels and the interdictor is a specialised ship with no real fighting power. That is too many bigs ships for the "fighter-oriented" rebellion.

Plus I feel strongly that the Venator has its place in the "stardestroyer" type imperial wedge-shaped vessels line. We should not forget, the Galactic republic transformed into the Empire, and we see Darth Vader and the Emperor in the last scene of ep 3 on venators which now have the plain white colours of the Imperial Navy instead of being couloured like in the Republic Navy.

 

But this was only my opinion and u should not take it personally. Please Addonay, do not give up the great work u put into this Mod.

 

Please note that there already is a empire venator in this mod for skirmish, all you have to do is to activate it, and deactivate the rebel one. And while vader and the emperor used this ship, it was also used by general kenobi and other jedis. The only fact abouts its usage we have, is that its the direct predecesor of the ISD, and went out of service in favour of it. The empire wanted big intimidating ships like the ISD class and the various SSDs(And the deathstars obviously). Fighters where not that important for empire, they served as protection for capital ships and did garrison duty.

 

The whole way the empire treats fighters as throw away objects, and the simple fact that they mothballed the Venators(and didnt just stop producing them) even though it was a by far superior carrier than a ISD, shows imho that the empire neither has the will nor a reason to use this shiptype. The empire is about using interdictor cruisers(not just the lowly one we have ingame, there where even SSD versions of them later on) to prevent their prey to get away, and ISDs to squash their enemies like flys.

 

Then again this game is hardly canon and if you feel the venator belongs to the empire side its easy to do, just keep in mind that the ship is a successor design of the Victory, and the direct predecessor of the ISD. Hell the victory wasnt even in any of the movies afaik, its just EU that tells us it came before the venator, so do like you want .

 

Edit: And the assault frigate being a better battleship than the venator just makes no sense.

 

Compare this

http://www.starwars.com/databank/starship/republicattackcruiser/index.html

to this

http://www.starwars.com/databank/starship/assaultfrigate_ii/index.html

 

So the assault frigate is a refitted version of a design that was already long outdated even before the clonewars started. According to tal while its weapons got stronger and their shields got a boost too it seems, they are just in a different class then the venator. Just compare the armament the ships have on those sites ...

[Adonnay]

I decided to strike the leading '0' and call the new version v. 1.0a

 

changes in 1.0a:

- set the ISD to tech level 4 as planned (and forgotten in 010)

- added another reserve bomber squadron to the Judicator to bring it in line with the rest of the Acclamator fleet

- addded another 6 fighters to Red Squadron to bring it to a total of 12 units

- to emphasize the relative new design of the Nebulon B compared to the others the Nebulon has gotten an accuracy upgrade against all ship classes. It should now do good especially against those Tartans and (in numbers) even against Acclamators.

 

None of the changes tested, since I'm in a hurry right now - please provide me with any feedback you can. Thanks!

 

-> Version 1.0a <-

[shadoe]

I know in the EU an Assault Firgate is no match for the Venator.. I was just thinking balance-wise for the game. Well, no problem. It was just an ideea. If I want my tech tree I can make the changes myself. So forget it.

 

About what Meethos said... both Vader's Squadron and Red Squadron are smaller than 12. Is any fix possible?

[Adonnay]

Forgot about Vaders squad... :/

 

Edit: And it seems the Y-Wings have some formation problems...

[Adonnay]

quick fix for both above mentionned problems.

[Empirecitizen]

This mod is great and fit GC and skirmish very well. I love all these strong fighters(especially the new X-wing and tie advanced) and the strong capital ships.

 

So I decided redo the empire campaign. (only on medium because I was just wanting to see how the campaign feel with this mod)

The ground battle deffintely feels better with the new at-st so there's nothing much to comment on that except being excellent.

But the space battle is a bit wierd for the empire tech 1. The only space combat unit buildable is the tartan. As I had only on acclamator and Vader's squad, even a Lv2 rebel station is quite a headache(That means I have very little fighter and bomber support while attacking a station with a single cap ship). Of course, I could bring in a swarm of tartan with a loads of them as reinforcement. But that is 1.expensive(although there's lots of credit to waste) 2. nothing near fun.

The rebles shouldnt have that much problem because they can build a lot of X-&Y-wing in tech 1 which are very effective.

That is not a very big problem as the mod is not meant for the campaign and the player can eventually live through it(problem solved when tech is upgraded)

If u have the time, please add one or two acclamator to the empire's initial fleet in the campaign.(or u have other ways to solve it) If you dont have the time, just dont bother to do it and improve the mod on what it is meant for.

 

Once again, thanks for the mod.

[rocketeer]

@Adonnay:

 

Im going to play around with the changes a bit now, once the mod reached the point its pretty balanced, do you have any plans on trying to mod th eAI a bit? Nothing extravagant, just stuff like changing building priorities and fleet compositions if thats possible. It would be nice if we could prevent the AI from doing silly things like comissioning fleets out of lots of tie scouts, avengers and tartans with a sinlge acclamator .

[Tal Odo-ki]

I finished a "hard difficulty" GC Rebel campaign in just 17 game days and never got past tech 2. The GC AI is totally lame. The AI never built any stations above L1, never built any Acclamators (in spite of being able to, since I implemented all of shadoe's suggestions as a test), and never garrisoned any of its planets except Coruscant. I don't see how any of you have been having any challenge whatsoever playing GC. The SP campaigns are actually fun, and some of the missions are difficult to win. The GC is so pathetically easy it's utterly boring.

[Meethos]

I finished a "hard difficulty" GC Rebel campaign in just 17 game days and never got past tech 2. The GC AI is totally lame. The AI never built any stations above L1, never built any Acclamators (in spite of being able to, since I implemented all of shadoe's suggestions as a test), and never garrisoned any of its planets except Coruscant. I don't see how any of you have been having any challenge whatsoever playing GC. The SP campaigns are actually fun, and some of the missions are difficult to win. The GC is so pathetically easy it's utterly boring.

Try teching up and see if that changes the AI's behavior. On my GC the AI builds up to level 4 stations, never seen a level 5. And no they don't Garrison that many planets, but they do build like 4 light factories on a single planet, which can be interesting.

Otherwise I agree with you, the AI is not that agressive and often likes to spam Tartans in favor of anything else. I often see 1 victory, 1 broadside, 4 tie scouts and 32 tartans. Everyonce in awhile I'll come across are large fleet though containg 1 ISD and as many as 11 Victorys. Would be nice to have the resources to edit the AI.

 

Has anyone really tested the <AI_Combat_Power> to see if or how it affects the AI build queue??

 

Edited for spelling.

[rocketeer]

Try teching up and see if that changes the AI's behavior. On my GC the AI builds up to level 4 stations, never seen a level 5. And no they don't Garrison that many planets, but they do build like 4 light factories on a single planet, which can be interesting.

Otherwise I agree with you, the AI is not that agressive and often likes to spam Tartans in favor of anything else. I often see 1 victory, 1 broadside, 4 tie scouts and 32 tartans. Everyonce in awhile I'll come across are large fleet though containg 1 ISD and as many as 11 Victorys. Would be nice to have the resources to edit the AI.

 

Has anyone really tested the <AI_Combat_Power> to see if or how it affects the AI build queue??

 

Edited for spelling.

 

Yep thats exactly what i meant, its slightly better if you start galactic conquest on tech 5, i came up against lots of ISDs(well relatively speaking, up to two in a defense fleet, but this was right in the beginning), and while it seemed not to built lvl 5 stations it atleast used ISDs to protect its planets. And if you think 4 light factories are interesting i just had a battle against a planet with 4 AT-AT factories, barracks and 1 heavy factory, oh and this surface to survace weapon that likes to disable my artillery in very crucial moments . Needless to say i lost, but it cost him much.

 

Edit: I think the problem is that the AI is not aggressive enough, i wasnt even attacked once, even though he seemed to have plenty of stardestroyers, and i only had 2 capital ships. I agree though that acclamators are a bit rare, the AI really loves tartans and victorys though ...

 

Edit2: Could it be that the AI is "bright" enough to see that it doesnt need lvl 5 stations to built capital ships? It seems it favours mobile defense fleets over stationary defenses, so it might ignore the lvl 5 station as its a purely defensive building. Wouldnt be surprised if its hardcoded and the AI doesnt even take the combat_power of stations into account.

[SithJedi]

the pop points for the ships is way to high in gc

[wolfshadow]

Adonnay: I'll say this: I love the work that you have done with this mod. It's made the game much more interesting for me. The one good thing about an XML based mod... If you don't like somthing, get off your lazy butt and change it yourself. I really don't care about balance due to the kind of game that I play. ( I generally play Gal. Con. for fun for a few minutes at a time after work) So if someone doesn't like how you do something, ask where somthing is and change it yourself. That's what I've been doing. I generally edit the space defensive structures for a higher refire time than what everone likes. I edited the ATAT to make it more fearsome, 'cause that's what I like... Whatever strikes my fancy at the time.

 

Your mod has exteded the gameplay, and mad the game alot more interesting. I'll be interested to see what you do once we can get new models into the game.

 

Thanks for your hard work.

 

wolfshadow

[Ravenwing]

Ok, so it's my 1st post I think but I'm a long time lurker in here and I must say that I admire the amount of work you put into this mod Addonay. Actually it's the only way to play EAW for me now

 

For a change I'd like to point a little balancing problem on the ground. While I like your changes I'm not sure about point of T4-B tanks now. They seem to die awfully fast when faced with AT-ST. In my recent trials I was easily able to wipe out 3 T4-B tanks with 4 AT-STs without losses. Perhaps lowering firepower of AT-ST vs vehicles or upping armor on T4-B would be in order.

 

Just my 2 cents. Keep up the good work!

[magna mandaloe]

Adonnay I had 2 questions is it possible to make Gallofree transport and Merchant Freighter Buildable *Without causing it to crash* 2 how did you make Moldy crow so stable? 3 um would there to be a way to get Virago to work and Command Centers? *Basically if you wanted to build Elite Infantry or Planetary ships like Coreillian Corvette Tie- Fighter VSD X-wing etc?*

[Adonnay]

Ok, so it's my 1st post I think but I'm a long time lurker in here and I must say that I admire the amount of work you put into this mod Addonay. Actually it's the only way to play EAW for me now

 

For a change I'd like to point a little balancing problem on the ground. While I like your changes I'm not sure about point of T4-B tanks now. They seem to die awfully fast when faced with AT-ST. In my recent trials I was easily able to wipe out 3 T4-B tanks with 4 AT-STs without losses. Perhaps lowering firepower of AT-ST vs vehicles or upping armor on T4-B would be in order.

 

Just my 2 cents. Keep up the good work!

You're probably right... the T4Bs are a little weak right now... but mostly because I don't know where to put them because I can't see the rebels drive around in heavy tanks. For me they're always the small guerilla unit but that obviously wouldn't work in EAW... we'll see about that.

 

Adonnay I had 2 questions is it possible to make Gallofree transport and Merchant Freighter Buildable *Without causing it to crash* 2 how did you make Moldy crow so stable? 3 um would there to be a way to get Virago to work and Command Centers? *Basically if you wanted to build Elite Infantry or Planetary ships like Coreillian Corvette Tie- Fighter VSD X-wing etc?*

Gallowfree and the Shadowclaw (Merchant Freighter) can of course be made buildable. Easiest way is to take a working unit, copy it, rename it and change its model and icon... then slowly change the rest until you get it like you want it to, and don't forget to test between every step if it still works. Same with the Virago...

About the Moldy Crow... the question is more how did you get it unstable? Why don't you compare "my" Crow to yours and perhaps you find out what's wrong

 

About the Command Centre... not sure what you mean.

 

@Wolfshadow: I totally agree... while I try to please as many people as I can without sacrificing my own ideas/goals there's always gonna be more than enough people who don't like aspects of this mod (or the whole mod - but those are easy to please... don't use it). Many changes don't really require alot of knowledge and can be done within a few minutes. Just look into the XMLs and try it... you can easily make the game you want.

[magna mandaloe]

Adonny I seems that Calamari Cruiser has Ither been replaced in 9.0 verison with the Venator or something * I have mon Calamari but can't build cruiser.* Whats up with that just wanted to know.

[Koci]

Adonnay --> I have Vader x 2 (twice) in space battles with newest version and fix. Two icons with Vader, one Vader with "call wingman" possibility,

just info :-)

 

Best Regards

 

Koci

[Meethos]

Adonny I seems that Calamari Cruiser has Ither been replaced in 9.0 verison with the Venator or something * I have mon Calamari but can't build cruiser.* Whats up with that just wanted to know.

Thats odd, because I can buid them, have you built a level 5 Station? Have you researched them yet? Those are the only things I can think of why you can't build. I don't think Adonnay has ever touched the <Required_Planets> attribute on any of the ships.

 

Check your Spaceunitcapital.xml file and look at the Mon Cal ships the Required_Planets should read:

<Required_Planets>MonCalimari, Kuat, Fondor, Sullust</Required_Planets>

Are you able to build on the ships on the other planets? Hope that helps.

[Meethos]

Adonny I seems that Calamari Cruiser has Ither been replaced in 9.0 verison with the Venator or something * I have mon Calamari but can't build cruiser.* Whats up with that just wanted to know.

Thats odd, because I can buid them, have you built a level 5 Station? Have you researched them yet? Those are the only things I can think of why you can't build. I don't think Adonnay has ever touched the <Required_Planets> attribute on any of the ships.

 

Check your Spaceunitcapital.xml file and look at the Mon Cal ships the Required_Planets should read:

<Required_Planets>MonCalimari, Kuat, Fondor, Sullust</Required_Planets>

Are you able to build on the ships on the other planets? Hope that helps.

[K1ller]

Hello again,

 

I spent the whole weekend playing you MOD (older version 0.8d). I have some questions and suggestions, if I may.

 

1) I played the GC as the Empire on hard. The ground combat is REALLY a challenge. The biggest problem I found was that the initial landing spot allows you only 3-4 units capacity. Which allows only 1-2 AT-ATs. They do not have a chance against speeders, Plex slodiers and artillery atacking at once. But I think the strategy of superior numbers started to work and I can instantly replace the loses.

 

2) I thought there is Mara Jade in GC, but I have never got her. Why?

 

3) In every land battle I fought I saw 2 Kyle Katarns fighting me. But I think it is the problem of the game not the mod as I saw 2 Han Solos and 2 Chewbaccas in unmodded game as well.

 

4) Yesterday I tried the GC for the Rebels and I thought what the hell. It is so easy. First the AI does not build lvl2 and more space stations. It even seems not to build capital ships. Is there some way to tell AI to build something? The second problem is that I can take 9 units to make a raid. So I take all my heroes (Han, Chewie, Kyle and Ben Kenobi) + some speeders and Infiltrators I have a nearly invincible army which is not limited by the unit capacity of the "normal" landing. Can you please make the limit back to 3 units?

 

When I finsh the current GC I am looking forward to test the new MOD version.

 

And please excuse me if some these question has already been answered, I am at work and can not read all messages here.