Prox Kolari Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 Originally posted by Pvt_Dancer For all purposes it IS a jedi simulator though. People who are interested in this game are interested because of the atmosphere of the Star Wars universe. Exactly. If you want to play Serious Sam, go play Serious Sam. Let's say in Medal of Honor MP you were somehow invincible when crouch-jumping. So every is now crouched and jumping, and looks like an idiot. Some would complain "come on, this is supposed to be WWII for God's sake," while others would say "but I'm doing it and it works! It's a tactic! It's in the game! This isn't really WWII!" If that's the feeling, add lasers and flight to MOH. How about a gun that shoots lightsabers? Hell, it's just a game where the only thing that matters are frags, right? I bought this game because I liked the idea of being a Jedi, cautious and exacting, not because I like chopping up as many people as I can at any cost, or tossing as many as I can into a pit. If you want mass melee bloodshed, play Rune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt_Dancer Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 Prox you da man (did I just say that?). You explained what I meant better than I did... but don't you be bad mouthing Rune. I love Rune and know a lot of people that play that game with an honor code just as they would with Jedi Knight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughJ Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 HL was originally slated to be released around the time of Quake2, it ended up coming out something like 10 months later, after being delayed as valve tends to do, this isn't anywhere near enough time to go and port everything over to a new Quake2 engine... especially considering all the engine modifications that were made.. many console commands in HL are identical to Quake, the demo file types are .dem (unlike .dm2 of Quake2).. I believe the model formats are also the same as Q1, rather than Q2.. from planethalflife: "Half-Life is based on the Quake engine by ID Software, with Valve's own enhancements to the engine, such as 16-bit and 24-bit color and MMX support, as well as being developed to take full advantage of 3dfx's Voodoo2. Half-Life is based on a whole new level of proprietary technology creating a extremely rich and original gaming experience" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWB Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 For all purposes it IS a jedi simulator though. People who are interested in this game are interested because of the atmosphere of the Star Wars universe. I bought this game because I liked the idea of being a Jedi, cautious and exacting, not because I like chopping up as many people as I can at any cost, or tossing as many as I can into a pit. If you want mass melee bloodshed, play Rune. Please, everyone pay attention to these two quotes because they put it perfectly. I play MOHAA too and I've got fed up with people going on about how "it is video games" and thus keep using the stupidly designed rockets all the time. Yes, in certain aspect they are, but they are also supposed to based in a specific "universe". What is the point in buying MOHAA and JO if they're all going to end up being the same game? Go and play Quake 3 if you want that rubbish. Some of us don't have much gaming time and thus like to enjoy what we have and it is getting really irritating having it ruined by those few (yes, few because not everyone is doing it) people who seem to have nothing better to do. Why can't you just be content with force speed... how fast do you REALLY need to go? Its not a racing sim after all... For two reasons: 1)So they don't have to allocate points to force speed. 2)So they can screw us over in CTY and still out run us Why can't people just play the game fairly and in the spirit that it was intended. If it isn't hackers, its people using screwed up models and if it isn't that they're manipulating the engine someway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafia_Jabba Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 -conclusion....Join a server w/ rules setup...thats the end i guess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trienco Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 getting away from bunny hops, but: isnt it also the developers fault if they ALLOW a mp-game to become another version of q3? there just shouldnt be enough rocket launchers and ammo on a map so everybody uses it. when i heard about the flechette in jk2 i just laughed. it's absolutely un-starwars and still they dont have a choice. 'people expect shotguns and grenade launchers in a modern shooter' 'but it wont fit in the world' 'who cares, we need to please the mass market'. i would just love to remove that stuff. as soon as the tools are out creating a mod that get's rid of all the anti-starwars stuff. but take away the flechette and rockets and sabers will be too strong. though i still consider bunny hopping as exploiting a problem with the physics (i dont even know how that should work.. else i'd say 'normalize (part of) that damn vector and multiply with the right speed' *g*). well, wait for patches and mods. might be wrong there, but i guess most serious players would rather some of the mods for hl and not hl-mp itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionheart Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 In my experience, Bunny Hopping ruins games. You get someone good at it, and not only are they impossible to catch, but almost impossible to shoot to. This makes the teams games pointless as one person can play the game on their own, so making the team effort futile. Bunny hoppers always defend this by saying it's skill. Maybe it is, assuming they have not just bound keys, but the point is, it is a flaw in the engine which is being exploited. That's exactly the same as someone finding a flaw which allows them to see through walls, give them quad damage etc. and those people are called CHEATS. What's the difference, none except the other loop holes have been removed and continuous Bunny Hopping has not, so people who are unable to achieve results any other way, use the Bunny. Another excuse is, it's in the game so it should be used. But it's not in the game, it's just something the developers can't or can't be bothered to fix. I think either MOHAA or RTCW have a stamina bar. This effectively allows a certain amount of Bunnying, but runs out quickly and has side effects like not being able to run. As time goes by, and new engines are used, I'm sure the developers will limit the Bunny Boys, but until then, we'll have to live with it. Personally, if I'm playing on a server where the Bunny rules, I go elsewhere. PS. I'm not talking here about just jumping everywhere, but about those who use it to give them more speed than the model is supposed to have. Thereby upsetting the balance of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scud Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 You the hughj from Zt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRIMLOCK Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 when did bunny hopping become CS related? i always thaught its been around since Quake 1.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicket the Ewok Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 I know it was possible in Team Fortress for Quake (And incidentally, quakeworld) Yes, I remember seeing heavy weapon guys going faster than scouts normally could in QW TF. Quite strange. I'm sure ID/Raven know about this and I'm sure if it was simple to fix it would have been fixed a long time ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pvt_Dancer Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 I take exception to what you said Trienco... those guns are just as much a part of the SW world as the lightsabre. First of all, the majority of the SW world AREN'T Jedi's. What the hell would all those other people do to get in their little bit of violence? Of course there are guns and plenty of them in SW. Probably a wide variety too. I mean, our culture has a wide vareity of guns, why wouldn't theirs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TdM Posted April 9, 2002 Share Posted April 9, 2002 thank god one person in this forum called it strafe jumping thank you valdarious - I presume strafe jumping is the same thing... what kinda ridiculous word is bunny hopping.... you do that on bikes and it sounds stupid then... strafe jumping is the term yes all technical so nice... umm... anyway can you do the signiture curve? strafe jump continuously in one direction in a big long curve then after about 5 or 6 jumps switch direction and strafe jump the opposite way - used to give you a massive leap in action quake 2 giving you a massive advantage.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughJ Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 "You the hughj from Zt?" yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krak3n Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Straff jumping is more difficult in JKII becasue of force jump is automatic. You can do it's just u can only tap your jump buttin very lightly. For people who have been straff jumping since HF / CS then it shouldn't be hard to adapt. I for one have found it difficult but it can be done. I've found straff jumping + force speed = you move very very VERY fast, a good get away on ctf_imperial . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retro Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Your effectively encouraging cheating...BAN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VaderJM Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Use dark rage, force speed and bunny hop in CTF, then laugh at the people trying to catch you, all the while yelling "WHEEEEEEEEE" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniKorn Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Since when is strafejumping cheating. Just because you are too lazy to learn it doesn't mean it is cheating. And those binding bunnyhopping to a key will never learn the decent trickjumps. In elite force extremely beautiful moves were executed. Learn it if you want to be a pro. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trienco Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Originally posted by Pvt_Dancer I take exception to what you said Trienco... those guns are just as much a part of the SW world as the lightsabre. First of all, the majority of the SW world AREN'T Jedi's. What the hell would all those other people do to get in their little bit of violence? Of course there are guns and plenty of them in SW. Probably a wide variety too. I mean, our culture has a wide vareity of guns, why wouldn't theirs? i'm not talking about all the guns, but especially the flechette. matter of taste but to me it seems to much of a "every shooter has a shotgun"-decision. and of course you cant just stick with the guns you see in the movies. 5 versions of the same weapon would be quite boring just like it would be if all weapons would be blasters with just different damage and fire rate. but when was the last time you saw a shotgun in a sci-fi movie? (dont mention alien 4, they didnt have sci-fi like weapons at all *g*) anyway, i guess it was about strafe jumping before i mentioned a couple other things *g*. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70-228 Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Since when is strafejumping cheating. Pretty much since it's inception. It was originally a nasty little bug that people would use. Then it became somewhat mainstream in Q2. And they even kept it in for Q3 because that community liked it. Which was a shame because had this technique activated a Quad damage you can bet it would have been removed, speed was just on the cusp of acceptability. CS removed it and marked it down as cheating. Kingpin accepted it and pretty much simultaneously self destructed because of it. Q3 accepts it and RTCW has coded against it via their stamina thingy (I think). Personally I always felt it a pointless little exploit that created a new "skill" for no real reason. I hope JK2 will see it as an exploit too and remove it so we can concentrate on more important skills like sabre use. PS. If your spending your time practicing how to jump and strafe and swing your mouse around just so you can outrun other people in a game then you're spending far too much time online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 If you want a perfect "jedi simulator" you won't find one.. anywhere. Games are meant to be played.. and when multiplayer comes in, the developers seek "balance" and "fun," and strict adherence to canon and fanboy rules takes a backseat. That's just a fact... Also, I would highly encourage people who want JK2 to be a roleplaying game to read up on the following: Star Wars Galaxies Knights of the Old Republic These are full fledged RPG's, where you can be Jedi, and they will immerse you in the Star Wars Universe better than JK2 ever could. The shooter genre has its limitations, and I doubt it will ever live up to the standards set by the role-players we keep hearing from (remember, these are the people who call gun users names when they win, and complain about Stormtroopers using lightsabers). JK2 is a first person shooter.. you know what that means? It means it isn't a Star Wars movie.. it's an action game, about blowing stuff up and shooting things. Sure, there's lightsaber action in there too, but the essence of the Dark Forces series has always been the first person shooter. A discussion about strafe-running/jumping turns into a discussion about roleplaying in the Star Wars universe. ; ) Personally, I think that some people will never be satisfied. It just isn't the game developers job to disable every single feature he put into his game that doesn't fit into your view of what "Star Wars" should be, sorry to say. And yes, we went through the whole Half Life engine thing... anyone who says that it's based solely on the Quake1 engine is only partly correct, regardless of what planethalflife says. [/end rant] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reserved_name Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 i use strafe jumping simply because i think the game speed is a bit slow and i want to move faster around maps because its more fun.. i would use rolling but after a roll i cant move at all for a short while which doesnt make it a very quick way to move around maps (obviously its meant for light saber fights).. but i dont really care.. if strafe jumping is there i use it, if it isnt i dont mind.. not a big deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrEEpaGe Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Originally posted by Prox Kolari Me too. I'm also sick of all these cheap, cheap asses out there bunnyhop-draining, drain-gripping, or whatever other neat little exploits that are based on exploiting weird timing issues in the engine, and saying "but it's legit! I'm not cheating!" Cheap is always legit, but people dislike it. "But I'm winning." Okay, great. If the point is to get the most kills, have fun. Let's turn the Star Wars universe into freaking Unreal Tournament. Next up, a voice patch with Yoda taunting "Die, b!+@#." i would love to see a voice patch with yoda degrading me...hehe....that little bugger needs to take a shock rifle shot to the head.... hehe UT foeva..heh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
posternutbag9d9 Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 The solution is to play other gametypes besides ctf... WIth all the force/guns/sabers I really haven't felt the desire to do ctf in this game...Let the lamers stay in ctf... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacNab13 Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 Bunny-hopping is a ridiculous notion that doesn't belong in any action game - except for one with rabbits maybe. Bunny-hoppers are lamers... Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughJ Posted April 10, 2002 Share Posted April 10, 2002 bunnyhopping is fine when it adds something to gameplay, without causing imbalances... quake contains no such qualities such as classes, force powers, or a realistic damage model where game balance can be hurt by it... bunnyhopping is a technique, you can learn it, perfect it, and incorporate it into your game to where it falls along side explosion/rocket jumping, trimping/double jumping, and other such movement techniques... it allows for an expansion of gameplay elements that gives a sharper learning curve and extends the life and interest in the game due to deeper gameplay... for those of you complaining about this simply due to the fact that you 'don't have the time to learn it' (or that 'people who do have the time, have no life') should really just go back to playing Atari.. if someone is willing to spend more time playing and learning a game than you, they deserve to be a better player... however I will agree that bunnyhopping in JK2 is perhaps imbalancing and more exploitive, due to the fact that it negates the need for force speed in some ways (although you still gain from the increased attack rate, etc).. but that doesn't mean it's a bad thing in ALL games.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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