RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 Sorry I guess sometimes when I think people aren't trying too hard to understand me, instead of knuckling down and trying to explain myself more clearly, I decide to become sarcastic and 'clever'... And that - in reality - is not actually that 'clever'! My bad... Apoligies to all... My last post was 'meant' to be a joke... ...boom boom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 If you listen to the RotJ carefully, Vader force pulls his saber back to his hand as he's walking down the stairs. You don't actually see the saber but you see him motion to catch it and reactivate it. It's very subtle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 Razor, OK. I believe you about that. If I can be bothered, I'll watch the film again at some point, but from what I can remember, I'm sure you can easiely see it that way. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's conclusive, but it's certainly more than possible. Even if it is, I could argue that that's not exactly the 'saber throw' I've seen in the game, but that's not the crux of my argument anyway... If that is enough to convince you that saber throw is 'movie-realistic', then fair enough. I still don't agree, even if Vader did do what you say in the film. I still think it's not justification enough to have Jedi's potentially throwing and pulling saber's back to them every few seconds... But, I admit you have a point. It depends where you draw the line... it would have been nice if you could have at least admitted I may have a point too, but I guess that's too much to ask... Your correct, it's your mod. You may choose as you like... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alesh Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 Renegade i don't think neither me or razorace have said throwing the saber every few seconds is ok, I find it really crappy and nothing like the movies even if we accept saber throw is in them (and it wasn't guided), that's why razorace is redoing saberthrow to make it more limited to certain situations as i understand it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 What more justification do you need? If it's in the movie, it's in the movie. Obviously, it'll have to be carefully redone or it'll will be abused. I imagine the fatigue cost, having to recover the saber manually, and teh defenselessness will be enough of a insentive to not spam it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 Yes, very true... What you've just listed will make it better than normal JKII... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILR Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 I want to add a comment towards the original topic of the thread.. I felt that the beginning of the game had a great movie autmosphere. When things queited down you could hear the classic 'beeping' from when obi turned off the Death Star's tractor beam. The ambient music during slow times also matched that mood. When things picked up the music was also very Ep 4ish. Another thing that kept it movie feeling were some of the level aspects. Alot of wall textures resembled Star Destroyer and Death Star textures a TON. And every Imerpial computer console looked EXACTLY like how they did in the movies. But soon after the Kejim base things started to become less like the movies. I have to give Raven som slack, because they surely can't limit all of their levels to exact SW envirnments. Artus Mine was a entirely unique level, but alot of it reminded me of the trash place in cloud city (on the screen for five seconds...) and a little like the trash room in the Death Star. However, I expected to the detention area to look a bit more like what we saw in the Death Star. I assumed this because the Imperials like to make everything uniform, and exactly like everything else (clones, anyone?), so a similiar cell block design to the death star's probably wouldn't be too far fetched to suggest. Few problems with enemies during the beginning... those brown dudes with the yellow blasters. Uh... who are these guys? I've never seen or heard of them before JO. And we never got to see the stormtrooper gatling gun. I'd rather have that than Raven's repeater gun/shotgun. The crossbow also behaved in a way that was surprising to me. I never played the first JK, so I'm fresh from the theaters.. and quite honestly the crossbow bieng a slow moving non deflectable fat blob of green blaster really took something to get used to. Since most of my complaints in the last paragraph didn't really happen until later, I think the beginning of the game was the ideal movie to game experience. Kejim base was damn good as far as the SW feel goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILR Posted March 21, 2003 Share Posted March 21, 2003 Originally posted by razorace What more justification do you need? If it's in the movie, it's in the movie. Obviously, it'll have to be carefully redone or it'll will be abused. I imagine the fatigue cost, having to recover the saber manually, and teh defenselessness will be enough of a insentive to not spam it. hmm.. fatigue cost? Watch out now.. while I do like RPG's, I like straight forward action games too. I believe giving the player the inconvenience of having to pull it back on his own, taking more time and attention from battle, will be enough to deter spamming. And when it comes to moves like saber throw, simply detering abuse of the move is all that's really needed. edit- or did I read that wrong, and you just mean mental fatigue to the player? I don't think adding stats to the game is a good idea. The force stats are RPG enough for this action game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alesh Posted March 22, 2003 Share Posted March 22, 2003 Fatigue will be the name for the points force powers, dodge and other things will spend when the mod is in a more advanced stage, instead of having dodge points and force points as it is now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 22, 2003 Share Posted March 22, 2003 Not entirely true. Dodge and Fatigue will still exist as seperate meters. Fatigue is a measure of battle fatigue instead of just force powers. Fatigue is much larger than the current Force meter than Force Powers will also cost more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 22, 2003 Share Posted March 22, 2003 Dodge needs to be seperate so it will be possible to kill someone other than just wearing down their Fatigue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alesh Posted March 22, 2003 Share Posted March 22, 2003 Have you changed this or did i misunderstand you when you explained it? Anyway seems fine to me, not everybody dies tired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 22, 2003 Share Posted March 22, 2003 No change. The whole Dodge/Fatigue concept has been around since the beginning. I just haven't mentioned it in a while. Been too busy working on smaller design projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILR Posted March 23, 2003 Share Posted March 23, 2003 Hmm... while I'm a little on the fence about the fatigue thing, I do have a suggestion that will make that addone less of a stat thing and more to do with the physical gameplay. With JKIIMP, I never liked how the players had ultimate Robotron abilities. What I mean is.. they can go from rest to sprint in an instant, as well as suddenly sprint in an entirely different direction. It sounds like the fatigue thing is staying in your mod.. so perhaps you can make it so fatigue is used when running back and forth in zany directions that are too impossible for the human body. Just a suggestion, but I think it'll be a good incentive to get players to slow down in duels, and not be so berserker with their sabers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 *shrug* Momentum stuff is hard to do without making player feel unresponsive. I'll look into it thou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ILR Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 Originally posted by razorace *shrug* Momentum stuff is hard to do without making player feel unresponsive. I'll look into it thou. yeah, the thought occured to me that it would sooner frusterate the player than add hightened excitment through realism. But think of it this way.... when standing still (yourself, in real life) you can jet off in a givin direction much like the animations in the game. But stopping and jetting off in the opposite direction is a little harder. If you can manage a system that allows a player to jet from standing, but have slower responses when changing directions... then the player would still be able to get the responsiveness gameplay--when stepping smart--as well as realism of momentum issues. I can imagine that'll be difficult to code... and even more so to shove over the internet in an MP game. I think even a simplified verson would be of value, because the opponent the player faces has the same handicap, right? It's like an equation, what you do to one side you do to the other, as long as the sides are equal you can do whatever you want to acheive the right numbers. (In this case, its movie realism. And for that, we simply need to slow things down. JKIIMP is insanely fast.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 24, 2003 Share Posted March 24, 2003 I'll try messing with it at some point. Unless you're going full tilt in real life, you can stop on a dime. This could be used as an additional encouragement to not run all time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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