Luke's Training Lack?

[UnrealJedi]

Originally posted by Vestril

 

I just rewatched the trailer you mention and by my eyes Palpatine wears a black cloak while Anakin wears a Brown one, though the sun does make it look darker.

 

 

 

Luke is still wearing black in the end of the movie, why doesn't he change colors of clothing if colors of clothing represent his inner turmoil. Also I believe Qui-Gon (though it may be Obi-Wan) wears a black cloak in the beginning of Episode I, does this represent his going to the Dark Side. What's more Han Solo wears a black vest and black pants, is this showing his fall from grace. On the other end of the spectrum Stormtroopers wear white aromor, is this symbolic of their travel to the light side?

 

Black and white coloration is not...well black and white. Part of the idea is that everyone wears toned down colors in the trilogy to show the bleakness of the Empire. Simply because someone wears black or white does not mean that they are evil or good, respectively.

 

I'm basing Luke edging towards the dark side from his change of clothing from ANH to ESB to RoTJ. Luke starts out wearing white and then goes to black. The color symbolism applies to Jedi. Everyone worries about Jedi falling to the dark side, no one worries about Han or the stormtroopers going to either the light or dark side of the Force. It all comes down to the old adage "With great power comes great responsibility". If you are going to develop your Force powers enough to become a Jedi, you'd better prepared to learn a great deal of control, or what happens? You fall to the dark side. Since Han nor the stormtroopers are users of the Force, this doesn't apply to them.

[Leagle]

Luke spent probably at least 3 weeks on Dagobah.

 

Han & Leia needed to repair the ship, bounty hunters arrive.

(Couple of days?)

-This could of course be a lot longer, like a week, but I don't think so. Remember the fleet combs the asteroid field, sustaining much damage. I suggest the first holo-report we see "...considering the amount of damage we've sustained they must have been destroyed." was at least a day into the search, then the bounty hunters are called. They'll take a while, probably 2 days or more.

 

Luke speeds away to Dagobah in the meantime.

 

Han & Leia escape. Maybe two weeks to Bespin (could be more).

I figure they spent a few days on Bespin before anything happened. They seem to be comfortabely set up. Vader knows Luke will come, he gets time to relax. (Or practice saber combat, but that's probably his idea of fun. * Mine too, why do you think I play JO;)*

 

They fret about Threepio and recouperate. I suggest Lando's been desperately trying to impress Leia. (Luke has vision now?)

 

Lando invites them to a formal dinner.

 

Shock Horror it's Vader!

 

Takes some time for Luke to arrive.

 

 

 

I think Obi-Wan had instructed Luke after ANH. There is a large gap between ANH and the ESB, and Ben would not have sat around twiddling his ethereal thumbs. He must have trained Luke, or he would have sent him to Yoda sooner.

 

 

 

Just because Vader is damaged, dosen't mean he can't fight!

 

In this form he wiped out the Jedi order remember.

[txa1265]

Movies = suspension of disbelief.

 

The entire timeline requires that we deal with some amount of time incongruity. Obi-Wan is perhaps 15 years older than Anikan, but is an 'old man' when Vader is the most feared being in the galaxy. Also, the time between EpII and III is not supposed to be that long, and by the end we should be seeing a certain twin birth. Making Luke ~20-ish in ANH. Making Vader ~40 and ObiWan 55 max. More along the age of Qui-Gon than Alec Guinness.

 

So, we have to let that float ...

 

Similarly, we need to accept that when Luke leaves Dagobah he is at the point where his basic skills are formidable but the training incomplete - needing control and refinement. Meaning that Yoda and ObiWan taught him certain skills, but also how to learn, exercises and so on ...

[Vestril]

Han & Leia escape. Maybe two weeks to Bespin (could be more). I figure they spent a few days on Bespin before anything happened. They seem to be comfortabely set up. Vader knows Luke will come, he gets time to relax.

 

Makes sense, but...would Vader wait:confused: Wait, I just figured it out, Boba Fett figured it out, the closest Imperials got there and explained everything to Lando and waited for DV to arrive (booyah).

 

The entire timeline requires that we deal with some amount of time incongruity. Obi-Wan is perhaps 15 years older than Anikan, but is an 'old man' when Vader is the most feared being in the galaxy. Also, the time between EpII and III is not supposed to be that long, and by the end we should be seeing a certain twin birth. Making Luke ~20-ish in ANH. Making Vader ~40 and ObiWan 55 max. More along the age of Qui-Gon than Alec Guinness.

 

Actually I think its a little closer to a 20 year difference. In the beginning of ANH Vader would be about 40 and Obi-Wan would be about 60. There is a rather large difference between 50 and 60, and Obi Wan has likely not been using the Force (he has to be hiding), and living on a sun planet, which would weaken his ability to use the Force and make him look older, respectively.

 

 

Movies = suspension of disbelief.

 

I agree, but tis more fun to suspend your disbelief when there is some logic to it

[Leagle]

...for a leader of the Alliance. I think he would wait. He also wants them both as bait, remember?

 

Vestril, Ben seems so old b/c he is living as a hermit on a wind-swept, parched, sand-planet. As one famous visitor put it: "The suns'a doin' murder to mesa skin!"

 

And the sand.

 

And the wind.

 

Ben would not have been weak in the force, he defended himself well from vader on the death star, though both knew he was probably doomed.

 

Tarkin: "He must not be allowed to escape."

Vader: "..escape is not his intention.." you get the picture.

 

Obi-Wan knew that if Vader found him he would probably be able to defend himself, but would not really be able to break free.

When he realises Luke is waiting for him he sacrifices himself.

 

 

Uh, I think the point here was to show why he looks so old. He is a bit older than owen, but lives as a hermit. What's to bet he goes for long walks in the desert?

[spacelord]

As I see it from the above posts, it could take months for Han and Leia to reach cloud city without hyperdrive.

 

As for food and such you have to think a little trekkie here, I mean if you look at it from a logical standpoint most things are probably recycled on an starship and energy is probably not an issue considering that traveling at lightspeed probably consumes more energy than snailing along like they did.

 

But that's just my take on it.

[Vestril]

...for a leader of the Alliance. I think he would wait. He also wants them both as bait, remember?

Of course he would wait, but if Vader was there, and they were there, why would Vader wait for a few days to capture them? Why not do it straight away? See?

 

Obi-Wan knew that if Vader found him he would probably be able to defend himself, but would not really be able to break free.

When he realises Luke is waiting for him he sacrifices himself.

 

Actually if you watch ANH again you see Ben look over at Luke with this mischevioius glint in his eye, and then he takes his pose, I think he realized that he would only slow Luke and Han down, and that he wouldn't be able to defeat or run away from Vader, so he stalled until Luke could see, and then sacraficed himself to teach Luke an important lesson.

 

As I see it from the above posts, it could take months for Han and Leia to reach cloud city without hyperdrive.

 

As for food and such you have to think a little trekkie here, I mean if you look at it from a logical standpoint most things are probably recycled on an starship and energy is probably not an issue considering that traveling at lightspeed probably consumes more energy than snailing along like they did.

 

I agree with a lot of that, except that I doubt that the ship could have sustained months of travel, it seems unlikely that three people (one of which is rather large) could eat, drink and stay clean AND fly a ship for a couple of months and come out of it as sane as they did, also I doubt that they would have enough energy (fuel) to manage that... Also it does not stand to as much reason that travelling through hyperspace takes more fuel, though getting to lightspeed would consume a chunk, I would imagine.

[BOOHOO]

Originally posted by UnrealJedi

 

I'm basing Luke edging towards the dark side from his change of clothing from ANH to ESB to RoTJ. Luke starts out wearing white and then goes to black. The color symbolism applies to Jedi. Everyone worries about Jedi falling to the dark side, no one worries about Han or the stormtroopers going to either the light or dark side of the Force. It all comes down to the old adage "With great power comes great responsibility". If you are going to develop your Force powers enough to become a Jedi, you'd better prepared to learn a great deal of control, or what happens? You fall to the dark side. Since Han nor the stormtroopers are users of the Force, this doesn't apply to them.

 

ALSO, white can represent a n00bie like in karate or some crap. As u get more experienced, ur colors get darker.

[Caldera]

*sigh* Why do you guys think poor Kenobi is an old, washed up Jedi that can't beat his own student? If you ask me, Obi wan had more than enough power to beat poor old anakin(i feel really sorry for him, more on that later), but he sees things in a different way. Obi wan 's stay in tatooine has not strained him physically, nor has it dampened his connection with the force. However, he has grown much wiser, like yoda, and he sees that his time to fight has passed. His era is over, and it is time for luke to take responsibilty of a new age. The old republic's downfall was basically the downfall of all the old jedi. Obi wan and yoda were the links to the new jedi order, and they served their purpose. It wasnt a matter of will or power, but a deep sense of wisdom that told Obi wan that the universe did not depend on him anymore.

 

About anakin, the poor guy has had tough times. I havent seen ep2, but i hear he gets hurt pretty bad. And i hear he gets hurt beyond redemption in ep3 or so. He is mentally and physically hurt, and seeing that he cannot beat palpatine, he just serves him. He is powerful, yes, but he doesnt have the spark in him he used to have. I believe it was literally beaten out of him by either palpatine or other characters(i dun wanna lead to possible spoilers).

 

All in all; Vader, Yoda and Obi wan are all jedi's who's times have passed, and they all serve a purpose in overthrowing palpatine, and beginning the new jedi order. Obviously, Vader has no idea of this, but he is a player in it all the same.