Framerate drops with vertical rooms?

[MasterGriffin]

A friend of mine and I are both learning how to make maps right now. She made one, but when she tested it out the first time, she said she had her framerate drop in half when she was playing it...apparently it was because she had a room below another one, and she couldn't get her framerate to raise until she put it on the same 'level' (horizontally) as the other room. Anyone know if this is a defenite problem, and if so, is there a fix for it?

[idontlikegeorge]

i dont see why, unless for some reason the player could "see" into the other room from the way it was set up being below

 

also, it depends how the lower level room connected; really there shouldnt be any correlation between map Z axis height and framerate

[MasterGriffin]

Well, it was her map, and I didn't get to test it myself, so I'll just tell you what I know. She made a room with a few 'jail' cells, and a stairway down to the arena, or whatever the other room was. When she added the room below, her framerate dropped from 90 to around 30-40 or so. She went through different things she thought it would be, like glass, models, dynamic lights, etc. I guess she then deleted the lower room, and it fixed her framerate. Any ideas? I don't think it could've been because of the size of the room. I'm about to start working on my level, so I guess I'll see if I run into the same problem.

[RichDiesal]

Most likely, she didn't put in hint brushes properly and the game was drawing all of both rooms at the same time.

[Emon]

I think making everything detail does the same thing (lower framerates).

 

How come neither ctf_bespin or kejim_post have a single hint brush that I can find, yet they run extremely well?

[MasterGriffin]

What's a hint brush? I haven't heard of that one yet, but then again, I'm still learning.

[UniKorn]

There was probably an error in the room below. When she deleted and rebuild it, she probably removed the error.

[RichDiesal]

Originally posted by Emon

I think making everything detail does the same thing (lower framerates).

 

How come neither ctf_bespin or kejim_post have a single hint brush that I can find, yet they run extremely well?

 

Simple architecture, very little detail.

[Emon]

Except that kejim_post isn't very simple...

[RichDiesal]

Which kejim_post are you looking at? Most of Kejim is filled with simple squarish rooms with the occasional curved section - with nothing but boxes inside. Big mostly-rectangular brushes don't increase tri count all that much - it's primarily highly complex clipwork and curves that cause bit fps hits.

 

It's all texturework that makes it seem complex.

[Emon]

Guess I haven't played it in a while to notice.

 

It's also textures that hurt your framerate the most (resolution and size).

[idontlikegeorge]

i thought it was faces that hurt framerate;

 

like back in my DoD days, id get better looking, better playing maps using larger textures and putting more emphasis on texture details than on brush details (cuz HL we dint have detail brushes or patch meshes)

 

so basically id have nicer textures on simpler brushes, and that worked out best for the looks/play balance mappers need to get with

 

hehe of course for good play in an expected high battle area, the wpolys should be around 600 max

 

what are the recommended polys for q3/jk2? probably blow my mind hehe oh yeah and what is the console command to display r_speeds (or whatever they are called now?)

[UniKorn]

developer 1

r_speeds 1

r_showtris 1

[Karshaddii]

Why does Kejim not have a single hint brush but still runs fine?

 

Im no expert, Emon, (YET) but I do know that you only have to use Hint brushes in only certain cases.

 

Think of how hint brushes work--they basically add more portals--BUT if you are clever enough (and have a S###load of time on your hands from all the testing) you can design a map where there are enough natural portals and no fabricated ones are needed.

 

Look at the design of Kejim--Rich was partly right about there being really amazing about the architechture--its composed of square rooms. BUT--it's how those rooms are placed that makes the map not need any hint brushes. The Raven team very strategically placed all the rooms--which in turn were connected by hallways that serve as portals. The result?

 

In MOST places, no matter where you stand the computer only draws on average about 3 rooms--which do not have really anything in them that would smash the FPS down.

 

It may be easy to take Raven's Kejim_Post map for granted--as it may not look as fabulous as some of the projects you are working on--but the way it is laid out is fabulous--as well as how it runs.

 

I may not be making any sense because I cannot explain myself real well = / But in short--it's the Architecture that makes Kejim_Base run so well.

[Emon]

More polys hurt your framerate because they are textured. Untextured, smooth shaded polygons or something like that are a gajillion times faster to render than textured ones.