Jedi Hunter2354 Posted July 17, 2002 Share Posted July 17, 2002 Excellent: Absorb Strong: Lighting Protect Speed Push/Pull Mind Tricks Weak: Seeing - I can see people through walls, whoopdee frickin doo, its not bad as in design, but its just worthless Grip - Worthless if its not a map with drops, a choked victim shouldn't be able to put protect on after he is being gripped, If I have a full force bar I should be able to choke 100 health out of a victim Drain - Wow I get to use my FULL force bar, to take their Force bar, Need health, why not just get a fn health pack. This just works great since 90% of people use absorb, not. It should work like it takes a chunk of 3-4 bars out of your own force and not a hold down type like lighting, it should take all your opponents force while only taking those 3 or 4 bars of your own. Utterly Worthless: Dark Rage - Not only does it take about HALF your force meter, its takes 80 of your health which is ridiculous, to top it all off, your super-slow for about 10 seconds after it wears off. What a deal. Why does this have to be so worthless, I saw it used well back in backstab days (superfast backstabs, how gay but magnificent) but now since they have rightfully been nerfed rage is just worthless. Rage should take more of your force but only take around 30 of your health. Thats the best I could come up with about rage, if anybody thinks something else is better to improve this peice of crap, then please share with us. Oh, and the servers where force regen is at 200 are awesome, its so gay, tedious, boring, and stupid on the regular servers. People gotta learn and put it at 200, IT ALL SHOULD BE AT 200!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercen4ry Posted July 18, 2002 Share Posted July 18, 2002 Seeing is there for many reasons: a) It counteracts the Jedi Mind Trick b) It allows you to see people easier and around corners; a sniper's best friend c) At level 3, it allows you to passively dodge sniper shots (unless they're smart enough to shoot you in the foot) d) It also allows you to see trip wires easier. Trust me, that can help I always keep points in it... and I use it a LOT. Grip has now been strengthened from 1.03: Now force push/pull do not ALWAYS break the grip... making it easier for the darkie to choke the enemy and/or toss him off a cliff. The counter is not protect, but absorb... fyi. Drain is supposed to be a dark-side heal, enough said. If you saw how many people abused it under 1.02 to kill enemy force bars on the fly, you would see why they gave it the nerf. Keep in mind that Dark Rage also makes you REALLY hard to kill while it's active. That alone is why it costs 6 bars and 80 health, unless you shut it off early. And besides, want every force power to be uber powerful like before? Find a server running JK2 ++. You can find the link to the file in my FRR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Hunter2354 Posted July 18, 2002 Author Share Posted July 18, 2002 Where did I say protect was the counter? It was a mistake as I meant absorb but I don't see where I made that mistake. It doesn't matter what rage does, the design is flawed and the consequences are horrendous. You flip rage on, I book it and your screwed, happeneds everytime. Rage is worthless, period. Why do I want these powers to be better? Because right now you have 90% of the "skilled" players running around jumpkicking people with a finger on the absorb button incase anybody uses something on them. Theres no reason to be dark side, because absorb owns all and is ridiculously overpowered. Lighting isn't as bad, but It is just too easy to spam and get a lot of kills, and owns all other darkside powers except for grip on maps with drops. Even though absorb owns it and everything else but worthless dark rage. This is not how a game should be balanced. Tone down lightings damage or something, and do something about absorb ruling with an iron fist. Absorb is too easy to use conservatively and have whenever you want it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercen4ry Posted July 18, 2002 Share Posted July 18, 2002 I do admit that absorb can be overpowered in some circumstances, but given it's the only way to have a nf duel at times, is now more than ever the only counter (save luck on push/pull, since they are no longer pure counters) for grip/lightning, etc., I have to say it's balanced. It seems to me like the remedy to most of your problems would be to play on a nf server - it gets rid of the powers that seem so very poor in your opinion, and allows you to just play the game... Just my $.02. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cig Posted July 18, 2002 Share Posted July 18, 2002 Absorb is too powerful. Light jedi can counter pull an push with it, dark jedi have no counter to neutral forces so why should light jedi? Plainly unbalanced. Havin absorb protect against grip and lighting is fine but not pull and push too. Dark rage is too weak compared to protection. Dark rage cost doesnt justify what it gives, you take 50% less damage an swing a little faster for 30 sec at lv 3. Protection you take 87% less dmg at lv3. Protection slowly drains your bar like absorb and is actually better than rage. No one, absolutely no one dies in 30 secs now with the new autoblocking so rage is a total waste of force. Protect can last longer, costs less, and gives better protection. Plainly unbalanced. They need to allow the option for kicking with NF. Not allowing kicking doesnt make any sense, why would you need force power to kick? "Now force push/pull do not ALWAYS break the grip... making it easier for the darkie to choke the enemy and/or toss him off a cliff. The counter is not protect, but absorb... fyi" Ive been able to break grip with push and pull everytime in 1.04 without fail. The real key to getting grip to work is to move yourself as you grip and move the opponent your gripping. You can roll, jump, even kick you opponent while you are gripping them. You can also spin them around. If they are light jedi then you have to scare them with a few lightning taps so the turn absorb on an use up all their force, then you grip em when they run out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted July 19, 2002 Share Posted July 19, 2002 Because the light side os greater than the dark! muhahaha! Heh, personally, I think push/pull is redic. The range is WAY to far, and too easy to spam. Dark Rage? Easy victims for me when people use it on me. Grip? Rocks in CTF. Stand next to flag, grip anyone who gets enar and let your teamates whack away at them. Also good on drop of maps...especially pushing them while gripping. 3 counters, 1 is absorb, 2 is push, 3 is when someone is going to drop you off a cliff....you just pull them with you. Okay...lightning...damage is too much. Does about 50 damage if they don't have absorb...but I don't see lightning used that much, so I don't mind. Seeing is worthless other than countering mind trick. You can just pull out your saber when near snipers. Absorb forces people into guns or sabers. Not a bad thing...but I think it should at least take away health just like dark rage does...or some sort of penalty. Speed? Now that's a pain to deal with...but easy to push/pull people with it. Drain is useless now...period. It takes all your force power, and only SOMETIMES works. I just laugh to myself when someone rains me, because 80% of the time it only takes 20% of my power away...and I know it drains 100% of theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill_st Posted July 19, 2002 Share Posted July 19, 2002 Agreed, darkies are way at a disadvantage since 1.02. Let's see: Light: -Absorb (uberpower), protect, mind trick (less interesting) vs. -Lightning (countered by absord), grip (countered by absorb), Rage (useless: takes away force, heath, and leaves you open to attack for 10 secs>amazing), Drain (only barely worthy for healing, not a counter to absorb anymore, etc..). Verdict? Except for maps with pits (if you can surprise him with grip b4 the light jedi uses absorb) lights are WAY more powerful than darkies. I'd say they are even if the only light power was absorb (that's what many people use most anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FatalStrike Posted July 20, 2002 Share Posted July 20, 2002 Originally posted by cig Absorb is too powerful. Light jedi can counter pull an push with it, dark jedi have no counter to neutral forces so why should light jedi? Plainly unbalanced. Havin absorb protect against grip and lighting is fine but not pull and push too. Yes there are things the Dark Jedi can not counter, but light Jedi can not use lightning for long rangge hits in saber only. They cannot take another players force power. So what you have is a power with greater offensive ability, and one with greater defensive ability. That is the point!! Originally posted by cig Dark rage is too weak compared to protection. Dark rage cost doesnt justify what it gives, you take 50% less damage an swing a little faster for 30 sec at lv 3. Protection you take 87% less dmg at lv3. Protection slowly drains your bar like absorb and is actually better than rage. No one, absolutely no one dies in 30 secs now with the new autoblocking so rage is a total waste of force. Protect can last longer, costs less, and gives better protection. Plainly unbalanced. What do you want a longer saber too? Jeez this last qoute is straight BS! Last time I check protection does not make you run faster and swing faster? Protection gives you defense and Rage gives you offense. DO I NEED TO HAMMER THIS IN!! LIGHT - DEFENSIVE DARK - OFFENSIVE So basically what these people want is Dark to have the same defensive ability as light. But they don't want light to have any ofensive ability. Does that sound like balance to anyone? NO!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Hunter2354 Posted July 21, 2002 Author Share Posted July 21, 2002 Heres what I came up with, absorb should only absorb half of what force power is attacking it. So if you have absorb on: Lighting does half damage Push/Pull only push/pulls you half as much, drain only takes half of as much of your force power as it usually does etc. For grip you would only move half as fast and take half as much damage making it so that you would still have to use push to push away and completely negate the grip. This would make the balance perfect IMHO Think im gonna go talk to the JK2++ authors about this if its possible, it would make the game awesome. Then everything would be perfect except for dark rage which needs to take much much less health. Having it on the whole time takes away 82 health which is ridiculous. It should take at most 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hagen Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 the last week more than usual has been using Lightning, and I must say that I win more frequently with Lightning than light side. Lightning can tip the battle to your side. Especially with many people around you and if you play a "sneaker" from behind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Maximus Posted July 22, 2002 Share Posted July 22, 2002 I play a dark jedi all of the time and you guys are all nuts! I kick the crap out of light and dark jedi. I set the following in master: jump - level 3 push + pull - depends on the map seeing - level 1 grip - level 3 drain - level 3 lightning - level 3 All you need to do to get the light jedi is tap the drain key, when he/she stops changing colors then you grab them with grip, it works fine at a little over half way, then when they change colors again and break grip give em a good old blue lunge and a kick. They have no offensive powers except mind trick but seeing counters that. So all you need is some saber skill and a little time to whittle them down. If your skilled enough you will win. Plus most of the servers I vist a dark jedi is almost always on the top of the heap! So do not dis the dark jedi or these powers! Drain is your best friend. I can stay in a ffa map for quite a while with just drain and some saber skill on my side. Just practice more and you will see the potential of the dark side! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus w/ Saber Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Lighting is only good on the moron servers or moron times when EVERYBODY is running around and spamming lightning. Otherwise absorb makes force powers useless and your left to fight long saber battles. They really need to make the saber damage scale up to 2 LEGAL, not just a command because barely any servers have that and its just boring kicking and getting kicked. I swear I joined one server that had high damage double bladed lightsabers and I have never had such a fun time ever before with this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Maximus Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by Jesus w/ Saber Lighting is only good on the moron servers or moron times when EVERYBODY is running around and spamming lightning. Otherwise absorb makes force powers useless and your left to fight long saber battles. They really need to make the saber damage scale up to 2 LEGAL, not just a command because barely any servers have that and its just boring kicking and getting kicked. I swear I joined one server that had high damage double bladed lightsabers and I have never had such a fun time ever before with this game. Try ZONE-RED server. Damage is set very high and its a balst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediGhost[SITH] Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 Grip - Worthless if its not a map with drops, a choked victim shouldn't be able to put protect on after he is being gripped, If I have a full force bar I should be able to choke 100 health out of a victim I've conluded that the person who started this thread is a newbie lightning/grip/drain whore who probably can't use a saber for #### so he uses some sort of explosive weapon. And seeing is used mainly too see the Mind Tricking people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petezilla Posted July 29, 2002 Share Posted July 29, 2002 O you must be the greatest, smartest player ever huh JediGhost[sITH] calling Jedi Hunter2354 a newbie thx for giving us your opinion and not adding anything to this thread. We are not talking about sabers here. The point is unbalance in the forcepowers there are actually people that want to use all force powers and get some use out of it you know. I totaly agree that absorb is overpowered what you say that its a defencive power wrong you can still use push pull which are exellent offensive powers. Your idea of reducing the effect of forcepowers instead of total immunity is a good one i think. rage is indeed totally useless i have never been killed by this force power in the 5000-10000(or so) times i have died. Drain is not very usefull also indeed. If you get drained you shouldnt have about 75% of your force left it should only cost this much force too.choke and lightning are configed the right way i think. As for the upped damage servers you cant use these in a clanwar so that's no good for me so now we gotta shoot people instead of sabering them for quick kills since pull+kick is very dangerous against a big gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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