sir_Latin Posted April 17, 2002 Share Posted April 17, 2002 A thing I don't like much about the Jedi Knight storyline, is that it doesn't fit with the Star Wars universe. With that I mean with the movies & expanded universe. With the "real" storyline Or am I wrong? Anyways, in Jedi Outcast. When Kyle rescues Jan, she said they interrogate her about the Jedi Academy. Why would they do that? Wouldn't Desann know much more than her of the Jedi Academy? After all, Desann was a student there. This was a bit wierd, anyways, I might have missed something sir Latin [Edit - Stormy - spoiler tags engaged. ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'akt Sangwar Posted April 17, 2002 Share Posted April 17, 2002 u shud say this contains spoilers, for those who didnt know... jan survived or that dessan was a student [Edit - Stormy - spoiler tags engaged. ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D'akt Sangwar Posted April 17, 2002 Share Posted April 17, 2002 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted April 17, 2002 Share Posted April 17, 2002 Welcome to the forums. The original Dark Forces game tied in very well with the Classic trilogy, in that Kyle Katarn was the one responsible for infiltrating the secret Imperial base to steal the plans to the first Deathstar. Later on in the same game, he rescues Crix Madine from a Detention Centre. Kyle also receives his initial briefing from Mon Mothma, and Vader makes an appearance to check up on the Dark Trooper project. Jabba the Hutt has Kyle captured at one point as well, so it feels more enmeshed with the events going on in the films. Dark Forces II: Jedi Knight takes place after the events in Return Of The Jedi...and focuses on Kyle's personal quest to avenge his father, so it doesn't tie into the movies. The fact that 7 Dark Jedi were waiting in the wings to enter centre-stage after the events in ROTJ also jarred a little, IMO. Mysteries Of The Sith - the expansion pack for Jedi Knight, featured Mara Jade...but there are still questions as to why she was with Kyle at that time...and the plot as such was a bit shallow, IMO. But then, it was only an expansion pack, not a full game. MotS takes place just before the Jedi Academy trilogy. So in those terms, Jedi Outcast ties in a bit better with the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_Latin Posted April 17, 2002 Author Share Posted April 17, 2002 sorry for the spiler thing btw.. I didn't think... newbie to this forum as you see Anyways, IMO the storyline doesn't fit with the EU. The valley of the Jedi. Howcome it's never mentioned in the books? (I haven't read all) The valley would be in great danger in the New Jedi Order series (NJO). If Luke is supposed to know, or other Jedis, maybe they'd use it to defeat the Yuzaan Vhong, or at least protect it with everything they have. Anyways, Luke would probably never use it, but the valley, IMO would play a part in the EU if it is so important as the JK games imply. I'm not saying that the JK series storyline is bad, only that it doesn't fit with the EU. Anyway, problem is. That if the books EU included the JK series storyline, JK series storyline wouldn't be so cool, cause then all the fans would have read it before the game came, and know what happens And that would suck! But for making it fit with the EU, some books should've said something. My spoiler question hasn't been answered btw I also want to know ppl oppinion on this. Does the EU (Expanded Universe) fit with the movies? why? why not? sir Latin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kataarn Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Well, here's my opinion. Only 3 people know the co-ordinates of the Valley of the Jedi currently, those three people being Kyle, Jan, and Luke. Luke would never use the power of the Valley, everybody knows that. Out of the remaining two, Kyle is the only one that would use the Valley, and he, of course, isn't about to. This answers the question of why they don't use it. As to the introduction of it in the first place...I believe Kyle was searching for info on why his father died, and RT88 decided to be a jerk. Why was Jerec just waiting? Who knows, maybe he had to assemble his posse first, maybe events just took that long to unfold...but more likely, they knew they couldn't challenge Vader & Palpatine together, so they had to wait until they were gone. My two cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Wasn't the Valley of the Jedi the place where Darth Bane's army of Sith Lords destroyed themselves? As for does the EU fit with the movies... no. Not even close. Luke and Leia's mother is found in one of the EU books; she's not Amidala. Owen Lars was Obi-Wan's brother in the EU, not so in the prequels. The Stormtroopers are just people drafted into the Imperial army in the EU, not so, as Episode II will show. The whole way of training Jedi is screwed up and the Force is so weak in some places, it's not even funny (Children of the Jedi). Some SW books are partially canon; Zahn's original Trilogy and Shadows of the Empire. Lucas had involvement in them. But some of the details are off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vestril Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Luke and Leia's mother is found in one of the EU books; she's not Amidala. Actually they didn't find Luke's mom, he thought he did but she was lying. Just thought I'd throw that in.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acdcfanbill Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 actually, she admits to lying, and says she just used luke... thats the black fleet crises... my, erm, least favorite of teh books i have read... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JK_Wakefield Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 NO NO the stormtroopers in Ep. 2 are completely different from the ones in the trilogy. In the Heir to the Empire series Thrawn found a mountain full of cloning tanks but not enough to create the amount of retarded stormtroopers that you see in the trilogy. And if he did clone the stormtroopers in the trilogy why weren't they all a bunch of vaders runnin around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 We don't know that the Stormtroopers in the Original Trilogy were not clones, as far as the canon of the movies go. What we do know is Palpatine has the Kaminoans make him an army of clonetroopers (clones of Jango Fett) to "defend the interests of the Republic from the threat of the Separatists". These Clonetroopers were created in massive numbers, and are dressed in armor that's half-way between the present-day Stormtroopers and Jango's Mandalorian armor. There are clues that might point to the Stormtroopers being Clones in the original trilogy, though. Han wouldn't speak to the Imperial com-man who asked "TK421, why aren't you at your post?". Luke and Han also don't speak to the officer who tries to get into the turbolift with them, merely gesturing to Chewbacca. Leia asks Luke, "Aren't you a little short for a Stormtrooper?" indicating, at least, that Troopers are all roughly the same size. And all Stormtroopers have the same voice. Yes, there are ways to mask someone's real voice. Leia used one of these devices when she infiltrated Jabba's palace. However, we can be fairly certain that this is not the case with Stormtroopers, as when Luke and Han DO talk with the helmets on, their voices remain the same as always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPY_jmr1 Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 i'd like to throw something into the fray: re : stormtroopers. the books show that stormies are recruted(sp?) army style, but the movie will show that they are clones but why cant you have both? i mean the more the better right? every guy that comes in off the street is one less to clone right? the short for a stormtrooper comment might just mean that the imp army will only take people of a certen size/stranth(sp?) I am sure that i will think of somemore later. comments? edit: as when Luke and Han DO talk with the helmets on, their voices remain the same as always. idea: when the armor is *ahem* procured, i know you hear baster fire, but the armor shows no damage in later scenes. therefore the stormies were killed/disabled some other way. blunt force to the head come to mind.(blater stun does not efect stormtooper armor(think this is what it's for, low power/stun shots)) however the armor is also designed for anti bluntforce attack(however..... ewoks..... hmm.... naw will take to long ) any hit hard enuf to knock out a stormie, will also damage/destroy any device built into the helmet. thats maybe why luke and han never use the helmet comlink. any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_Latin Posted April 18, 2002 Author Share Posted April 18, 2002 Anyways, what I wonder: Why did Desann interrogate Jan Ors about the Jedi Academy? Wouldn't Desann know more about it, he actually was a STUDENT. At least that's what Jan says when Kyle saves her, they dropped the Valley of the Jedi subject, cause obviously Kyle led Desann there. Then she says they asked her about the Jedi Academy... I think that's pretty dumb, considering Desann was a student at the Academy Did I miss something in the storyline? About the Stormtroopers being clones in the movies. I don't think it indicates that. That they are roughly the same size, doesn't mean much, they probably have to be of some height to enter the academy at Carida. As for the voices, maybe they thought one voice was enough when they made the movies Stuff about movies being canon, the EU and the JK 1-2 storylines.. I found out there's thread in another forum here "The Valley of the Jedi" Where there is a huge discussion about it sir Latin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 You also shouldn't forget about the Imperial Academy, where they train people in Imperial ways. Luke wanted to go there, initially...until he found out about Biggs Darklighter, his friend, leaving that place behind to join the Rebellion. Why have an Academy unless you're training people to serve in the Imperial army, or what-have-you? Of course, it could have been simply an Officer's academy...but I would imagine it would also be training people who want to become Stormtroopers. And wasn't Han supposed to be an ex-Imperial? Kyle's an ex-Stormtrooper, BTW - not that this really counts, because it's still EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_Latin Posted April 18, 2002 Author Share Posted April 18, 2002 Why have an academy at Carida if everyone are clones? Kyp Durrons brother was in Carida, so the imperials go and get young boys, and make some join by force, like Kyp's brother Anyways, can someone answer my spoiler queston? sir Latin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted April 18, 2002 Share Posted April 18, 2002 Carida is from the books, not the movies, and I'm arguing that the books are wrong so I will accept no evidence like that from the books. Yes, we saw a lot of Imperial Stormtroopers get the tar beat out of them on Endor. And all of their screams still sound the same, and the same goes for when the troopers are shot. Looks like it'd be fairly tough to destroy the voice-adapter. Also, if there was an attack on the head, there'd be a hole in the helmet or a very big dent. Furthermore, the Imperial Academy appears to mean the NAVAL academy. Biggs Darklighter went into the Imperial Navy, Luke wanted to be a pilot and Han was a TIE-pilot before he defected. The Stormtroopers are cannonfodder, the TIE pilots are operating heavy and expensive machinery, so maybe they wouldn't trust clones to do that job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_Latin Posted April 19, 2002 Author Share Posted April 19, 2002 Where in the movies does it say Han Solo was a former TIE pilot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi_Monk Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 Where in the movies does it say Han Solo was a former TIE pilot? It doesn't. But then, there's nothing in the movies that even indicates that he was in the Empire. So, either way works for my argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sir_Latin Posted April 19, 2002 Author Share Posted April 19, 2002 exactly my point. It seems to me you got that from the books, which you say are wrong anyway... Ofcourse, I might be wrong... it's kinda late here in Norway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DashRendar1 Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 MAYBE A SPOILER Hmmm, if Kyle stole the Death Star Plans, than what was the point of the mission to Toprawa to get the plans!? It is mentioned in Rebel Dawn that Bria Tharen, Han Solo's ex girlfriend, led a diverting action on Toprawa to allow the Death Star Plans reach the Tantive IV. Am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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