Guest Forceflow Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 Yoda thought she was another hope for the continuation of the Order, that speaks volumes for his faith in her strength in the Force, really. When does he say that? And now don't say that she was 'the other one'. In fact it is very unlikely that Yoda thought that she was this last hope. With no training at all she could've never beaten Vader or the Emperor. Not even Luke was truly able to do that, and now he had a lot of training. So in the end it makes more sense if Yoda was truly speaking of Vader for this being the last hope. Which would also fall into the 'Balance to the Force' theory that Annakin in the end DID bring balance to the Force. (That is if you define balance as being light sided only) Of course the question remains if this makes sense, since both Obi-Wan and Yoda tell Luke he shouldn't try to convert Vader. Tricky, I wonder if we'll ever find out what Lucas meant in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrEEpaGe Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 Originally posted by Vestril Just as clairification... About 12 years passes from Ep I to II, and since Owen and Beru seem to be hanging out together, and since Owen the actor who plays Owen is more than a bit older than that, and in some of the pictures on starwars.com he has stubble...I'm pretty certain he is Anakin's Step-Brother just as clarification They are not just friends. Owen and Beru are very close to getting married in Episode II. Owen is about the same age of Anakin, and yes, Owen is Anakin's Step Brother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 She later dies in childbirth, Leia is taken away, and Ben takes Luke to live on Tantooine. No, Leia says that she has vague memories of her mother and that she died when Leia was "very little". It's possible, Kev'i Haric... but I don't think it's likely. One of the devices authors use in writing is using similar terms to describe a character, especially if the person is mysterious so that when the mystery is finally solved, you can say "Oh, there it is!" Yoda says: "No, there is another..." Yoda, on his deathbed tells Luke: "Luke, there is another Skywalker..." Luke says to Ben: "Yoda spoke of another." And Ben gives us the last piece of the puzzle when he says "The other he spoke of was your twin sister." So you have a theme, a trail of words that all point to Leia. Luke tells Leia "If I fail, you'll be the only hope for the Jedi," mirroring Yoda's admonition to Ben. "Because the Force is strong in my family..." But then, you think--what could Leia do? Ben's dead and so is Yoda. Maybe she could've been taught by their spirits? Maybe the Force somehow would give her special knowledge of the Force. Also, Yoda obviously did mean to train Luke well, but then Luke threw a monkey wrench into it when he ran off to save Han (and didn't return between the movies, either, as evidence from his vague words to R2: "I have a promise to keep to an old friend." The promise was the one he made to Yoda to return, so he hadn't come back since then). So he wasn't Yoda's Patsy... but might he have been Ben's? Ben is obviously very close-minded about Vader. Think about it, he never tells Luke that Vader is his father, but tells him what? That Vader MURDERED his father! Sure, it was true "from a certain point of view", but what did that half-truth do to Luke? It kindled hatred in him, which leads to the Dark Side. But then, Obi-Wan knows from experience that the Dark Side can only defeat the Dark Side (he turned momentarily when he battled Maul). And furthermore, he allows Luke to see Vader strike HIM down! Luke's just found a link to his past, a link to his father and toward a great dream of being a hero--and Vader destroys this link before his eyes! And Obi-Wan facilitates it by not defending himself! When Luke, on Dagobah, confronts Ben and tells him "There is still good in" Vader, Obi-Wan tries to dissuade him! "He's more machine now than man, twisted and evil..." He's not your father, so kill him! What the heck is Ben thinking when he tells Luke these things? I believe that Ben is not the benevolent elderly Wizard that we've perceived for the last 25 years. Ben is scheming and manipulative, using Luke to destroy his greatest mistake. He failed and by his failure caused the destruction of every Jedi but himself and Yoda. Think about that--all of his friends, his whole life-style... he goes from respected to derided as a "crazy old wizard", and he must live in hiding lest the Empire come for him. He knows he can't defeat Vader, he's not strong enough to kill the Chosen One who is more powerful than Yoda. But then, he reckons that Vader's own son might have inherited his incredible powers and might have the ability to do what Ben could not. It's easy to think so, after seeing the movies, but when you think about it Vader was MUCH stronger in the Force, and he probably could have done some gripping and other Force attacks to whup up on Maul... Yeah, Vader's a Grip Whore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inSpiRe- Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 What im dying to know is......WHAT HAPPENED TO LORD SIDIUS? U know, the "master" in episode 1. I mean, there are mysterious transmissions from him, and he makes an appearance once, but what really happened to him? And i think this also ties in with that little quote in TPM, the officer dude saying "but who was really destroyed, the master or the apprentice?" I am dying to know, and does lord sidius make an appearance in episode 2/3? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Forceflow Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 uh oh... man, watch the movie again, and watch it REAL closely!!! And while you're at it, watch the original trillogy again, too. You gotta pay more attention Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caldera Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 Most people fail to realize that Obi wan is a very powerful jedi. Defeating Darth Maul 1v1 is no easy task, even though it was made to look so. Darth Maul was TOYING with a jedi master AND a padawan(i see him as knight, he is way too good for padawan). And Darth Maul may not be strong with the actual force powers, but he seems to be in his mid to late 20s and he has unbelievalbe physical strength and endurance, and he has MAD lightsaber skillz. This leads me to believe that Obi wan is very powerful(or cunning) for defeating Maul. H However, it might just be that since Maul rarely uses physical force powers, he did not see the pull+jump (and possibly speed) combo that Obi used on him. Anyways, a victory is a vicotry, and no one should underestimate Obi wan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jman3ooo Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 Originally posted by inSpiRe- What im dying to know is......WHAT HAPPENED TO LORD SIDIUS? U know, the "master" in episode 1. I mean, there are mysterious transmissions from him, and he makes an appearance once, but what really happened to him? And i think this also ties in with that little quote in TPM, the officer dude saying "but who was really destroyed, the master or the apprentice?" I am dying to know, and does lord sidius make an appearance in episode 2/3? U have one post...? You registereg to say that Watch REAL CLOSELY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrEEpaGe Posted May 1, 2002 Share Posted May 1, 2002 Originally posted by inSpiRe- What im dying to know is......WHAT HAPPENED TO LORD SIDIUS? U know, the "master" in episode 1. I mean, there are mysterious transmissions from him, and he makes an appearance once, but what really happened to him? And i think this also ties in with that little quote in TPM, the officer dude saying "but who was really destroyed, the master or the apprentice?" I am dying to know, and does lord sidius make an appearance in episode 2/3? Well, first of all, since you're obviously missing something here, I will tell you that he does appears in Episode 2 and will appear in Episode 3 ( I am going out on a HUGE limb with THAT comment ), but I also need to tell you something else that you might have not caught on to at first . Darth Sidious is Palpatine. I hope that clears some things up for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkSide Posted May 2, 2002 Author Share Posted May 2, 2002 What I want to know though.. is why he says to Luke "Your father wanted you to have this, when you were old enough." If Vader didn't know he had children, why the heck was he telling Obi-Wan he wanted his lightsaber given to his child? good catch, Frizbee. Here's what I'm gathering about Crazy Old Ben. He lies like a dog about anything related to Anakin. You wanna know about your father, yeah.....he was killed by uhhhhh a pupil of mine,Vader, and uhhhhhh he wanted you to have this (rubs finger against nose in universal I'm lying body language) when you were old enough....and I uhhhhhhhh took it upon myself to train him....and uhhh go get him I find it interesting though that Ben pretty much committed Obi-cide in his final duel with Vader only after he was sure Luke was watching. Maybe he knew he had taken things as far as he could and the only way to take down Vader was to make Luke hate him. TDS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inSpiRe- Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 thanks threepage for the clarification, cuz ive heard the rumor that palpatine was sidius. and for being nice about it. i just wanted to clear some things up, and no thanks to those people who had to be rude bout it. fyi, jman3ooo, i had just registered yesterday and i have no clue why u have to be so snappy about it. the first time i saw the movie, i though sidius looked like palpatine, but i wasnt too sure. like i said, i heard that rumor from somewhere and i just wanted to make sure it was true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thrEEpaGe Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 Happy to help. =) Also, if you are wanting to know more about the Episode II sith/character connection, visit http://www.jedinet.com/prequels/episode-ii/. They also have some very interesting news about Episode III. If you have any more questions, just message me or post a new thread =) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L'Equa Sinar Posted May 2, 2002 Share Posted May 2, 2002 I belive vader figured out luke was his son at the end of ANH where he wa tailing him in his TIE, the phrase "The force is strong with this one" gives a feeling of recognition from vader, as if it was his destiny NOT to kill luke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCanr2d2 Posted May 4, 2002 Share Posted May 4, 2002 Inspire, the Palpatine/Sidious link was half disclosed in that near end scene. When Yoda and Mace discuss which one was killed, the master or the apprentice, there is a convenient pan to Palpatine in a hood similar to his Sidious look. It's sort of subtle, but then again if you take in what they are saying and what George shows on the screen, it isn't as hard to miss as many people suggest. There are many small plot points answered this way, where GL shows little things as someone speaks, or a lingering pan on something or someone. They are designed to be that way, and not bad editing, or time filling. Sometimes people take too much on what is said, and ignore what is on the screen, which takes the text out of context. I don't think Vader knew Luke was his son in ANH, but by some time in TESB. As we say later on in ROTJ, the small amount of Anakin not consumed by the Dark Side is the part that hides many of the discoveries that Vader finds out and keeps from the Emperor. Like being able to sense Luke on the Shuttle Tydirium and on Endor, the Emperor can't feel his presence. It ended up being a case of being 99.9% consumed by the Dark Side, but Luke sensed that small amount of good left in Anakin, that he ended up convincing him to change his stance on the Emperor, enough to kill him. It's almost a case of blood is thicker than water - that when the Emperor is trying to kill his son, Anakin starts to see some of the errors in his way, that the people that will be killed in his evil will also include his family - his son and daughter. Perhaps it got a little too personal for Anakin to continue to be Vader.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIO Posted May 4, 2002 Share Posted May 4, 2002 Lucas should just admit that no one doesn't know that anikin is vader Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vestril Posted May 4, 2002 Share Posted May 4, 2002 Lucas should just admit that no one doesn't know that anikin is vader Umm, there are some people that don't know yet, who haven't seen the movies, and there will be more of them, let's call them 'new people' and the idea is that it would be nice for these 'new people' if they watched the whole thing through and got most of the same suprises we got when we watched the original trilogy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clem Posted May 5, 2002 Share Posted May 5, 2002 ok it may be a little late to post about the droids .... it may be late to post at all ... but lets think about the amount of droids in a galaxy .... LOTS not R2 droids ALSO LOTS If they all go R2-letternumber there are only 260 combinations ..... so ... some must be named the same thing the same with c-3p0 so obi and darthy probably dont know the droids Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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