lukeiamyourdad's civs template

[Admiral Vostok]

Not bad, here's what I say:

 

I'm very against the Demolition Squad Trooper. Naboo has a small enough population as is without soldiers blowing themselves up. Either have him survive or get rid of him altogether.

 

Pirate doesn't sound very Naboo-ish.

 

I like that they rely on trade to get tibanna gas. Although this potentially unblanaces the civ, it goes with the theme of being a dependent civilisation, which is why the Trade Federation's blockade was such a concern - they weren't self-sufficient. Instead of making it that you need to trade with neutral towns (which is where I see the unbalancing coming in) perhaps they can only obtain it through resource exchange, but get a Credit-resource mining bonus to balance this.

 

So which civ is next on the list?

[lukeiamyourdad]

1. I thought that the demolition trooper could be those guys who destroys old buildings with dynamites and stuff. maybe he can survive...

 

2. I remember some EU pirate helping the Naboo during the Battle of naboo. But That's just EU.

 

3. I understand the unbalance in the naboo's case for Tibanna gas and they already get a credit bonus(now mentioned). however ressource exchange seems bad in this case. The price of Tibanna will get too high and it will cost too much credit to trade. Maybe we can have both.

 

I'm making the Hutt cartel next.

[Admiral Vostok]

1. It's still not very Naboo-ish. I can't see a Naboo person ever using explosives. They are more long-range oriented in my eyes.

 

2. Well clearly the Naboo civilisation doesn't look like they'd mix with pirates. They are too self-righteous. Once again EU screws things up. Maybe the odd Pirate is feasible, but making them a hero/leader unit is entirely contrary to the movies. Bounty Hunters are a different matter - the Naboo's dependence on outside forces lends itself well to them.

 

3. The Naboo could have some sort of benefit over other civs when it comes to exchanging for tibanna. After all, their strength in air makes it a vital resource for them.

 

Perhaps the Naboo simply get a trickle of Credits from the start of the game (or once they reach the second tech level). This would be a better implementation of their "Taxation" tech they had in SWGB1. Since the Naboo culture focusses on education, government and the arts, this trickle of Credits is entirely feasible (the whole society contributes to the greater good).

[Sithmaster_821]

I like the idea of them getting resourses exclusively from trading, but they should get a lot of gas from each trader, cause they are an air dependant civ.

[clonedjedi]

i like your ideas but the only problem i found was that demolition guy naboo r civilised and they wouldnt really give there life for 1 building. instead of the pirate maybe u could build a squad leader it would boost the fighters attack a little and give its pilots a strategic edge in air combat.

[lukeiamyourdad]

Vostok:

 

1. Hmmm....How can they destroy their old buildings when they want to build new ones? Anyway, I'm making the change to planting charges and running away.

 

2.They're not hero/leader units. More like my mercenary for the Rebels just with another name.

 

3.Agreed. And good idea on the trickle of credit. Making the changes right now.

[Admiral Vostok]

1. Styles of warfare and construction don't have anything to do with each other. There is no civilisation on earth that demolishes their own buildings for redevelopment with ranged missiles.

 

The demolition trooper does not fit with the Naboo. That type of unit are more identified with terrorist-type armies, so they would be right at home in the Rebel Alliance. The Naboo style of warfare is thus: since they have a small population, the Naboo focus on small groups of well-trained, elite unites, rather than a horde-like mass of lesser-abled troops. The Naboo have a very cultured way of life, which is also reflected in their armed forces: uniforms are beautiful colours and designs, and their vehicles gleam with polished chrome and smooth, artistic design. Surely from this description you can see that a guy running up to a building and planting a bomb is not very Naboo-ish. Ranged warfare is considered much more advanced and cultured (at least it is in our world) and as such the Naboo's method for enemy building destruction would be more like the cannon or artillery of SWGB1.

 

2. Okay. But in the way of heroes I think for the Naboo you should take CLOned's great idea of giving them a flying hero in an N-1. Get rid of the pirate/mercenary altogether.

 

3. Good.

[lukeiamyourdad]

1. I just thought that in time of desperation and when you're vastly out-powered, out-gunned and out-manned, you use whatever you can.

 

2.If we have squad leaders we'll need basically squad leaders for all civs since it wouldn't make any sense how only the Naboo are smart enough to have leaders. Anyway, I'm keeping the merc for the rebs. I'll think about the pirate.

 

3.

[Admiral Vostok]

1. When it comes to the Naboo that is not the case. They are a very sophistocated people, and if they must resort to warfare they'll do it with style and discipline, not with "whatever they can".

 

2. Keep the Merc for Rebels by all means, it goes well. But pirate for Naboo is so wrong.

[lukeiamyourdad]

1.Hmm...there are times for discipline and style and others when you're desperate...I'll think about it.

 

2.Still thinking...

[lukeiamyourdad]

Well guys I finally got off my lazy ass to make the Hutt Cartel Template

 

Now now some precisions about the Naboo first:

 

-I've removed the demolition trooper due to heavy opposition

-I'm keeping the pirate as an anti-Jedi Trooper

 

I'm adding a few precisions about Jedi now:

-Certain civs can ''mass produce'' Jedi type units while others cannot. Let me explain. The civs which can mass produce them get weaker Jedi Knights and Padawans but they cost less (ressource and pop) while civs who can't ''mass produce'' them get stronger Jedi, but for a higher cost.

 

MP Jedi Civs:

 

-Republic

-Empire(you'll see)

 

Non MP:

 

-Rebel

-Confederacy

-Naboo

 

The other civs don't get to have any Jedi at all but other types of units to compensate. Now when I say ''mass produce'' I don't mean it litterally. It just means you can get a higher number of them.

 

I'll post precisions about warfare, trading, overall ressource gathering, etc. in some other posts after I finish the civs.

 

Now for the Hutt Cartel:

 

Palace: Starting building, acts as a CC but stronger with more hp but lower defensive attack

 

-Slave: Basic Worker. Does everything a worker can except repairing mechanized units and buildings.

-Slave/Engineer: Repairs mechanized units and buildings but can also heal organic units.

-T-16 Skyhopper: Unarmed at the beginning of the game, fast flying scout. You're not granted one at the beginning, you have to build one.

 

Cantina:

Trooper building facility

 

-Gammorean Guard: Hutt Basic trooper armed with an axe or polearm. High hp and attack but rather low armor.

-Weeqay: Armed with pikes but has a low attack with high armor. Mainly defensive units.

-Hireling: Random alien/human which is basically a guy armed with a small hand blaster. Not strong but cheap.

-Bounty Hunter: Only available to Hutt Cartel(Other anti-Jedi units for other civs). Strongest Anti-Jedi unit. Very high cost but all around effective. Can only build a few( if the first one you hire dies, then you can build a second one. The second one is stronger however. I'm thinking about putting heroes for this( starting by Greedo up to Boba Fett adn it ends there). Costs gets higher with every stronger bounty.

 

Starport:

Where you build all sorts of ships and vehicle

 

-Desert Skiff: Normally unarmed land troop transport. If units are loaded on it, it gets the attackt power of the first unit to load into it.

-Landspeeder: Fast ground unit. Weak hp and armor but decent attack. Basically a landspeeder with a guy handling a mounted gun on it.

-Desert Barge: Slow moving lightly armored ship. Can move on land only. Small defensive attack but can transport LOTS of trooper units.

 

T-Wing: Pirate fighter. Very fast but low attack and very low armor and hp.

Freighter: Slow moving flyer with very high hp but bad attack. Some sort of flying fortress.

R-41 Starchaser: Torpedo fighter. Dives in on its target and launches a torpedo. Very effective vs. ships.

Z-95 Headhunter: Multi-purpose fighter but weak hp and rather slow.

Transport: Air Transport. period.

 

Hutt Palace:

Building where you can build special Hutt units. Also serves as defensive building.

 

Jabba the Hutt: Slow moving Jabba orders units around. Increases the attack of surrounding troopers.

Garduala the Hutt: Slow moving hutt which increases the wroking rate of slaves around her/him...

Hutt: Slow moving hutt that works like Set's priests in AoM. Can convert certain types of enemy units(Heroes, robotic, and Jedi units cannot be converted but hirelings such as mercs, pirates and hutt hirelings are more easily ''persuaded')

 

Spaceport

 

Trade Freighter: Most heavily armored trader unit. Gets Hutt cartel best trade bonus.

Gambler:Units that uh...gambles ressources. When one is on the terrain, you get a certain number of ressources every x amount of time but you might also lose x number of ressources.

 

Other buildings:

 

Power Cores: Hutt power cores are not expensive but happens to degrade over time.

Trading Shop: Buildings that increases the trading rate if it's...built. High Cost

 

Ressource and Trading

 

Well they get a heavy trading bonus. Their workers however are a bit less effective in late game. They get Tibanna gas through regular paltforms.

 

Population

 

They get pop with houses or Camp. Camp are weak but are set up quickly. You start with a few camps then you ccan build houses.

 

Other things

 

They get no Jedi type unit but they get the strongest bounties.

They get no fighting sea units but as you can see have a flying anti-ship unit.

 

I have no idea however of how their sea units should work. So again if you have any idea on sea units for any civs(except gungans) please post them.

 

That's all for now. I'm doing the Empire next!!!

[Admiral Vostok]

Well I personally feel the Hutt Cartel or some similar smuggling organisation is not worthy of inclusion in SWGB2, merely because they would prefer to wage war in an under-handed, inconspicuous way rather than fielding an armed force.

 

However, I will comment on a couple of things for this civ design:

 

Military units are built at a cantina?

 

Love the gambler idea.

 

The aliens whose names you forgot are probably weequay.

 

Not sure about the whole "bounty hunters get stronger with each one that dies" concept. I think if this is implemented the bounty hunter should at least cost more each time, as though the hutt management are saying "that guy sucked, we better spend more on the next guy".

 

Here's an interesting idea, though no doubt most people will hate it: due to the dodgy types who associate with the hutts, if you leave two or more trooper units standing around doing nothing, they get damaged every few minutes. This represents the fact that if not given things to do, the mercenaries will get to talking and no doubt start fighting each other. This can be avoided by simply setting them to patrol. This is a little annoying, but I think it captures one of the things you would have to take into consideration if you were really in command of a wretched hive of scum and villainy.

[lukeiamyourdad]

Originally posted by Admiral Vostok

1.Well I personally feel the Hutt Cartel or some similar smuggling organisation is not worthy of inclusion in SWGB2, merely because they would prefer to wage war in an under-handed, inconspicuous way rather than fielding an armed force.

 

However, I will comment on a couple of things for this civ design:

 

2. Military units are built at a cantina?

 

3. Love the gambler idea.

 

4. The aliens whose names you forgot are probably weequay.

 

5. Not sure about the whole "bounty hunters get stronger with each one that dies" concept. I think if this is implemented the bounty hunter should at least cost more each time, as though the hutt management are saying "that guy sucked, we better spend more on the next guy".

 

6.Here's an interesting idea, though no doubt most people will hate it: due to the dodgy types who associate with the hutts, if you leave two or more trooper units standing around doing nothing, they get damaged every few minutes. This represents the fact that if not given things to do, the mercenaries will get to talking and no doubt start fighting each other. This can be avoided by simply setting them to patrol. This is a little annoying, but I think it captures one of the things you would have to take into consideration if you were really in command of a wretched hive of scum and villainy.

1. They wanted to put such a civ for Clone Campaigns but did not have enough time. I think they deserve to have a place in GB2.

 

2. Mercenaries, Bounty Hunters, little Gambler, Scum, all hang out at the cantina. Think about it as a recruitment center.

 

3. Thank you:p

 

4. THANK YOU!

 

5. Thanks for pointing this out. I'll make the change right now.

 

6. Yes people will hate it:p

 

*Turns his back away from his Hutt army for some time to take care of his econ...forgets to put them on patrol...goes back to his army...lots of corpses...and the remainders are fighting each other...*

 

You get the idea...

[Admiral Vostok]

2. Still sounds pretty funny

 

6. Some people will hate it, but to compensate your troopers should be cheaper. I consider myself an experienced gamer because I play not only computer games, but many other games including Warhammer (which some of you may be familiar with). Warhammer is a tabletop miniature wargame, which is actually very similar to an RTS in some respects. Anyway, there is a race you can play as in Warhammer Fantasy called Orcs, which are based on a mixture of Tolkien's Orcs and barbarian tribes. Anyway, there is a rule for Orcs that because they fight amongst themselves a lot, you have to make a test to see if they do just that. I'm not sure of the exact details since I don't use Orcs myself, but it involves something like rolling a dice and if you get a certain result one of your units fights amongst itself, rather than fighting the enemy.

 

I mostly play Warhammer 40,000, which is the Science-Fiction version of the game. I play Tyranids, which are basically a combination of the Alien films' aliens and Starship Troopers' bugs. They have a rule that if your lesser creatures go too far away from the leading creatures they revert to instinctive behaviour, which could include hiding in a forest or running away altogether.

 

Sure, this things are annoying, but they add complexity and an extra level of thinking and strategising to overcome. I think if this sort of thing were introduced into an RTS it would make a fantastic game. It would be a welcome change from simply build->train->fight->repeat until victorious.

 

You may see it as annoying, but in reality you always have to take the good with the bad, and I really think this is something that Hutt leaders would realistically have to be concerned with. If we want an authentic Star Wars feel it's the only way to go. Well, that's my rant for the day.

[lukeiamyourdad]

2. From a realism point of vue it's way better a cantina...

 

6. This underpowers the Hutt. Since most Hutt Soldiers are basically mercenaries and hirelings, we cannot lower their cost and this makes other civs way more powerful. Other players playing other civs won't have to spend the extra seconds(seconds are very important) on putting them on patrol('cause you have to make them patrol acertain area not just randomly).

The Hutts are underpowered this way. If this was a turn based game, it would work but I don't think it will in an RTS.

[Admiral Vostok]

On the contrary, hiring mercenaries is cheaper than training and outfitting your own army. Therefore a lower in price is entirely reasonable. However, I don't think this is the way to make up for the animosity rule (stole that name from the Orcs I mentioned earlier).

 

All civs have a bad point, some more than others. The Trade Federation has weak, slow troopers. The Wookiees have tough, fast units. Overall, the Hutt Cartel's troops are reasonable, perhaps their only weakness is their animosity. I think it would be nice to add little things in like this, that overall they even out but still provide a level of realism you wouldn't get if every civ operated in exactly the same way.

[lukeiamyourdad]

I'll think about it and ask around a bit but I don't think this will serve anything more then annoy the crap out of people.

[clonedjedi]

the hutts as u said are mercenaries i really dont think they should be a civ since they are nothing more then a gang and go on about there own business and dont really care about trying to destroy another civ. i really think it would be better if they had small camps on maps (desert) ewok camps (forest) and they have unique upgrades for your troops and stuff.

 

kinda like the kreeps in warcraft 3

[Admiral Vostok]

Well those are my thoughts as well, CLOned.

 

Luke's Dad, ignore my idea if you want. I just think it's a shame that people aren't willing to overcome the bad points in their army to have a more authentic experience, they just want the armies to be good no matter what.

[lukeiamyourdad]

Well that's why there's so many newb bashers, *******s out there. I've asked around and it turns out this idea is not so welcomed...This is a difficulty that will slow down the Hutt more then any other civs...oooo I just thought of something else...

 

Here it is...with the Hutts as long as there is a military unit active on the map, you lose gradually credits(representing paying for your hireling) and if for some reason your credit number is too low, your army is starting to fight each other.

 

This could also be represented in the original cost of the unit. Alongside the regular cost(in this case Hutt units don't cost credits at the beginning) and everyone of them costs say 1 credit for x amount of time. The more troops you have the more credit it will cost you. The stronger units also cost more credits per x amount of time or still 1 credit but for a shorter amount of time.

If you don't have enough credits your units will start fighting each other.

[Admiral Vostok]

Okay, that's a great idea and I whole-heartedly support it. Though perhaps instead of fighting each other they become uncontrollable - they become like a neutral computer player. So they'll defend themselves if attacked, but they won't do your bidding until you get more credits. There would of course be a warning when this is about to happen.

[lukeiamyourdad]

Nice idea Vostok. Thanks for it.