Official JK2 1.03 Patch Thread!

[fitzwilliamd]

I was dueling one of my friends and he ran at me swinging, so I switched to Red and strafed off to the left. He went by swinging and keep running forward. I came up behind him and did the over-head Red swing, and it was blocked by his saber!

 

What the hell is going on!? That's stupid! How is it possible for him to reach around and block a heavy stance in his back?

 

If I take the time and effort to complete a strategy like that, I don't think it should be blocked, thanks to this stupid patch.

 

Not only that, but if people are running around swinging, it's almost impossible to actually hit them. No matter what I do, the saber is blocked. And they are swinging like crazy!

 

I don't get it. I try to put some strategy in and it gets unhumanly-possible blocked.

 

This is one of my problems with the new patch. Strategy is useless, if perfect execution results in failure. It is difficult to maneuver your opponent to be more open than smashing your saber into his unprotected backside.

[BlackDove]

Hmm, I see everyones point, since that was what I was thinking when I first fired up this baby. However with time (one day after, I know, very short time), I realised it's not at all about the planing and tactics.

 

For example, I use yellow stance, hardly ever switching to red or blue. So, I'm like in this game, and I try to follow the jedi code, like maybe it will teach me something (I know, this really maybe sounds lame, but hear me out). So I somehow remember the phrase "A Jedi uses the force for knowledge and defense, never for attack". Now you can learn a lot from that sentence. First, I check out what force is my oponent using. If he is using the dark side, then I know he will come off on me agressively and I know that he will be impatient and make the first strike. If he is using the light side, then I know he will be more like me (I'm a sucker for the good, sue me), which is more backed. Now this isn't a general rule of course, you have exceptions, but generally it is like that, since dark side users SHOW that they want to attack and destroy, and the light side users just want to defend, heal, or use the dark side to their advantage, not to mention there is protect which is blocking the sabre damage.

 

So to cut the long story short, I realised it's not really about thinking anymore, now you gotta rely on your basic instincts, or on what you know from before. I know that today, when I tried to keep it down, I had about 11-3 ratio of wins and losses in a big duel (were about 10 people). However later, I was nervous, and I just tried to attack, and swing and push, and it wasn't working at all...just kept SELF INFLICTING damage to myself at all times. Like I had a suicide wish.

 

So what I'm saying is, rely on your feelings more, and instincts, than on "Ok, he is left, so now I gotta take this stance, and then try and strike him on the lower part of the elbow, which will probably take off 34, and then I will have to change the..." *WHAM* you're dead.

 

Anyway, my second post here, so I am probably considered a newb, but seriously think about it. Try to rely your moves more on instinct, then on planning (considering that you know how swings work, since if you don't, you're dead anyway )

[Nill the Mean]

Timing/instincts/planning are all very important, admittedly. I have ADSL so I usually get a ping of around 50 when connceting to local servers. This eliminates the need for me to swing randomly for a start. The thing is, I was timing my hits during 1.02 and I am still timing them. Fight any match against me and you will see that I am not "flailing violently" even if you win. I SWEAR that I time ALL my hits. But timing has become partially redundant thanks to overdone saber clashing. Even if I time my attack properly it has a very large chance of being blocked in the most unbelievable times. That is why I still say it should be toned down. I am not kidding when I say I have seen impossible blocks. It really happens.

I saw one guy start a heavy overhead swing, I slashed at his gut with the strafe-swing. His hands hadn't even started coming down yet and my swing just went right through him causing NO damage at all. I don't know if this is the blcoking system messing with the collision detection, but it needs some work.

 

Before I get criticised...

I am not pro-1.02.

I am not pro-1.03.

I am pro-1.04.

[BlackDove]

Yes, another thing many people, including myself here, are in need, is a great patience developing. Usually I just want to "SABRE THE DAMN GUY AND BE DONE WITH IT, GIVE ME THAT DAMN KILL!!!" as I'm sure we all do. But lately I just take my time, and the duel maybe lasts for 5-10 minutes, before we are done...Of course lately accounts for the one game today, and the other two where I majorly sucked because I wanted to play "push/pull/throw sabre/get yourself hit without the other guy having to do anything" style...

[fitzwilliamd]

I saw one guy start a heavy overhead swing, I slashed at his gut with the strafe-swing. His hands hadn't even started coming down yet and my swing just went right through him causing NO damage at all.

 

Previously, when an opening became available, either due to strategy on my part or my opponents carelessness, I could slash through his defenses and do damage.

 

This is not the case in 1.03. I can get an opponent open and slash his legs out from under him, but he mysteriously blocks from all angles. I would use terrain in the past to get above my opponent to slash down at him. Nothing works in this patch, even when the opponent is cooperating to test and learn the new game mechanics. Utilizing tools that require some modicum of skill are useless now: terrain, feints, and other thoughtful strategies.

 

Example: Before I was able to feign defensive action away from the intended target on my opponent’s body. I would spar with my opponents, diverting their attention away from my real purpose. With 1.03 this is useless as the intended target, once opened, is either blocked mysteriously, or is undamaged by a clean hit: e.g. their exposed back, or their open midsection as they swing overhead as you noted above.

 

Please dialogue with us, Raven. Tell us you are working to solve these problems.

[BlackDove]

That's really odd, I used red stance today on an open feild against my oponent (two different games), and my red stance (normal swing) slashed right through their sabre, injuring him on the head and on the part of the leg...The other game, I did like a horizontal sweep, and it went from thie to thie, damaging both, and killing the oponent that was on 30 health (we lately ask how much hp does one have left)...Plus I wouldn't expect that my hit goes through his sabre. If the defense is what you are reffering to, I find it rather refreshing since before you could have swung blatantly all over the place and win a match (main reason why newbs were winning all the time, just swinging like idiots all the time).

[XManny]

I've seen this over and over again.

 

Let's compare this to the Counter-Strike updates for a second:

 

People play Counter-Strike

50,000 Counter-Strike players exist 24/7

Word of a new patch, 1.4, comes along

Lots of hype, everyone wants the patch

Patch is released

counter-strike.net forums are spammed 2 seconds after the release

75% of the threads talk about how they "hate" the new update, how it's newbie bs, how the developers are a bunch of ****wirts with small wieners, etc.

After a week, every one is happy again.

[CooLJoE]

Well, to be fair, to many of the top Counter-Strike players it died like a year or 2 ago. I used to play that game alot and then cheating went rampant. Then punk buster and other anti-cheats came out. Then punk buster stopped updating and CS died again. Now supposedly there is a better anti-cheat thing and the new patch. Whats my point? CS is different from JK2. Infact I hope JK2 NEVER takes the route that CS has had to go through. So please don't compare the 2 as its a slap in the face to JK2 or any other game you compare with.

[CooLJoE]

Here is my proposition to Raven and all others on here (more to Raven since they are the ones making the next patch). So PLEASE READ WITH AN OPEN MIND.

 

Here goes.

 

 

It seems to me that the Duelers are the ones who like the patch and the CTF/FFA people are the ones who do not like it. Or atleast the majority seem to think this way.

 

My idea is that Raven should make patch 1.04 to reflect this. Make it so CTF/FFA games use the original settings (ver 1.02) and have Duel games use the new settings (ver 1.03). I'm thinking that this will be ALOT better as a solution.

 

Here's my reasoning. CTF/FFA require fast quick movement and kills. You can't sit dueling 1v1, 2v1, 3v1, *gasp* 4v1 for 10 minutes in CTF/FFA (well maybe FFA, but CTF its out of the question as you need to retreive/capture the flag). Dueling is really all about the long battles.

 

So there you go. Thats what should happen in 1.04. Then after that happens, come back to here and find out what CTF/FFA people want changed and same for Duelers. But PLEASE do not mix the 2. They are played completely different and should be treated as such.

[Longshanks]

Great patch......cheers Raven/LucasArts,you`ve just made multi-player even better...Yay.!!!!!!!!!!

 

3 cheers for 1.03!!!!....Hip Hip...hoooraaaaaaaa. !!!!!

 

 

I LOVE YOU RAVEN. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CooLJoE]

Here's food for thought.

 

I just got done playing JK2 CTF on a 1.03 server for 4.5 hours. Yes thats alot of playing.

 

This patch is so bad, the only thing we saw THE ENTIRE TIME was people spamming the blue stance special moves. The spin move and the backstab move (more so the spin move though). I'm talking they would do it in large crowds, knock you down and do it, have someone else knock you down and do it, etc. etc.

 

Even after confronting them they never stopped. Made the game utterly boring and lame.

 

The worst part had to be when I had 100hp and grabbed shield so I was up to 80. So 100hp and 80 shield (or around that). Guy comes up, does backstab on me. BAM, I'm dead. 100hp and 80 shield gone with one move. I kid you not. This is how bad the patch has become. I can deal with DFA. This patch took a single 1-hit kill move and gave us 2 more. Hows that for quality.

 

Thank you Raven for making me pay money for a game and then destroying it for me. Its like buying a Porsche Boxster and then having the Porsche dealership take it back and give you a Ford Focus. Sure its driveable, but no where near worth the $50k you paid.

[BlackDove]

50k$ for a Porscha?

[GE Predator]

"My idea is that Raven should make patch 1.04 to reflect this. Make it so CTF/FFA games use the original settings (ver 1.02) and have Duel games use the new settings (ver 1.03). I'm thinking that this will be ALOT better as a solution"

 

No no no no no, put EVERYTHING back the way it was, guns, force, sabers. Then just keep

DFA and lunge

 

keep force absorb the way it is in 1.03

 

the fixed chopping off limbs

 

then to settle the drain/heal complaining. Just make it so they use 2x the force, THAT'S IT, don't make it half as effective, just make it cost more. Cause as it stands right now, 2x the price for half the effect is just wrong.

 

and keep the levels of course.

 

 

ATM I'm playing JO with the 1.02 patch. 1.03 sucked the fun right out of the game .

[fitzwilliamd]

THE ONLY GOOD MOVE NOW IS BACKSLASH PLEASE FIX THIS!!!!!!

It is not completely accurate to say that only backslash is effective; it is, perhaps, the most effective. In addition to backslash, the medium special, and the strong DFA are still fairly useful in moderation.

 

This patch sucks. Me and my friend tested HEAVY STANCE, I hit him 15 times, 13 out of 15 swings were blocked and resulted in NO DAMAGE.

 

I feel your pain. When an opponent swings wildly or slips up and you slash a heavy right down his throat, even if his saber is on the other side of his body at the end of his wild swing, he can magically block it. It is difficult to enjoy the beauty of a well-timed strike when a good hit results in no shield or health damage.

 

I have watched a talented player hit every opening on his opponent rhythmically, artistically, so that it takes your breath away. His opponent could not touch him. The resulting damage was negligible. This is very discouraging.

 

Before 1.03, I would work to create openings, slash them, and do damage. Now, taking a shot at a wide-open adversary does not mean you will damage them: skill, lightning reflexes, and adroit timing do not ensure damage, they can only ensure a clean hit. A somewhat guided randomness is the order of the day. 1.03 is so buggy that you can be completely immune to light stance attackers just by facing them, even while moving. If you do not swing or show them your backside you are invulnerable to their attacks.

 

Hopefully, Raven is play testing the new patch and will have some fixes available soon.

[qazzaq]

The last patch that came out ruined a game that me and many of my friends truly loved.

 

You can now shoot people in their back/hit them in their back and they block the move when not even facing you. The blocking rate is so high now that even with heavy stance it is incredibly hard to hit people and have them not block.

 

DFA has been replaced with yellow stance backslash/stab which is the new "super move".

 

I understand nobody liked the one hit kill moves, I didnt either. But this patch has turned the game into a spam fest on almost every server where people dont even attempt to use strategy anymore.

 

Note: I moved your newly created thread into this official thread in order to cut down on redundancy on the next page. I also delted the two subsequent posts, because they were basically spam. -- Canoli

[BlackDove]

WILDCAT FOOTBALL RULES!!!!

 

no wait...it's...

 

PATCH 1.03 RULES!!!

 

Really much better than 1.02

 

Think about it. Everyone is complaining about 1.03 because they can't use the exploits of 1.02 anymore...one big shrink for everyone to go please..

[idlemind]

Originally posted by =SSC=Kal-El

WILDCAT FOOTBALL RULES!!!!

 

no wait...it's...

 

PATCH 1.03 RULES!!!

 

Really much better than 1.02

 

Think about it. Everyone is complaining about 1.03 because they can't use the exploits of 1.02 anymore...one big shrink for everyone to go please..

 

hey wow thanks, I never thought of that. Because that's obviously what everyone is complaining about. Just look at the number of posts in this thread alone about no more DFA. /sarcasm

 

No one is complaining about that. And if you think there aren't anymore cheap moves, i just went onto a guns FF FFA server today. The only force move I bound was pull. I have no idea what any of the guns do. There must have been 20+ people on the server. I won easily by pulling people till they fell, then red backstabbing. It was cheap as hell and there was nothing anyone could do about it. Let me repeat, I had never played with guns before this one round. I don't even play 1.03 saber combat well. Sounds pretty lame to me. the only way someone else could have won was by employing the same lame tactics I used.

[BlackDove]

Well I guess the patch 1.04 could abolish backstab, but the backstab was always there. It didn't come with 1.03...

[Sabre_Slinger]

i just updated and restarted my comp, set all my multiplayer settings to defult, changed graphics to 600x800 and now when i refresh there are no servers at all... ive tried everything.

[BlackDove]

a) check that your settings are correct (above the table with the list of servers)

 

b) if you had a lot of mods, and skins try reinstalling..worked for me

[Sabre_Slinger]

ive been playing for about a week online and i dont have any mods, this is the first patch ive dled.

[BlackDove]

Humm, then I don't think I know, sorry...

[CooLJoE]

True, both the backstab and spin move were in 1.02. BUT, they didn't do much damage. Atleast not near as much as now. Those 2 moves can.....err WILL kill anyone they touch. Even with full health and none-partial-almost full shields....you'll die from those moves. I know cause it happened to me several times.

 

Just go back to 1.02. Raven obviously messed up and fixing it from here will only become more confusing and won't get us anywhere. Go back to 1.02, and then re-evaluate the situation.

 

- Force powers were fine (altho it shouldn't take 100 force to give 50 health, should be 100 force for 100 health. its a disadvantage to use force heal since you lose all your force).

- Saber blocking was better in 1.02. Infact I would rather have 1.02's blocking settings.

- The "less damage at start and end of swing" idea is good. Keep that one.

- Force absorb being invisible is ok.

- Force drain draining yourself equally is lame. I don't use it, but it should be more like 100 drain on enemy = 75 drain on yourself. That way you had a purpose to drain.

- DFA non-turning is great. Makes it less spammed. ALOT less.

- All 1-hit moves should either be removed, or lessened so no matter what, the max damage from them is only 90. 90 at the most. If person has shield, deduct their amount from total 90 (50 shield and 100 health + 1-hit move = no shield 60 health). Taking full shield and full health is just lame. And everyone and their family is using those moves. For 4.5 hours on one server they only did that move. WAY worse than DFA.

[BlackDove]

Those are some very good points there, although I would have to go with this one:

 

(It was written by ArtifeX I think)

 

When speaking about just the changes to saber combat in the v1.03 patch, I'd say that Raven failed (in part) to accomplish what they set out to do, which was (I hope) to make the game more fun by giving the players more winning tactical options to choose from. Reasons I believe this:

 

Things That Were Done Right

The removal of self-defeating spin swings from Medium style is a big step in the right direction. Think of it this way: if you're spinning 360-degrees through a swing, then you're spending half of your time with your saber pointed in the wrong direction. With regular swings, that happens much less. Plus, those spin swings are S-L-O-W and do the exact same amount of damage as the normal, faster ones.

The addition of Strong Style combos. This simply means you can add more attack options to your repertoire while using Strong Style. That's never a bad thing.

Repairing (not Nerfing) the DFA. Now you can't get killed instantly by a saber buried so far in the ground that you can't see it. Yay!

Making the Light Backstab and the Medium Finisher more deadly. Both of these moves were hard to do and left you open forever. Now they have the damage to balance out the risk. Good job!

Adding more duel maps!

Things That Were Done Wrong

Previously the ratios of attack damage were 30 damage for Light, 60 damage for Medium and 100 damage for Strong (reduced, 3/6/10). Now, damage has been lowered for all three, but look at the new ratios: 20-30 for Light, 30 for Medium, 40-60 for Strong. If you look at the minimums, you come up with 20/30/40 (reduced, 2/3/4); certainly more balanced, but if you look at the maximums you get: 30/30/60 (reduced, 1/1/2). How does this expand on viable choices of Stance? Looking at solely damage, why would you use Light or Medium over Strong? You can do double damage with Strong! More importantly, why use Medium over Light? It does the exact same maximum damage! What has been done here is narrow the number of winning choices, not expand upon them.

One useful tactic (maybe too useful) has been heartily nerfed: the DFA. Many will cheer this change that had difficulty defending against it, or were just annoyed by its constant use, but ask yourself how many times you've used it successfully in the new version. Would you still say it's useful? Maybe, but you will have to agree it is much less useful than before. Again, a narrowing of options.

The addition of Saber Throwing to No-Force games is ludicrous. It will just turn into a blockable boomerang fight, mark my words. Don't you think the addition of kicking into No-Force games would have been more interesting and fun? I just don't understand Raven's move on this one.

Why keep the Light Crouch Lunge swing from turning during execution? Did anyone have a problem with it? I sure didn't. Anyone? This will just cut down further on the people who actually try to use Light Stance. That==Narrowing of options.

All swings do less damage except for the backswings, which actually do so much more than before that they're almost always 1-hit kills. I've heard people tell of servers where people run around backwards trying to land these swings. That's a pretty strong statement about how much more effective these attacks are than all the others. If I gave you a butter knife, bag of rocks and a Rocket Launcher, and told you to go kill someone, which tool would you use for the job? There might be an occasional circumstance where you might use a bag of rocks, but how often would you use it in comparison to the rocket launcher? One percent? Half a percent? ...Narrowing,...Narrowing...

Double-tap Kicking. The technical problems of using this with a laggy connection and the extreme difficulty of kicking someone who is crouched forces me to give this a big thumbs-down. Now those people with modem connections or who simply have difficulty hitting their key that fast won't be able to use this attack. How does that give us more options?

Slowing down Medium swings. As if there weren't enough reason to give Medium a miss. Why was this done? To empower Light? Read carefully: Don't empower a Style by Nerfing the others! If you want to empower it, then just make it do more damage, give it more range, give it Defense Breaking, or any other number of things!

Lowered Damage for normal swings. Why lower the damage on swings that almost never connect? Light and Medium both can be blocked 100%! What difference does it make if you lower the damage? This only made sense in the case of Strong style which now requires 3 hits to kill in a duel rather than the old 2-hit kill. Light and Medium both now require at least 5 hits to kill if there is no Healing. That's a moot point when you consider that those hits will never land!

 

Now, to this, I would only add about the kicking part, and that is to abolish it for good. I was in a game yesterday, and there were two squad members (I forgot the name of the squad), so they were like TRAINING eachother how to kick all the time. They even had their sabres lowered. I mean I did kick both their asses, but it's not FUN anymore if people actually think that they can play like that. I hope you understand me heh

[Doppelganger]

I like most of the changes, just a couple things that irk me:

 

1) Saber throw is now abused; it is used even in the closest ranges because when it returns to your hand you instantly go to a ready stance. This makes it an extremely fast 30hp attack with many advantages: you are only vulnerable for a split second, you can retreat quickly, you have longer range (it takes slightly longer to do it from a small distance, but at these close ranges the time difference is pretty meaningless for all but the shortest of swings, i.e. light stance) and there is no chance of having your saber parried by a more powerful stance. I suggest a recovery time after catching the saber which may include no blocking ability for a time, reduced movement, or both. Hopefully it’ll be enough to deter wild swinging but will also not permit a person to use it when they are very close: the saber throw should be used when one clearly outflanks the enemy and gets behind them or when they make a totally superfluous swing, but the “run backwards forever and saber throw while they vainly try to swing at me until they die” routine is annoying.

 

2) The light stance can retreat too fast from battle…and then quickly use a saber throw. Actually, it’s these saber throwing retreating forever players that force me to use light the entire time the running battle persists: that way I can actually land a hit since I don’t slow down so much while taking a swing and I reset fast enough to usually avoid the inevitable saber throw. This lack of choice detracts from the fun in my opinion. Perhaps the movement should be slowed down while light is swinging to prevent ultra fast retreat. It’ll still be fast enough to give fast the hit and fade advantage, as light swings are very short. In ye olde days I used a DFA to get rid of these guys, but now that’s become far more difficult. (and justly so)

 

3) DFA seems to make much more sense now after the nerfing. Something that is odd is that I often land on top of the player I aim for and they swing at me while I’m on their head and hurt me some. It seems to me that the area where damage is dealt should be extended to right below the attacker’s feet as well.

 

4) On DFA: also, since there is splash damage, it looks rather funny when your saber doesn’t touch the person but you kill them anyways: perhaps some sort of animation that would turn you towards the person you hit. This is just an aesthetic thing, not a battle tweak. Not sure if that can be done gracefully.

 

 

5) Possible unintended balance change in 1.03: Many of us have noticed that after one completes a swing, most noticeably in strong, there is a period where you cannot swing but you will block. This blocking without attacking period DOES NOT WORK against saber throw, and it is this time when I most frequently get attacked by saber throw. (People can usually tell because your saber has movement blur during this stage)

 

6) And lastly, one tweak that would be revolutionary (and I’m not sure if it’d be good) and seems to fix many of the aforementioned problems (at least theoretically) is simply make backpedal speed slower than forward running speed, even if just a little. Often these times when I get worn down from saber throws while I vainly try to swing at my opponent and just miss by the barest of margins occur after a long, long pursuit where I try to make absolutely sure I can hit them with a swing, but after about 30 or so seconds of straight running and blocking saber throws and no swinging I get annoyed and careless.

 

Yeah, so basically that's it. Too much retreat+short range saber throw. fix it! and give me some comments and feedback.