Guest Chillin Posted June 21, 2000 Share Posted June 21, 2000 Master, actually man is coming pretty close to being able to create another human being. They can clone them, make out of other peoples organs, whatever. I hope they never actually clone a human. I think that is one of my greatest fears, having clones running around everywhere. What I'm seeing is all the clones have some genetic malfunction, and the clones clone some super warrior guys and make an army of them and rebel and destroy us all. But thats just the pizza and too many movies talking. ------------------ "Tis easier to ask forgiveness than permission." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 21, 2000 Share Posted June 21, 2000 Well, actually I've been trying to stay away from religion in this thread, but it does seem that we can't thoroughly discuss these matters without mentioning God. It's okay...as long as we bring two things to the table: an agreement to disagree, and a sense of humor. The computer koan--I have decided not to voice my own take on this koan. There were times when Siddartha Gautama (an ancient mystic teacher otherwise known as the Buddha) would refuse to answer a question because any answer he might give would interfere with the student's own finding of the truth. Have some haiku instead: 'Such noisy children. It is good we have monsters in the basement.' 'Get out, mister pilot--I will fly this plane into the ocean!' 'Silent weasels at dawn, hunting for gnomes to fall upon and eat.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 21, 2000 Share Posted June 21, 2000 I spit in hatered from the person who dares crash that plane in the ocean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 ...It's a lower-case p, like this: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chillin Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 I knew that, I guess I just never told the dumbos who didn't know. j/k ------------------ "Tis easier to ask forgiveness than permission." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lt Cracken Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 Clone wars, like in Star Wars. wierd, we are on the brink of that, as a race. *shudder* My fav sci-fi the idea of a evil idea! SAY IT AIN'T SO!?!!!!!!!!! ------------------ Even if you dodge this, Kakarotto, THIS PLANET'S GOING UP IN SMOKE!! Vegeta, DragonBall Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 It ain't so. Okay, new koan. This time I'll pick a real zen koan, the classic "What is the sound of one hand clapping?" I've never worked on this one myself, so it'll be a fresh one. Remember: run straight at the enemy, yelling 'BANZAI!' at the top of your lungs, and cut his head off before the startled look has left his face. It's the only approach that works. ------------------ "I sought the true nature of reality but discovered instead the real nature of truth." --Thrustweasel of Earth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chillin Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 Yeah, then the startled look is locked on his face forever! The logical anwser for your koan Imladil would be silence, but I guess we never really use logic here sooo... You would hear the sound of the air moving from the waving action made by your hand. Or you could be clapping against a wall or your leg. --------------------------------------------- Also I wanted to bring this up for a while. I don't know what it is but sometimes I have dreams, and then the dreams come true. Nothing major just kindof normal everyday happenings. The problem is I don't know the dream is something thats going to happen until the thing in the dream comes true. And I can never remember any details just that I remember the same thing happening in a dream. If it is that I'm psycic it would be useless cause like I said before I don't know I'm seeing something thats going to happen until something happens. Or it could be that I actually never had a dream, and that my imagination makes me think I saw this same thing happen to a dream. You all following me ? Well I'm done I just wanted to put that up for you guys to bop around. ------------------ "The pen is mightier than the sword. Thats the biggestload of s**t!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 22, 2000 Share Posted June 22, 2000 One hand can't clap. The End ------------------ "What is thy bidding thy Master"- Darth Vader. Go into the pantry and steal a cookie!"- me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest HiddenTalon Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 Actually I know someone who is double jointed and can clap with one hand... it sounds like just anyone claping. ------------------ Name: HiddenTalon Email: HiddenTalon@mail.com Occupation: Crashing virtual X-Wings Webpage: www.scabmaps.cjb.net =) Don't click on Mr. Smiley! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 The sound of one hand clapping...would be silence. But that's not really the point that I get from the koan. To me, what's important is the realization that it takes two hands clapping together to produce the noise; one hand can only wave, but two strike against one another and clap. It is as if each hand resolves the other, works against its opposite to produce the desired effect. Likewise, in real life, nothing does anything by itself...every action affects surrounding factors, and produces results by interacting with something else. If I have a thought, that thought is connected to the life experiences that caused me to have it; if I jump into the air, I do so by pushing away from the ground. Even the sheer act of existance is countered by the possibility of nonexistance...without nonexistance, there could be no 'being.' Ah, but I babble. This is a tough cookie indeed. It illustrates a fundamental principle in the nature of our existance, but it doesn't quite come down to words. This is where most mystics wind up sounding crazy... I am intrigued by your dream question, Chillin. I've had them, too, and believe it or not, I do have an explanation for you. Unfortunately, it draws on a lot of really bizarre mystic hypnobabble that I'll have to think over most carefully before putting to words here. I'll have to work on it, I'm afraid, with the post tomorrow. Meanwhile, has anyone else had prophetic dreams? ------------------ "I sought the true nature of reality but discovered instead the real nature of truth." --Thrustweasel of Earth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 Yep, of Armagedon. <font size=1>j/k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lt Cracken Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 I do. It's wierd, I dream it, forget it, then, in real life (if there is such a thing ) it happens, triggers something in my brain, and BOOM! deja vu. and I KNOW I drempt it! it's wierd, and then sometimes, i do remember teh dream, and BOOM! it happens! cna you explain Imladil? I mean, CLEARLY!!? (j/k) ------------------ Even if you dodge this, Kakarotto, THIS PLANET'S GOING UP IN SMOKE!! Vegeta, DragonBall Z Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 I'll try, but as I said before...this is gonna get weird. This is mainly due to my drawing on different sciences, religions and philosophies to put together a clear explanation. There simply isn't one entire worldview that has enough of the facts to explain this. First off, I think you might be talking about the deja vu sensation proper...which has been explained by western science. It seems that when you see something, another part of the brain receives and processes that information before your neocortex (or 'thinking self') does...so it triggers a strong feeling of recognition. My question would be, did you remember these dreams after having them but before witnessing the event? If not, you may be experiencing deja vu proper. But a dream that flat comes true is another matter altogether. What is a dream? Well, when we're dreaming, we are essentially experiencing another state of consciousness...one in which the subconscious mind has come to the forefront and is using the visualization abilities that the sleeping consciousness is not. These visual abilities are what are refered to in the east as 'the third eye,' and are simply that imaginary screen on which we see things in our minds. Essentially, when we're awake, we're constantly using this third eye...we each have a stream of accompanying images, symbols, etc. that run through our minds as we're living our daily lives. When we turn off the thoughts, such as when we're asleep or in deep meditation, the subconscious comes forward to fill the void, to fill in the blank screen. This is the only chance our subconscious mind has to communicate with us, and usually that is just what it does; it projects images and stories that reflect the inner workings of how you think and feel. Occasionally, however, the subconscious mind uses the third eye to penetrate the veil of mystery, and that's when things get weird. Whoa, there! Weird indeed. Veil of mystery? What the heck are you babbling about now, Imladil? Here it is as plain as I can make it: there is an energy center floating over the top of everyone's heads. This energy center is depicted in many paintings as the halo...when depicted on a living person, it suggests sanctity. This is because that energy center is the lens through which God projects our soul into our bodies, and the holy have reopened that door, so to speak, in their own quest to find Him. Now...the halo is present in everybody, just veiled from our perception by the subconscious mind. If one meditates and lives correctly, the subconscious can be made 'clear,' and one can then perceive the great veil directly...or, the subconscious mind can relay that information to you. Either accidentally or because it has something imoportant to tell you, the dreaming subconscious can turn upwards and look into the halo...and see through that lens into what I like to call the Great Mystery. Through the halo, one can see everything and nothing. Past and future both coexist there, and time itself is an immutable constance. For the religious, there is paradise and God; for the scientific there is understanding. I'm sorry if I've stopped making sense at this point, but no other mystic has ever been able to adequately describe the Great Mystery. What's important for my explanation is that past and future thing; this is where our vision of the future comes from. To recap. When we are dreaming, the subconscious mind takes over the third eye. When that third eye looks up into the halo, it can catch glimpses of the future. Okay. Maybe that wasn't so weird after all... ------------------ "I sought the true nature of reality but discovered instead the real nature of truth." --Thrustweasel of Earth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 23, 2000 Share Posted June 23, 2000 So, what's today's Zen? ------------------ "What is thy bidding thy Master"- Darth Vader. Go into the pantry and steal a cookie!"- me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chillin Posted June 24, 2000 Share Posted June 24, 2000 I remember the dreams at least right when I wake up, then as the day progresses all thats happening makes me completely forget the dream. ------------------ "The pen is mightier than the sword. Thats the biggestload of s**t!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 24, 2000 Share Posted June 24, 2000 Chillin, you're describing a normal dream, not deja vu. The experience is authentic. New koan? Let's see. "Why did the eskimo starve in the jungle?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shootist Posted June 24, 2000 Share Posted June 24, 2000 Because the elephant ate all his frozen peanuts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Commander 5-98 Posted June 24, 2000 Share Posted June 24, 2000 Wrong he got to hot!!!!!! ------------------ I rule this ocean with an iron fist,an iron tail, and for that matter an iron everything-Metalseadramon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 24, 2000 Share Posted June 24, 2000 Because he couldn't ice fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 25, 2000 Share Posted June 25, 2000 Well, The Master seems to be onto something. Care to take it further, and find 'the moral to the story,' so to speak? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Master Posted June 26, 2000 Share Posted June 26, 2000 Well he didn't know how to scavenge for food in a differn't area, so he had no knid of food source. Ice fishing (as far as I know) is one of their main food sources up north (in the cold region.) Plus there are animals in the jungle that they don't know how to avoid- but back to the moral. Don't make a major move to an area that you have never been before. Or something like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Chillin Posted June 26, 2000 Share Posted June 26, 2000 Master they also spear up seals and the like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Imladil Posted June 26, 2000 Share Posted June 26, 2000 I think the eskimo starved because there was no food around...at least, none that he recognized. He didn't see a polar bear, or a seal, or a patch of iced-over water to fish on. There were no walruses or even whales! To me, this koan is an exploration of the nature of truth. The eskimo wasn't stupid for not recognizing what other food was around him...it's just that he was relying on what information was already in his brain to plan for the future. This is how our minds are wired, and it works for us just fine...until we get to areas where we have no previous knowledge. The answers could be right there at hand, but if we're constantly checking the old database for comparisons, we might miss it altogether. This is what I mean by 'thinking outside the box.' Where's Q? We could really use an omnipotent being's input right about now... Truth. This is a very tricky concept, and I've identified it as one we should explore here. Most people spend their entire lives searching for 'The Truth,' thinking that when they have arrived at it...they will have the right answers, but those who have different answers are wrong. Since this is a basic major flaw in the reasoning of most people, and one which prevents the integration of greater concepts, we should reflect on comparing two things: the complexity of the human brain, and the complexity of the living universe. Obviously, the one doesn't have enough complexity to fully reflect the other. Another way of looking at truth: truth is essentially a set of ideas that can be contained within our brain in chemical form. When compared against the world around us, we see that these ideas either 'fit' or don't. When they do not fit, we then review our 'model of truth' so that they can. This is human learning...but it does have one shortcoming--it can only know that with which it has come into contact. Now, we can think of a brain as a computer, which understands only MS-DOS when it is built, but which can have software installed that allows it to interact with the world around it. This software can be compared to the religions, sciences and philosophies we integrate over the course of our lifetime. Once we've installed it, we can go online and do our thing with ease. To take the analogy further, and perhaps demonstrate why we have so many different worldviews among our species, we can think of this software as, say, Windows 95. We can use Windows 95 to hook up on the web and get around most computer applications...but when compared to Macintosh or Linux, it seems completely different. Windows 95 programs won't work on Macs, and vice-versa. Both computers, from their own point of view, are 'right,' while the other spouts gibberish and is clearly 'wrong.' Yet both operating systems are about running computers. And both can get you on the internet. Today's daily zen is an oldie but a goodie, and it concerns the nature of truth. The most correct answer wins a dream date with Hillary Rodham Clinton. (...!) "If a tree falls in a forest and nobody hears it, does it make a sound?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest George the Armadillo Posted June 26, 2000 Share Posted June 26, 2000 I am very, very confused now, yes... ------------------ I've never done a stupid thing in my entire life, with the exception of all that stuff I did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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