DF Series Storyline Continuity (Revised, and w/ Spoilers)

[Digital_Ronin]

Originally posted by Kurgan

And he just smiles and points to the "color change" nob on the hilt of his blade.. gives it a spin (so that his blade changes a rainbow of pretty colors) and the kids all go "wooooooooooooow"

 

(And the fanboys in the audience imitate Ewan McGregor and yell "Nooooooooooooooooooooo!")

 

*ROFL* :D

That would indeed put a very spectacular and merciless end to all color debates, yes.

Being an SW fan and also very observant when it comes to sabre colors, I still wouldn't mind to see that... just for the hell of it.

 

As for those midichlorians, though... *shivers*

 

Digital_Ronin

[xtmn8r]

I've mentioned this somewhere else but will post it here as well.

 

Lightsabers are very intricate weapons and need constant maintenance. Without regular maintenance the lightsaber will cease to function. If this happens, a Jedi may need to replace the crystal or have to construct a new saber.

 

Chagning the crystal can change the color. What does this mean for the game?

 

1) If this was Kyle's saber from JK1 or MOTS that he left with Luke, there is no doubt that by this time it would no longer function. As a result, Luke would've had to change the crystal and hence the color could've changed a a result

 

2) Maybe Kyle lost his saber long ago. Therefore Luke just gave Kyle a new one.

 

Now WHO'S lightsaber is it...well...that's for another day :-) One thing is for sure, Luke (or an apprentice) did tinker with it to keep it funtional

[Ko'or Oragahn]

Xtmn8r, I don't agree at all.

Both movies and the EU have shown lightsabres that lasted for more than a decade.

 

Wes Janson SMR, Kyle absolutely wanted a lightsabre and was very hurried about that. It's pretty obvious in JO.

If Kyle had buried Yun's lightsabre in the Valley, he could had taken it back with him when he returned to the place where he defeated Jerec years ago.

 

The reason to explain why he didn't do that was just a matter of respect for the deads and a question of tomb desecration.

 

I don't see Kyle diging Yun's tomb to stole the lightsabre. No no no.

 

Now, he used another one with an orange blade in MOTS.

 

Probably a lightsabre given by Luke or a lightsabre that he found somewhere. We don't know. I'll have to chevk the in game models of the lightsabres that Kyle used in JK and MOTS.

 

And finally he had a blue one in JO.

 

Possible explanation : Kyle thought that he would in fact need a few teachings from Luke after his failure with the Force on Dromund Kaas.

 

Here comes the blue lightsabre which is more symbolic than anything else.

 

The more he tried to learn things from Luke's teachings at the Academy, the more he got pissed off and sensed the tentation of the dark side.

So he put an end to the lessons and let his new blue lightsabre at the Academy.

 

I may say that this new one was built by Luke. I suppose that Kyle still doesn't know how to construct a lightsabre.

Look, in JK, he uses two lightsabres that he never built himself.

[Keiran Halcyon]

I still think that yellow-orange is the same saber.

 

Kyle, in the end of JK, makes two statues, one for his father and other for rahn. Not for yun. After that he attaches yun's saber in his belt and the game ends. Later, if he buried Yun's corpse, i boubt he leaved that saber in the grave. At that time there was not a jedi academy so he couldnt have made another one*, and he was a jedi, he needed one, and it remembered him yun's sacrifice, he HAD to keep it.

 

 

*unless in his father workshop there was in the wall a saber schematics, i dont remember it well...i remember there were remote's schematics...

[xtmn8r]

I know I'm asking for trouble, but here I go :-)

 

Lightsaber: Ko'or Oragahn are you referring OB1 giving Luke his father's lightsaber? OB1 didn't have much going on out there and he probably maintained the lightsaber over time. :-) Regarding EU. There may be instances where an unused lightsaber may still "function" but it would not be well tuned. Without regular maintenance, a lightsaber will become less effective and eventually cease to function.

 

JK1, MOTS, JK2 etc :

The info on StarWars.com is not written chronologically. The events on Dromund Kaas I believe is MOTS. At that point Kyle decides to attend the Academy. Also, I believe the Esential Guide to Characters mentions that (and I'm paraphrasing here) Kyle's brushes with the Dark Side along the way lead him to give the Force up all together. Eventually this leads up to where the game starts out. I think they put the Desann reference where it is just to tie all the VOTJ info together

 

So:

JK1

Kyle doesn't need training from Academy

MOTS

Kyle decides to go get training

Kyle eventually fears turning to the dark side and puts the Force behind him

Jedi Outcast

 

Hope this helps...although I'm guessing theyll be even more questions then before :-)

[Kurgan]

I still think that yellow-orange is the same saber.

 

I can prove it.. do you want me to post screenshots? Might take me a few days carting them over here on floppy disk... but I can do it.

 

There's nothing to say that somebody needs the academy to build a lightsaber. Luke and countless Dark Jedi did it without the academy. Luke did it from old books found in Ben's hut on Tatooine. In JK, you don't see it in gameplay, but in the menus you see a book and the parts to a lightsaber. Since Kyle doesn't build one, I assume what we're seeing is either Rahn or Morgan's plans to build a saber. Sound good?

 

Remember that there are numerous Jedi libraries and Holocrons floating around there after the Jedi Purge, so I'm sure the information was not just written down in one place (in Ben's house). For all we know it's common knowledge, but nobody builds them because only Jedi can be proficient with them in combat. Actually lightsabers may have had important industrial or medical uses for all we know and those plans could simply be modified for combat.

 

Kurgan

[Keiran Halcyon]

Well i CAN see differences in colors, i'm just saying that the saber is the same. They changed the color becasue they wanted to or wanted the player be able to use another color, and it is not a radical change as orange to blue, we are talking about yellow to orange.

 

If you read the manual, they said that Mara Jade has constructed a new saber, so her color change is explained (although it is a lie) but about kyle's they do not say ANYTHING, and if it were new, they would have said it.

 

As i pointed out, in Morgan workshop maybe there are plans for the lightsaber, but i think he didn't make one. And very little material about the jedi was left, Luke Skywalker has barely found enough things. I do not know if in the New Jedi Order they found more holocrons, but as far as i'm concerned, there was only one in the bantam books, and it was destroyed.

 

For all we know it's common knowledge, but nobody builds them because only Jedi can be proficient with them in combat. Actually lightsabers may have had important industrial or medical uses for all we know and those plans could simply be modified for combat.

 

That is from the New Jedi Order too? As far as i know, only jedi can make lightsabers, because they have to use the Force to unite the parts. If it were common knowlegde, why doens't everyone has one? They are very useful items to cut things, and very dangerous. You dont need to be a jedi for that.

[Kurgan]

I haven't read the New Jedi Order series, but frankly, I think that "needing the force" to "unite the parts" to make a lightsaber sounds like pure BS. Sure I suppose you COULD build a saber using the force to move the parts around, but you could also build it conventionally, and you could do the same thing with a computer.

 

Maybe the Jedi do have some kind of "rule" about that, but who's going to enforce it? In the Radio Drama (canon after the screenplay, novelisation and film) of ROTJ, we have the scene with Luke building his saber. Nothing about requiring the Force to do anything, although he does use it to help him concentrate (but that's it.. nothing about the creation of the saber itself).

 

It's a piece of technology, just like a blaster or a hyperdrive. Anyone with the adequate parts, and knowledge, can assemble one.

 

Or are we now going to assume that Desann and Tavion built all those lightsabers themselves? Think about it!

 

As to the question of "why doesn't everyone have one?" Well, originally, in Lucas's story, everyone DID, stormtroopers, mercenaries, soldiers, EVERYONE. But then he changed it, to make it the unique weapon of the Jedi/Sith. You can still find the concept sketches/paintings of such use by non-Jedi/Sith on several sites and in several books (Art of Star Wars for example).

 

But practically, why didn't everyone use them? Perhaps they were expensive to build. Maybe the parts were rare. Maybe it was difficult to do. Or maybe the Jedi had legal controls (copyrights?) over the construction, and so they monopolized them (but in that case it would mean nothing once the Jedi were destroyed). The Sith were able to build lightsabers without Jedi help, and again, we see in JO that non-Jedi are obviously building lightsaber (unless you believe that Tavion and Desann just sat around building lightsabers all day for the Empire).

 

Maybe lightsabers were BANNED BY LAW after the Jedi purge? That would make having one illegal, like disruptors. So they'd become incredibly rare, with the Empire punishing anyone (like the Jedi) who used them. Vader would get off the hook of course because he was the Emperor's right-hand man, and maybe a few agents on the side (in secret of course). It's kind of like chemical-biological weapons are today. Just about everybody agrees that they won't use them, or build them, but in secret, they build them anyway "Just in case."

 

The other thing could be the perception of the Jedi as evil (the Emperor's propaganda) making owning the weapon something that was shameful and taboo. Like how it is with the swastika or Confederate Battle Flag in parts of the United States. If everybody is going to think you're a freak for displaying it, a lot of people won't do it.

 

Could be that perhaps there is a certain attitude that the Jedi were primitive and superstitious, so lightsabers are seen as outdated and obsolete (in favor of blasters, like Han Solo's comments). So snobbery makes them fall out of favor. After all, if nobody thinks they're good, nobody is going to buy them.

 

So there could be lots of reasons. I'm betting that there is some book out there in the EU saying how a Jedi must infuse his special crystal with the living force or some other magic-tech BS excuse, but until I see that, I think this is a perfectly legitimate point. And again.. what about JO?

[Kurgan]

If you read the manual, they said that Mara Jade has constructed a new saber, so her color change is explained (although it is a lie) but about kyle's they do not say ANYTHING, and if it were new, they would have said it.

 

But they didn't have to SAY it, anyone can SEE It for themselves.

 

End of JK: Saber yellow.

 

MotS: Saber orange.

 

You can look at them in JK and compare, Mots and compare, and JO and compare. All of the yellow sabers look distinct from the orange sabers. They are NOT easily confused (unless you have some color blindness issues, and if so, I apologize).

 

So was Mara's purple saber in MOTS a "lie" in the same way that Kyle's blue saber in JK2 was?

[Wes Janson SMR]

Originally posted by Kurgan

So was Mara's purple saber in MOTS a "lie" in the same way that Kyle's blue saber in JK2 was?

 

That's exactly what I belive...I think. Mara never built herself a lightsaber in the EU series. Or if she did, she never had it handy - until Luke gave her his father's.

 

And I always assumed Kyle was using Yun's lightsaber during MotS.

 

And I still believe that he should be using Yun's 'saber for JO. Notice the operative word "should".

 

I never understood why these devs can't even put in a decent backstory behind all of these changes. Sure, there are a lot of gamers out there who couldn't care less. But there are too many who do care.

[Keiran Halcyon]

In 'I, Jedi' novel they say that the electronics in the saber must be assembled with the Force, not my fault.

 

I can see colors very well as i said before. I'm just saying that i assumed (as wes janson) that the saber was yun's

 

And about mara purple one, if they do not explain it, people could assume that it was luke's because the hilt is similar and yun's was darkened to in the game. And the poster from TPM had obi wan with a blue saber , but it seemed purple.

[Star ReaVeR]

If there's green,purple and blue there has to be more colours for evil jedi no?

[Kurgan]

Well here's the thing, if it's mentioned in "I, Jedi" then it's EU, not SW canon, and so it really doesn't have to apply to anything.

 

As I said, the only Star Wars evidence we have in the canon for lightsaber assemblage is in the ROTJ radio drama, but in that case the only thing that Luke uses the Force for is to concentrate while he's working. He puts it together with a screwdriver and soldering iron just like a normal person (or the SW universe equivalent tools). ; )

 

Again, if we follow I, Jedi in JK2 to the letter, we have to assume that Desann and Tavion had to bulid all of those lightsabers that the remnant is using. Or, we could speculate that the remnant spent years and years on this project, and so each Reborn and Shadowtrooper had to build their own lightsaber, and had to be taught by Desann/Tavion how to do it. This would mean they'd need their own evil "Academy" etc. I know it's a game, but in story terms, that's how you'd have to do it. I figured they just got the raw materials they needed, and started up a lightsaber factory. Robots could manufacture the lightsabers needed in plenty of time, and much more efficiently (besides, you have standardization and its much cheaper to mass produce things than build them each individually). You could have your two Dark Jedi spot check and inspect the sabers afterward to make sure there were no major defects, but in general that would be the smart way to do it.

 

Or, like I said, you're left with having them sitting down and building a ton of lightsabers all by themselves in their basement, like Luke did.

 

About the whole lightsaber change thing, all I'm saying is that sure in real life and in game terms and liscensing terms, there's no explanation and doesn't need to be. We just get new saber colors in each game, end of story.

 

But, if we're going to try to explain it in story terms, we have to assume that Kyle is using a green saber then a gold saber in JK, an orange saber in MotS, and a Blue saber in JK2. And since we have no knowledge of sabers suddenly changing color after a few years, we have to assume that Kyle (or Mara) got those sabers from someplace.

 

So where did they get them? Did they build them, or did they find them or were they given them somehow? That's all I'm saying.

 

Right now you can assume that Kyle is really using Yun's gold saber in MotS, ignoring the onscreen orange saber, and assume Mara is using a blue one that belonged to Luke (and before him Anakin) ignoring the purple one. Likewise you can ignore the blue saber in JK2 and pretend it's orange (like I'm doing with cheat codes). But again, in story terms that's equivalent to watching ESB and ROTJ and whenever Vader says that he's Luke's father, you pretend he said "Obi-Wan is your father." ; )

 

Granted the plot point isn't that important, but it was made a big point in JK2, the whole giving up the lightsaber as symbolic of his giving up the Jedi way, etc.

 

And since LEC/Raven has really no explanation story-wise, we are speculating on what's the most likely reason he has a blue one?

 

Maybe somebody needs to write a book about how he had some more adventures after Mots and built a new lightsaber for that, or lost his orange one or something. ; )

[Wes Janson SMR]

If I got the green light from the SW legal department (or wherever), I could churn out something worth reading.

 

But why write when it's considered simply "fan-fic" and not "canon"?

 

'-)

[Tzar Sectus]

But practically, why didn't everyone use them? Perhaps they were expensive to build. Maybe the parts were rare. Maybe it was difficult to do. Or maybe the Jedi had legal controls (copyrights?) over the construction, and so they monopolized them (but in that case it would mean nothing once the Jedi were destroyed).

Actually, there's a much more reasonable answer to this. What's a better weapon to use conventionally? A blaster is longrange while with a lightsabre you have to get completely close to your opponent to actually be a threat. Generally, blasters are better weapons. You'd have to be insanely good with a lightsabre to use it well in normal firefights.

 

By the way, it's nice to see someone else who believes the lightsabre is just a piece of technology... I really don't like what all these books suggest about the connection between lightsabres and the Force.

 

-Remi

[Keiran Halcyon]

Again, if we follow I, Jedi in JK2 to the letter, we have to assume that Desann and Tavion had to bulid all of those lightsabers that the remnant is using. Or, we could speculate that the remnant spent years and years on this project, and so each Reborn and Shadowtrooper had to build their own lightsaber, and had to be taught by Desann/Tavion how to do it. This would mean they'd need their own evil "Academy" etc.

 

 

The Reborn are from Empire Reborn? Then, they had a Dark Academy and lots of dark jedi. In I, Jedi Corran Horn builds a saber in two-three days, and in his grandfather diary was told a thechnique to do one in one day. Remember that the Sith spent a millenium to reveal themselves, Empire reborn can wait a little.

 

.

About the whole lightsaber change thing, all I'm saying is that sure in real life and in game terms and liscensing terms, there's no explanation and doesn't need to be. We just get new saber colors in each game, end of story.

 

That is what i've been saying. But then, they could have gave Mara her blue one since we had never used one until JKO...

 

So where did they get them? Did they build them, or did they find them or were they given them somehow? That's all I'm saying.

 

At least we know Mara built hers, as lame it can be...

 

Right now you can assume that Kyle is really using Yun's gold saber in MotS, ignoring the onscreen orange saber, and assume Mara is using a blue one that belonged to Luke (and before him Anakin) ignoring the purple one. Likewise you can ignore the blue saber in JK2 and pretend it's orange (like I'm doing with cheat codes). But again, in story terms that's equivalent to watching ESB and ROTJ and whenever Vader says that he's Luke's father, you pretend he said "Obi-Wan is your father." ; )

 

That is what i'm doing, Using SBX you can also have Yun's and Anakin's hilt

But it is not like pretenmding Darth Vader isnt' luke's father, Orange is very near to yellow and blue to purple.

 

Maybe somebody needs to write a book about how he had some more adventures after Mots and built a new lightsaber for that, or lost his orange one or something. ; )

 

That would be cool. But Mara's Saber cannot be explained, sice she still uses it. And have been using in every book.

[Celchu]

I mean in the Jedi Knight game he had a green lightsaber, then if he choose the light side you use yun's light saber all the way through MotS. So when did he get the blue saber?

[TNode]

The devs screwed up. How on earth they managed that is beyond me.

[Pear]

I asked Kenn Hoekstra about it, and he speculates that the sabre he finds in the Academy is just a new one, and assumedly has no connection with the past sabre(s) he's used.

[Bl4de]

I dunno, maybe he created his own after MOTS considering you have to make your own to become a Jedi, but I dunno cause after MOTS I thought he gave his saber to Luke? There's no way anyone messed it up, they probably have a reason behind it.

[*Darth Vega*]

Maybe Luke couldnt remember what color Kyle's lightsaber was so he just grabbed one out of a box?

[Etz]

I think someone mentioned in an interview that in single player they had to follow the SW canon as far as they could. That means only color choices were blue and green. There have been many threads about this same subject, some of them long and giving much indepth specualtion (but only speculation) why the color of the saber is what it is. How ever I haven't seen any real proof for either way yet.

[Madcow]

the saber IS the right color, kyle just went colorblind in his old age

[enDless_Deliriu]

I still say Luke was goofing around with it, broke it, and had to replace the focusing crystal!

[ShadowCell]

Maybe Luke was tempted by the Dark Side, and decided to break Kyle's lightsaber, but all he did was change the color because he forgot what he was doing. *sigh* Too many funny Star Wars drinks will do that to you I guess...