Which Side Do You Think is Superior in Multiplayer?

[Superfly0590]

As to the second point, I must say I really despise all this elitist condescending to newbie smack that has proliferated the forums. We all were newbies to FPS's at one point, and I'm sorry to say but you cannot claim to have advanced beyond newbie stage in a game that has been out for less than a week.

 

To begin: I do not want a flame war here.

 

Nowhere in my post did I declare ownage. I have my ass handed to me same as anyone else. I will say that I win much more than I lose. Right now I attribute this to so many new players. It is very easy to see a truly skilled player and immediately know I am about to die.

 

Advancing beyond newbie stage is not very difficult. Anyone who played JK:2 online already has a comfortable layout for force bindings, a good understanding of the carried-over force powers and IMO, is not a newbie (relative to the truly new players. Newbie is not a deragatory name although it carries the stigma of such. Everyone was a newbie in every game they ever played.

 

I don't see how you still consider yourself a newbie after the situation you described earlier. You obviously have an understanding of force powers. The ability to recognize another person's style of play. The ability to adapt to that style and defeat it. Newbies don't adapt, they are usually just trying to figure out what the heck you're doing.

 

I think the largest hurdle/skill gap is for players who do not have a good layout for force bindings. Using F1-F12 (or whatever the default is) against someone who never moves their hand or looks down to use force powers is an excersice in futility.

 

One more thing(always one more thing with me ): in my opinion the most powerful combo in multi-player is rarely used, even more rarely is it used effectively (I am among those trying to learn it ).

 

--STUPidflY

[Grand Moff]

I must be the only one who thinks they are perfectly balanced.

[dougp]

Just out of curiosity, how do you kick?

 

I was playing around with a friend last night in duels, and his tactic was to drain me, grip me and then slash with the blue styles.

 

My counter? Mind trick, wait for him to do an "action" and just push him and run in swinging with one red and quickly switch to yellow. He was dead fast.

 

When I do play the dark, I agree with people, I use drain first, then lightning. Too easy.

 

I rarely will "grip" people anymore, and if I do, I jump off with them, totally nullifying my kill. Now if I throw a push in and you're stupid enough to jump when it's three people vs. me, it's not my fault you fell off .

 

But can someone please tell me how to kick? hehe

[TheDarkSide]

IMO, there are several other factors which must come into play before you can say one side has a distinct advantage. The most important being the Force Level of the server. Set @ Jedi Master level where you can load up on everything save 3 or so force powers, you are pretty close to god mode save the invulnerability. Set @ Jedi level where you get something like 20 pts to distribute, I think things will even out. A light can max out absorb but have little else. A Dark with Saber skills instead of force or maybe a little drain will provide an imbalance then.

There is a proliferation of Master force level servers out there cuz everyone wants to experiment with everything.

 

On to whether absorb is too strong, it may be. But at the worst that doesn't give an unfair advantage to the Light Jedi. It merely negates the Dark Side advantage of offensive force powers. At worst, it evens things Force wise, and forces (no pun intended) the matchup down to saber/weapon skills. It strongly creates an even playing field.

Now bear in mind that force absorb is incredibly easy to misuse, and leave yourself extremely vulnerable. Forgot its on or accidentally mi**** the key in the heat of battle, and you can be toasted QUICKLY. If a Drain attack takes you down to zero force, then you might as well throw yourself down a pit or fall on your own sword.

 

I think Drain is pretty good balancer to Absorb...the only real complaints I have is that it SHOULD take some more force to expend than it currently does, and the way that Drain prevents you from regen your force pool even after the drain attack is over. I think that lasts for something like 10 secs for a Drain 3 attack (it feels like an eternity )

 

TDS

[Kyuss]

"Evil will always win because good is dumb!" - Dark Helmet "Spaceballs"

 

I think that sums it up...

[TheDarkSide]

To begin: I do not want a flame war here.

 

I apologize, re-reading my post my rant on newbie-ism did seem a tad more provocative than I intended. It wasn't directed at you, as much as your last sentence just set me off It was not my intention to flame you. And as a matter of fact, I appreciate your civilized response!

 

 

 

Nowhere in my post did I declare ownage.

 

No you did not. I took your last line and ran with it. Apology offered.

 

 

 

 

I don't see how you still consider yourself a newbie after the situation you described earlier. You obviously have an understanding of force powers. The ability to recognize another person's style of play. The ability to adapt to that style and defeat it. Newbies don't adapt, they are usually just trying to figure out what the heck you're doing.

 

I guess my definition of a newbie slightly differs from yours. To me I am still a newbie because I feel I have not discovered all there is to discover in this game. I don't know how to perform reliably any "unlisted" combo except 2 or so. I feel like I don't have a handle on what all I can do, and that someone out there knows something that I don't. Once I am comfortable that I am the master of my gaming fate, then I graduate myself past newbie status. Your definition makes sense too...I guess to me that is ULTRA newbie

 

I really think you hit an important point by talking about force power bindings being a critical component to online play. You ABSOLUTELY MUST MUST MUST rebind the force keys from the horrendous F1-F12 default setting. F12 is a worthless key to a right handed WASD user. Myself I use WASD and a 5 button mouse with the following setup for my primary force powers

tab= push

q=pull

e=absorb

mousewheel= stance select

button#4 mindtrick

button#5 heal

 

1,2,3 I have bound to speed seeing and protect (don't use much of them except speed from time to time)

 

I should really change my nick, eh?

 

TDS

[dansolo]

TheDarkSide makes a good point in bringing up the force level limits for the server config. I personally think "Jedi Knight" is a pretty good level to play at. Jedi Master seems to have just a little too much insane force usage for my liking. I prefer the weapons and sabers, with just enough force to push people around...

 

It seems to me that the problem powers which keep surfacing on the message boards are Absorb and Drain. With a little tweaking, these two powers could even out nicely. No one likes an empty mana bar all the time

 

-ds

[MorpheusX]

Thanks for posting your config. I too am a WASD player and was having trouble figuring out where to bind things to make it easier on me. The "q" and "e" I like a lot. I'm rather used to having Tab be my "current player screen", so I may tweak that. What key did you rebind that to? Anyway, my own tweaking will lead to my own preference, but I do appreciate the insight.

[dansolo]

Oh and to dougp-

 

Try running towards a wall and when you touch the wall, jump. You should do a backspring off the wall. Now try it on another player instead of a wall

 

From what I've seen, this is the only way to kick.

 

-ds

[Superfly0590]

dansolo: I agree, Knight force levels are the most fun for me. Then it's a matter of preference as to who has what skills. Not an all out force war with everything.

 

TheDarkSide: I like your nick. Keep it!

 

Back to the original topic of the thread. Which side is better?

 

I see it like this:

 

With Drain in it's current state, it's only a matter of time before I drain all of your pool (regardless of how good you are with absorb-all I have to do is tap drain 2-3 times). Once that happens it's very easy to keep your pool empty. I can now use my offensive powers to kill you/keep you from running away.

 

The Light powers are groovy, but when you realize how easy it is to take them all away, they lose their sparkle.

 

Granted you may kill me with your saber. But don't I have the advantage? I am continually healing myself while a keep your force pool dry!

[dougp]

Can't heal yourself if we don't have force!

 

Muhahahaha

[TheDarkSide]

I'm rather used to having Tab be my "current player screen", so I may tweak that. What key did you rebind that to?

 

I rebound (is that the correct past tense? looks weird) or rebinded whatever the player info screen to the down arrow. I rarely ever use that except when someone complains about lag, so I can check to see if they really are hindered or just whining about dying

 

Originally I had push at q and pull at e, but I found push to be very very handy during grips, sometimes more so than absorb, since you knock the guy down. I also would more times than not smack the tab key on accident when I was trying for the q to break a grip. I tried my darndest, but no matter how hard I tried, my ring finger on my left hand just doesn't like to move straight up from the a to the q. So I just went with the flow instead of trying to fight it. I don't use pull all that much, although that works with the grippers too in a suicidal way. hehehehe so i rebound that to the q key and voila!

 

I like the nick too, but it feels so hypocritical TheDarkSide Light Jedi.

[darky]

So then, this is what we have so far:

 

DARK SIDE:

 

Basically offensive. Everything can be countered by absorb, though which has no timer. It's a cheap tactic.

 

LIGHT SIDE:

 

Defensive. Can be killed with the ALL POWERFUL drain. Also very cheap.

 

Perhaps one can get more usage out of the light side powers. I've never really used them in MP, and I'm not totally interested in that, right now, at least. The name of the game is kill and play hard. That's why right now, I'm DARK.

[Superfly0590]

Darky:

Here's my quick summary(read: my opinions):

 

Light Force power: Defensive

Effective when used sparingly. Light's star ability is the very good heal. I wouldn't call any of Light's abilities 'cheap'. However, Light Jedi who run away to regenerate mana pool & heal are 'cheap'.

A Light Jedi must be very good with his saber to win.

 

Dark Force power: Offensive

Most effective when alternating any offensive range force attack with drain. Doing this is considered very cheap by most people (myself included). 'Drain whores' constantly tap drain you so you have no force and cannot heal at all. They will then whittle you down with force attacks which will over time kill you. Most of the time these people will not even engage in saber combat at all.

 

Disclaimer: I know nothing. These are my opinions not to be taken seriously by anyone at all.

[Pedro The Hutt]

hm... I think that neither is THE most powerful side. It all boils down to which side suits you best. But ofcourse, since many people get a rather offensive nature while playing games, they ofcourse go for the offensive powers. So the dark side is generally speaking more popular.(also those who like cool powers instead of good powers will go for the dark side).

Personally though I like to get victory through fair and honest means instead of gripping someone and slamming him into a wall or off a ledge. So it's light side for me. ^_^(besides I like my Force Healing too much)

Anyway that's just my two cents.

[Lon Averole]

Ultimately, easier to use is stronger. And this makes the Dark Side superior. In addition to the fact that Jedi can't use their power offensively, there is the added problem that, by draining, the Sith can actually reduce Jedis' ability to even defend.

 

I think Jedis need close team cooperation. If the master is gripped, the learner must shoot the gripper, or vice versa.

[Kyuss]

I personally never use drain unless I am playing Jedi Master or whatever that game mode is. I would rather use my force points on things that will help me get points rather than to stay alive at someone elses expence. You don't get points for staying alice, nor do you lose points for being killed... unless of course it is suicide. I focus more on rage, lightening, push, jump, and sight... also me light saber is always at the max, except saber throw... In my opinion if you need to throw a light saber all the way around the room, then you shouldn't be concerning yourself with that person.

 

Force Asorb... I haven't had any complications with people using that against me. I just walk off and let them waste their mana.

 

I do believe that there is more skill involved with the server is set to Jedi Knight and not master. You actually have to "aim" your force... such as lighting, drain, etc...

 

The force powers are hand and hand with weapons. People complain about rockets... well you can always force push those back. All in all, everyone of us has a weakness. Whether it is a weapon or specific force power, we can either compain about it or just accept that fact that we do have a weakness... and we might have something that causes a weakness is someone elses style.

 

In FFA, you objective is to simply kill as many people as possible... so don't worry about the "few" people you have trouble with. If you waste time with the ones that have found a weakness in you, than it is your own fault.