Lord_FinnSon Posted January 20, 2001 Share Posted January 20, 2001 LEC, could you at least give JPB to us, PC gamers after taking Obi-Wan away from us... Check it now and sign! www.petitiononline.com/JPBpc/petition.html [This message has been edited by Lord_FinnSon (edited January 19, 2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Acid_Rain327 Posted January 21, 2001 Share Posted January 21, 2001 Geez...you people have been ripped off TWICE by the same damn game, and you're STILL asking for more? Wake up, people. Furthermore, if LEC gave a crap about people wanting Obi-Wan, or any of their other games for that matter, then they wouldn't have abandoned all the PC Obi-Wan enthusiasts in favor of cashing in on Sony's new blatant rip-off, the PS2. [This message has been edited by Acid_Rain327 (edited January 20, 2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Saesee Tom Posted January 22, 2001 Share Posted January 22, 2001 Shut up, the PS2 is not a rip-off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Maul Posted January 22, 2001 Share Posted January 22, 2001 Acid's been here longer than you, Tom, even longer than me. You may think the world revolves around you, but believe it or not he knows more about these things than you do. Everyone's allowed to have their say. Just because someone bad-mouths a console you have to go and shoot off your mouth. He's saying JPB for PS2 would be a rip-off, and I agree. Hell, you've had a field day with the cancellation of SBR for DC. ------------------ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest hi Im mad Posted January 23, 2001 Share Posted January 23, 2001 dont get mad, acid is actually trying to help us, I think lucas arts is sucking all the money they possbiley can out of JPB also, and it isnt fair. But I am glad they released a version for the DC because I dont have a playstation and never will, its too old now, but I am getting a PS2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_FinnSon Posted January 26, 2001 Author Share Posted January 26, 2001 Geez people! We don't have to rip fellow gamers head off just because they say what they think. There are always other cool games(like "No one lives forever" and "Deus EX") and I know this is a little of topic, but annoucment that Battle for Naboo is coming for PC, lights up my day. This petition was actually a little test to see, how many people is thinking the same way about JPB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Acid_Rain327 Posted January 29, 2001 Share Posted January 29, 2001 I wasn't trying to be offensive. It's just that, for the most part, this forum seems to be made up of fairly level-headed and intelligent people. It bugs me when such people get ripped off completely, go and get a ported version of the SAME game and get ripped off again, and then ask for more. I mean, LEC has had two chances to make a truly killer game, and they've used them both to screw us over for money. And as for the PS2 being a rip-off, let me give you a run-down: People see the 66 million polygons per second capability of the PS2, and are amazed. However, those 66 million are untextured, unlighted and are basically just raw, wire-frame polygons. If you add all the necessary components to those polygons (which are mandatory since the days of Atari) you get a number roughly between 3-6 million, at best. That number is demolished by any other current-generation console soon to be on the market. Next, simultanious texturing. For anyone who doesn't know, polygons must be textured, lighted, etc., in passes. This means, a programmer must texture it, go back and add gloss, go back again and add lighting, and so on. Now, the number of options a programmer can utilize in one pass determines how quickly, effeciently and easily a programmer may texture a polygon. The Nintendo GameCube allows programmers to complete 8 different effects in one pass, while the PS2's programming only allows for one effect per pass. This means that a programmer must go over a shape up to *eight* times in order to achieve the desired look. The X-Box can do so in 4 times that speed, and the GameCube can do so in 8. Basically, Sony didn't take the time to make programming more efficient. It's needlessly difficult, and developers have already jumped ship because of this, among other reasons. The team behind Sony's pseudo-flagship character, Crash Bandicoot, were among those that left. Next is the V-RAM. This is placed so oddly in the PS2 that it will take developers years in order to achieve the console's maximum limits. Basically, before this system's maximum performance is seen, the console will be obsolete. If you want me to nit-pick, then look at simple things like compressed texturing and jaggies. The Sega DreamCast has already utilized anti-aliasing to virtually rid games of jaggies, and the PS2, which came out a year later, still suffers the same problems as it's age-old predecessor, the PSX. Instilling anti-aliasing wouldn't be that hard, (and it'd solve a lot of complaints from Sony's consumers) but no, they decided not to deal with it. Texture compression basically squeezes everything together to not only make tighter, neater-looking textures, but it reduces the size of the files, which in turn, reduces lagging and the need for "fog". The X-Box, GameCube and DreamCast all support this, but PS2 doesn't...so, you can look forward to the nice, pixilated textures we've all grown accustomed to with the PSX. And here's the real kicker: Sony decides to continue to use the PSX controllers instead of designing new ones, right? Well, that's all fine and dandy. It's a cheap and lazy decision, but what the hell: the controllers are decent, and it saves the company money to use on other things. But, then the time comes to deal with what all DVD players (a low-end, "80 dollar" dvd player, I might add) need - a remote. Do they use the money they saved on controllers to give us a good, reliable remote? No. Instead, they sell the friggin' rights to make remotes to outside developers. In short, you're buying an 80 dollar dvd in a lazily-souped-up version of a 99 dollar console, which will be obsolete in one year. All for the low price of $300. And on top of that, you have to plop down another $60 for one of maybe 10 or so uneventful games... and yet another $30 for a friggin' remote. [This message has been edited by Acid_Rain327 (edited January 29, 2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jedi Kanigget Posted January 30, 2001 Share Posted January 30, 2001 *Rebuttal* I don't know about anyone else, but I tend to buy games that are fun, not aesthetically pleasing. The fun part comes in first, if it looks good visually, all more the better. Believe it or not, with all the bugs in JPB, I had fun. Same thing with a lot of PS games. The PS2 may still have "jaggies", but I don't care. Why? Can you say "Metal Gear Solid: Sons of Liberty"? Or maybe "Legacy of Kain 2: Soul Reaver" and "Silent Hill 2". If these three games are anything like their predecessors, they're worth the PS2 alone. Jaggies or no, the PS2's graphics are stunning. The issue of the programming difficulty: I don't see this as a problem. The programmers left are, logically, good programmers, so really the only thing gamers have to worry about is a bad plots/stories. The issue of the controller and remote: To quote the old adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". The PlayStation controller is the best controller I've used hands down. I've heard this from many other gamers as well. The controller fits comfortably in your hand, unlike the Dreamcast's, which requires an extra three fingers on each hand to grasp comfortably. As far as the remote goes, I don't know of any companies that give away peripherals like that free. And there is a good remote out there, it's at Best Buy, maybe even some other stores. It's made by Saitek and costs a bank-breaking $20. The only thing that equals the PS2 is the X-Box, and since it's under the brand name of "Microsoft", I'm not going to touch it with a ten foot poll. I have enough problems with Microsoft as it is, I don't really want my console game freezing up. Nintendo Gamecube, granted, is powerful, but like the 64, it's using the technology of yesteryear. CDs and CD-ROM's are on the way out, being replaced by DVDs and DVD ROM's. This means more disks per game. CDs can hold a lot of information, but not nearly as much as DVDs. This means if Nintendo wants to make longer games, it's going to need more disks;and usually that means a higher price. Dreamcast? It's days are numbered. Sound off all you like about how good it is, it still doesn't stand a chance against the combined forces of PlayStation 2, X-Box, and Nintendo GameCube. The biggest games for Dreamcast so far have been games that have appeared on other consoles. Unless Sega comes up with a revolutionary game soon, the Dreamcast will soon be a faded memory. There are legions of loyal PlayStation and Nintendo fans out there who will buy the next incarnation of their favorite console. With the addition of Microsoft, new gamers will probably go after that due to it's big name. Dreamcast is already sinking fast in Japan, it's only a matter of time here. To wrap this up, buy what you want. If you had a PlayStation and liked it, you're going to like the PS2. If you didn't like it, buy something else. Investigate, find out what games are coming out for the consoles and buy the one that has the most games you're interested in. Don't just buy a system because it's more advanced. Look at the PlayStation. It was considerably less advanced than the 64, yet it consistently beat out the 64 in sales worldwide. Buy a system that you know you'll have fun playing; that's the reason to play games. To have fun, to be amused; not to say "ooh, that's pretty!". And finally, if I remember correctly, Acid has a bias against both PlayStations. I'm the exact opposite. Listen to what we have to say and make your own judgment based on your own views and observations. Do not base your decision solely, or even partly on what is said by others. They are not the ones who will be playing your new system. Whatever you do, have fun. (All right, all right... the last line was cheesie...so sue me.) ------------------ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Acid_Rain327 Posted January 30, 2001 Share Posted January 30, 2001 *Re-rebuttal* -Uh, sorry dude, but you're misinformed. The GameCube is already more powerful than the PS2, in several aspects - this being proven without over-blown and exaggerated specs. Which, by the way, was my point: if Sony cared about their consumers and it had faith in its product, then they'd produce specs that are at least logical, and physically possible for even the most basic games. -GameCube'll be using mini-dvd technology (discs that can hold somewhere in the ball-park of a gig and a half each). So...actually, PS2 is using technology of yester-year, and PS2 games on 4 CDs will cost more than GameCube games on say 1 or 2 dvds. Then, throw in the difference in labor costs because the GC is 8 times easier to program for... -And for that matter, the PSX was twice as powerful as the N64, but the only companies that actually used the PSX's full capabilites were SquareSoft and.... no, just SquareSoft. But, if you want to compare games, then I'll take Zelda, Goldeneye and even Mario64 to a million and a half Tomb Raider and Street Fighter clones. By the way, I have no bias against the PSX; I'm just ticked off at the fact that Sony traded quality for money, and companies we've grown to love like LEC are joining the rip-off bandwagon. -I think the DC has at least another year of life left. And two words for you: ShenMue Two. So, while Kanniget and I disagree on which consoles are better, I agree that people should buy what they want, because they want it - not because of what some dumbass like me spouts off. But, I think companies should be more honest and not (essentially) lie about their product in attempts to crush their competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Maul Posted January 30, 2001 Share Posted January 30, 2001 Here we go again... Sega are now developing games for Xbox, PS2 and GameCube, so with this extra money you can expect Dreamcast to be around for a couple more years. Remember, as of now it's the only online console. Xbox has enhanced version of MGS2 and SH2, and Dreamcast gets LOK:SR2, so a PS2, in my eyes, is not worth it. The only game I gave a damn about on PS2 was Oddworld: Munch's Oddysee, and it was shipped to Xbox. All the better IMO. Microsoft are willingto give developers a hand with their games, whereas Sony just sit back and watch the money roll in. ------------------ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jedi Kanigget Posted January 30, 2001 Share Posted January 30, 2001 -GameCube'll be using mini-dvd technology (discs that can hold somewhere in the ball-park of a gig and a half each). So...actually, PS2 is using technology of yester-year, and PS2 games on 4 CDs will cost more than GameCube games on say 1 or 2 dvds. Then, throw in the difference in labor costs because the GC is 8 times easier to program for... Uhm...no. Some PS2 games are on CDs, others, like Summoner are on DVDs, which hold just a bit more than 1.5 gigs. And the new PS2 games are no more expensive than new PS games. The jaggies: I decided to look into this. One thing Acid did not mention about smoothing over jaggies is a lot of times it reduces the detail. Again, this is only for aesthetic value and rarely affects the gameplay. If you want some info on how the PS2 is combating aliasing (jaggies) without losing detail, take a look at this <A HREF="http://ps2.ign.com/news/21661.html">article</A>. And, Dave...Microsoft? Now there's and evil empire. Have you learned nothing from the <A HREF="http://pub19.ezboard.com/bthecouncilofjedi">Council of Jedi</A>? ------------------ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Maul Posted January 30, 2001 Share Posted January 30, 2001 Yes, I learnt that... ------------------ [This message has been edited by Dave Maul (edited January 31, 2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi SuperBuen Posted January 31, 2001 Share Posted January 31, 2001 Ok I've just read the posts and all that and I'm just wondering: What does it matter? I've always had a console. I've had an Atari, Nintendo, SNES, N64, and a PC of course. My friends has had Segas & PSX, etc. I doesn't matter what the specs are. I can't believe some of you can say "This console sucks" or "this console is better than this one". In my opinion, there's one and only one value a console has: FUN. If you enjoy it. If it's fun for you. If it lets you escape everyday problems and concerns. If you're entertained for a few hours. If it lets you take out your aggressions. Or maybe it just passes the time, then it has served it's purpose. There's only one way you can compare consoles, and that's by how fun they are (actually the games). And that is totally a personal choice. Therefore no one can tell me a console is better than another one. Someone can tell me though say the DC is kewl b/c of JPB. Or the N64 rocks b/c of Zelda. And the PSX is awesome b/c of MGS. But again, just because someone likes a kind of game doesn't mean you will like it either. I think everyone should make up their own minds on what they like, and it doesn't matter if something is more advance or whatever. As long as it's fun... ------------------ You can do it your own way Just as long as it's done just how I say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_FinnSon Posted February 2, 2001 Author Share Posted February 2, 2001 I didn't know that my topic would encourage people to throw so mixed opinions here. I must admit that I have had an opportunity to play JPB only once in a gamestore and it was playstation version, but I have also seen dreamcast version in action(after JK/MotS & TPM it looked awesome and possibility to play as Obi-Wan and Mace Windu in addition to many other cool Jedis was exciting while we are still waiting for Episode II). Besides I liked original Super Star Wars games in Super Nintendo and thought this would be cool game following their footsteps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi SuperBuen Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 Originally posted by Lord_FinnSon: Besides I liked original Super Star Wars games in Super Nintendo and thought this would be cool game following their footsteps. Those are awesome!!! I wish they would make a TPM/JPB type game for the classic trilogy! ------------------ You can do it your own way Just as long as it's done just how I say... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Acid_Rain327 Posted February 3, 2001 Share Posted February 3, 2001 I wish they'd make TPM/Prequel games using the Super Star Wars engine. =] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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