Most Powerful Jedi

[Bungalow]

If you go and watch the movie again, you'll see that Dooku does take swipes at Yoda, as Yoda jumps along bulges on the walls, swipes that damn near hit him.

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Oh for the love of...

 

Bungalow, how many people have to tell you how many times, DOOKU WAS NOT WINNING.

 

It's even been proven to you, by the pictures posted here of Dooku HAVING to fight Yoda with TWO SABERS

 

Period. No more. End of story (or saga, if you keep this up).

 

Give it up. Dooku did.

 

So long. Farewell. Bye bye...

 

[CagedCrado]

Just because you get cut in half or whatever dosent mean you lose midichlorians, because the count is per cell, not for your body. Also i am pretty sure that lukes count wouldve been much higher if he were not a twin, and if you look at the eu it dosent necasarily matter about the midichlorian count of the parents because anakin solo is far more powerful then his mom, and even luke midichlorian wise he is probably as strong as yoda. Midichlorian counts dont really matter though, what matters is training. The more training a jedi has, the more powerful the jedi is. My theory of being twins is proven by the fallowing:

Jacen and jaina solo are not nearly as powerful as their brother anakin, who is much like his grandfather anakin skywalker, good with machinery, very powerful with the force. He might even come close to anakin skywalker, because when he was four years old and had almost no training he could use the force rather well, and by the time he was 16 he was almost a jedi master. It dosent matter though because he dies. Im going to revise your list though because i dont think it is correct:

 

1.Yoda

2.Palpatine/Sidious

3.Luke Skywalker

4.Darth Vader/Anakin Skywalker

5.Obi-Wan Kenobi (aka Ben Kenobi)

6.Mace Windu

7.Count Dooku/Darth Tyronous

8.Qui-Gon Jinn

9.Darth Maul

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End of the list is filled with jedi killed by mandalorians, blaster wounds, and wookies.

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Also this list is by ability, not midichlorian count, which if i put them in order that way id list thim like this:

1.Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader (yes i think they have the same as i stated above and atleast 3 other times)

2.Yoda

3. Anakin Solo

4.Luke Skywalker; Leia Organa Solo

(they have the same count)

5.Jacen; Jaina Solo

6.Mace Windu

7.Count Dooku

8.Obi Wan Kenobi

9.Qui Gon Jinn

10.Darth Maul

 

You may think i just dont like Darth Maul, but he is really not that skilled as a jedi and definetly only uses the force for simple things.

 

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This List is by jk2 jedi ranks

Jedi Masters:

Yoda

Sidious

Vader (this one is arguable, but i think he probably is)

Qui Gon (I stated above that he is less powerful then Dooku and obi wan yet he is a master and the others are knights, this is because he is officially a jedi master, i think yoda gives him the title after he is deceased)

Mace Windu

Luke Skywalker

Jedi Knight:

Tyronous(yes its true, he really isnt that good)

Obi Wan

Jedi:

Darth Maul

 

Oh and bungalow:

DOOKU DIDNT HAVE A CHANCE, DIDNT GET CLOSE TO A SMALL HIT

[BlackDove]

Thank you for impaling those messages...I really don't see them when they are in a 12 normal size...

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Well, I see the point you're making, CagedCrado, but I still say that if you're going to ask the question "Who is the most powerful Jedi, you would have to go strictly by medichlorian count. But if you ask the question "Who is the most skilled Jedi" I would have to agree with most of your list (I just don't know enough about Anakin Solo and the other EU kids to place them).

[CagedCrado]

Knowledge is power, that means that some shmuck that lives in the outerrim could be the most powerful jedi and wed never know.

 

Also what do you think on what i said about midichlorian counts being per cell?

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Well, you are correct, medichlorian count would be in parts per cell, not entire count; but think about what happens to vader. He's going to probably lose A LOT of blood, and then be hardwired into machines to sustain him. That's a lot of trauma to the human body. It would probably be impossible for all the cells that are lost (medichlorian cells) to be regenerated.

 

Yes, knowledge is used to the end of power, but when speaking of Jedi being powerful, you're speaking of how strong they are with the force.

[CagedCrado]

Midichlorians are a way to judge your power from a certain point of view, midichlorians are your potential for power, ability is how well you utilize it. On your scale of power anakin and vader have equal power because his midichlorian count is the same. Here are my factors of power, and in this order:

Ability

Stanima

Power Potential

This is the jist of it, but in between the dots explains how i got the totals, i know it is too long to read really.

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Ability=years studying the force, force type of use, and power potential, also to an extent stamina

 

Stanima=ability x size (in living flesh, so if vader in armor ways 500 pounds, it is not all force using) [human average for male is 160-200 depending on height, female is 90-125 depending on height] {yodas are 1/3 human weight}

 

Power Potential is in midichlorian count, another factor is life span.

I figure that a typical human is the star wars universe should live to around 100, most likely more as long as they have proper health care, yodas live to be around 1000.

(from day of birth)

Actual:

So you take midichlorian count, and turn it into a number between 1 and 30 (27 being anakin if you calculations are correct etc) and multiply it by how long they have studied the force, for vader it would be from age 9 to age 46, when he died. He studied the force for half a human life expectancy, so 27x.5=13.5

yoda would recieve almost 9 life expectancies because of his species, so yoda is 17x8.74=170, and also you have to figure in a learning rate, but i put humans and yodas at equal intelligence.

 

Yoda VS Vader

Yoda potential=170

Anakin Potential=27

 

Actual at death=

Yoda=148(i figured yodas to live to 1000 with proper health care, yoda lived only 874 years)

Vader=13.5

 

Stanima

At young age (18-25 human):

Yoda: age=150 (1.5 x 17=25.5 ability) 25.5x .3=7.65

Anakin: Age=19 (.2 x 27=5.4 ability) 5.4 x 1=5.4

(this would be the rate they consume force energy)

 

At oldest age:

Yoda: Age=874 (8.74 x 17=148) 148x.3=44.4

Vader:Age=46 (.5 x 27= 13.5) 13.5x.6=8.1

 

As you can see, anakin would be close to yoda at a young age in force that could be used, but IS weakened as vader because he dosent have as much life force, as yoda has a disadvantage there too. If vader would not have been injured by obi wan his stanima at death would be 13.5

 

Usable force at birth:

Yoda:Age=1 (.01 x 17= .17) .17 x .3=.051

Anakin:Age=1 (.01 x 27=.27) .27 x 1= .27

 

This show that anakin, at equal ages as yoda, can use the force substantially longer.

 

Power Potential:

(as stated above power potential is from birth to life expectancy, or actual, from birth to time of death)

 

At birth:

Yoda: 170 (17x10)

Anakin: 27 (27x 1

 

Actual:

Yoda: 148 (17x8.74)

Vader: 13.5 (27x.5)

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Totals:

Yoda:

Power Potential at birth: 170

Actual at death: 148

 

Stanima:

Young:7.65

Old:44.4

Newborn:.051

 

Average Overall (jedi power total)=92

(power potential goes in as 1 in the average, not two)

 

Anakin Jedi Power Total=13.6

 

Yoda is roughly 7 times more powerful then vader, there are some inconsistancies in this thing i did bu i dont know them, it is late, yodas age plays a huge part in how powerful he is because in almost anything you do the more wisdom, the more knowledge you have the better you are, i also included midichlorian count into everything too so they both have advantages and disadvantages exploited, including size.

 

An average jedi would be obi wan...... i think hed come in around a 6-10

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Umm... I going to concede this debate to you, based wholely and entirely on the fact that I don't feel like coming up with any more reasoning at 3:30 in the morning, and the whole formula process you've applied looks far too complicated for my reading pleasure at this time also. Point well made; I bow down, CagedCrado.

[Bungalow]

I'm not gonna argue with you and your mathematics, but back to Dooku

Sure they may have filmed dooku with two sabers, but there is a reason Lucas took it out.

Two possibilities:

Shorten the film

OR OR OR

He's making Dooku look better, because Dooku stood a chance against Yoda

Admit it, there is no one else, in any of the movies that could stand a chance against Yoda, besides Dooku.

I'm not saying Dooku was winning, I'm saying that there might have been a slight, minor, inperceivable chance that, Dooku could have kept defending tiring out the 800+ aged Yoda, then he'd have his way with the green dwarf.

 

Most powerful Jedi, excluding Sith's and Dark Jedi's would have to be Yoda (at his peak)

 

But Exar Kun still rules

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Actually, now that I've started to read your formula, allow me to make some points as I go along:

 

-Yoda only lives to be 900 because of his connection to the force. The lightside gives a Jedi longer life, because they focus the power of the force to make themselves stronger.

 

-Unlike the game says, Jedi do not have a given amount of force energy, or mana. When a Jedi uses the force, it takes a great amount of physical and mental concentration to do so.

Think of it in terms of using muscles to lift a weight; the longer you hold the weight, the more tired your muscles get, the harder you have to work them to keep the weight held up. A force user always has the same "amount" of power, it just drains them physically to use it. This is seen in most of the movies, after any of the Jedi (watch Luke and Yoda in ESB, especially) stops using their power, they exhale as if relaxing a muscle.

 

-Stamina and learning rate, as with many of the things you are working with, are variables that are far too theoretical, unless you are George Lucas, to try to work into any equation.

 

-"Size matters not. Look at me! Judge me by my size, do you?" -Yoda:yoda:

Size of the individual does not matter, rather the percentage of medichlorians in their blood determines their ability to comminucate thier will to the force.

 

I truly do appreciate trying to apply a logical formula to this, but I do not believe that it can be successfully done, as nobody has data to actually support the numbers/variables that you are trying to work with.

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

And Bungalow, I don't know if you're just trying to be annoying, but by this point, I really hope that's all you're trying to do. You're arguments are baseless, and all you've done is say "I really like Dooku", "I think Dooku would have won", and "Dooku is a badass; and come up with really far-stretching "well it could've ACTUALLY been this way" 's. I'd flame you, but instead I'm going to just ignore you.

 

On this argument anyway; no hard feelings, I hope.

[Bungalow]

No hard feelings, just started defending Dooku, cause everyone was badmouthing him about how he got owned, which out of all honesty I don't believe, he may have been beat, but he didn't get owned

 

And you bring up a good point, Yoda is small yet he has such a high midochlorian count

But since you say that force connection is due to the amount of midochlorian concentration in the blood, then size does matter,

Although you have a fixed amount per volume, a larger volume doesn't change the fixed amount, but the total amount increases, and so if Yoda was larger, his Midoclorian count would be the same but, he would have a larger total midochlorian count

Whether this makes a difference is beyond me

anyone care to give their opinion?

[defalc]

Well, Vader is not as powerful as he was when at his peak (probably Episode 3 before he gets turned into Vader). Thus the most powerful is Anakin, not Luke.

 

Yoda was so owning Dooku. In the uncut script, Yoda is going to deliver a killing blow to Dooku but Dooku pulls down the pillar. Yoda could have killed him but instead stopped the pillar, allowing Dooku time to escape. So nyarner.

[Dath Maximus]

Sorry i left guys. It was 9 here and i was having Ghandi wrestle Bill Clinton on WWF Smackdown. MasterD-LeyAmas is right thats the link.

[Darth Knight]

chosen one does not mean strongest one

[CagedCrado]

I was basing stanima on how long itd take to physically drain their force, and light jedi would always have an advantage on my ability scale because they live longer, also yodas species does live much longer then humans, and he wouldve lived a much longer time to live under medical supervision.

 

I agree that i am not entirely accurate though, it was late and i left out a lot of variables. Such as anakin would probably learn much faster then yoda and would get an advantage on learning ovver average people, yoda would be 1, anakin would be 2 because he is naturally smarter.

 

Size does matter on stanima because youd have more midichlorians overall, so his stanima would be less, but this was more to make bungalow have a reason dooku would lose since his froce would drain much faster, therefore yoda wouldnt fatigue fast.

[Methos]

The only reason that Luke was considered a 'Master Jedi' so early in his life was due to the fact that THERE WERE NO OTHER JEDI AROUND. you could consider a busted up pinto the fastest car in the world...if there were no other cars. same deal with Luke, he would have been a sorry ass Jedi in the Old Republic and prolly could have got his ass beat by one of the kids Yoda was training. Luke was poorly trained and ill equipped to rebuild the Jedi Order and in my opinion ruined a once noble tradition, but thats my 2 cents

[CagedCrado]

In the old order hed still be considered a master though with his abilities by the time he was thirty, wich was when he became a jedi master anyway.

[gonk-raider]

im suprized yoda or obiwan didnt leave behind a record of jedi combat techiques.and im sure luke would have done just fine in the old republic..besides in the new jedi order since all hte knowlage was destoryed besides saber building you'd expect them to not look as hot as the original i mean after all the old order didnt start out badass after all..it takes time

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

I did just want to mention that I really like this thread, I wish more people would give an opinion on the subject. It's a good break from the normal banter and flaming that goes on. We really do need more of these types; I think I'll go dig back up the "who's the wisest Jedi" thread...

[Bungalow]

wisest Jedi would be Yoda

Wisest force user would be Palpatine, because of his ability to manipuate everyone

[MasterD-LeyAmas]

Ah, yes, this is the point I brought up on that thread. I would think that Sidious would at least have to get some credit for having deceived everyone in the Republic/the Jedi Order/then the Rebellion into falling into his master plan. It was really just a stroke of luck, along with the efforts of Han/Leia/Chewy and the gang, that brought him to his demise. He was one clever little devil.

[CagedCrado]

Manipulation dosent make you wise with the force, he was a smart guy though, best politician there ever was in star wars. He was also a very powerful jedi though, even though this thread sort of slipped into anakin vs yoda (anakin would be schooled by the way) but yoda vs palpatine would be much cooler. Palpatine might actually have to use his light saber! (yes he knows how to use, who else taught darth maul?)

[Bungalow]

I wonder what type of saber Palpatine uses

Maul uses double saber

Dooku uses bent hilt

Palpatine is more bad ass then both of them, he must have a crazy saber