Heavy Stance

[n0th1ng]

think it's too powerful or good balanced? feel free to comment

[Tree]

Overpowered.

 

just like light stance is way underpowered.

 

I'm gonna laugh when raven balances it in a patch.

[n0th1ng]

gotta agree with you on that one, drain+heavy stance = death for most ppl

[power_ed]

personally the one i hate the most is the

 

taunt/drain/grip/HeavystanceBlow/taunt/moreGrip/tryToCounterWithPush/Drain/deathFromAbove/tauntAgain/evenMoreGrip/getThrownIntoThePitAtNs_streets/Ysay:hahaYouSuck/ combo

 

(i know, it's time to go to bed Ed...)

[CheshireKat]

I'm going with way too powerful on this one...

 

I was on a FFA Saber only server today, and I kept seeing the same Heavy Blow over and over. People just look for a crowd and Wham!!!

 

Ridiculous!!!

 

It's a real bummer in duel too. After hitting someone 3 or 4 good ones with Med they give you one shot and it's over... What fun is that?

 

Tear.

[Juztyn]

Why is there no 'It's fine the way it is' option? :\

[Schizophrenic]

I don't get any of the stances. Blue = light damage, yellow = medium damage, red = heavy damage. Good lord, you're getting hit by a lightsaber. Even a slight caress can take off a limb. You know how when you turn on dismemberment in singleplayer, and if you accidentally tap that stormie on the head, his head flies off? That's how it should be like.

 

The three styles shouldn't have anything to do with the amount of damage you do, but with how powerful your attacks are (THERE IS A DIFFERENCE). A more powerful attack would have a good chance of breaking through weak defenses, but a good defense would be able to counter it. If somebody swings hard at you but you put up a weak block against it, it should knock your blade aside and cut you in two. Even if it was just one swing, it should take you down.

[Nax]

I would have to disagree with the conception that the lightsaber should be able to dismember with the slightest of effort. Contrary to the game engine, which lets the lightsaber drift gracefully through walls, the movies would tell us that, though the lightsaber could cut though metal, it would still take effort behind the swing. I do agree that the light stance should do more damage though.

 

In addition to that, I really think they need to allow certain things to interrupt attacks. I mean, currently, the only thing that's gonna stop an insta-death heavy overhead swing is either insta-death, or force push/pulling them to the ground. You should be able to stop or soften an attack by wounding, or something of the sort.

 

Nax

[Canis_Aureus]

The three stances are very well balanced IMO. What kind of poll is that anyway... there is no option for people who think the stances are fine as they are. The LAST thing I want to see is that you can take more hits with a lightsaber than you can now. ONE hit in heavy stance should kill you IMO! The blue stance isn't weak, if someone uses heavy stance there is a period after the attack is done when he's still vulnerable... you will be able to hit him a few times when using blue. Blue stance should NOT do more damage as that would mean these headless chicken morons would get lucky more often.

 

If you spin around in light stance like a headless chicken... no wonder people kill you with the heavy stance... There is nothing I enjoy more than ripping those morons apart... they really ruin the beauty of saber fights. If something needs to be fixed it would be:

- The spinning of the blue stance... looks so dumb

- The unblockable special of heavy stance (you should be able to block it)

 

Apart from that the stances are well balanced and I use all three depending on what stance my oponent uses. Most people I fight use only one all the time and THAT is their weakness.

 

Also the theory about the damage of a lightsaber might make sense, but this is a game and the most important thing is GAMEPLAY. The three stances offer different ways of attacking your opponent. When thinking in terms of gameplay a fast attack MUST be weaker than a slow attack!

 

If they changed the MP saber fighting to be the same as SP saber fighting we would have more control and the fights would be more fun and look better... that is the most important IMO.

 

Besides the blue stance is much better for defending against guns and saber throws, so every stance has it's strenghts and weaknesses.

 

If you are tired of getting killed by heavy stance fighters... change your tactics! I always use blue or yellow stance against the heavy stance.

 

The biggest problem people have is their inability to change their stance depending on circumstances.

 

I vote for:

x It is fine as it is, but tweak the blue spinning maniac move and the red unblockable hit... everything else is perfect!

 

And for the people who voted that the red stance is too slow... PLEASE get a grip... it is NOT too slow and making it faster will only allow you to actually succeed in your heavy stance whoring. Now it isn't a problem, but it would be if it was faster.

[MrCrusher]

Leave it as is, but add a Defensive-Couter-Stance to level three defense, here are some sugqestions in the feed back forum:

 

http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?

s=&threadid=41603

 

 

[D66]

Why is there no 'It's fine the way it is' option? :\

 

Because this is a game forum and tradition stipulates that one may NEVER be happy with what was released!

Look at the forums at http://www.tribalwar.com for an example

 

Empire and Phantom Menance both showed that a light saber needed some force behind it to cut (The Door on the Trade Fed Ship and Vader's shoulder) But Jedi has vader saber-tossing Through steel support struts to take down a catwalk.... so who is to say.

[Kippla]

the only way to make everyone happy with it, is if they made everyone have only one stance they could use, just a set few powers they could have, and set amount of skill points for all of them. That way everyone has exactly the same stuff to work with, and ppl would have admitt it was their lack of skill that caused them to lose.

 

But what fun is that? The fun thing is the differences people choose for their characters, and you, through skill and strategy being able to beat a good deal of them.

 

That being said, you can see a heavy swing a mile off. Even move in and roll out quick to make them swing, then move back in as they're left wide open. The only real problem with heavy stance is if you have lag and cant predict a safe distance from it.

 

- imo -

[Assault3000]

People the heavy stance is not even as powerful as secondary saber attack in the original Jedi Knight! There is no point to changing anything if you survived in JK you can survive in JK II.

[VaderJM]

I hate when people lobby to change something that any idiot could dodge.

 

The heavy unblockable can be seen a mile away, and unless you just sit there, blithering like an idiot, or running right into it, you can dodge it easily, with a couple steps back, a jump, or a roll.

 

Most of the time, it's luck that allows you to land it.

[DannyDiplo]

Personally I'd like to see it toned down a little, or at least made blockable or (my preference) have them move slower as well as swing slower. Having an unblockable one-hit-and-your-dead move does take away from the fun of the game. People always counter by saying, "Yeah, but it's slow"... Well, yeah the saber movement is slow but the person weilding it can still move as fast as someone in the light stance, which negates the slowness because they can just jump around performing that one move.

 

What I've seen all too often is dark-side, heavy-stance people who use drain, then pull you over then do that 'one' move. Using pull means you can't even get out of the way doing a roll most times. Basically you're fighting one of these characters you have to hit absorb the second the match starts to stand any chance, and if you're a fraction too slow there goes all your force mana. However, if you leave it on.... there goes all your force mana. Kinda detracts from the fun IMO.

[Broode]

The only problem I have with it is that is seems to kill me from across the room. I know, I'm on 56k, and I can accept lag, but I dont get that from any other stance. Does the heavy stance have more range? problems with the netcode? Dunno. I've heard talk of people getting hit by it after the blade has been swung (people on cable complaining), you know, like that Fyaar guy in SP - he can hit you with his claw ages after he swings it. Maybe a fix of this nature is in order.

 

The other thing that annoys me about heavy is the knockback - its the new batsaber. I could understand a meter or two knockback, just to give the impression that it's strong, but this thing pushes people back way too far. On no force servers on ns_streets, all everyone does is go down to that big plateau on one end of the map and swing at each other, trying to knock each other down the holes. IMO, that shouldnt be possible, unless their standing right next to it.

 

The other other thing that gets me about heavy is the animations - they don't look powerful, they just look slow! Maybe if it looked like he put a little force behind it or something.

 

And to those complaining of being killed in one hit - thats what its supposed to do. Host a multiplayer game and, with a stopwatch, measure the time it takes between slashes on medium and heavy - and then compare the damage, its quite fair. In fact, heavy is easily dealt with:

 

 

-Broode's Assorted Guide to Dealing with Heavy-

===================================

 

The way to avoid heavy is to be manouverable. Use medium or light stance, and look for features in your environment to help you - nearby walls, cliffs, cover etc. Try and roll backwards when they take their swing, then roll straight back up to them (or past them - hehe) and take a few swings. Giving them a kick to the face is a great way to stop them hitting you, and it gives you a free swing. And always remember - saber throw is your friend. Get out of their range while they swing and cut them up. It may not seem to do enough damage, but its good to whittle them down to a level that you can kill them in one or two shots. If you go straight up to their face swinging, don't complain if you get killed.

 

If you see people are draining you, drain them first or use absorb. If they start to use that "death from above" manouver, GET OUT OF THE WAY! You shouldnt be directly in front of them anyway. A great way to deal with it is to push them in the air - especially off a cliff. Taling about cliffs, if they are using heavy near a long drop, run away or push them over, don't try to engage them one on one near an edge.

 

Thats about it. If you use this information to your advantage, you will never have problems with heavies again (unless they use it in a big saber melee, but you should be doing that too).

[Desslock]

No one likes anything they lose to. I believe heavy is balanced. If you allow yourself a moment to get hit by it, then thats your problem, not mine for using a deep game element and playing on my personal preferences.

 

Of course it is funny to see a guy waste time trying to hit someone with heavy when all they have to do is hit them once, switch to medium or light stance to finish them off. I can wager about 7 fights I've seen where the defender had 25 health and the attacker had 100/25 and still using heavy, and the attacker lost because the defender got some lucky hits in.

[thrEEpaGe]

exactly...they take sooo long to do, and although strong stance (ITS NOT HEAVY) heh..is very strong (and aptly named, i might add), it is balanced with its speed...with light you can get in tons of hits and try to dodge theirs much more quickly (in NF, i never use strong because i can get in and get out while they are trying to even touch me...)...i think, however, that medium is balanced (it shouldnt be, because this time, moderation sucks; being a jack of all trades in saber speed and power isnt good IMO in most situations....in a situation where it would take 1 medium hit to kill and 2 light hits, i would go with medium...otherwise, i would stick with light...

 

but btw, can we all remember back to JK's sabers?????

everybody used the same swing....nearly the entire game....heh...boring...

 

 

lets not complain about JO =)

[Lnt. Kechtt]

This is nothing new to me. I've seen at least three threads on this very topic. Oh!, Canis_Aureus, ditto to every thing you said. I just want to point out that on the poll that I don't think that the speed one is about needing to tweak it up. I don't like heavy because it's too slow, so I don't use it often. Anyway, I thought I'ld get two bits in and then bug out of the topic. The stances are balanced. If you don't know how to use them, then don't use them. What's the point of complaining? Complaining doesn't do anything for you other then get people mad at you for it. As the old saying goes, "Don't get mad, get even ":evil1: If you're haveing a problem with strong stance, start a server and get a couple of bots and try fighting them with just strong stance. That way you'll get to learn how to use it incase you want/need to, and you'll have an idea on when people are exposed when they use it. Come-on people. Let's get out of the complaint forums and into the game more. I know I don't make many friends with these posts (I've got a couple) but from one that's only a "so-so" player: Stuff happens, deal with it! Get better and beat them later. O.k. I'm done.

[Econ]

Originally posted by Canis_Aureus

I vote for:

x It is fine as it is, but tweak the blue spinning maniac move and the red unblockable hit... everything else is perfect!

 

 

 

What do you mean by Tweaking the maniac move?

I use the Blue stance and I see alot of people just spinning around like tops.. Their fighting styles are careless and its leaves them open which then they are easily killed.

[Pain]

I don't have any problem with it the way it is.

[Tree]

Originally posted by DannyDiplo

Personally I'd like to see it toned down a little, or at least made blockable or (my preference) have them move slower as well as swing slower. Having an unblockable one-hit-and-your-dead move does take away from the fun of the game. People always counter by saying, "Yeah, but it's slow"... Well, yeah the saber movement is slow but the person weilding it can still move as fast as someone in the light stance, which negates the slowness because they can just jump around performing that one move.

 

What I've seen all too often is dark-side, heavy-stance people who use drain, then pull you over then do that 'one' move. Using pull means you can't even get out of the way doing a roll most times. Basically you're fighting one of these characters you have to hit absorb the second the match starts to stand any chance, and if you're a fraction too slow there goes all your force mana. However, if you leave it on.... there goes all your force mana. Kinda detracts from the fun IMO.

 

This line is very true.

 

"Yeah, but it's slow"... Well, yeah the saber movement is slow but the person weilding it can still move as fast as someone in the light stance, which negates the slowness because they can just jump around performing that one move.

 

I see all these n00b tips on how to get in on them after they swing. Which are all BS since they can jump/roll and move the same speed you do, after they swing. The swing keeps you at bay due to the extreme range of strong stance. Sounds like a lot of these people haven't played multi-player much. That or they use strong-stance themselves and would hate to see it taken away.

 

I've been playing since day one and I haven't seen anyone using a light/medium stance who OWNS strong stance ppl. Please give me the IP of this magical server where it happens. On similar threads ppl brag about owning strong stance ppl. I ask for the IP they normally play at and I don't get it. Can't say I'm suprised.

 

If your playing on servers with FF then it is easier to deal with them using saber-throw. But usually though these strong-whores are drain whores also. Gee what a shock.

 

At the very least they need to tone down the one-hit one kill gayness. On NF server there is no way to combat someone who jumps around doing it over and over.

 

If you think light stance is balanced, well your a moron. People who use light stance agains a medium/strong get absolutely slaughtered. I have NEVER seen anyone own with a light stance. In fact I can't ever remember getting killed by someone using it in a duel. No one does.

 

That imbalance directly relates to the strong imbalance. The weaker the stance the less range and power you have. This is supposed to be balanced by attack speed, which as I covered before is a joke. If you get beaten by someone in light stance often, quit and never pick up the game again.

 

I wouldn't worry about it I'm sure RAVEN plays games on-line. I'm sure they have seen what I've seen and it will be fixed in a patch.

[Econ]

Originally posted by Tree

 

 

If you think light stance is balanced, well your a moron. People who use light stance agains a medium/strong get absolutely slaughtered. I have NEVER seen anyone own with a light stance. In fact I can't ever remember getting killed by someone using it in a duel. No one does.

 

 

Why dont you elabrorate on what part of the Light Stance is imbalanced. I use the Light stance so does that make me a "moron"?

 

I am able to stand Toe-to-Toe with MANY good saberists who use Med and Heavy stances and we have really good duels and guess what stance im using.. Light..

 

I have never gotten "Slaughtered" repeatedly, but I have lost and I have also won many battle and I am a Lightside force user. Its all in how you play the game.

 

[Tree]

I did elaborate. Read the next paragraph.

 

I said you are a moron if you think they are balanced. If my opinion really effects you then, yes. You are a moron if you think the light stance is balanced. Especially in NF duels.

 

If you are beating people with light stance they are not good.

 

Please post the IP of a server where you play often. I would like to see this for myself. Or the name that you play under and I will look for you when I play.

[Silent Wolf]

Tree,

you need to simmer down or take a cold shower you come off like a big dick.

 

Anyways,

I havent had a problem with heavy users. I prefer medium but i change my style frequently between heavy and the ocasisnaly fast attack to finish someone off. There are a lot of saber styles that ive seen, and a lot of ways to get around each and everyones saber style. I suggest that instead of complaining about it, just find a way around it. It will make you a better player, and perhaps ....just perhaps in real life you might be one less complainer is this whiny world.