Breton Posted March 8, 2003 Share Posted March 8, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA could somebody please get me the homicide statistics in these countries instead of just firearm homicide, In 1996 there were 681 homicides total in England and Wales. The same year, there was 33 times more murders per 100,000 population in Washington DC than there was in London. Totally in US there is 7.3 murders per 100,000 population, while the number is 0.9 in Norway. also, you must realize that there is a history of gangs and organized crime in the US, this is not as prevalent in other countries, therefor taking guns away is a far less effective way of dealing with crime in the US. You never know until you try Jm qui gon, I have not been beaten just so you know. K. But I wish you would come with a real argument on why guns should be legal soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbguy1211 Posted March 8, 2003 Share Posted March 8, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA you must realize that there is a history of gangs and organized crime in the US, this is not as prevalent in other countries, therefor taking guns away is a far less effective way of dealing with crime in the US. Now, I like to attack ideas and not people, and I don't like calling people names... but dude you're close... That statement is completely and devoid of any facts and/or truth. When you make outrageous statements like these you really need to back them up with facts and or number rather than your opinions or else people will simply call you full of it... On another note... Are you in some sort of "organization" or group of people who meet to share their religious feelings and/or opinions with each other? What I'm getting at is... are you in a cult? Seriously because your mind state really resembles the thought patterns of people in them and it's a little creepy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edlib Posted March 9, 2003 Share Posted March 9, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA fascism is an ultra liberal form of govenrment, much like comunism, it includes the use of big governments and taking away freedoms from the people for the "benefit" of all. Not by any definition I have ever heard of it. "Fascism - A philosophy or system of government that advocates or exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with an ideology of belligerent nationalism." Personally, I associate fascism with: Ultra right-wing authoritarian thought. Militaristic nationalism, touching on xenophobia, with a belief that constant and decisive use of force can and should be used to make others agree to your point of view, with a tendency to ridicule pacifists, or worse, to lump them in with the enemy. Equating all those who disagree with being traitors. A call to return to traditional ideals, to undo the damage caused by the decadent, wealthy, liberal intelligentsia, and the almost total rejection of modernistic thought, especially where it concerns individual freedoms. A mocking of the democratic processes of parliamentary bodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEDI_MASTA Posted March 10, 2003 Author Share Posted March 10, 2003 edlib... conservatism is right wing, I believe we can all agree on this, conservatism is the idea of people maintaining the rights and keeping the givernment as small as possible, does this sound like a fascist government toyou? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbguy1211 Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA conservatism is the idea of people maintaining the rights and keeping the givernment as small as possible Bwahahahahahaha!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEDI_MASTA Posted March 10, 2003 Author Share Posted March 10, 2003 that was... umm... how you say.... profound? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Fergie Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA edlib... conservatism is right wing, I believe we can all agree on this, conservatism is the idea of people maintaining the rights and keeping the givernment as small as possible, does this sound like a fascist government toyou? Very humorous, MASTA did you sleep through school. As pb put it HA a HA ahuh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMasterEd Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Having guns legalized is actually a good thing. When the Opium Wars ended, Britian legalized the drug to control the drug. If you legalize it, you now have control of it, prices, who gets it, etc. But if guns were made illegal, you have absolutly no control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edlib Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA edlib... conservatism is right wing, I believe we can all agree on this, conservatism is the idea of people maintaining the rights and keeping the givernment as small as possible, does this sound like a fascist government toyou? I didn't say it was a perfect fit, but there are those elements in conservative dialogs that I have noticed lately, especially from avowed conservative commentators (mostly from Fox News, or the AM talk-show guys like Limbaugh, and ESPECIALLY from this new guy on the scene, Michael Savage, who I have NO problem labeling a fascist, not to mention a racist... when I heard that Savage is encouraging the government to enforce an archaic law that would require the police to arrest anyone who publicly opposed the administration's war-plans, that was the topper for me) that give me a bit of pause for concern. In observing these commentators for a couple of years now, I have noticed one common, recurring theme: to try rid the country of liberal thought,.. or at the very least reduce those that hold such views to such a total laughingstock in the eyes of the public that the country will in effect be running on a one-party system. (All in the name of information and/or "entertainment," I guess. ) And, as you no doubt know, a one party government is no longer a true democracy, but borders on being a fascist state. It really wasn't until many of the mainstream conservatives began labeling the U.N. (and even occasionally N.A.T.O.) as "irrelevant" in the last few months that my concern really started to kick in for real however. All I'm saying is that there are a few people like myself who have noticed these things, with a fair amount of growing concern, and would like to be assured that the mainstream conservatives, the current administration, and the Republican Party do not really hold with these views. However, when you, as the most outspoken conservative voice on this board, suddenly take to displaying the symbol of the most violent fascist and racist regime the world has ever known as a substantial part of your online persona, it really does little to calm my concerns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbguy1211 Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Originally posted by edlib I didn't say it was a perfect fit, but there are those elements in conservative dialogs that I have noticed lately, especially from avowed conservative commentators (mostly from Fox News.... ... I have noticed one common, recurring theme: to try rid the country of liberal thought,.. or at the very least reduce those that hold such views to such a total laughingstock in the eyes of the public that the country will in effect be running on a one-party system. (All in the name of information and/or "entertainment," I guess. ) And, as you no doubt know, a one party government is no longer a true democracy, but borders on being a fascist state. Hehe.... foxnews... well at least it pays the bills! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagobahn Eagle Posted March 10, 2003 Share Posted March 10, 2003 Having guns legalized is actually a good thing. When the Opium Wars ended, Britian legalized the drug to control the drug. If you legalize it, you now have control of it, prices, who gets it, etc. But if guns were made illegal, you have absolutly no control I'm talking about something like Norway, where you can have guns, but only when you're in a hunting association or something, and then only after intensive handling/safety training. Regulation is the key word here. Yes, guns are legal, but should they be legal as in "unrestricted". Would you like it if you went to a country where you could drive without a license (just buy the car and get on the road)? I don't think so. You see, this is not a question of black and white. There's a full gray zone, going to illegal (black) and unrestricted (white). What we want is somewhere in-between, like cars. You can get a car, but only after you get a license, and to get a license in the first place you have to qualify for it (vision/reflex checks and so on). I'm not saying we ban guns. However, I say that we should require people to undergo training to get one. Indeed, the constitution says the militia should be quote, "well-regulated". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 I'm all for requiring licenses to use firearms... I'm against restricting certain firearms outright. You should, however, need a different license, for example, to own an assault rifle than you do to own a glock 'matic, but outright saying, "Well, we're not letting you own MP5's," pisses me off. The AK-47's a prohibited firearm in Canada... The one gun I've really wanted and I can't own one. I can (and do) own an AR-15 (basically an M-16), and as a restricted firearm, I had a hell of a time getting it. Pistols/handguns are prohibited firearms in Canada, except for competitive marksmanship... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Why would citizens need assault rifles? Isn't your .50 Desert Eagle enough? Escapes me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nitro Posted March 11, 2003 Share Posted March 11, 2003 Well, I can't own a DE... It's a handgun, and as such, it's as illegal to own as that AK I wanted... Or a WWII Thompson SMG for that matter. Those are prohibited in Canada too. As for my AR-15, I'm a marksman. I learned in Scouts, shooting .22 rifles, when I was 12. I later joined cadets and did quite well in provicial competitions, mostly top 5 finishes, but I never got to nationals... Well, technically I did, but I could never go because of school, work, sickness, and in two cases, deaths in the family. When I turned 18 just about two years ago, I started getting myself all hooked up, licenced and cleared for restricted firearms and such, and about four months ago ordered and received the first projectile weapon I actually paid for... When I first got my licence, my dad gave me one of his .22's and a shotgun that I still haven't touched (no reason to... I'm a marksman, not a butcher). I spent 3 months breaking in, and working on, my AR-15 (M15A2 National Match model), and made a couple of visits to a local gunsmith. Now she shoots straighter than anything I've fired before, and I'm completly in love with it. For anyone with a love of military firearms, and $4500 CAN (after everything, like S&H cause I bought it from the States, duty, smithing, extra mags, cleaning supplies, portable hard case, really heavy duty gun locker, registration, and ammo expended to date), I'd highly recommend an AR-15. Check out http://www.armalite.com for details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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