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  1. This is an internal map test, we wish to have a large ctf game (5 on 5 preferrably). This is a map based on the map of the same name in jedi knight 2. Layout is the same and weapon placement is similar. Features nice ambience, lifts and the original music! We need about 5 or so testers for a match very soon (tonight). We also need a good server host to run the map and support about 10 people or so. Please reply with your contact or pm me. Thanks! Pics: http://pics.xs.to/pics/04086/narshadaa.jpg http://pics.xs.to/pics/04086/narshadaa2.jpg http://pics.xs.to/pics/04086/narshadaa3.jpg
  2. Hey if someone could point me to some CTF-warring factions pictures, they are for a project and I' am hard pressed to find any. I don't have jk2 or JK:A installed on my machine right now unfortunately. Thanks!
  3. Thats interesting. What you have to consider s control. You are in a sense arguing that reality sucks. What would be better then to control a saber in reality and fight with friends. Well if you think anything is better then that, then I have no business arguing with you. But if you indeed think that would be truly amazing then you can perhaps take vantage of my perspective. It is a game. Yes. This is why we require extra luxury and general aids to help facilitate this lack of physical control, and sense. We also have protocols in place (as you mentioned), that help improve gameplay, because the reality is, we ARE NOT ACTUALLY THERE wielding sabers ourselves. However, as games become more technically advanced, more and more of these factors that hinder our influence of the motions depicted by our screens, our 'control' weaken and even vanish which leads to steps closer and closer to truly feeling as if you are wielding the saber yourself. If you think games and movies have no business with eachother or that they are essentially always different and should remain that way, then sir I would completely disagree, and would have to say you are not of the perspective of the innovator. I think you have your mind set in the world of JEDIKNIGHT 2 (ie. quake engine), and tweaks applied to it. Try and let your mind grasp an entirely different level of control. Still the same mouse and keyboard movement, but think it more advanced and one with essentially a greater degree of control. A great and simple analogy of this "EVOLUTION OF CONTROL" might be the game Splinter cell. You might notice the superb animation. Moreever you may notice (if you've played it of course), that you can scroll your mouse to achieve not only a slow walk, and quick jog speed, but an intermediate pace setting with animation that is cleanly blended and a good balance of both the slow and fast pace. Now imagine adding 2 more paces, and maybe 4 more paces, and eventually adding animation so dynamic that it seemingly integrates (as in calculus), all intermitten motions giving you extreme control, and thus allowing you to better navigate based on a particular situation. It is this innovation that can make ANY GAME great, and it is this evolution of games that may be forseen. As a game developer said on XGR (Xtreme Gaming Radio) "soon we will be playing movies". Now your jumping ahead. Your going from a game full of aids and help, to a game with NO AIDS, and NO first person view? Take it slowly and things can come into perspective. Why would FPS's die if realism was popular. Of the various styles of games FPS's seem to me to be the most condusive to a realistic environment, and best suited to convey a realistic feel. So in support to my perspective fps's are successful. But then again, this is a weak argument as many game styles are successful. So I cannot pursue it, simply reject it. True, but one must not discount realism (and when I say realism I mean reality in action and not reality in context, like physics for example, but not everything must be tactical ops or some real shooter, fantasy is still extremely appealing) and its possible implementation as a tool to enhance the level of entertainment a game provides. An environment that better resembles and reacts (ie. breaking walls and lamps upon impact perhaps) will definately bring more then a static unrealistic environment (although its success with its player is definately dependent on the way it is utilized, it may possibly be a burdon, but it could also be brilliant if it is done correctly) Seems like you conveniently forgot about LUKE AND VADER whose battle is of a far greater (imo) demonstration of a jedi's perception of battle, and caution. At this time we have jedi who are extremely strong, granted luke is still starting out, but he is nevertheless quite tough. Battles here demonstrate both the jedi's ability to use the force and predict what to do, but also don't go so far as to indicate the blatant coreography. At times episode 1 and 2 do similar things with combat so that it just seems more believeable, that the jedi are using powers of their mind to fight rather then stepping in a pre determined sequence, particularily Dooku and Obi-wan. But there are times when the dancing is just too much (additional spins and twirls that are synchronized, and basically frills, you will see alot of this in ep3 from the looks of some trailer footage). Wow, are you kidding me? The movies in ep1 are fast and really enjoyable to watch. But I can easily tell each and every step and swing that is taken, it is very clear. This combination of clarity and speed is evident since it is REALITY! Obi is actually swinging and he knows what to do, he doesn't have saber stances with pre-defined attacks. So this level is ESSENTIALLY inachieveable at least for now, as games cannot be as free and close to reality as is there, but nevertheless they are progressing to something along these lines (albeit slowly). Again you are putting a cap on your imagination, confining ideas, restricting evolution. You must believe the impossible is achieveable somehow. KOTOR has its own extrodinary flaws as well (people don't wait until you swing, or stand in front of each other and don't move while they are making moves, moreover the player control of combat is nill, it is semi turn based and basically click to attack, the computer will perform the intricacies of the attack for you) but it is an incredible game in a different sense, which is beyond the scope of this discussion. How do you propose to have a FPS have more realistic fights anyway? Here are some issues that need to be resolved: 1. How do you enforce no running and jumping in a FPS saber fight? There are many options to this and all your questions that designers will eventually find suited to them (as games like jediknight evolve and go from engine to engine). One idea would be to first have movement acceleration, so you cant strafe dance side to side, but when you push a direction you may start slow for a brief moment, then slowly ramp up speed (like reality, you can't just run in one direction then suddenly in a split second run in the other direction, you have to slow down, stop, change directions, speed up, run. Jumping could be connected to a constant use or physical force pool that governed basic jedi movement while a seperate pool was responsible for force. These are then scaled individually as desired for the best use. 2. Guns vs. Sabers Yes this is quite a problem. But it can be solved with innovation. Although what I might say could sound unattainable or foolish, only time will reveal the possibilities of programmers and designers. Here I would say 100% manual blocking. Obvious not to difficult of blocking but tied with saber control which is a HUGE ISSUE. My vision is that of manual mouse saber control, but still regulated with certain yet deep and branching variety of animations. It is complex to explain so I will simply say that manual block would force jedi's to take their time and use their own SKILL to block blaster shots. It would also force mercs to be agressive and break the jedi's ability to block or outshoot their deflection ability (precisely like the jedi master shot off the genoshian balcony by jango in ep2), 3. Force Users vs. Non-Force users. How do bounty hunters do in the movies against jedi? Pretty damn good don't they (boba, jango, and also imo the greatest bounty hunter Calo Nord [from kotor] who could probablly kick the crap out of an avg jedi). When they have the skill and the mechanisms to fight (and experience/knowledge), they can perform quite well. But again this comes to the realistic implementation. Jedi should use force powers extremely sparingly so as to achieve these kinds of epic battles that seem a good fight. Again one reality system depends on another and so on. It is a big web that must be strongly linked or fail all together. 4. Damage and Killing This issue is really up to the developer and the context of the game. As I said earlier don't just JUMP to an ALL OUT REALITY GAME (like the game that will corrupt itself if u get killed so u can never play again). But instead take smaller steps to something more and more real. Again, immobilizing and damage might be critical to delivering an interesting and immersive experience. The other thing you have to consider is that this isn't the JEDI KNIGHT we have now with some 1 hit damage mod. This is a whole different system, one that perhaps delivers the greater realistic control that would warrant physical damage and immobilizing (as it may happen less often if 2 players are of similar skill and are able to defend and attack well, and like the movies basically endure the battle, and suffer the consequence of their defeat). When you bring all these components of reality together your mindset completely changes from that of simple 'a game' and moreover the jediknight experience in its current form. I hope my post may have changed your way of thinking about our debate slightly, it is only a bit of what I try and conceive in my mind. A better gaming experience is always ahead, their are almost no limits.
  4. Although I' am surprised you weren't warned by a forum mod about the verbal abuse towards me, I' am not surprised my theory has met opposition, however little sense that opposition makes. 1. Right 2. What does anything I said have to so with SP? When I say experience I mean game experience. 3. No thanks won't happen? Computers, faster.. erm.. computer speed has nothing to do with what I' am saying. Again you go off on a tangent. The points I mentioned only concern the fact that the newer tech engines have quite different animation systems that are not as forgiving to unrealistic looking animations (both in speed, and animation frames (or lack thereof)). 4. I don't think you can make me.
  5. The original trilogy as Cain mentioned represented far more skillful and thoughtful fighting (not just coreographed saber dancing). However EVEN in EP1 and EP2 the duels are slower then that of JA and JO. Moreover the gun fights are tremendously slower and also more tactical (not just simply running with a huge flak cannon, and jump off a ledge while firing at full speed). If you think otherwise you should try to better compare the game reality to the movie reality. For an idea of the gun fight pace that much better represents the pace of movie gun fights play a mod called "Troopers: Dawn of Destiny" for unreal tournament 2003/4. In this mod you will see what pace and cautious fighting are about. Weiser_Cain: Agreed.
  6. hahahhaha! In what sense? The ONLY thing I can see jedi knight besting kotor in, is actual combat action. EVERY single other thing you could possibly imagine in games is done better in KOTOR. KOTOR is an incredible experience. JA is just decent action.
  7. 3 things: 1. You are in the vast minority 2. A more realistic 'fantasy' experience may possibly equate to a greater experience 3. Evolution of games in this fashion is inevitable
  8. Trust me it does . Why? Because it is still way faster then movies (gun fights and saber battles), and when (if) they move to the doom3 engine which seems logical since its raven. THEY WILL BE FORCED TO go slower, because maintaining jedi academy's speed in the doom 3 engine will look foolish. They will be forced to (for the benefit of a much better experience) slow down fighting to logical and more cautious saber wielding levels, and I would imagine make sabers and weapons more deadly as a result of the slower pace (otherwise death might be rare). All I have said is inevitable with an improved engine. You simply cannot have shoddy or un realistically rapid animation as it will look blatantly wrong in a new tech engine, while engines like Q3 can forgive it and even welcome it. The same is true for Q4, although it should be fast, because of the engine it wont be anything like Q3's speed and soon to be relatively jerky animation.
  9. Just clear your mind, and imagine it. It would be a sight to behold! I imagine it would look better then the movies LOL! Oh I say 3 or 4 since academy isn't really 3, its a different game.
  10. Wait he put the dead rodian on his bike and went to catch calo?
  11. Calo Nord: Pinnacle of Bounty Hunter's INTRO: And so is told the story of the greatest bounty hunter time contains. Incredibly deadly, vastly intelligent, heavily armed and most dangerous of all, without emotion or remorse. Calo Nord is that of a legend in his time alive and was known throughout the galaxy as a blatant ghost who was not to be trifiled with, who killed those who even spoke with him, and who delt only with those he knew would have the credits. --------- Calo Nord sits quietly in the corner of a busy Cantina. Lower Taris was bustling with activity at this time of year, while the underlords of cities preyed on the greater traffic of information... and bodies. (Thugs approach Calo...) Jeker: "Look Vahn, see that guy there... thats Calo Nord!" Vahn: "WHAT? That little runt, hahahha! I could drop him in a second." (Mandalorians are caught by the comment and look over to the ensuing battle) Jeker: I almost can't belive it myself, this punk is CALO NORD?" Calo Nord: Go away. Vahn: Ohhhh, looks like the little punk is trying to get tough. Your nobody you punk. Calo Nord: One. Jeker: One? You trying to scare us? Ha! Hey Kucken, Groth get over here, this punk thinks he can tell us what to do. (Two thugs get up from a table and move over to them, one a Rodian the other a Old Twi'lek.) Vahn and Jeker feel somewhat more secure with the added backup, and are looking for a fight or at the least to investigate this so called Legendary hunter. Vahn: So what do you want to do you punk? You think your going to take us all on? Calo Nord: Two. Vahn: I don't think you know what your getting into there Nord. Or are you even him? Probablly some lowlife trying to climb the ranks in Taris. Hah. (Vahn drew a vibroblade and at that time, Jeker pulled out a blaster pistol, Groth and Kucken took out blaster pistol prepared to fight) Calo Nord: Three. Before Vahn could move closer to Calo or Jeker could fire, a beeping flash mine lay at the feet of the thugs, the Mandalorians didn't at all feel threatened by the event but did lay their hands on their heavy repeaters. (Calo draws two heavily modified heavy blasters as the mine explodes with light, the group of thugs are blinded in the cloud of bright light there was the sound of 3 blaster shots and the cry of pain) (The light level returned to normal and all could be seen was the 4 thugs dead on the ground. 2 Had been shot in head, Jeker had a blaster hole in his chest that seemed to match the location of the posterior positioned Kucken who received the end point of the blaster bolt.) Calo Nords black goggles glistened as he turned to face the awestruck mandalorian mercenaries. Calo Nord turned, replaced his blasters away and began to walk out of the Cantina at a staggered pace. One of the mandalorians stood up in Calo's path. Maiker: Heh, nice job pal, you handled yourself well. (Maiker still had a hand laying on his heavy repeater) Calo Nord: Go away. Maiker: Whoa, I' am just appreciating your work, you see I'am in a similar buisne... Calo Nord: One. Trevlon, Maiker's mandlorian friend knocked on his arm and gestured for him to sit down. Maiker was shocked by the repeition of routine and Calo's lack of verbal exchange. Facing any other foe he would have took action immediately by this insult as he rarely commented anyone, but he wasn't sure what to expect form this stout killer. Maiker: Alright I get the idea, I'll be out of your way then pal. (Maiker sits down) Calo Nord: Smart. Calo then walked out of the bar as he didn't like to stay at a 'hit' scene too long as his blatency had limits as did his patience. Business elsewhere had to be dealt with. [Note: Please stay true to the starwars mythology, and don't bring in any lame names or references to modern time or pop culture or any other garbage, if you know what I mean. If I feel a post has driven the story in the wrong direction I will just say scrap last, and continue from before. So you know, Calo is from Knights of the Old republic, not your usual SW style character in that he is quiet and takes absolutely NO BS. The best analogy I can make of him is 47... the HITMAN]
  12. Jedi Knight + Doom 3 engine = the revolution all you need. Leave the MASTERFUL rpg elements to games like kotor and kotor 2 which are unbeatable in their fields. Once JK makes its next engine step, particularily if its doom 3, developers will be forced to create the incredible animations and slower paced (even more movie like) saber battles that would make the series incredible. Why? Because the animation is quite sophisticated on engines like that, so much so, that lower frame animations look 'out of place' and obscure in the graphically rich environment. Well of course this may digress slightly from the run and gun style much of Jediknight is inherent with. But after the engine matures (after quake 4), bringing the JK series to it while maintaining the fast action is certainly conceivable although far off (time wise).
  13. Hahaha. Actually I just played the game with the ghoul2 cvar. That was my only desire, and I was forced to play on my own server with it on. You are quick to judge, and believe you are absolute and always correct. As if some being of yours is higher then all others and can give truth to the true resolution. Although you have a strong standpoint, you fail to see the POTENTIALLY positive standpoints of others.
  14. It seems Cheeto, that spider AL would do well with that lesson himself. Please direct it at him as well.
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