Jedi Style 1.1

[Canis_Aureus]

Well I tried this mod and I really liked it. I couldn't find any servers though, a shame since the fights are pretty nice. But this post is actually a sort of reply to Razorage in another thread.

 

Thanks for the input, Canis_Aureus. I'll talk to Stellarwind about it. We haven't come up with a permanant solution for kicking yet so we'll see. By default, it's too risk-free to kick..... I'd like to keep kicking in, but we gotta make it easy to use AND realistically usable. You can't just expect to run up a fully alert person's face without them cutting you in half with the saber.

 

What I like

- Shield recharging while sitting, although I wish you would remove shield completely from the game so you could only get shields this way.

- REALLY like what you have done to Force Speed... this is the way it should be!

- Saber collision is really cool.

- Saber throw is great, no more of that close combat saber throwing.

- Really nice how you can't spam specials all over the place.

- The delay on rolls are great that's how it should be.

- Bacta canister and health kits work brilliantly although I'd rather see at least health kits removed completely.

- Protect and heal ... again nice work.

- I couldn't get the walk button to work as a "hold down" key... but the one handed/two handed systems seem really nice.

- I really liked being able to wallkick while in the air, very nice feature.

 

Suggestions

- Sideways kick removed. While I agree that kicks suck in the base game, being risk free, they do add to the style and are great for fighting more than one enemy. What I would suggest is making the damage low and making it so that the enemy will only be knocked down if he's performing or recovering from an attack. Besides there should be a recovery on the kicks also there you are open for attacks. Perhaps you could even take more damage if hit durring a kick.

-At times the combats seemed a bit static. The slower speed in red style especially. I would suggest that the speed only slows down durring the actual attack and recovery of the two handed styles and then still keeping the ordinary walk button... at times slowing your speed down like that durring a swing can really make a difference so I missed that.

- You should include a few cool features like RGB coloured sabers and scaled models too

- Saber damage was a bit on the low side I think... default setting perhaps?

 

Final words

Jedi Style looks very promising... it is centered on gameplay and not added extreme features. I hope a few servers will run this mod, I think it will give us some very nice and cool duels. I like Jedimod++ but the servers I have been on has some extreme settings and that really ruins the experience... besides the doublebladed saber sucks, clips right through the model... too ugly for me... and using two sabers at once... lame. Jedi Style is all about gameplay ... I think it will be great!

[razorace]

- I couldn't get the walk button to work as a "hold down" key... but the one handed/two handed systems seem really nice.

 

 

Honestly, I wasn't involved in the version that's out right now. I just joined the project this week and I haven't actually gotten involved with the code yet.

 

Isn't that the way the walk button normally works?

 

Like I said, the kicks are going to need a rewrite. A recovery on kicks is a interesting idea but I'm concerned that it would prevent a good player from knocking down another player during an "openning" and then killing him.

 

I'm not sure quite sure what you mean by "static" but I understand the movement speed during a attack. I've been thinking that we should try lowering the stafe speed in two handed mode while swinging. Currently, I feel like I have to move ltoo much to the left and right to get the desired swing combos.

 

 

What's wrong with saber damage? I'm hesitent about uping it as there's no ability to dodge clear off a swinging blade. Sure, it's not "realistic" but you gotta give the player a chance to get away from the blade. Plus, the higher the blade damage the quicker the duels end.

 

I've been tossing around a sort of "force dodge" ability to replace the shields and improve realism. It seems to me that a person in saber combat should survive more than one actual saber blow. So to simulation battle fatigue and "hits" I'm think we should make a "force" Dodge guage. While you still have power in the guage you auto-dodge anything that would have hit you (like the way the reborn dodge out of the way sniper bolts, etc.) When you run out of dodge energy you talk actual damage and probably die in one hit (or two if you're lucky)

 

Also, I'm thinkng we could try reworking the force system as well. The way is it now almost all the force powers take the same amount of force power. It seems to me that, from the movies, certain force powers require different amounts of concentration and trade off in fatigue. I'd say expand the force resivor and then link battle fatigue into the gauge. Make running during combat, blocking, swinging, etc. take a effect on your force gauge. My reasoning is that "real" force users don't have "force guages". Their force useage is limited by their concentration, fatigue, skill, and knowledge.

 

Anyway, I think that's enough for now. I'll let Stellarwind know about this thread so he can put some input in as well. It is HIS mod.

[CorranHornjr]

I was wondering something razorace, you mentioned in my other thread 'Kotor and jkii sabering' that you can use jedi style 1.1 for SP...how do you do that!? I loaded the mod and tried to play it in SP but it didn't work.. please let me know what I need to do to try to get this to work...i played it in multiplayer, but I think it would be cool to see it used in SP

 

thanks

[razorace]

You and me both. Sorry if I unintentionally implied that it works in SP. I was just saying that I prefer the Styles saber physics better than the SP physics now. But, I'm betting I could talk stellarwind into letting me port it to SP once they release the source code. Again, sorry for the confusion.

 

Razor Ace

[Old_Ben]

Originally posted by Canis_Aureus

I couldn't get the walk button to work as a "hold down" key... but the one handed/two handed systems seem really nice.

 

In the options there is a seetting to make walk the default so you don't always have to hold down the button to walk.

[Canis_Aureus]

Yeah I know Old_Ben I always have it on SHIFT... perhaps my keyconfig got screwed up somehow... anyways it didn't work and I used the "bind SHIFT "cl_run !" .... anyways if it works with the normal hold to walk key I am fine

[razorace]

Mod Progress Update:

 

Well, I haven't heard from Stellarwind in about a week. It's his mod so I can't exactly DO anything until I get a game plan worked out with him. I hope I hear from him soon, I've got a bunch of ideas to bounce off him....

 

Razor Ace

[razorace]

Still haven't heard from Stellarwind, if anyone hears from him let me know. He's the creator of the Mod and I'd hate to have to take control of the project because he disappeared.....

 

Anyway, fortunately before he disappeared he sent me the lastest source code so I COULD continue the Mod if he's perminately gone.

 

As for addition ideas I've heard a few from my game savy bros. They suggested saber dropping and push breakable windows.

 

Let me know if you guys have any great Mod ideas.

[razorace]

Still haven't heard from Stellarwind, if anyone hears from him let me know. He's the creator of the Mod and I'd hate to have to take control of the project because he disappeared.....

 

Anyway, fortunately before he disappeared he sent me the lastest source code so I COULD continue the Mod if he's perminately gone.

 

As for addition ideas I've heard a few from my game savy bros. They suggested saber dropping and push breakable windows.

 

Let me know if you guys have any great Mod ideas.

[Jyt-Pon Dai'el]

Originally posted by razorace

Let me know if you guys have any great Mod ideas.

 

razorace,

 

I have a bunch of Mod ideas (and absolutely no Modding experience) if you're really interested in them. Should I post them here, or is there a better way for me to get them out there to the community? Thanks.

[razorace]

Just post away. Remember Jedi Style is aiming for "realistic" Star Wars combat.

[Flip-flip-chop!]

hello

(whoohoo, my first post!)

i have a mod idea that would add realism: whe someone throws a saber, if you force pull it you catch it and use double sabers (like anakin in ATOC). except that would totally screw the thrower...... maybe if you just hit the flying saber with yours it would be knocked out of the air and onto the ground, giving you a small advantage (the thrower could force pull it too him).

 

i have another idea: automatic realistic saber combat, its a hassle to activate, and if your going for, uh realism, it makes sense, doesn't it?

 

flip-flip-chop

[razorace]

Thanks for the ideas. I already had those ideas, but they are still excellent, none the less. Great minds think alike. Anyway, while making it possible to pick up your opponents would great and Dest's two saber work is great, unfortunately, me and Stellarwind aren't sure we could impliment two saber combat that's convincing and realistic. Once Dest perfects the look of double / dual sabers we'd be happy to include it in the mod. As for now, I think we're going to concentrate on single sabers only.

 

maybe if you just hit the flying saber with yours it would be knocked out of the air and onto the ground, giving you a small advantage (the thrower could force pull it too him).

 

I'm going to try to talk Stellarwind into getting droppable sabers in ASAP.

 

i have another idea: automatic realistic saber combat, its a hassle to activate, and if your going for, uh realism, it makes sense, doesn't it?

 

I agree, it is a pain. However, the realistic saber combat in SP is hidden in the SP source code. Until the SP source code is released we can't change anything in SP. Plus, you could just write a simple script that would activate the cheat at a press of a button. Here's a site dealing with scripting with the Quake 3 Engine (The basis for the JK2 engine)

[Jyt-Pon Dai'el]

Here are some of my JK II Mod ideas. Sorry for the long post, I actually did edit some of them out to keep it shorter.

 

- Saber can damage players on other side of (thin) walls.

 

- Saber can be thrown through (thin) walls or objects with force seeing level 3.

 

- Camera rotates 90 degrees as the player executes a wall-walk so that the camera is always centered on him, rather than on the level.

 

- Player can alter the trajectory of a wall-walk with force speed enabled.

 

- Player can run straight up a wall instead of just flipping off it. This could be done by running straight into a wall, double-tapping jump to execute the vertical wall run, then tapping it again to do the backflip.

 

- Bring back mid-air blue lunge (without the feather-fall).

 

- Create new saber style(s) for double-edged sabers and duel-sabers (I think this is already being considered, but I thought I'd throw it in anyway).

 

- Easy-access communication/taunt menu (a.k.a. MOH:AA).

 

- Include option to impose walking during duels (if both players vote yes). Running could only be done as short bursts during the duel.

---- There could actually be a whole menu of rules that could be voted on before a duel initiates (saber throw, kicking, double-edged sabers, etc.)

 

-Change Force Absorb into Force “Nullify”…

----Depending on assigned level, this either drops all of the target’s Force powers somewhat in point-value, or negates them all-together, for a limited time (maybe not neutral powers, or maybe only neutral powers, whatever works best). This will balance Absorb’s effectiveness, and make Light vs. Light battles more interesting.

 

- Jedi vs. Merc:

---- Mercs can have a Jetpack, and can pull themselves over short walls

---- Mercs have grappling hooks, and can even tie up other players if they shoot them with it (like Boba Fett did to Luke in RotJ). This should somehow be blockable and breakable, and should definitely only last for a limited time.

---- Mercs can only carry a limited number of weapons (based on weapon size)

---- Mercs get a sword instead of the stun baton. Limit this to same damage as baton, but enable dismemberment (possibly with blood). Sword vs. Sword combat will work just like sabers.

----These new Merc abilities/items could be either there by default, or selectable like Force powers, or new inventory items to pick up.

 

- Make Repeater primary fire faster and more accurate (more tightly grouped shots), and secondary fire less accurate (randomize shot distance and trajectory). This should balance the effectiveness of the gun, rather than just nerfing secondary fire damage.

 

- Integrate “Over-heating” for Repeater and Flechette secondary fire so it can only be fired 3-5 times in a row before cooling down (like the silenced machine gun in Return to Castle Wolfenstein, or the Covenant weapons in Halo.

 

- Add “Light vs. Dark” game mode for all team game types.

 

 

Thanks for listening to my ideas, I hope you can use them.

 

-[Edited for speling ]-

[Jyt-Pon Dai'el]

By the way...

 

Originally posted by razorace

 

 

I've been tossing around a sort of "force dodge" ability to replace the shields and improve realism. It seems to me that a person in saber combat should survive more than one actual saber blow. So to simulation battle fatigue and "hits" I'm think we should make a "force" Dodge guage. While you still have power in the guage you auto-dodge anything that would have hit you (like the way the reborn dodge out of the way sniper bolts, etc.) When you run out of dodge energy you talk actual damage and probably die in one hit (or two if you're lucky)

 

Also, I'm thinkng we could try reworking the force system as well. The way is it now almost all the force powers take the same amount of force power. It seems to me that, from the movies, certain force powers require different amounts of concentration and trade off in fatigue. I'd say expand the force resivor and then link battle fatigue into the gauge. Make running during combat, blocking, swinging, etc. take a effect on your force gauge. My reasoning is that "real" force users don't have "force guages". Their force useage is limited by their concentration, fatigue, skill, and knowledge.

 

GREAT IDEAS!!

 

Here's some ideas to elaborate on them. Some of them may be obvious additions, but I'll include them anyway.

 

For Force Dodge, the gauge could be the normal sheild gauge, but could have two levels of effectiveness. When the gauge still has power in the second level, all attacks are dodged. Once the gauge goes down to the first level, it reduces the health damage by half for every hit.

 

Your idea for a new Force system is genious! I think this would greatly improve on the pacing of the saber combat. Anything that encourages more walking during saber combat is a good thing in my book.

[razorace]

Here are some of my JK II Mod ideas. Sorry for the long post, I actually did edit some of them out to keep it shorter.

 

Heck, post them all, the more, the better. Anyway, before I go into personal comments on the suggestions / ideas, I gotta say that everyone has had some great ideas! Of course, now I need to figure out where Stellarwind went and get some of this stuff implimented. If I can't find him soon I'm thinking of just making a "spin off" mod based on the saber code stellarwind has already done and a title of "Masters of the Force". The idea is so I can still use the code without making unofficial releases with his mod. Anyway, on to the personal commentary.

 

- Saber can damage players on other side of (thin) walls.

 

- Saber can be thrown through (thin) walls or objects with force seeing level 3.

 

I don't see a situation where you could use this one. The range of the saber is very limited and I haven't seen any maps that have thin enough walls... Plus, I don't think that a lightsaber could cut that efficently thru a wall. Yes, a saber is suppose to cut thru anything, you still have to give it time and / or blade pressure to cut thru objects. As such, I don't think you could slice thru a wall with the time / strength of a saber swing.

 

- Camera rotates 90 degrees as the player executes a wall-walk so that the camera is always centered on him, rather than on the level.

 

That's a interesting idea, I'd try more of a 45 degree angle, so you can at least see where you're going. This sounds like something you gotta try to see if it works out. I'll add it to my wishlist.

 

- Player can alter the trajectory of a wall-walk with force speed enabled.

 

I agree, wall walk would be cooler if it was more controllable. However, wall walking seems like a complicated Force Power. I feel that wall walking (other than a simple push off jump) should be ability of higher level force users. My thoughts are IF we go with a leveling system, wall walk would last longer based on your Force level.

 

- Bring back mid-air blue lunge (without the feather-fall).

 

Why? The lunge is just a high powered spam move. I feel the specials should be for effect / finishers, not for spamming. As such, I'm hopeing to seriously rework all the specials.

 

- Create new saber style(s) for double-edged sabers and duel-sabers (I think this is already being considered, but I thought I'd throw it in anyway).

 

I believe this has been covered before, but I'll repeat it. While the double / dual sabers are awesome, they aren't really much more than a code hack at the moment. Until someone figures out a way to add new animations to the game, we (or anyone else) can properly impliment double / dual saber moves or stances. So, until then, Jedi Styles will remain a single saber game.

 

- Easy-access communication/taunt menu (a.k.a. MOH:AA).

 

Good Idea, I'd put it in but I'm don't believe there is enough audio clips per model to do that.... Maybe with some placeholder sounds until people make their own. We will see.

 

- Include option to impose walking during duels (if both players vote yes). Running could only be done as short bursts during the duel.

 

Good Idea, I'll see what I can do.

 

 

-Change Force Absorb into Force “Nullify”…

 

Interesting idea, but I imagine most of the defencive Force Powers will be voided out if we go with my Force Dodge idea.

 

- Jedi vs. Merc:

---- Mercs get a sword instead of the stun baton. Limit this to same damage as baton, but enable dismemberment (possibly with blood). Sword vs. Sword combat will work just like sabers.

 

While sword combat IS cool, I don't think it's approperate for the Star Wars setting. Why use a sword when you can just "Blast them!" Sides, that would involve making an entirely new weapon AND stance system just for one weapon. As for the other Merc ideas, they would become Merc items in the level system if it's made. (of course, players could mix and match force powers and merc power ups if they want.)

 

- Make Repeater primary fire faster and more accurate (more

 

Good idea for a more balanced Repeater, but the thing is too deadly as is.

 

- Integrate “Over-heating” for Repeater and Flechette secondary fire so it can only be fired 3-5 times in a row before cooling down

 

Good idea! The ROTC s-machine gun kicked @$$.

 

- Add “Light vs. Dark” game mode for all team game types.

 

Noted.

 

Thanks for listening to my ideas, I hope you can use them.

[/Quote]

 

NP, like I said, you have some good ideas. I'll be sure to source you if we use something you thought of first.

[razorace]

GREAT IDEAS!!

 

Thxs. I try.

 

For Force Dodge, the gauge could be the normal sheild gauge, but could have two levels of effectiveness. When the gauge still has power in the second level, all attacks are dodged. Once the gauge goes down to the first level, it reduces the health damage by half for every hit.

 

I like that idea. The one problem I see is that with this system your health will be too low to be able to take half-damage from a saber or blaster. Maybe instead go with a damage limiter that limits damage to a minor wound?

 

Your idea for a new Force system is genious! I think this would greatly improve on the pacing of the saber combat. Anything that encourages more walking during saber combat is a good thing in my book.

 

Thxs. The way it is now, you can use a heavy duty Force Power as easily as a Minor Power. It doesn't make sense to be able to use Force Lighting, while jumping and moving backwards, and other such instances. I hope to change that.

 

Razor Ace

[Canis_Aureus]

I don't like the double bladed saber or fighting with two sabers. It just looks wrong... I like the classic saber really and hope Jedistyles will add other content than this. Jedimod already have them and it looks bad and plays badly too. You would have to spend A LOT of time trying to balance these two new weapons... and imo that time can be used for much cooler things.

 

But lots of great ideas here... the force dodge is one of my favorite... Perhaps make it less automatic so that you have to press a button and the automatic dodge will last for 5 seconds or something. The dodge gauge would slowly recharge, but every time you use it you drain some power from it. When you use the ability to dodge the next attack will be dodged. And since you can't see how much your enemy has used his dodge fights will be more interresting... trying to trick your opponent into dodging a fake attack. The recharge on the dodge gauge should be REALLY slow, but much faster if you crouch with saber off.

[razorace]

I feel that Force Dodge should be 100% automatic. It's only purpose is to A) replace the shields, and B) make the player feel that they are "using the Force" to dodge impossible to miss shots that should kill them. If you make it a manually trigger ability I feel it would take away from that. Instead, I was thinking that there should be a Defensive Stance. The Stance would be push button activated (like the two handed stances) and would boost your defensive ability to nearly 100%. (plus this mode would increase the chance to deflect bolts back at attackers.) The offset for this would be a healthy Force drainage and an inability to move or use Force Powers. Basically, this is set up to mainly deflect blaster bolts like in the movies.

[Flip-flip-chop!]

hello again -

i was thinking about razor saying he wanted ideas for 'realistic' saber combat. i was going to say that 'real' saber combat, if you got hit you'd die, not impossibly dodge it. (this sounded a lot more convincing in my head) but then i read his bit about 'using the force'. that's a really cool idea.

 

my next idea is : finishing moves (though the whole concept is kinda nulled by the one-hit-one-kill thing). once a person has less than 20 health, they are open for a finishing move, like (these are just off the top of my head) breaking there neck with the force (a la Kueller in the book 'The New Republic') of suspending them upside down in the air for a beheading. you get the idea, something 'movie-ish' to end the battle. the 'moves would definantley have to be blockable and have a high force cost (so if you get less than 20 health you arn't screwed, just more vulnerable).

 

well, those are my ramblings for 2day.

 

Flip-Flip-Chop!

[razorace]

I also like the idea of finishing moves. Maybe link it into the fatigue level of your opponent. Once your opponent fatigues out he's open for finishing moves or something like that.

 

My latest idea after rewatching the battle scenes from the movies is changing the Saber Lock to Saber Clash. It no longer requires button mashing but is more of a "window of oppertunity" to do a non-saber attack such as a kick, force power, backhand, etc. This makes it more in line with the movies and more of a test of speed and skill instead of button meshing and who can do force push the most.

 

I've started a thread about the nature of saber combat here.

[razorace]

Anyway, here's a peek at my first draft design doc for the first stage of modifications to the game.:

 

First Major Modifications:

 

 

 

Weapons:

 

Damage for all weapons is heavy boosted. A direct hit WILL kill you. This is off set by the new Force Dodge.

 

Direct Hit Damage

--------------------

 

Repeater (primary) 20 Damage

Repeater (Secondary) 200 Damage

Blasters 100 Damage

Sabers 100 Damage

Missiles 200 Damage

Thermal D 200 Damage

Trip Mines 200 Damage

 

Repeater:

 

200 Round Max. Secondary Fire costs 40 Rounds. Secondary has some sort of power up sound before firing (2 sec delay).

 

 

Moves:

 

Defence Mode - Hold button to use, puts you in 100% defence mode. Effectively halfs of the cost of attacks to your Dodge Meter, but you can not attack or move while in this mode.

 

Force Powers:

 

Call on the Dark Side of the Force - Converts 60% of your Dodge Meter into your Fatigue Meter (2 Dodge to 1 Fatigue). Prereq: Progressive (0,1,2...Kills) until Death. You can use this if you have less than 60% of your Dodge Meter but the cost is at +1 Kills and you will gain Dodge up to 40% of Max.

 

 

Force Dodge: Replaces shields. This represents your normal / jedi reflex to dodge attacks. When you are hit by damage, instead of taking damage, you will do a reflex dodge/block and lose a number of Dodge Point based on the damage that would have been caused (on a 10 Damage Points to 4 Dodge Points basis). If you don't have enough Dodge Point to cover the full damage you be hit for 1/3 * (Full Damage Amount - Remaining Dodge Points) Damage Points. Force Dodge recharges over time (1 min empty to full) from your Fatigue Points at a cost of 4 Dodge to 1 Fatigue. All players have a max of 100 Dodge Points. This works out to about 10 dodged saber blows over a time period of 4 mins assuming you don't attack at all.

 

 

Fatigue: All players have

 

Saber Contact:

 

Saber Contact replaces Saber Lock, Saber Contact occurs more often than a normal Saber Lock. There are left / right and up / down locks just like Saber Lock.

 

Up / Down Saber Contact Moves:

 

Saber Left (Primary + Left) - Attempt to rotate the blade counter-clockwise. Countered by Saber Right. If not countered can result in....Knockback Left after one rotation (Jump Prereq: 3 Fatigue), or a Heavy Parry/Loss of Saber Left after two rotations. After the saber is off-center by 180 degrees, you can excute a Backhand Left / Heavy Kick Left.

 

Backhand Right (Primary + Right) - A Light Parry Left immediately followed by a backhand to the right. Prereq: 5 Fatigue, saber off-center 180 degrees left Damage: Heavy KnockBack Right, 10 Fatigue

 

Heavy Kick Right (Jump + Right) - A Light Parry Left comboed into a heavy right sided kick. Prereq: 5 Fatigue, saber off-center 180 degrees left Damage: Heavy KnockBack, 10 Fatigue

 

 

Saber Right (primary + Right) - Same as Saber Left except with a opposite bias.

Backhand Left

Heavy Kick Left

 

Quick Kick (Jump + Back) - Swift kick to opponent. Prereq: 3 Fatigue, before any other move. Damage: KnockBack

 

Quick Combo (Primary + Forward) - Attempt to..........

 

------------

 

Please don't rip ideas from this without permission, I've been working hard on this thing.

[razorace]

I've unofficially cancelled Jedi Styles until Stellarwind shows back up. Until then, I'm starting a Mod in the same vain of trying to boost the realism of the game in general. The official title is Star Wars: Masters of the Force. I'm aiming for a two staged modification schedule. Stage One will involve reworking the game mechanics for more realism. Stage Two will involve adding a experience / leveling system to the game for a more flexible and fun game experience. Eventually, I'm aiming for a Mod capable of recreating the movie battles in a way that is as fun and realistic as possible. I will accept help in basically any area and experience level.

 

The main thread for this is in General Editing, here.