Question on times

[Guest Merlin]

I have never posted before, but I have occasionally read the discussions that have been posted at this site when I have been trying to find information on the Pod Racer game. This is probably beating a dead horse because you may have already answered this question. I entered into the competition for that offered the computer system. I ended up finishing fifth which isn't bad considering the demands I have on my time. The question I have is how the heck did the time of 1:35 etc. ever get achieved on the BTC. I finished at 1:37.95 although I probably could have shaved a few more tenths off if I put my mind to it. Is there additional hidden upgrades or is there a short cut in the first course that I have never been to find or is there a specific technique that enabled the shaving of two seconds beyond my time. I'm just curious at how it done. If there are any answers please let me know. Thanks.

[Guest theahnfahn]

Hello! Good for you to get that good of times. I was the second place winner in the competition, and if you don't mind I would like to hear your thoughts on how fair the competition was. I don't think it was judged fairly, and I am still waiting for a response from the contest judges to see how they could be sure some people didn't send in fake times. Actually, if you watched the list like I did, people DID send in fake times. How they knew these were fake is obvious - the times were impossible to achieve. But what about someone who is just thousandths of a second faster than you? They still could have cheated.

 

First and foremost, my official times were:

29.94542

1:35.880081

 

These were both done with Ben Quadinaros, but I'm sure you know that. And quite obviously, they were done with full upgrades. There are no secret upgrades so you can rest easy. There is also no shortcut on this level (but you can be assured I spent many hours looking for one). To my knowledge, nobody has found any way to hack into the game and change pod stats. What I am basically saying is that I could not have cheated because I don't even have the know-how or the means to do it. We both know that this alone is a hollow promise, so let me explain the strategies I used .

 

Ben Quadinaros is the fastest pod and has an extremely long boost. Use him (duh). ALWAYS get a boost start! If you haven't done both of these things you have no right to be skeptical.

 

Before you even attempt to actually beat my times, use your head. If you are racing the course flawlessly, but you have missed a shortcut that would have saved time, then you are never going to perfect the course. This game is nothing but speed, and the fastest way around the track is obviously the shortest one.

 

How did I do so fast? I analyzed the course and told myself exactly what THE FASTEST WAY to go was, and then I tried to do it with my fingers and the underlying keys. That reminds me, if you want to do perfect then you MUST play with the keyboard. A faster computer is better as well. Better framerates mean better accuracy and turning precision. I have a PIII 500 with a 21 in. monitor, which is a BIG help.

 

Turns and boosts. Every turn must be taken perfectly. Every left turn should be flush against the left wall, and even right turn in due respect. I used the slide constantly on this course. There should be absolutely no adjustments in your direction. No left-right nudges to make sure your pod is going straight. This wastes valuable milliseconds.

 

The boosts are the heart of this course, and I spent the last 2 weeks of the competition doing nothing but finding exactly where to boost. It is a rather hard to explain physical motion concept, but to maximize your boost you have to keep it going for as long as possible. You should never start it midway through your cooling meter, you should always let it stop just before you are about to flame, and you should NEVER let your boost meter reach the absolute bottom. Thus a few long boosts are better than many short boosts.

 

With all this in mind, I hope you begin to understand how I did those times. To convince you I would have to actually sit down at your computer and do them, but I have told you how to approach the course. What I haven't told you is when and where to boost, when and where to turn, and every other nuance I used. I can't do this here because of time constraints and my inability to post screenshots from my hard drive. I can, however, send you my walkthrough for this course, coupled with about 15 screenshots. I would have simply done this to begin with, but I thought you might not want an unexpected 700 KB file in your email. Just let me know if you want it. I am also willing to send you a screenshot of my times, send you my tgfd.dat file that holds all my times, or even race you on multiplayer and win every single race against you.

 

Now, as for MY skepticism (which I think is warranted). Getting those times took me a month. Prior to that, I had already been playing (and was the best) at racer for three months. Ask anyone here, most have raced me and know my bitter dust trails:O) Give me five minutes to warm up and I will get within a hundredth of a second from my records, and will do it again and again and again. I see no way to do any faster taking the route I do. I have also tried every other way around this course, and I know my way is the fastest. It takes about 2 hours of play to shave .03 seconds off of my last time, and I did this every other day for 3 weeks. The practice and sheer luck of that many races got me the times I did. But why did I lose?

 

Jose, the official winner, has times that blow my mind. I haven't even attempted them because I know doing so would be a waste of my time. He won't race me on heat, he won't explain anything at all about how he won, and more than anything I find this to be just plain rude. If he worked as hard as I did he would jump at the thought of bragging and showing everyone how he won a $4K computer. He said something along the lines of "Why should I tell you anyway, you won't believe me?". Who cares whether or not I believe him, I still want to hear what he has to say. I would have left him alone, and graciously given him the podracer crown, but one thing he said just baffles me. He told me he improved by 2 seconds on the final day of the competition. That is absurd. Nobody spends that much time racing to come back and improve by that much on the last day. If he had done what I had done and waited until the last second to post his times then I would believe him, but the times he had posted the day before were in fact 2 seconds slower. I got home about two hours before the competition ended, and I freaked when I saw he was in first. I spent an hour and forty five minutes trying to shave the .02 seconds he had on me. I finally did it, posted my times, but 6 minutes later he had times posted again that were .13 seconds faster. Until he tells me what he found out that was so special in that last 10 minutes I will remain skeptical.

 

The only reason I even bring up my skepticism is because you doubt me as I doubt Jose. But I, unlike Jose, have hopefully shown everyone (and will show you even more if you allow me to email you) that I am telling the truth. The sad thing is the judges have already made their decisions, and I am getting a $250 set of speakers without any means of verification, except for their supposedly fail-safe downloading procedure.

 

Any thoughts? If you ever have the time, I would like to race you on a REAL course - The Boonta Classic! After over 50 races on that course I have never been beaten. And I still laugh to myself when I think about how extremely stupid that competition really was. I mean come on, The Boonta Training Course is the worst course to pit hardcore podracers against each other. Give us a challenge!

 

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And there he is. The reigning champion of the Boonta Classic, and the crowd favorite-TheAhnFahn

[Guest wizzywig]

Merlin--

 

Everything TheAhnFahn says is true (I've seen him race, and it's no brag, just fact), and I agree that Jose's times give off an aroma. It's obvious that the game can be hacked, since a few people were posting lap times of under two seconds (I mean, how stupid was that?). If Jose could actually race that fast, why not meet TheAhnFahn on Heat and prove it?

 

There's an obvious answer.

 

--wiz

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by wizzywig (edited February 14, 2000).]

[Guest theahnfahn]

It's not quite obvious, but it is reason to be skeptical.

[Guest Jedi72]

I don't know how fake times can be acheived

or posted for that matter. I don't need to brag on my accomplishment. I was told that

there is a good possibility that there is going to be another Racer contest using a different track. My official time was 1:35:725189. When I first started the contest

The AhnFahn's time seemed out of reach for anybody since his time was almost 2 full seconds faster than the person that was behind him! There is no secret to the track.

It's like a track field the shortest distance

around the track is lane #1. You just have to find your lane #1 on the game.If there is

another contest we will go at there. Until then Round 1 goes to me!

[Guest Merlin]

First and foremost, I believe you in your times. In fact, that is why I wrote. I have spent more hours than my wife would have liked in trying to perfect my racing. It has been fun, and a nice break from the stresses of life and family. I would like to see your course pictures. I am not a computer guru and hopefully I can figure out how to open the file. I admit I have a lot of skepticism in regards to that final day. Postings and repostings where occuring a lot faster than it usually takes when you try to improve by even the smallest of margins at that caliber of play. If the first place winner did it, I congratulate him, the first two spots are amazing times. It took me weeks and weeks just to get where I was. I have to admit, a nicer monitor probably would come in handy in that, I for the most work with a 14" monitor and that tends to cramp things a lot. I have never raced multiplayer on-line and wouldn't even know where to find it. From the sounds of it you would probably skunk my feeble skills. For I am weak in the force Thanks for the response and hopefully another competition will occur on a more difficult course. I would love to try and win a computer if the opportunity presents itself.

[Guest theahnfahn]

So are you going to tell us anything about how you did those first place times? What I tried to show was that this was not merely a search for "lane 1". I raced the course flawlessly, and if you could shed some light on how you did so much better I would greatly appreciate it. Again, if you improved by 2 seconds in just one day then something is very wrong. Round 1 isn't going to you until you show us a little more than some hex code you sent in that could have been faked. Why won't you tell us ANYTHING? All I ask is just one multiplayer race. You don't sound believable in the least.

 

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And there he is. The reigning champion of the Boonta Classic, and the crowd favorite-TheAhnFahn

[Guest Jedi72]

I beat your 1 lap time by .25 of second and your 3 lap by .16 of a second. You make it

sound like a beat those times by 10 seconds!

It's not a difficult thing. Within 2-3 days of buying the game I cracked the top 10. What would beating me in multi-player mode

prove? Would that make you feel better? I

don't want to race.

If you want me to say that you're better than me then I will say it.

 

THE AHNFAHN IS A BETTER RACER THAN ME!!!

 

I'm to old to be going around trying to take down someone who offends me. Someone accusing me of wrong doing.

 

I'm sorry for the way you feel about this.

I had alot of fun playing this game and taking part in the contest. I'm not going to let anyone ruin that experinence for me!

 

Jose

 

[Guest wizzywig]

Jose--

 

What would beating me in multi-player mode prove?

 

You've got it turned around. If you could beat TAF in multi-player mode, it would prove you're not just blowin' hot methane gas. Why not play him, just to show you're in his league? That would certainly end the speculation, wouldn't it?

 

Like I say, I've seen TheAhnFahn race most of the courses on Racer, including the BTC. If you can beat him, or even come in within a second or two of him (make it a best of three to make it fair, if you want), then you'd make a believer out of me.

 

--wiz

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by wizzywig (edited February 13, 2000).]

[Guest theahnfahn]

I don't want you to say I am better than you. I am asking that since you have supposedly achieved better times, why not tell me how you did them? Or better yet, race me on multiplayer so I finally have a challenge. Your 3 lap is hardly believable, but that one lap is simply absurd. And I witnessed you improve it by .2 seconds within the last hour of the competition, just after you had posted your times and I beat them. If I must continue to repeat myself, nobody who specifically bought the PC version of the game to win that competition, who spent weeks working their way up the list, who has shown absolutely no knowledge of the game, can improve their times by as much as you did on the final day of competition. I can tell by the way you are treating this situation that something is really fishy. If you had given this competition even a remote effort, you would know how freakin much .25 seconds is (it's insane on a one lap). That is an extra 1/3 of a boost meter, something that I don't think I overlooked. It is blatantly obvious you either have a defective disk, you are holding some big secret from us all from simple human indecency, or you cheated. To get the one lap time that I did it takes two full laps around the track before you can reach Ben's top speed of 648. I don't think anyone else had the patience I had to actually go around the track twice before even attempting a lap record, and it is obvious that to beat my times you would have had to use every technique I employed and then some. If you were just any other ordinary Jo I would have blown you off from the start because you have gone out of your way to sound conspicuous, rude, and annoying. But if I was cheated out of a $4K computer then I have every right question your validity. I have emailed the competition judges and have asked them how sure they really are about the nature of this verification procedure. If they blow me off, which I'm sure they will (I sent that email 4 days ago), then you will have won whether you cheated or not. I would just like you to know that I would rather have no prize at all than get a set of speakers and you illegally win a new computer. If you don't want to take this seriously then please just don't say anything more.

 

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And there he is. The reigning champion of the Boonta Classic, and the crowd favorite-TheAhnFahn

[Guest Jedi72]

I bought the N64 version of Racer the day it came out back in May of '99. I played it many times over. By the time I learned about the contest in Dec. of '99 I knew it would be easy. When I first posted a reply to this forum I mentioned this fact. I set the lap record by choosing the 5 lap option.

I would clear the path on lap 1(rocks on the homestretch) then I would get a couple of opportunities to set a lap record. This way

there is more of a chance to set a record.

Not just the one shot you have on the 3 lap setting. This method helped me in 3 lap setting. Those 2 extra laps help alot in the way that you can find your "lane 1" and you

can experiment on where to use the boost.

The more steady you can the racer the better the time. If your racer is swaying side to

side use lose precious time. If I had cheated

I would've given my self a bigger cushion.

I wouldn't give someone the chance to pass me up the last minute of the contest. Again,

I feel sorry for the way you feel about this situation. If you feel it neccessary to complain to the officals that is your right,

but it makes you sound like a sore loser.

 

The difference in our times is so small I don't think someone can start then stop a stopwatch that fast.(.25)

[Guest wizzywig]

Jose--

 

The latest modification of your story is unconvincing--and you can't say I'm a "sore loser." I say, meet TheAhnFahn on heat and prove you can do what you say.

 

Talk is cheap.

 

--wiz

 

 

 

[This message has been edited by wizzywig (edited February 14, 2000).]

[Guest theahnfahn]

Can't you see I am not a sore loser? My times have been beaten before. I don't even hold the majority of the records now. I DO have an extremely high margin between all other BTC times, however. You mentioned the 5 lap option, which is quite obvious and I did that as well. You said this somehow helped with your 3 lap times. How is this so? I am also very interested to find out your boosting points. I can see how a slight alteration may yield minutely faster times on the 3 lap, but there is nothing special about the one lap. You boost, your boost runs out, and then you cool and boost again all the way to the finish. There is no special pattern for the single lap.

 

The only thing that still troubles me, given that you answer the above questions, is how you see .25 seconds as such a small margin. You treat it as though it is an insignificant amount of time. Given the range of the competition entries it seems minute. That is another reason why this competition displeases me. I can race people on heat and beat them by 2 full minutes, and they say "Wow, you are really good". What they don't know is that beating them by 2 minutes is many orders of magnitude greater than beating them by 1 minute 50 seconds. In much the same way, I don't think anyone really knows how perfect my BTC times are. You can think that .25 seconds is nothing, but I can assure you it is not.

 

I broke the 30 second lap about a week before the competition ended. I put in another good 15 hours shaving it down to 29.94542. Do you see what I am getting at? There were over 10 occasions where I actually tied with my previous time, and that is measuring to 3 decimal places. There is a terminal velocity in which you simply can't go any faster. Once you break the 30 second lap, a hundredth of a second shaved off your last time is even more incredible than being 2 seconds ahead of the competition. Your .25 seconds is way more than you make it out to be. You don't even lose that much time when you crash into one of the rocks and you have to restart your boost. If you are telling the truth, the least you could do is give yourself some credit. But the next time you tell me I am sore over a measurement of time that most people can't do with a stop watch (a claim that I also beg to differ), then I will have no choice but to again ask you for even one ounce of proof.

 

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And there he is. The reigning champion of the Boonta Classic, and the crowd favorite-TheAhnFahn

[Guest Ikhnaton]

Be a man, Jose. Race him on Heat.

[Guest Conor]

Ever see the Olympics or other speed sporting events? The best in the world are often within 1/100 or even a few thousandths of each other. Especially in a computer racing game, where there are hardly any variables compared to real life, .25 of a second is a simply huge amount of time.

 

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"There cannot be any 'story' without a fall - all stories are ultimately about the fall - at least not for human minds as we know them and have them."

-J.R.R. Tolkien

[Guest wizzywig]

.25 of a second is a huge amount of time when you are bettering your performance on Racer. Absolutely huge.

 

But .25 is nothing at all when you are changing digits in a hex code.

 

If I had done it legit, and people were questioning my ability to do so, I'd be itching for a chance to shut them up by shutting them down in competition.

 

--wiz

 

 

 

[Guest theahnfahn]

*They all feverously shout: "fight fight fight fight fight"*

 

Meet me behind the school playground tomorrow. I'll be there five'ish.

 

------------------

And there he is. The reigning champion of the Boonta Classic, and the crowd favorite-TheAhnFahn

[Guest Merlin]

I didn't think that my simple question was going to create such a stir. I am interested in getting information about this HEAT everyone has been referring to. I have one question regarding it though. I know that dependent on the quality of phone service and lines in a particular region that this can dictate the response times of a game when playing on-line. I know for myself, my house is ancient and I live in an area where the phone company is just about as old. Sometimes I'm surprised that they even offer a means of getting on the internet. Has this been a problem for anyone racing on-line? Let me know. I'll probably lose horribly, but some fresh competition might be good for me. I can always learn a little more. My goal is next time, I won't be coming in fifth. Thanks alot.

 

[Guest Jedi72]

This is my final reply on this subject.

To Conor I've seen many track & field races

in my day. Typically speedsters like Michael

Johnson & Marion Jones win their races by good margin. Remember Atlanta in 96? Michael

Johnson shattererd the 200m record by some

.4 tenths of a second. 19.32sec was his time

that is mindblowing! Flo Jo in '88 set a record in the 100m that has even been remotely challenged not even by the dominating Marion Jones.

 

I strongly believe there is no reason to race. What if a lose by 5 sec or even 10

would that mean I cheated on the contest?

Hardly! One races differently in head to head competition than racing alone. I don't

have to prove anything to anybody. I really

don't care at this point if anyone believes me. Say what you will about me in future posts about the competition. For those who

posted negative comments about me I don't mind. Heck! I've even forgive y'all!

 

I'm truly am sorry to the theahnfahn for anything I said to offend you. I did have a lot of fun playing the game, after all this

I don't even want to look at the game.

I'm happy playing NBA2K on my Dreamcast.

That will satisfy my video game cravings for now until World Series BB comes out. Maybe

if they do have another Racer contest I'd probably get excited about Racer again. Maybe

nobody will look at me as the badguy in the

next contest. For sure I will be a marked man. Everybody will know my progress next time around.

 

So Long,

Jose

[Guest wizzywig]

So long, Jose. And though we are totally unworthy, thanks for forgiving us.

 

--wiz

 

 

[Guest wizzywig]

Merlin--

 

Go to heat.net. You have to download the Heat software, and sometimes the connections do get a little cantankerous. Don't know how your particular phone service would affect your connection, but I'm sure degraded line quality would degrade the game experience.

 

Ostensibly, you are supposed to be able to race two or three opponents at a time, but in actuality, you can only race one-on-one or the lag just becomes impossible to deal with. Even with only two racers, you can sometimes get pretty bad lag, where the race just stops-starts-stop-starts, which gets you crashing into walls, missing turns, etc., which is no fun. There are probably a lot of factors that affect lag besides phone lines--the servers on your own ISP, peak traffic on the heat.net servers, etc.

 

When there's no lag and you're up against a decent opponent, multiplayer is great, because the game's AI doesn't give you anywhere near the challenge that a good opponent does.

 

I haven't played in a long time, and I was only mediocre when I did. But it was fun the few times I played online.

 

--wiz

 

 

[Guest Ikhnaton]

Jose, you're a wimp, chicken, fraidy cat, whatever you want to call it. What principles do you think you are upholding by not racing? you're only proving that you are arrogant and unable to take a challenge. The gauntlet has been thrown and you refuse to pick it up. That is real bad, man.

 

I'm technically in retirement from JK, but your actions disturb me so much that I have to post.

[Guest Merlin]

Thanks for the information on the heat web site. I think I might have to try it sometime when I get a chance.

[Guest Nodrin King]

Hey me scurvey pod-headed buckos, me think there be a modesty module stiched into the skin of that thar MERLIN. He (or she) be so perlite an' all. Rer minds this ol' sky pirate o' one'o the roughest toughest blighters what ever played a game. He'd act all perlite, get yer in a game...then clean the decks with yer innards. Yar!!!

 

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Paint a 3 on the side and I'll drive it!!!