Units Are Not All Created Equal (LONG)

[Guest BlackMantis]

So here is something I think is very interesting, and very excellent! It was pointed out before in an earlier post (somewhere) that not all Heavy Mechs are the same. The example used was the Empire vs. Naboo heavy mech. I not only agree with this observation, but I will take it a step further. This is true of Sea units, Heavy Weapons, and Air units also!

 

When the book states that the Empire is good at Mechs and the Rebels are good at air, and the Gungans are weak at Jedi, etc.... I do not believe those statements are simply based on the upgrades that the particular Civ is privy to. I believe it goes deeper than that, and maybe is not even documented.

 

Now, it may be my imagination, but when I play the Rebel Alliance, and I take X-Wings on "kill the enempy trooper" runs... there is absolutely no comparison to when I do the same thing with the Gungan Fighters. The Gungan Fighters have the same "stats" as the Rebel fighters, but don't seem to have NEARLY the success that the X-Wings do.

 

Another example is using the Gungan Jedi vs. the Naboo Jedi. Again, undocumented, but I swear to you that the Naboo Jedi will turn anything to my side, and are monumental to helping me win games when I take the mech-impaired Naboo. When I take a Gungan Jedi, and attempt to do the same thing, he tells me the Gungan Union has informed him not to work too hard, and turning guys to the Gungan side is simply not in his job description. He then precedes to get a cup of tea and a cookie, and sits down to watch the battle.

 

Heavy weapons is the last example. I have used the Rebels Heavy Weapons to attempt to take out Fortresses, only to have them get eaten up before even scratching the enemy.... But when I use my Gungan heavy weapons, it seems like there is only death and destruction awaiting the enemy fortress, it can't stand up to the Gungan assault. Again, undocumented in the stats.... the only thing mentioned in the book being, "the Gungans have strong Heavy Weapons."

 

Now, I can not explain nor verify this with more than experience, but it seems to be a recurring theme in every game I play. And, I believe other people are noticing it. And lastly, I think it is GREAT! It is a welcome change in the RTS world to have certain units that are "the same" for 6 Civs actually be much more or less effective depending on the strengths and weaknesses of that Civ.

 

Peace,

 

Mantis

[Necro]

interesting...

[Guest DarkTrooper]

Heavy weapons is the last example. I have used the Rebels Heavy Weapons to attempt to take out Fortresses, only to have them get eaten up before even scratching the enemy.... But when I use my Gungan heavy weapons, it seems like there is only death and destruction awaiting the enemy fortress, it can't stand up to the Gungan assault. Again, undocumented in the stats.... the only thing mentioned in the book being, "the Gungans have strong Heavy Weapons."

well when i was the trade feds against the gungans, i just used the big cannons from the fortress and killed the fammbaas and hvy weapons with ease. b/c every unit has a counter

[SimonW]

I like these "hidden" bonuses. They give a more authentic Star Wars feel. How would you like it for movie realism if a Gungan Fighter blasted an X-Wing into oblivion?

 

However, I don't think it will affect game balance two much.

[Guest Tie Guy]

I've noticed the exact same thing. (and if i remeber correctly i'm the one who pointed out the mech thing after playing the naboo and empire)

 

It makes a HUGE difference, even though they seem the same. Those differences often are the deciding factor in a game, and are really quite obvious...well...to me at least.

[Jordus1587246506]

Did you notice the Naboo only have an Assault Mech while the empire has a HEAVY Assault Mech.......... ........just a thought boyos..... :bdroid2:

[Guest BlackMantis]

Jordus:

 

You are missing the point methinks. Tie and I are talking about the same units from each side, not upgraded units, and not the advanced version of units.

 

It is wierd, and I bet not many people will notice it. However, I just played another 3 on 3 tonight. 3 humans vs. 3 computers. It took about 3 hours and 10 minutes before the computer side all gave up. Anyway, the differences were obvious again.

 

I really don't think it's all in our heads... I think there is more to it than the stats let on...

 

Anyway, it was a my brother (Wookies); myself (Naboo); and some guy named Ash (Trade Fed.) VS. 3 Galactic Empires on Moderate difficulty. Our Wookies went heavy, heavy Airforce. Our Trade Federation went heavy on Troops and Heavy Weapons, and I went all-around, with a strong focus on Jedi. There was major teamwork involved to repel the computer's early rushes, followed by combined arms tactics to then go on a counter-offensive late in the game.

 

Probably the most fun I have had playing a game in a very, very long time. I hope others are having as much fun as I am playing this game. Is the game perfect.... hah! Far from it. But I tell you, it is so much fun, you rarely notice any of the weaknesses!

 

Peace,

 

~ Mantis

[Dvlos]

Easy way to answer this... make a scenario..

 

Put regular ties vs zwings.

 

 

regular at-ats vs a group of rebel assault mechs. and see if their is any clear cut winner?

[Paragon_Leon]

The trick with those kinds of test-scenarios is, that they are sometimes made in a way that makes certain sides fire first, eliminating others in the process beforehand and getting an unfair advantage. You'd have to play them in an arena-setting, all in shooting-distance of each other. That way, once you start the scenario, they immediately start to fire at each other, at the same time.

[Guest Wanderer_Man]

"So here is something I think is very interesting, and very excellent! It was pointed out before in an earlier post (somewhere) that not all Heavy Mechs are the same. The example used was the Empire vs. Naboo heavy mech. I not only agree with this observation, but I will take it a step further. This is true of Sea units, Heavy Weapons, and Air units also! "

 

 

I assume your talking about Naboo Heavy Strike mechs vs Empire Heavy Strike mechs as that is the only heavy mech Naboo get, in any case they do exactly the same damage to one another.

 

 

Heavy weapons is the last example. I have used the Rebels Heavy Weapons to attempt to take out Fortresses, only to have them get eaten up before even scratching the enemy.... But when I use my Gungan heavy weapons, it seems like there is only death and destruction awaiting the enemy fortress, it can't stand up to the Gungan assault. Again, undocumented in the stats.... the only thing mentioned in the book being, "the Gungans have strong Heavy Weapons."

 

Taking out any external factors such as other units shooting at your heavy units, RA and GN units take the same amount of damage from a fortress.

 

All units of same types with for all civs do the same damage to each other, if your refering to actually Civ balance..that is a whole other topic, because yes then civs weaknesses and strengths play totally differently, but then again that is a cool thing about this game.

[Guest porkins14]

Simple solution:

 

Go edit a scenario and match these units head to head and see if they are stronger.