Jedi Too Powerful In SW2

[mez1109]

Have you noticed that the Jedis in Star Wars are not really in threat of danger, they seem invincible, and they know thay cant be beaten.

 

Obi Wan is not even bothered or feels not all threatened by Jango Fett.

In the old Star Wars they at least tried to run away from battles as they were outnumbered.

 

As soon as Padme & Ankin are locked up, she starts picking the lock, not really bothered that Three great beasts want to rip them into shreds.

 

Now the Jedi keep Cool, as they are Jedi you could argue, but Padme is a politition.

 

When Luke took on Vader, he didn't shiver, pee himself and say please don't hurt me, but his facial expressions showed that he saw Vader as a DANGER, thinking that he could actually die.

 

The Jedi in SW2 act as if this is a normal day, no problem kick his as today, then we can have a nice drink down the pub, Yoda is buying.

[MUHAHAHAHAHA]

Well... considering they were up against stupid beasts that weren't exactly invincible, they weren't THAT worried... they HAD been in situations that were worse before.. The reason Luke was afraid was because Vader was the most powerful guy in the universe (or so it was rumored), and well... he was badass. Considering he could Force Grip guys (to death mind you) who weren't even in the same place as him, people didn't mess w/ Darth... Luke wasn't even a Jedi yet, and hadn't really developed his skills to a level of Jedi Master, which Anakin/Darth was definitely at when he was Vader. Sure he moved slower, but that was because of the machinery...

 

Why would a Jedi fear a 1 v 1 fight w/ a bounty hunter? they can block blasters and dodge rockets.. Plus, he can force pull/push...

 

I don't see your reasoning.. please explan more

[mez1109]

What about Padme, she is no Jedi.

 

In Ep1, Quin Quan Jin showed in his face that Darth Maul is dangerous, but was not scared of him, but still first decided to dosh it, and fight another day.

 

When Darth Maul killed him I was quiet supprised, as supprised that Obi 1 who was not a Jedi Master as QQ Jin was but killed Darth Maul anyway.

 

So there was always a pssibility of death (for the good guy that is), while the Jedi in EP2 are so good, that nothing seems to be a threat to them.

 

Now the ending fight with Count Dooku, that was much better, the Jedi were not that tough anymore.

The was a very good chance of death, but I thought that Ankin would lose or win not get his most of his arm chopped off.

 

I think the danger depends on how the viewer is suprised by the bad guys actions, and that the viewer can't think of any way out of that danger.

[MotionMan]

Jedis are keepers of the peace. Sort of a police force. Why? becasue no one can mess with them. When they encounter a threatening situation they deal with it. They are 100% concentrated with the problem at hand. Luke wasnt trained as a Jedi since his childhood. He lacked alot of what makes a Jedi. Their manurisms, behavior, emotion, ect.

When Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan confronted Maul. Im sure they were surprised to see a Sith in front of them. But they knew it was something they had to deal with. They know the Sith are not just ordanary soldiers or bounty hunters . They know Siths are their equals or even stronger sometimes than Jedi. They couldnt walk away from Maul like frightened wimps. It was something they had to deal with to solve the secret of how a Sith could be around when they were thought to be extinct.

Same goes with Dooku. Obi wan knew how powerfull Dooku was. Thats why he said to Anakin "I cant take him alone". Its just something they have to deal with. Thats what Jedi are about. At the same time keeping their cool and focusing 100% mentally.

[MUHAHAHAHAHA]

Also, Padmé is no ordinary human either. In a scene that was cut from AOTC, Yoda tells Padme that she is strong in the Force. That isn't just some coincidence.... She may not be a Jedi (duh), but she has quick reactions, and is smart. A lot of times, brains make up for lack of braun.

 

When fighting an adversary such as Darth Maul or Darth Tyranus, of course they cannot be afraid, because fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering . Of course they are being cautious, and that's why they don't try to go 1 v 1. Obi-Wan was able to kill Maul by focusing and catching him off guard, while as Maul just kinda tired Qui-Gon down to the point where he could defeat him. Remember, it only takes 1 good hit to kill someonw with a lightsaber in the movies.

 

Also keep in mind the discussion between Obi-Wan, Yoda, and Mace about Anakin's arrogance, and Yoda tells them even the older Jedi have arrogance.

[MotionMan]

Plus im guesing Padame has had some combat training. She was a Queen but she also needed to know to handle herself. Remember in Ep1 she did real well taking Nute gunray and the droids. Plus if she needs a decoy and knows that her life is constantly in danger, she will most definately would have some combat training.

[Natty]

Yeah, look at Windu, just seemed so I dunno something a Jedi wouldn't say when Dooku is babbling on about how the Jedi will be out numbered and Windu turns around and says "I don't think so" I dunno why, I find myself in hysterics over it. Just seems something more like Samual L Jackson would say in Shaft or something. You could say that was kinda arrogant. It's not on the terms of Anakins "I'm better than obiwan, I'm ahead of him in a lot of ways" speech he gives to Padmé. Even Obiwan when he says that without the clones it wouldn't have been a victory, it seemed like he was bragging or something about the fact that the jedi and clones beat the droids. I think all Jedi have some form of arrogence in them, just not as strong or obvious or as intentional as others.

[AgentSmith]

I don't think the Jedi seem all powerful in EP II, quite the contrary, some 150 to 200 Jedi walked into the Arena on Geonosis and barely 20 made it out alive.

 

As MotionMan and MUHA said, the Jedi in that era were trained since youth so they could master their emotions and actions more than regular people, even more so than trained soldiers. With the Force most Jedi will know at times that they can't 'outrun' or avoid a confrontation, that they must face the challenge and this without fear (fear is of the Dark Side).

 

The part where Anakin come soff as arrogant I think is meant to be just that. He's a young adolescant (teenager) and most of those will be arrogant, cocky and impulsive. Top that with the fact he has more Jedi/Force potential than other Padawans of his age but less training and discipline and I think it makes perfect sense.

 

With Mace Windu's scene actually there was a bit of dialogue cut. It was supposed to more like this:

Dooku 'You're impossibly outnumbered.'

Mace 'I don't think so. One Jedi has to be worth a hundred Geonosians.'

Dooku 'And is one Jedi worth a thousand battledroids?'

(And the droids march in, the trap has worked.)

 

(Honestly the Jedi would have wiped out the Geonosians if the Geonosians had decided to fight the Jedi without any battledroids.)

 

And so many Jedi died in the Arena fight, they were outnumbered true but they were up against battledroids whose potential for combat against a Jedi favors the Jedi. It's just the sheer number of droids that overwhelmed the Jedi and cost so many lives.

 

It's sad though that in the scene in the Jedi Temple after the battle, when Obi-Wan and Mace thought it was a victory they didn't extend Yoda's dialogue to mention all the killed and slain Jedi. That must have an impact on the Jedi order.

[mez1109]

Most Jedis are arrogant, or wiil become arrogant during some time in their life, mainly when they get much stronger with the force, like you said, Mace Windu shows these arogent trades.

 

After Yoda finished fighting Count Dooku, and everybody being gob smacked in the cinema, as they fault Yoda would be a laugh, this shows you that Yoda pretends to be the helpless old man, as he has great power in the force, and tries to control his own arogents.

 

Most Jedi seem not be able to do that, you could say that most Jedi when reaching great power, WILL become Sith Lords, as it is much EASIER.

 

When you play for example the Jedi Knight Series Games, the DARK FORCE POWERS are much more fun, most Jedis will think after some time, Why am I doing this, people are all liaers and cheats, its time I did something for myself, and who is going to stop me.

[ET Warrior]

If all Jedi's eventually thought that, then they wouldn't have been the guardians of peace in the galaxy for a thousand generations. They all would have become sith and the galaxy would be ruled by them. Jedi are not all arrogant...it's true that they show some traits of arrogance, but they aren't all, hey i'm a jedi back off or i'll kill you. And they're still human, so showing a little arrogance is something that i think is unavoidable, they are after all the most powerful humans in the galaxy. And yoda does not pretend to be a helpless old man, he really is an old old guy. He simply doesn't use the force to aid his everyday activities, because that is of the dark side. we saw that Obi Wan and Qui Gon (not quin quan) can run super fast as we saw in ep. 1 But they don't always run like that. The force should only be used when needed, or for very small things, like when obiwan used it to retrieve his map marble thing.

 

And maybe you think the darkside powers in jediknight are more fun....but when i play jkII online i always play as a light jedi.

 

 

And why wouldn't Padme immediately start picking the lock after the animals were released? Would you just sit there and let it eat you if you had a way to get out?

 

AND in episode 1 Qui Gon did not show in his face that he was scared....when he was ambushed on Tattooine he was caught by surprise, it was very hot outside and he was tired, and they needed to go. On Naboo, as soon as Darth Maul shows up he steps in front and says, "We'll handle this" No hesiation at all.

[mez1109]

If a big monster tried to rip me to shreds, i just wait for anakin and obi to free me.

 

Remeber, Jedi's have no super speed powers, Qui Gon says that they can see a few seconds into the future, knowing what will happen.

 

I still think that Yoda is hiding something about himself.

Yoda is a bad ass dark kunfu bashing saber fighter, quick on its legs.

 

YOU play the GOOD force powers in Jedi Knight 2, you goody goody two shoes. I used to think you were some Dark Horse, but your exactly like a Jedi (a compliment).

 

NOTHING beats CHOKING your enemies, pulling them high in the air, then, hihihihi, letting go.

[Faye Ying]

mez1109 >> i think you show more arrogance than all the jedi's ever shown in the movies put together!

 

all the jedi's are still human, or whatever race they are. they're sitll normal, they're not gods... all they are is simply gifted.

do they use this gift all the time? of course not, but of course they'll use it to gain the advantage when needed.....

 

I still think that Yoda is hiding something about himself

are you retarded? he's not hiding anything. he IS a old man, and to use the force takes some amount of concentration and strain on teh body. you even saw when he was holding up the concrete pillar over obiwan and anakin, he was using all he had to hold it up.

 

YOU play the GOOD force powers in Jedi Knight 2, you goody goody two shoes. I used to think you were some Dark Horse, but your exactly like a Jedi

and WTF does that mean?! are you drunk?

goodgood two shoe huh? hand me a teddy bear please.

[mez1109]

I aint drunk or retarded, just mentally disabled.

Sometime my brain switches off.

 

Anyway, If I was a Jedi, I be EVIL, Sith DestroyerOfNations or Sith Don for short, Sith God will do fine as well.

 

I kill you Rebel scum, I kick Luke's ass to kingdom come.

 

Oh yeah, don't diss Teddy, or he bite your balls off.

[natwa whitta]

Originally posted by mez1109

Have you noticed that the Jedis in Star Wars are not really in threat of danger, they seem invincible, and they know thay cant be beaten.

 

 

In the old Star Wars they at least tried to run away from battles as they were outnumbered.

 

 

 

 

When Luke took on Vader, he didn't shiver, pee himself and say please don't hurt me, but his facial expressions showed that he saw Vader as a DANGER, thinking that he could actually die.

 

The Jedi in SW2 act as if this is a normal day, no problem kick his as today, then we can have a nice drink down the pub, Yoda is buying.

 

 

Man, have you even seen empire strikes back? luke was scared, and another thing; the movie(EP II) took place in the jedi heyday, they were not worried. in luke's day, there were 2 jedi left, him and yoda ( except his sister, another story) and they were up to incredible odds against the empire. that's why they ran. they were out numbered.

[Jedi_Monk]

If a big monster tried to rip me to shreds, i just wait for anakin and obi to free me.

Then you'd die.

 

Remeber, Jedi's have no super speed powers, Quin Quan Jim says that they can see a few seconds into the future, knowing what will happen.

1) His name is Qui-Gon Jinn.

2) Jedi do have super-speed powers, watch Yoda's fight with Dooku or the part in TPM when Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan fled the droidekas.

3) Jedi can see farther into the future than that! Luke... LUKE... trained for three weeks and a day... could see Han and Leia suffering on Bespin, which was still days away. A fully-trained Jedi, in tune with the Force, could probably see decades into the future, without the Dark Side influencing them! Qui-Gon told Obi-Wan to "keep his concentration on the here and now" because Obi-Wan was looking into the future! Qui-Gon is into the Living Force, Yoda is into the unifying Force. Difference? The Living Force is here and now, the unifying Force is everywhere and everywhen.

 

When you play for example the Jedi Knight Series Games, the DARK FORCE POWERS are much more fun, most Jedis will think after some time, Why am I doing this, people are all liaers and cheats, its time I did something for myself, and who is going to stop me.

The Jedi have MORALS!

[ET Warrior]

Remeber, Jedi's have no super speed powers, Quin Quan Jim says that they can see a few seconds into the future, knowing what will happen.

 

Not only the part with Qui Gon and obi in episode 1....in episode two during the arena battle....with THAT many blaster bolts flying everywhere it would take superhuman speed to block those shots....not just the ability to know where they're going to be.

[mez1109]

So why did Qui Gon say that.

 

Oh wait up, there is such thing as force Jump, and force Speed.

 

I still don't think Luke was pis*ing himself in the Empire Strikes Back, he was SCARED, but not teriffied. If he was really scared he try to run away, or crawl into a corner, so you can't say that.

He knew that he was no match to Vader. Vader was obviously too arogent to be even scared of Luke a bit in Return Of the Jedi, so he lost.

 

Jedis are scared, of course they are not stupid, but they will not just stand there and take it from anyone.

 

In the Arena in SW2 as I remember there were outnumbered by 1 to 20 000.

 

About my previous posts, you people must be jokers to believe most of the stuff I said, but let me see you chained up on a pole, and then we see what you will do. It is only a joke for a laugh, peace.

[mez1109]

Oh yeah fergot, if you play JK2 Multi-Player, you will notice that the mejotiy of player play evil characters, such as Jango Fett, Darth, Maul, Reborn etc., and neraly everyone uses the sith powers.

 

If you also notice, in the old JK games ONLY if you were evil in the game did you get the sith powers, now Kyle still has the sith powers even though you are good as a standared.

 

 

Ravensoft explained that by saying that Kyle is not totally balanced within the force, being between the dark and good side as he has no proper Jedi dicipline, the real reason is that people enjoy both the Sith and Good Force powers.

[ET Warrior]

Ah, but you also must remember two things, first this is a video game, not real life.....in real life those jedi would be killing real people with their sith powers....so they'd have have no morals. Secondly, Jedi are raised from the time they're like 3 years old in the jedi temple.....they have goodness drilled into them, and they are trained to be guardians and defenders, not agressors.

[mez1109]

Your right.

 

Could it be, because all this goodness is drilled into them, the dark side becomes for some Jedis a new adventure or a new feeling, as they have never really experienced this.

 

Or its just ********s* excist, and there is always one or two black sheep in the flock.

[Jedi_Monk]

Supposedly, there have only been 20 commissioned Jedi who ever left the Jedi Order. So, obviously a Jedi leaving the Order to persue his own interests is very rare. Then again, maybe there are some "excommunicated" Jedi who turned to the Dark Side whose fate is unmourned by the Jedi. Either way, the vast majority of Jedi are very moral. There's more to doing the Will of the Force than just helping "liars and cheats", because the people who die after such a life of doing the Force's bidding become One with the Force. They get to be hardwired into the universe and exist forever. While the Dark Side is annhilated unless (EU and possibly apocryphal) they anchor their soul to something in the Land of the Living.

 

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Jedi_Monk, you are correct, it is not the Jedi themselves that usually turn, however, to a Jedi-in-training, the easy way out of the dark side can be a tempting way to go.

 

Back in the days of the Jedi/Sith wars, this is how many were turned to the dark side. Those who lacked the discipline to become Jedi were persuaded to the dark side with promises of ultimate power. And ultimately, the Sith's lust for power was their downfall.

 

As far as Kyle goes, he is the one exception that we know of to walk the middle path. He is able to use the force for dark purposes, without turning to the ways of the sith. But as we see in Jedi Knight 1/Mysteries of the Sith, this is not easy for him.

[mez1109]

As you noticed in the SW movies, that the Sith try to keep themselve alive for longer.

 

Anakin technically is dead, but decides to rather live in a robatic suit, which even feeds him, his reason, to live longer and use the force.

 

The emperor obviously is human, but the guy is ancient, he should be dead, his body with blue veins sticking out, and weird skin makes him look like a dead corpse or zombie. he must be keeping himself alive somehow.

 

Yoda dosen't count, as his species lives for many years anyway.

 

The Sith are obsesed with living, while the Jedi are ready to die for other people.

 

I wonder how in SW3, Anakin ends up in the vader suit, what thing could have done that to him.

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Good question, eh?

 

Do you want an answer, or do you want to wait until the movie comes out to find out???

 

And it IS like that, but it's because of their association to the force that it is like that.

 

The dark side of the force is death, inherently. If someone is particularly strong with the dark side of the force (Palpatine), it will make them age faster, die faster.

 

It's the other way around for the light side. Someone who is particularly strong with the light side (Yoda) will live much longer than their life expectancy, because they focus the force within to make themselves stronger.

[AgentSmith]

I agree with MasterD-LeyAmas, a Sith will look and be older and more worn out because unleashing the Power of the Dark Side drains their own life.

 

Palpatine/Sidious is old in the trilogy but not that old. Especially considering their advanced medicine. It's just the Dark Side that eats him alive, draining his life.