BlackDove Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Ok, this has been around on another forum that I visit for some time now (ok *cough* about 2 or more weeks *cough), and I was too lazy to transfer it here, but ok, here it goes. The quote from the personal e-mail was quoted by the person writing the e-mail, in which there were no copyright violations that have been presented if the given e-mail was quoted on a forum, or in public. The forum is not private, and everyone has a direct access to it upon acquiring membership which is free, prooving that the content is viewable by everyone. The quoted material has been somewhat cut from the parts that are not relavant to the subject by the poster however there was no alteration from the original thought of the message. Also all personal information such as e-mail adresses of the original poster of the message and the official at Raven, have been removed by the poster of this message, ie ME Originally posted by Aiee: On the behalf of myself and a couple of danish friends, I sent an email to Mike gummelt, who is one of the two lead programmers at Raven. In my email, I mentioned several of the things me and my friends have found slightly imbalanced, as well as suggestions as to how to fix it. I just received a reply, and from the look of it, the days of people running backwards into fights in the hope of scoring a quick kill with the backstab are nearing an end. Quoting the mail: Subject: RE: Patch 1.03 feedback and 1.04 suggestions Date sent: Fri, 10 May 2002 10:57:40 -0500 I was prepared for yet another ranting, raving, offensive and childish e-mail from panicky, impatient 12 year olds, but I was very pleasantly surprised by your e-mail. It was calm, logical, rational and well-thought out. These are very good suggestions (I definitely want to fix the backstabs, I thought they had been fixed, but apparently the other programmer never got around to it, and I like the idea of more ammo per pickup and/or faster respawns... and I've always been in favor of moving slower when running backwards) and I have written them down on my list for a second patch (if we do one). Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FEAR_IS_MY_ALLY Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Cool. Thanks for the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackDove Posted May 28, 2002 Author Share Posted May 28, 2002 Basically.....THERE IS A LIST!!!..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackDove Posted May 28, 2002 Author Share Posted May 28, 2002 Originally posted by FEAR_IS_MY_ALLY Cool. Thanks for the info. Bah you beat me to it, I didn't think anyone was gonna post that soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Wind Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 aaaaahhhhhhhhhhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!! im done. i have little hope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Wind Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 i need to have a long chat with some of my peers and send a letter soon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Begger Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Then by the looks of it 1.04 is going to destroy JK2 more...so now they're nerfing backstab...great... next they' nerf the medium overhead finisher... next they'll nerf heavy... next they'll nerf medium... next they'll nerf light.... next you'll have my mod...(read my mod suggestion if ya dont' know what i'm talkin about ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maartenl Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 hey Nathan that's funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Truthful Liar Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Go Sweden! Thanks for the info Good or Bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Wind Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 yeah, i know. looking back it reads like a bad afterschool special about writting to one's congressman. still, it wasnt meant to be funny. i find this far from humerous Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
da_rat Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 I definitely want to fix the backstabs, I thought they had been fixed, but apparently the other programmer never got around to it From this quote alone it might mean that your gonna have to wait awhile since theyère jacking off and dont know whos doing what Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krash Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 I disagree with just about every suggestion for 1.04 that you made.... Instead of faster respawns... just kill yourself as your falling. More ammo per pickup will just make everyone spam again like they did in 1.02 instead of actually having to aim like you do now. Moving slower when running backwards? That means everyones sensativity would have to be a billion so you can always walk forward. I hope that 1.04 doesn't gay the game because of that e-mail... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Begger Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 a team Valar here? hmmm...I believe on the TWL forums that most of you dislike the new ammo restrictions.... and as for running backwards slower..it is quite a stupid option..they just keep catering to those who cannot handle the game, instead of those with real insight to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegis Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Originally posted by Krash I disagree with just about every suggestion for 1.04 that you made.... Instead of faster respawns... just kill yourself as your falling. More ammo per pickup will just make everyone spam again like they did in 1.02 instead of actually having to aim like you do now. Moving slower when running backwards? That means everyones sensativity would have to be a billion so you can always walk forward. I hope that 1.04 doesn't gay the game because of that e-mail... He was talking about the weapon dumps respawning faster. Also, with increased ammo being given per dump, that wouldn't remove the need to aim, or bring spamming back, it would just make it so players don't have to rely only on fire modes that a jedi can reflect back with ease. Also, do me a favour. Run backwards, and tell me you move as fast as when you run forwards. If you can, well then I guess the current situation is fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Godammit you people are brickheads! No one is going to change your opinion on anything, since you're all so stubborn. Go back to your cave of grumpiness. The comment about "We have insight. You have NOT" just tells us about how you cannot adapt, and is a silly excuse for slamming a very good idea. And don't give me any elitist crap, this forum is so newbie-hating that it hurts my head to read it. Moving slower while *running* backwards IS a very good change to an already good game IMHO. How would it destroy the game? People wouldn't run like chickens from saber fights, and "saberists" would actually catch up with those people who ran from them. It would be closer to realisty without sacrificing gameplay. I can't count the games that get this thing wrong. You guys want a bad change? Make the blocking system like 1.02. "Now we can have the pathetic jousting fights like in jk1, and it would be all fun 'n stuff!". In this order, these are the changes i'd like to see: 1) First of all fix backstab ASAP. I dont care how, make it blockable, unturnable, remove the move altogether or whatever. Fix it, it was never meant to be like this, according to that developer letter. 2) Backtracking should also be fixed ASAP, IMHO. 3) Make it so you could actually lose your saber when throwing it, *completely* like single player. 4) up the damage on the lightsabers a tiny weeny bit. They're not lethal enough, and without backstab, fights can drag on endlessly. 5) Adopt the push/pulling of items from single player. Raven has already shown us that it could be done, there's really no reason not to do it IMO. 6) Implement the idea of manual blocking, though automatic blocking can happen if your guard is not up, but it will cost you force. This idea is commented in the feedback forum. That is all for now, please comment and tell me what i get wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferox Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 heh, you guys are argueing about the new patch.. but you missed one sentance he said (if we do one) that might of been the last patch . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C'jais Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 True. Didn't actually see that, but i'm sure they will make another patch. This community is so hostile that they must be getting death threats on a daily basis, and someday they will give in to all the people sending mails for improvement (and improvement IS needed!)... Really, i think they'll make another patch... Well, i'm quite sure anyway.... Raven, don't give up on us guys!!! I'll ******* kill you if you dont, you ******* **** *****!!!!!! (The last part was a sarcastic parody, for the slow of mind.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackDove Posted May 28, 2002 Author Share Posted May 28, 2002 Uhm, at least they have a list... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathan Wind Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 ugh, and quite a list at that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Begger Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Hmm...quite amusing there, your nice long message of what YOU want to see...you are exactly right though, everything is in YOUR opinion. Exactly why does backstab need fixing? Is it that you cannot handle it, so you want Raven to fix it for you? ahh I see... And as for blocking, blocking is good in 1.03, but damage is bad, it should be raised ...to the point of 1.02. Battles will be longer, less hits will be accounted for, but there still is that sense of danger when approaching an enemy. oh and I see, you have real insight, so YOU know what is a bad change and what is a good change and WE do not..okay, if you say so. As for the rest of your suggestions they are valid and I agree with them. One thing is certain though, I have adapted to the changes, but what I am angry about is how the people who complained about DFA/heavy stance in 1.02, are back again to complain about backstab. there is no satisfying them, yet Raven continues to attempt to. Oh, and have we changed your opinion? If we are stubborn, than so are you. I have not seen you change your opinion about liking 1.03, why? because YOU think there was no good reason to change your opinion. Well we are on the same boat, because I have not had one good reason to change my opinion on the patch or on JK2. Therefore if we are brickheads, so are you. THank you, have a good day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agen Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Then by the looks of it 1.04 is going to destroy JK2 more...so now they're nerfing backstab...great... Er.... yes, that is great actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackDove Posted May 28, 2002 Author Share Posted May 28, 2002 No more idiot people trying to backstab...can't wait till that happenes. Not because I can't handle it. I am one of the worst backstabbers there are, however it's really not fair to the people who can't do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Begger Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 well, then let's just all make it fair to the people who can't do it.. heavy stance - Can't use it well? awww... let's take it out for those who can't! Medium over head finisher - some people diefrom it? aww..let's take that out too.. Medium stance? - since heavy is gone and this is the strongest awww, new players can't use it well..that's gone too... ...well you got my point... If we constantly take out things in order to make it 'fair' for those who cannot do the moves or cannot counter it (but there is a counter), a new 'move' will appear that will have an advantage over others and that will be abused and taken out....Raven started with putting out a platter of a variety of different moves...and one by one...because some people cannot do them or cannot handle them...they are being taken away. There is no end, so why not keep variety in the game and not take this any further? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Begger Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 Oh hey Cjais, you said this yourself, how long did you play 1.02? how long? ohh yeah...3-4 days..I see. So you're making assumptions on it for your 3-4 days of play? I see..I played 1.02 for how long? 2 months....and we ahve both been playing 1.03 for how long? 2-3 weeks...hmmm...so I see..this is what I mean when I say insight...do you know anything in detail about 1.02? no. how can you make comments on it? I've played 1.02, and 1.03, and can play them both. I dislike 1.03, but have adapted and still play it, just not with as much passion as I had for 1.02. When you commented on why we have more insight, you just answered yoru own question on another thread. We have somethign to compare it to, while all you have to compare to 1.03 is the outer shell of 1.02. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SithMaster2003 Posted May 28, 2002 Share Posted May 28, 2002 I honestly find this subject rather funny. Let's see, not long after the game came out, we had people complaining about the DFA move and that grip and lightening were too powerful (and a long list of other stuff). So, what did Raven do? They made a patch that nerfed grip and lightening and basically eliminated DFA's lethalness. Just what everybody wanted (well, almost everybody). OK. So, here we sit again complaining about light stance backstab and that grip was nerfed too much (and another long list). Anyone see a pattern forming here??? Seems like no matter what, people are gonna nitpick the hell out of this game until it is customized individually for each person. So you all really think backstab is that big of a problem??? Whatever floats your LITTLE boat. IMHO, I think they ought to send DFA and backstab back to v1.02. Why? Because, even though people spammed the hell out of them then, they were still beatable. The only big gripe I had about DFA was the damage radius (i know, there is another word for it). If you were dueling with someone using DFA in v1.02, and you were standing behind him, then you ended up paying for it. THAT's why it was spammed. Now we have @$$-fighters who run backwards trying to do backstab. And if Raven nerfs that, then someone will find another move to spam. And the cycle will keep on going. Leave the moves alone, the idiots that spam them are beatable, you just have to know how. Let them spam the hell out of the move, there is always a counter move/force. In v1.02 I could easily beat DFA spammers with a little practice. With a little more practice I have found ways to beat backstab spammers. So, instead of patching it everytime someone whines, just let them spam until they learn better. BTW, has anyone else noticed some people spamming heavy stance backsweep (or medium, whichever one it is)? My one friend likes to spam it every now and then, and usually racks up the kills from it. If there are 2 or 3 people behind him, they all die. Oh well. Now go back to your b!tch!n'! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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