Why did the game die/is the game dying?

[Solo4114]

Not to get too far off topic, but razorace, you should check out the Pages of Now and Forever. (http://www.classicgaming.com/starcontrol) Fred Ford and Paul Reich III have released the source code to SC2 and it's been rereleased as a windows native program called the Ur-Quan Masters. Check it out!

[razorace]

Really?! Last I heard the source code had been lost. I guess they found it.

[Spider AL]

Retro-fest. Heh.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

Take, for example the Lavafort map in UT CTF. Granted, the approaches to the bases are identical, but the bases themselves are different, and may require different approach tactics to actually snag the flag and begin your run back home. To me, that's a balanced, but (minorly) asymetrical map. That'd be the kind of design I'm looking for in a good asymetrical CTF map.

Well, I've never played UT to any great standard, but at a cursory glance the blue base in Lava Giant(?) seems to have much superior sniping/defensive spots. That's really my point, differences almost always = advantages for one team. Sure, there HAVE been asymmetrical maps which were fairly "balanced" but they're few. Happened upon by accident, probably.

 

Even the slightest changes convey advantages. Take Yavin CTF: Red base has two lines of innocuous pillars in it. Made my life much easier when I came to get the red flag and ran out of Force. Dodging in and out all the time... mmm...

 

Intentional balance of the type you're talking about... well, as I've said elsewhere, even chess isn't balanced.

 

But I agree variety in maps is great, as long as there are some good mirror-image maps that can be used competitively in the game.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

I do think that you could still have more blaster weapons and have them vary in power. To help avoid having weak guns and unstoppable sabres, you could make one's ability to block a blaster shot dependent upon the relative strength of the shot

Yes, one could make more interesting blaster weapons. But unless some weapons are inherently capable of penetrating the lightsabre, whoosh, all-powerful lightsabre.

 

Also, the more complex you make the blocking system, the more prone to lag failiure it'll be, which will annoy the huge number of people who have some sort of latency problem. Single-key Manual with penalties would be nice, but I'm not here to expound my own theories on blocking methods.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

The whole point of playing a Star Wars game, as opposed to, say, Elite Force, or Quake 3, or UT2k3 or what have you, is because I want to play in that particular universe.

Well, I have to disagree here. The point of playing a DF game is because they're well polished, first-person shooters with hyper-real physics, arcane special powers and decent melee combat. DF has always skirted the canon when it comes to Star Wars. Dark Jedi? Thats an oxymoron, that is. Force-crystals? Force Destruction?

 

DF has never been and I hope never will be so ultra-faithful to the films that it loses the unique feel and flavour that the original carved out.

 

DF is a NEW experience. It's not pure SW. It's a hybrid, a blend. It's unacceptable to try and squish that. Too many people love it.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

See, I thought that it was balanced in terms of things like ammo consumption, rate of fire, etc. Sure it was powerful. Nothing wrong with having powerful weapons in a game. In fact, it makes things interesting. But it also had some downsides to it. The rate of fire was lower than other weapons, the weapon had no spread to it's shots, aside from the concussive blast when it made contact, and (if memory serves) it ate up more ammo than any other gun.

Oh no, totally imbalanced. Two-three shot stop, like the flechette. Difference is: The conky bolt travelled in a completely straight, nigh-infinite line, very very fast, and had about the same firing rate as the flechette secondary too. Easy to hit, much easier to make than flechette kills. Ammo was always plentiful in JK too, especially with the backpack dropping.

 

It was quite a lot of work to hog the power cells, armour and conky in JK, and that was the best way to win.

 

JO was much better in that there were two... maybe even three other guns that could rival the flechette. Rocket L, Heavy Rep and Tenloss at range. That meant the levels played in a much more fluid fashion.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

To me, that's balanced. You have benefits, but they are offset by disadvantages. Balancing does NOT equal across-the-board nerfing. It simply means (to me, at least) that the weapon or action performed in the game has pros and cons to its use and that, while something may be powerful, there are counters that can be used against it, and it has disadvantages upon which an opponent may capitalize (assuming they have the skill, creativity, etc.).

Oh, there are always disadvantages to any weapon that good players try to capitalise on. Let's take the flechette as an example again. Range was key with the flechette. It wasn't much use to most players at long range, and was hazardous to the user at short range, very vulnerable to a well-timed push. Thus the intelligent player cultivated an ability to maintain a mid-range with the flechette. Opponents tried to increase that, or cut it down. Repeater on the other hand was a good rival because of its high rate of primary fire which could be utilised in close, and secondary fire that was far less high-risk in close. It could be used at long range very effectively. Paradoxically, the rocket launcher was best in close, or when the opponent wasn't aware of one. It was nearly useless at long range, very good for mid-air primary shots on the fly, however.

 

But as I've said elsewhere, name me a gun and I can think of genuine disadvantages inherent in it. There will always be a gun that's MOST powerful however, and decent players will always compensate very quickly through their style of play, for any disadvantages there are. People learned to aim well with the flechette. To sweep areas with it. They became very VERY good at maintaining that middle-distance.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

I dunno. If I was a dev, I'd at least want to guage fan reaction to prior games before developing a new one in the series.

Maybe, if the dev's unusually dedicated and doesn't mind wading through the gazillion opinion threads... and if anything we say now applies in the future when gaming's evolved another few years' worth.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

That's what I'm looking for: something that jives with the rest of the design theme (even if that theme was based purely on budget concerns) so as to maintain the believability of the weapons. I'm not sure if I'm explaining what I mean to say, though, so I'm just gonna move on.

No, I get you. But what IS the Star Wars "theme"? I'm not sure even SW scholars could tell you. George Lucas certainly doesn't seem to know. He's dressed all the Jedi as "desert hermits" for some reason. He's made shiny what was dirty and made cutesy what was gritty, and that's just in RotJ. The prequels? Don't get me started.

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

Also, at least in terms of JO, I found that the gameplay in its base form was not all that compelling so, even if the game had had fancy graphics, I probably would've gotten bored with it after a while.

Well, of course, since it's a Star Wars game you feel the urge to change it to be more to your liking. When I don't think much of a game, I leave it alone. I don't bother about it.

 

If this game didn't have the words "Star Wars" in the title, nobody would care, I don't think...

 

Originally posted by Solo4114:

 

if the mod community can start developing mods that do more than let you pick lightsabre colors and hilts, do pirouettes (sp?), and pretend you are a nerf herder from Dantooine.

Quite. Hope springs eternal...

 

Yergh.

 

"I run this clothes shop on Drazen isle!"

 

"And I'm here to rob you and steal all your takings. Die."

 

*Tzzztt!*

 

"LAMOR NO KILLINGZ!!!111"

 

Gotta love them RPGers.

[razorace]

I agree with symmetrical map comment. ANY differences on a team map results in an advantage for one team or the other. The red team on Lava giant has the advantage (it's easier to get to teh blue flag by jumping the wall.)

[Solo4114]

See, right there, you prove my point Al & razorace, at least on the asymetrical stuff. Al said that lavagiant seemed to favor the blue team, in terms of defense and sniper positions. The blue team had limited protection with its small turrets, so that snipers could provide better cover for the main approaches. But, by the same token, they also had an easier flag to get to. Jump the wall, run across a bridge, and you're there. The red team, on the other hand, had a base that had more open sniper positions (therefore more prone to being killed by offense) but had a less direct approach to their flag. You'd have to go to the back of the base in order to get to it, if memory serves. So right there, you can see how one side has advantages and disadvantages, as does the other side. The balancing comes into play by making sure that neither side has an advantage or disadvantage that outweighs the other side.

 

I don't mind symettrical maps mostly, I just find that they can get old. If they're done right, though, they're fantastic fun. Even the old 2fort variations for CTF in Quake and such were a blast to play, and they were usually symmetrical.

 

As far as the design theme, I think that with the weapons in the original trilogy, you can see a pretty standard theme. Guns were based mostly off of WWII era weapons (likely because it was easy and cheap to obtain these as surplus, then chop 'em up and stick geegaws on 'em). In the new films, Ep. I seemed to be going for a more sleek, shiny, artsy look (which was actually a conscious decision, apparently) in order to differentiate with the more gritty look of the original trilogy. In terms of Ep. II, the usual footsoldier equipment of the Clone troopers was much more in keeping with the style of the original trilogy. The clonetrooper rifle is a great example of how you can have interesting looking new blaster weapons. And that was entirely CG and only VERY loosely based on the E-11 design, it seemed. (or rather, it'll evolve into the E-11)

 

Al, I think where you and I differ fundamentally is in what we want out of the game. I defintely want an experience that is as close to the films as possible, without sacrificing fun in the process. You seem content with a suggestion of the films, but nothing close to a real adherence to their content. I don't mind EU stuff. Don't get me wrong. I find it to be a nice change of pace. Like I've said, I wouldn't have minded keeping weapons that function similarly to the ones we have in this game, it's just the look and feel of them that I felt didn't jive with what I'd seen in the films and imagined from the books I'd read. Honestly, from playing Elite Force, a lot of the weapons in JO seemed pretty close to what you saw in EF. Makes me wonder just how much innovation Raven really did.

 

You're right, though, that if the game didn't have the Star Wars trademark on it, people wouldn't care, but that's what a trademark is all about: it's to indicate to the consumer what they can expect from the product. You seem to distinguish the DF trademark from the Star Wars trademark, and are happy with what you found JO to be. In terms of keeping with the DF theme, I'd say JO was pretty damn faithful. But to me, the DF games themselves never really captured the feel of Star Wars that I was looking for. I suppose the first DF game (from what I can remember) did this, but even that game had its flaws.

 

As far as the concussion rifle discussion goes (hey, that almost rhymes...), I think that kind of illustrates what I'm talking about. I'm fine with conkys being the most effective weapon all around. I'm fine with them being unblockable, or at least difficult to block (similar to the flechette at midrange). But I think the reason that I liked the conky more than the flechette was that it just felt more Star Wars. The look, the firing effect, etc., all seemed to suggest the films to me more than the flechette did. In that sense the conky was better designed, albeit probably a bit unbalanced, from what you described (like I said, it's been a good couple of years since I played JK1). If I were to create a disadvantage for that weapon, it would be the same one that the secondary fire of the flechette has: it can be pushed back towards you, if the opponent is fast enough and has force powers. It can't be blocked, it has an area effect for damage, and it's EXTREMELY powerful, but it still has that one small achilles heel that you can try to take advantage of. If the guy with the conky is smart, he'll find ways to compensate for that disadvantage, but it's still there. To me, that's balance. It doesn't screw up the game, either. That'd be what I'd look for in a more starwarsy kind of game: something that hews closer to the films in terms of the overall feel, something that's reasonably balanced (but not nerfed to the point of being useless), and something that's still fun.

[Spider AL]

So right there, you can see how one side has advantages and disadvantages, as does the other side. The balancing comes into play by making sure that neither side has an advantage or disadvantage that outweighs the other side.

I see where you're coming from, but the ability to stop the opposing team GETTING to one's base with impunity is more valuable. Take two teams of equal skill, put them on an asymmetrical map, and one team will win due to terrain differences. No set of advantages or disadvantages on an asymmetric arena are equal.

 

As far as the design theme, I think that with the weapons in the original trilogy, you can see a pretty standard theme. Guns were based mostly off of WWII era weapons (likely because it was easy and cheap to obtain these as surplus, then chop 'em up and stick geegaws on 'em). In the new films, Ep. I seemed to be going for a more sleek, shiny, artsy look (which was actually a conscious decision, apparently) in order to differentiate with the more gritty look of the original trilogy.

Well there you go. For Lucas at least, the design theme is apparently more related to budgetary concerns than any artistic continuity.

 

Al, I think where you and I differ fundamentally is in what we want out of the game. I defintely want an experience that is as close to the films as possible, without sacrificing fun in the process. You seem content with a suggestion of the films, but nothing close to a real adherence to their content.

Exactly. As I've said before, Dark Forces is an experience in its own right, a hybrid of SW and EU and FPS. It's wonderful. If you made the game purely like the movies, you'd be ruining that dynamic. Another game is the place to do things like that.

 

Like I've said, I wouldn't have minded keeping weapons that function similarly to the ones we have in this game, it's just the look and feel of them that I felt didn't jive with what I'd seen in the films and imagined from the books I'd read.

I do understand what you mean, and I would imagine I'd be equally miffed if say... the LotR movies hadn't lived up to my expectations.(In fact, I'm sure Peter Jackson had a spy in my brain, they were so close to my imagination ) But I'm not sure you can blame Raven for not making the EU guns the same as you imagined them...

 

In terms of keeping with the DF theme, I'd say JO was pretty damn faithful. But to me, the DF games themselves never really captured the feel of Star Wars that I was looking for. I suppose the first DF game (from what I can remember) did this, but even that game had its flaws.

Well there we have it, in a nutshell. Now, if a game was made to your specifications that was as close to the movies as you'd like, I'd play it, for one. But not if it replaced the classic flavour of Dark Forces, by being the next in the series. Dark Forces is a specific type of game. It has a tradition to maintain. Perhaps a PC-based sequel to Obi-Wan would be a better target to change into the game you want, as it seems to have the same ideas, and a shorter pedigree.

 

As far as the concussion rifle discussion goes (hey, that almost rhymes...), I think that kind of illustrates what I'm talking about. I'm fine with conkys being the most effective weapon all around. I'm fine with them being unblockable, or at least difficult to block (similar to the flechette at midrange). But I think the reason that I liked the conky more than the flechette was that it just felt more Star Wars.

Ah. Okay. I don't understand the reasoning behind this at all. hehehe

 

Once again, it seems to be a fundamental difference: The first thing I look for is gameplay. I know gameplay's important to you too, but it seems to be in the queue behind your idea of what feels Star Warsy, which I don't agree with really...

 

That's fine though, each to his own. But as I say, DF is its own game, and like Quake, it has its own style. To change it to what you've described would be the same as never having a DF sequel. It wouldn't really be DF, you see.

[Solo4114]

Well, maybe you're right about the DF games, then. The should keep releases in relative continuity to the previous games, definitely. Maybe an Obi-Wan sequel or an entirely new series of FPS shooters IN ADDITION to DF games are what is needed. Personally, I feel that the exploration of Kyle as a character is getting somewhat stale (at least for SP). Maybe that's because they had him going gray at the temples in this game. Then again, hell, so am I, and I'm only 25.

 

For MP purposes, I guess what I've been trying to suggest, is that by adding game modes (IE: the CBOM stuff I advocated earlier in the thread) should not necessarily replace the standard DM/CTF/etc. game modes, but rather should add on to it. I definitely see where you're coming from in terms of how you see DF. It seems that you really view it as a separate thing from Star Wars. It's its own license for you, and so, if the games all approximate EACH OTHER, then you're satisfied (assuming they're fun to play, of course). I get that. For me, I'm looking first at the Star Wars logo, and second at the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight logo, in terms of my expectations. That's not to say that I'm willing to sacrifice gameplay, it's just that what I expect out of a game set in the Star Wars realm is that it be first and foremost, true to the original materials, and secondarily be true to the previous games. But that's just how I prioritize things.

 

It seems that Raven is (assuming they get the gameplay/fun factor right and minimize the bugs on first release or first patch) pretty good at making DM style games. I don't enjoy DM, but it seems that a lot of the people who do find JO to be quite fun as simply a DM game with some Star Wars content.

 

Maybe what would be a smarter move for LucasArts (from a marketing standpoint) would be to release TWO games next time around, and thereby cater to different factions in the community. They could release DF4, have it focus on Kyle (or Kyle's kid or whatever), and have the MP gameplay be basically similar to what you have in this game (just PLEASE give us more CTF maps, and preferably slightly better ones -- don't give us LESS DM maps to compensate somehow, just give MORE CTF maps). At the same time, maybe they should produce an entirely separate title like "Star Wars: Team Battles" that focuses gameplay in a similar fashion to games like TFC, RTCW, and BF1942. No real single player content, aside from playing against (hopefully well-programmed) bots, much like what the original UT shipped with. You could play Clones & Jedi vs. Confederation & Sith, or Rebels vs. Imperials, or offer both sets of conflicts on different maps (IE: a Geonosis map, a Hoth map, a Death Star map, etc., etc.). Since the DF games (aside from the first one) all take place after ROTJ, you'd have plenty of source material to work with, and could keep weapons more akin to the blasters seen in the films. If some anal fanboy wanted to critique this based on the timeline, you could say, "Well, Kyle was always performing commando operations against highly technologically advanced and well equipped Imperials and neutrals. That's why the repeater, etc. were in the games. The later games simply represent the progression of technology after the close of the Civil War."

 

Thus, you don't have to replace DF with new content, you can stay true to the DF trademark, AND you can give the fans who want a more film-like, less EU-like experience what they're looking for. AND you'd probably sell twice as many games, because idiot fans like myself will probably just end up buying both. In that sense, I think you'd be giving everyone what they want and expect. And it's exactly Lucas' style: why put out one authoritative collection that's full of content to please EVERYONE when you can keep releasing individual new versions of things over and over, add maybe a smidgen of new material, and get the fans to keep shelling out the cash for it? (>sigh< I sure hope that the DVD collection of the original trilogy, or all six movies, will include the original versions of the films as well as the SEs. I plan on making my own SE version of ANH and replacing the GODAWFUL Greedo scene with its original.)

 

Oh, and as far as Jackson's ability to capture the look and feel of the LOTR books, it really IS uncanny (although he did have plenty of artwork to base things on). Overall, I thought his films have been fantastic (especially the extended uber-geeky-tolkien-fan version -- can't wait for the next films to come out in extended directors cut versions on DVD). My only gripe so far has been that one thing with Faramir. I get why he did it, I just always thought of Faramir as above that sort of thing (based on the books/BBC radio drama -- which, if you haven't heard is FANTASTIC). But that's a little OT, admittedly.

[Spider AL]

Yeah, I think two games would be the best way to go. Also, the more SW games the better, naturally.

 

sure hope that the DVD collection of the original trilogy, or all six movies, will include the original versions of the films as well as the SEs.

So do I, but I wouldn't count on it. I heard somewhere a while ago that Lucas was quoted as saying:

 

"The SEs are the movies now. What is this Or-ig-in-al you speak of? I know not this word. Now go, lest I set my ninja on you."

 

Well, in so many words.

 

Bah. Han was much more interesting when he was ambiguous.

 

My only gripe so far has been that one thing with Faramir. I get why he did it, I just always thought of Faramir as above that sort of thing (based on the books/BBC radio drama -- which, if you haven't heard is FANTASTIC). But that's a little OT, admittedly.

 

Oh yes, the BBC drama was good. And apparently there's quite a bit of Faramir dialogue floating around Jackson's cutting room, I hope it'll all end up in the extended DVD to fill out the character a bit more. More mention of why he knew Boromir was deceased, etc. Fingers crossed.

[Guest Jolts]

well, solo basically said everything I was going to say about the guns and everything else. Later I'll make a better post but right now my jaw is killing me.

 

As for seperate games, I still say lucasarts should develop a online only game, and then have any other sp games be seperate. They get twice the money, and we get 2 choices and 2 teams dedicated to working on one apsect each.

 

AS for kyle, I never cared about him, or his dark forces title. He reminds me of a cheap lorenzo lameass character. Some kind of cheeseball lethal weapon mel gibson cheap ripoff, some kind of nbc 80's detective sissy check out my 5 oclock baby because its time to rumble on the wb. I only was interested in dark forces and jedi knight because they had "star wars" in the title.

 

Drugs kicking in...sleep...oh yeah....

[Prime]

Originally posted by Jolts

I sure hope that the DVD collection of the original trilogy, or all six movies, will include the original versions of the films as well as the SEs. I plan on making my own SE version of ANH and replacing the GODAWFUL Greedo scene with its original.

Alas, I believe Lucas has commented that there are only going to be the SE editions on the DVDs. There is the story on it at TheForce.net somewhere. I think there is a petition about it somewhere too.

 

 

Originally posted by Jolts

AS for kyle, I never cared about him, or his dark forces title. He reminds me of a cheap lorenzo lameass character. Some kind of cheeseball lethal weapon mel gibson cheap ripoff, some kind of nbc 80's detective sissy check out my 5 oclock baby because its time to rumble on the wb. I only was interested in dark forces and jedi knight because they had "star wars" in the title.

Blastphemy! Thou shalt rot in Hell for these faithless words against our Kyle!

[razorace]

I suspect the DVD versions will be different from even the SE editions. Star Wars v3.0.

[Guest Jolts]

whoa

 

quote:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by Jolts

I sure hope that the DVD collection of the original trilogy, or all six movies, will include the original versions of the films as well as the SEs. I plan on making my own SE version of ANH and replacing the GODAWFUL Greedo scene with its original.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

I never said that, where is it pulling that quote from?

[Spider AL]

Yeah Jolts, Kyle owns you. Kyle's beard owns you. Kyle's shoulder pad owns you.

 

So there.

 

Blah Lucas.

[Guest Jolts]

only thing kyles owns is a George Michaels lookalike contest. Brothers perhaps?

 

http://www.jeffdolen.com/Look%20Alikes/Cameron%201.jpg

 

yeah hard looks and 5 o'clock shadows are real cool.

[Spider AL]

I wonder if the original cuts of SW still exist, even. It'd be just like Lucas to burn them in the eternal flame he keeps lit on his altar to cash money in his basement or something.

 

So much was superior about the original cuts. Was it me, or was the Rancor a better special effect in the original cut? Darker, less backdropping?

 

Jolts: Kyle's is a full, MANLY beard, like mountain men from... the mountains... grow. Deliverance notwithstanding. Kyle's beard could win a fight against your father.

 

If Kyle's beard can win a fight against your father, it can win a fight against you and therefore is >= you. If Kyle's BEARD >= you, Kyle's whole being is > you. Ergo, Kyle pwns you, or any member of your immediate family.

 

Okay,.. oh my lord, I've gone insane. Hlep me. Hlep me plaees.

 

[DeTRiTiC-iQ]

here, let me remove that staple.

[Spider AL]

here, let me remove that staple.

Drop the staple remover and back away slowly, cully. Nobody points any object at me that's sharper than an earthworm.

 

Hmm, Devastation demo should be out now, bbl...

[Solo4114]

He can go right ahead and destroy 'em. You KNOW there are people out there with copies in good condition, and I've got a DVD version of the original trilogy non-SE'd from Hong Kong. Visual quality isn't quite as good as something official, but if I can splice the greedo scene out of existence, I'll do it. Honestly, I liked the SE's new stuff, though Jabba in ANH just looked WRONG, as do many organic creatures when you CG 'em. I'm sorry, but I actually prefer Ray Harryhousen (sp?) stop-motion photography and maquettes to CGI a lot of the time. For some reason, they actually look more real to me. Probably because they're real physical objects.

 

Anyway, I'd keep a fair amount of the SE's new stuff, and would simply edit the Greedo scene out. Most of the rest of it was ok, from what I can remember. I wouldn't put it past him to release a v3.0, though. At the very least, Jabba needs some fixin' BIGTIME. I don't get why he'd destroy the originals, though. To me, at the very least, they'd be worth having for history's sake. To see how far the technology had come.

[Kurgan]

The game hasn't died, just some people decided to quit playing and start whining.

 

Honest. Despite my great love for our site and forums, we represent a tiny fraction of the total JK2 community, and we should never assume that what we do is the norm.

 

Really.

 

Just think of all the people who play the game on different timezones than you, or that play on "The Zone" or who play on other unlisted servers, or who play different versions of the game (1.04 won't show you 1.03 or 1.02 servers for example).

 

People were already announcing the "death" of this game a month after its release. I say LET THEM GO.

 

If they want to leave, fine... don't let the door hit you on the way out!

 

JK2 is the most advanced Star Wars game out, period. Galaxies may be more complex with its RPG manner (when it comes out), but you won't find me playing it, since you have to pay every month, and you can't just sit down for some fast action straight up with lightsabers and force. So in that sense, JK2 will always have a place... and the mod community is just getting warmed up.

 

 

I'm not mad, I'm just sick of hearing how because so and so quit the game, we all have to quit and stop having fun, just because he's bored and endless whining about how the patch ruined everything etc etc.

 

So enjoy yourself and don't let these guys spoil your fun. Go make a mod or something useful...

 

/end rant

 

 

Exactly. As I've said before, Dark Forces is an experience in its own right, a hybrid of SW and EU and FPS. It's wonderful. If you made the game purely like the movies, you'd be ruining that dynamic. Another game is the place to do things like that.

 

I agree wholeheartedly.

[Prime]

Originally posted by Kurgan

JK2 is the most advanced Star Wars game out, period. Galaxies may be more complex with its RPG manner (when it comes out), but you won't find me playing it, since you have to pay every month, and you can't just sit down for some fast action straight up with lightsabers and force. So in that sense, JK2 will always have a place... and the mod community is just getting warmed up.

If I had a penny for every time a read someone saying, "when Galaxies comes out JO will be dead"...

 

I've seen some expectations that are really way off when it comes to Galaxies and KOTOR. For some reason, many people seem to believe that those games are going to be FPS-style saber combat and replace JO. KOTOR is going to be a point and click deal, and in Galaxies it will be a very difficult to become a Jedi in the first place. As far as Galaxies goes, people are expecting the world. I've said it before, but any game that relies on teenage l33t d00ds for SW immersion is a disaster waiting to happen. That's why JO is so great. I have SP for SW immersion and MP for hack and slashing fun. I hope Galaxies and KOTOR (can't wait for this one) are big successes though, because maybe then all those RPGers around here will go play those instead mucking around on JO servers...

 

Personally, I think JO fills its role in the SW gaming universe well.

[Kurgan]

When Doom3 comes out, SimsOnline will be dead.

 

 

You know, now that I think about it, the community is a mixed bag, and that's a mixed blessing.

 

At first I thought that the RPGers were the ones unhappy with the game and that they were the ones that were all leaving (and I said good riddance) and I hoped that Galaxies and KOTOR would draw them away.

 

Now I'm seeing that some people play the game ONLY because they use it to role play.

 

Then I thought maybe it was the hardcore "competative" gamers that were leaving, because the game was biased towards RPG players. Then I realized that some people play the game despite the complaints and frustration of RPG players.

 

So now my view is that many people like the game for many different reasons, and some people have stopped playing the game and moved on for many different reasons, and there's no real accounting for taste.

 

The good news is, if you still play the game, there's people to play with and people making mods to enjoy, so you can still have fun!

[razorace]

Originally posted by Prime

I've seen some expectations that are really way off when it comes to Galaxies and KOTOR. For some reason, many people seem to believe that those games are going to be FPS-style saber combat and replace JO. KOTOR is going to be a point and click deal, and in Galaxies it will be a very difficult to become a Jedi in the first place. As far as Galaxies goes, people are expecting the world. I've said it before, but any game that relies on teenage l33t d00ds for SW immersion is a disaster waiting to happen. That's why JO is so great. I have SP for SW immersion and MP for hack and slashing fun. I hope Galaxies and KOTOR (can't wait for this one) are big successes though, because maybe then all those RPGers around here will go play those instead mucking around on JO servers...

Exactly, a LOT of people are going to come back to JO once they realize how specialize KOTOR and SWG are.

[Break_dF]

Originally posted by Rumor

can i make complete sentences that are longer than three words?

 

Can you find your shift key? Obviously...

 

 

Hello again, friends.

[shock ~ unnamed]

Originally posted by Break_dF

Hello again, friends.

 

BAD SCARY MAN RUN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

wok1

[Prime]

Originally posted by Break_dF

Hello again, friends.

Well look who it is! Shall we assume that the trolling shall commense immediately?