Another kick thread...

[Imperial_thug]

I think it's kinda silly that they put in all these moves and counters that you can do in case that you are knocked down, but then there is no way to knock someone down unless you have the Darth Maul saber. I think everyone should have some kind of knockdown move. I don't think kick would hurt anything because you can attack or evade from a knockdown position now. Most ppl that hate a certain move in the game are the same ppl who do not know how to counter it. I would like to see kick return, I think the game needs it.

[Mordred]

Well i did try a suggestion that other games have used, to disable surtain things well carrying the flag.

 

in this case force speed.

 

but was told thats no good they want kick.

 

personaly i think it would make the game better, as it was far to easy to get the flag a run force speed and absorb to get away with it. and the other team would do the same and it came down to which team returned the flag first.

 

but thats just my take on it.

[Comm539]

Aswell as slowing the game, nurfing things affects balance.

Just for example, you take speed out for an fc. You flag gets returned, you can be outrun by anymember of the opposite team, even if you started in front of them. This would probably lead to an fc never being able to cap.

We don't want nurfing, we just want to readd a feature that was worable and still will be.

 

Saber moves do more damage and are easier than kicks, so i believe kicks would no longer be spammed. Also, if you argue against kicks being readded, then you must also argue for the removal of katas butterflies, stab rolls and everything else people like to whore.

*But you can counter them* I hear you say. The same is true for kicks, just that you never bothered to learn how.

[kazesan]

Kicks make duels and FFAs less fun. I really don't want to see kicks in either of those game modes because it would really ruin a good thing. (FFA is almost perfect IMO) However I don't think people should start flame wars because of people wanting an option in one game type with specific rules.

 

Server side option to enable kick in CTF or more specifically S/O FF CTF great I agree 100% for people who want kick back in that gametype. I never play that gametype so I wouldn't care. As long as there are not tons of FFA servers with people whoring kick I am fine with it being in CTF. Don't mess up my gametypes and I won't mess up yours.

[Ardent]

Can anyone give me a straight-forward answer as to why JO's kicks were bad aside from "it's not Star Wars?"

 

BTW, based on a cost/return analysis, cost/return analysises were found to be the least cost-effective way of determining anything.

 

Go out there and practice for a bit with kicking. Learn how to gauge when someone comes into your range, and then go find a saber only ctf game there aren't a lot of competitive players in (there are a few out there). Now tell me that kicking someone down and red hacking them as the followup isn't the only way to kill an FC who knows what they're doing. When an FC is in transition across a level, there are plenty of opportunities for ambush and pulling and all that stuff. But once they've reached their base, chances are they can easily avoid stuff like pitfalls and ambushes. Which leaves a well-time kick more or less the only option.

 

What hurts almost as bad as the loss of kick is the loss of hitbox for the red dfa (which already had a ridiculously small hitbox as of JO 1.04 and now has a nearly non-existant one in JA), which was one of the other tactics used to nail an FC. Before it required a small bit of luck and a good deal of thought to nail an FC with red DFA. Now it takes Han Solo-esque luck and a lot of patience. I've found I have better luck with the yellow DFA. Which I SHOULDN'T, as theoretically it's a weaker attack.

 

Now, as far as the what is and what isn't Star Wars issue. Star Wars, specifically the Jedi Knight franchise, offers players two things all other FPS games do not: force powers and lightsabers (e.g. a true in-depth melee combat mode). Now I realize this may not have occured to a lot of people but...ff saber only player satisfaction should be just as important as the ff gunner's and the nf s/o's and the opinions of nf gunners should be ignored.

 

FF S/O players are utilizing ONLY what is unique to the JK franchise. If we wanted to blow people up with guns, we'd go play something else (something with a better guns engine, frankly). BF1942, Counterstrike, Wolfenstein...whatever. They're out there. But what we want is to cut our friends up into itty-bitty pieces and have fun doing it. Which is something only the JK franchise offers. Kicks, when used by competitive level players in matches, aren't a spam-whore tactic used to annoy other players (because it doesn't work on another comp-level player), they're a genuine tactical attack strung together with saber combinations. But if you make them impossible to execute (literally, with two of the three saber styles and figuratively with the saberstaff form) you remove THIRTY-THREE PERCENT OF OUR ABILITY TO ENGAGE THE ENEMY and darn near 80% of our situation tactics.

 

Would you be happy if Raven told you they're removing 33% of everything about guns? I doubt it. Beginning to understand why we're so upset?

 

It's not that we think we're better (in most cases, we flat out are), it's not that we think we're more important as customers (we're just in the best position to judge the game based on what makes it unique) and it's not that we're out to flame anyone (but everyone seems to like to bait us...including people that shouldn't be). We just want the tool we feel we need to play the game the way we want to. You already have the game you want. Why are YOU complaining?

[FurionStormrage]

Originally posted by Ardent

Can anyone give me a straight-forward answer as to why JO's kicks were bad aside from "it's not Star Wars?"

 

Because kicks, as implemented, produced more damage than a well-placed sabre blow. This is stupid.

 

I would agree wholeheartedly to place kicks back in the game if:

 

1) Kicks were blockable from the front

2) Did not go "straight to health"

3) Did not damage more than a sabre WHEN THE OTHER PLAYER CAN DEFEND.

4) Sabre damage is increased (it's rediculously low right now)

 

Because a knocked-down player now has some options for getting away from a kick this may now be a valid addition with the above caveats.

[the weiner dog!]

Originally posted by [div3rse.jello]

mojopin...all you do is roll with absorb on..and push around if you want

 

 

and i wouldnt be callin the best full force saber only dueler a wimp

 

 

 

 

 

He’s right; it's simple evasive tactics and prediction.

 

No different that dodging saber swings manually rather than relying on the auto block.

 

you know how you duel people can kind of "sense" when that guy is about to lead in with a swing or you see the wind up or he positions himself in a way where you just know what is about to happen?

 

Same for kicks.

 

I know a lot of people don't see it that way but there is as much of an "art form" to kick mastery, both offensive and defensive as there is sabering.

 

Now if you say that is absurd, I ask you this:

 

Just "knowing all the swings" makes for an elite dueler?

 

Of course not.

 

And kicks are no different.

 

There is a hell of a lot more there than meets the eye other than "tap tap".

 

 

And as for the #1 comment, I can't take that.

 

Break_dF was top dog by a long shot in JO and if he puts the same time and effort he did into JA, it will be no different.

 

[the weiner dog!]

Originally posted by WadeV1589

 

The s/o CTF "community" don't like their skills being removed because they feel it will reduce their ability to that of us mere average players *coughs*. I think it's more fear that they may start to get beaten as other people find new ways and they don't than an actual complaint about kick.

 

Wrong again.

 

I'm about at the point where I just want to do a few matches and demo them of me playing you people in JA and murdering you, then me playing someone like screed or the div3rse guys and it being a 20 minute stalemate to drive it home into you people that you are by no means even part of our concern.

 

I’m serious on this one,

 

Who wants a 1v1 match with me?

 

I will take any of you “adapt and learn” people and show you just how much more you have to learn.

 

No flames, just a friendly beat down into the world of reality for those who want to see what we are talking about.

 

Any takers?

[Prime]

Originally posted by FurionStormrage

Because kicks, as implemented, produced more damage than a well-placed sabre blow. This is stupid.

 

I would agree wholeheartedly to place kicks back in the game if:

 

1) Kicks were blockable from the front

2) Did not go "straight to health"

3) Did not damage more than a sabre WHEN THE OTHER PLAYER CAN DEFEND.

4) Sabre damage is increased (it's rediculously low right now)

 

Because a knocked-down player now has some options for getting away from a kick this may now be a valid addition with the above caveats.

These suggestions have been turned down by competative CTF players many times. I'd be happy with them though

[dyehead]

I'd be happy if kick did 0 damage but knocked people down. I think all kick-haters share the idea that we want to use kick as a means of dealing damage.

 

We just want to be able to stop the fc's momentum, as it is now, as has been stated 500 billion times, you can NOT stop a flag carrier who knows what he's doing without the help of lag/stupidity.

 

Having kick for the light staff only is pretty stupid imo, I'd gladly trade saber throw for kick.

[Ardent]

Originally posted by FurionStormrage

Because kicks, as implemented, produced more damage than a well-placed sabre blow. This is stupid.

 

Turn the kick damage down to 0 on your server. I know at least one game was played this way by the comp community. It didn't really change the game.

 

I would agree wholeheartedly to place kicks back in the game if:

 

You lost me at if. Just attach your feedback on what kicks should and shouldn't do thanks.

 

1) Kicks were blockable from the front

 

I'll cover this one: ever fenced? Practiced any form of swordplay? Ever done so in a tournament? Ever done so in a freestyle tournament? I have. Kicking someone in the leg (groin, knee and top of the foot are off limits, or I'd choose those) is a fairly common tactic. When your attention is on your opponent's blade (particularly at the point where it's most likely to impact with you) you can't afford to split your attention to watch for something like a kick. Instead, most sword styles teach you how to react to when you're kicked. So I suppose, if Raven liked me idea of making kick a Force skill (so you'd choose between saber throw and kick, likely), a higher kick skill means you better cope with being kicked.

 

2) Did not go "straight to health"

 

How's your personal shield going to stop an attack that's coming from inside it? The damage isn't from kinetic energy...it's from the weight of the impact. Which isn't affected by a kinetic deflection shield, when you get right down to the physics behind it. Sure, it might slow them down a little, but it doesn't slow anything else down, so why would it slow a kick down? Not that I'd mind not having any damage at all if it would just be capitalizable.

 

3) Did not damage more than a sabre WHEN THE OTHER PLAYER CAN DEFEND.

 

Blocking is still broken in JA. I'd worry about that before worrying about what sort of damage kick can do.

 

4) Sabre damage is increased (it's rediculously low right now)

 

You know, I don't think anyone will disagree with you on that.

 

Because a knocked-down player now has some options for getting away from a kick this may now be a valid addition with the above caveats.

 

Well, with the caveat of those options changing based on the re-addition of kicks, I think re-including kick will be vital to the strength of the FF S/O community. Maybe a quick move timer on it or something. I dunno. I just want kicking back. </3

 

Nobody responded to the latter 80% of my previous post...any takers?

[the weiner dog!]

I'm going to have to disagree with them doing 0 damage for one reason:

 

This affects a lot more people than CTF, primarily duelers (full force).

 

For CTF people, flip on absorb, kick+ dfa is a valid and often used tactic.

 

For us duel people it's pure suicide.

 

A 1v1 environment does not have the frantic chaos a team based match does and people simply don’t get killed by things like that when you can focus 100% of you attention on a single player.

 

Kicks in duels are used in a totally different manner than they are in CTF as well.

 

For us they simply must cause damage because full force dueling basically revolves around this core strategy:

 

 

Take a shot to the face, let a guy hit you with a 50+ damage combo, but never, ever put yourself in a position where you have less force than him.

 

Note I said force, not health.

 

Drain is the great equalizer in full force dueling so really health is not a big concern so long as you keep your hp at about at least 51 (so as to not die from an instant PTK combo).

 

True hardcore full force dueling is a "cat and mouse" game where each opponent saves up his pool for one massive barrage of combos to finish the guy off in a single shot.

 

If you don't instantly kill him with that onslaught, you better run like hell or stay on the offensive with kicks and fast damage moves like lunges because he's going to start drain whoring you the second you gets up from your attack and you need to prevent him from draining back to 100 hp by causing fast, incremental damage to offset the drain attack.

 

The only way to do that is to continue causing damage and simple basic saber swings are not going to cut it in that type of game with two people of that skill level.

[=X=Master HeX]

Why play saber only Full Force CTF? One word can sum that all up: AIMBOTS...

 

Just look around for some and I assure you there are working ones for JK2. Use them with a saber and you have very little advantage. This is why saber only ctf is so competitive... Short of someone using scripts (which every competition clan member can tell you are not as good as a human doing the move) there are very little cheats that would make a difference in a match.

[Flashblade]

Originally posted by Ardent

(e.g. a true in-depth melee combat mode)

 

ROFLMAO this one sure is funny as hell

[Comm539]

It's kinda like saying 'remove red stance down hack because its unblockable'. Well yes, kicks are unblockable, but like a hack, you just have to avoid them. The best defence for being kicked is to avoid the kick. Its very simple. I noticed that the main reasons why people get upset because they got kicked is because they're in some rush to run and start humping the guys leg. Keep your distance.

 

I find it highly ironic that people can moan about a 20hp damge kick being whored, when the same people admit to whoring katas, butterflies, rollstab and just a basic spamming of swings.

Why do you do it? Because it to some extent works (atm certainly). Why do we kick...becuase it works. You fall for it, get knocked over, don't know who to get up/counter a groundkill and become an easy kill.

You go to all this trouble explaining why your inadiquacies mean you get kicked to death. In the same time it takes to right that post, you could've learnt how to dodge and survive kicks forever.

 

This is all highly irrelevant anyway. Its a toggle kick patch. You don't have to have them.

 

And if admins do add them, it'll be trhough popularity. And even if its not, go moan about people whoring unblockable, instant kill katas and rollstabs instead of something that takes 20hp.

[the weiner dog!]

aimbots, heh.

 

nah Hex I can tell you why I play ff/so.

 

It's fast paced like a shooter, but the sloppy random element of gun games is eliminated.

 

Don't get me wrong, I love FPS's.

 

I play UT2003, Quake 3, RTCW ET and many others.

 

But in Jedi Outcast, like a lot of people who came from games like Quake 3, I think the guns are very sloppy and poorly designed.

 

The things that turned me off are:

 

No "instagib" weapon like a quake 3 rail gun.

Sure the sniper gun can cause heavy instant damage but you need to come to a dead stop, zoom in, charge it up...then fire.

 

For me slower pace = something I don't want.

 

And I'm serious about the overall slow pace of JK2/JA guns.

 

Even with things like force speed, a game of Quake 3 CTF is 3 times faster paced than any game of JK2/JA could hope to be.

 

Things like the instant kill rail, superior rocket launcher and overall faster game physics contribute to that.

 

 

 

The rocket launcher is much slower than rocket launchers from other games and again, the slow pace turns me off.

 

The repeater is not bad in alt fire mode, but primary is a waste of time.

 

 

The Golan is actually the only gun I can get into because it reminds me a lot of the flak cannon from Unreal Tournament.

 

But overall, the sup par weapons and the slower pace just turns me off so I don’t play it.

[Comm539]

Originally posted by WadeV1589

And you keep blurting out the same old crap about how bad it is to not have kicks in this NON JO game. So don't go around saying we're repeating ourselves when you're the ones with thread upon thread about kicks!

 

Oh and to kick them you had to catch up with them, if you can catch up with them, you can increase saber damage and do one hit kills, why is that not a solution? If you want it like Star Wars, sabers should be able to kill with one slice anyhow and seen as it's your only weapon in s/o CTF then why not have one kill shots? Personally I think that adds to the realism AND gives you a way to stop fc's, no doubt you will still complain though.

 

 

You obviously do not play s/o ctf (or know little about the games physics). Kicking is an instant move, along with pull, you can be quite close (although not caught up to them) and make contact (and kick).

Saber swinging slows you down. Since you cannot pull whilst you are swinging, you would need to be ahead of the fc and by the time the saber swung you would make contact. However, this can be easily evaded.

Kicking can stop/slow someone from behind, which is the issue here. A saber cannot.

[Pyro]

Originally posted by the weiner dog!

Wrong again.

 

I'm about at the point where I just want to do a few matches and demo them of me playing you people in JA and murdering you, then me playing someone like screed or the div3rse guys and it being a 20 minute stalemate to drive it home into you people that you are by no means even part of our concern.

 

I’m serious on this one,

 

Who wants a 1v1 match with me?

 

I will take any of you “adapt and learn” people and show you just how much more you have to learn.

 

No flames, just a friendly beat down into the world of reality for those who want to see what we are talking about.

 

Any takers?

 

I ACCEPT UR CHALLENGE SIR I WILL WIN U WITH MY KATA + SPIDERMAN WALL GRAB

[megafu]

i would gladly play you 1v1 wiener dog, just one problem, i returned my copy of JA couple days ago. Or else I'd show you how long a mathc can really LAST!

[FurionStormrage]

Originally posted by Ardent

Turn the kick damage down to 0 on your server. I know at least one game was played this way by the comp community. It didn't really change the game.

 

Ah, yes. Turn it down on MY server. I think I play on PUBLIC SERVERS; logically I do not control said servers.

 

You lost me at if. Just attach your feedback on what kicks should and shouldn't do thanks.

 

Has it occured to you that adding kick back in AS IS in JO requires a rebalance elsewhere? If you want kick as it is then my suggestions are what I would like to see if you get what you want. I compromise; you compromise; we both win.

 

I'll cover this one: ever fenced? Practiced any form of swordplay? Ever done so in a tournament? Ever done so in a freestyle tournament? I have. Kicking someone in the leg (groin, knee and top of the foot are off limits, or I'd choose those) is a fairly common tactic. When your attention is on your opponent's blade (particularly at the point where it's most likely to impact with you) you can't afford to split your attention to watch for something like a kick. Instead, most sword styles teach you how to react to when you're kicked. So I suppose, if Raven liked me idea of making kick a Force skill (so you'd choose between saber throw and kick, likely), a higher kick skill means you better cope with being kicked.

 

If you can't take the time to watch for anything from your opponent you have no business being in the ring, tournament or otherwise. If you or I were to use swords and you tried to kick me I can vouch for the fact that your leg would be twitching on the ground because I would CUT IT OFF. As JO is now, the only way out of a kick is to move. That doesn't track.

 

How's your personal shield going to stop an attack that's coming from inside it? The damage isn't from kinetic energy...it's from the weight of the impact. Which isn't affected by a kinetic deflection shield, when you get right down to the physics behind it. Sure, it might slow them down a little, but it doesn't slow anything else down, so why would it slow a kick down? Not that I'd mind not having any damage at all if it would just be capitalizable.

 

Kinetic energy (when you get down to the physics of it) is a combination of mass and velocity. Weight (in your example) is just a translation of mass impacting a body "at rest". If you can deflect the mass then you can reduce the kinetic energy.

 

Blocking is still broken in JA. I'd worry about that before worrying about what sort of damage kick can do.

 

Then I'd rather see them FIX blocking with a patch than introduce a potential gameplay imbalance with a requested feature.

 

Well, with the caveat of those options changing based on the re-addition of kicks, I think re-including kick will be vital to the strength of the FF S/O community. Maybe a quick move timer on it or something. I dunno. I just want kicking back. </3

 

I understand you want kicking back. I personally don't want it back as it was implemented in JO. I guess we're in partial agreement. Well, it's a start if compromise is going to work.

 

Nobody responded to the latter 80% of my previous post...any takers?

 

Someone other than me can pick up the guantlet...

[m_skywalker]

The problem with the JO kick seems fairly obvious to me, but then again this is just my opinion:

 

It was too damn spammable. It was quick and easy to pull off, had a huge hit box, and you had complete control of what what you were doing at all times. The secondary problem was that the act of spamming kick also rendered you very difficult to hit by conventional means, like with a regular saber swing, on account of you bunny hopping all over the place like a madman (yes, here is where you call me a n00b who doesn't know how to play the game, and tell me how you're so good that you could counter a kick spammer in your sleep). Thus, the only truly effective counter to kick spam was with kick spam.

 

Now, you say "what's the difference between spamming kick and spamming katas, butterflies, etc.?" Well, again, in my mind this is trivially obvious: NONE of the katas are even REMOTELY as easy to spam as kick was. As many folks have pointed out, every single kata has both an "engaged" phase (where you're actually doing the kata) and a "cool down" phase (where you're wide open for a few moments after finishing the kata). Frankly, for most of them there's even a "wind up" phase, where you're basically telegraphing the fact that you're about to do a kata (ALL of the staff katas definitely have this... before a butterfly, or the spinning one, or any of them, you take a step backwards or something before you launch yourself). So in dealing with someone who is trying to kata you, you have time before the kata starts to do something about it, time while it's happening to get out of the way, and time after it's done to implement an appropriate counter attack. Compare this to kick... kick is instantly delivered, requires no "wind up" time, takes no time to execute, and has little (if any) "cool down" time. You could spam at least 5 kicks in the time it takes to do ONE butterfly kata.

 

So there's my technical argument why spamming kicks is different than spamming katas. Here's my emotional argument: you mention that kicks were avoidable (if you "took the time to learn" or, to translate to what you really mean, "if you weren't a total n00b"), and I agree with this. What I don't agree with is that I should have to spend ALL MY TIME avoiding them at all! I did not buy JK or JA to spend every second rolling away from some bunny hopping monkey and worrying about getting up off the ground every five seconds. And I certainly didn't buy the games to fight people like I'm some kind of bunny hopping monkey. I played to use sabers like in Stars Wars. I'm sorry, I just did. Call me n00b, fanboy, whatever. If I wanted bunny hopping, there's PLENTY of other games where I could get my fill of it. My feelings towards the kick are almost identical to my feelings towards rocket launchers in almost every other game, and the whole "instagib" mentality (ok, I don't mind the rocket launcher in games like standard Quake and UT, but I tell you, I won't play Wolfenstein anymore where you bust your ass with your "real life" WWII machine gun, only to get instaSMOKED by some fool with a panzerfaust (or whatever it's called), as if ANYONE IN A REAL WAR EVER USED FRIGGING ROCKETLAUNCHERS AGAINST INDIVIDUAL INFANTRY UNITS... sorry, I get a little emotional when I think about this crap).

 

So anyways, that's the difference between kick and kata. Kick is spammy, nearly unavoidable nonsense that only begets more spammy nonsense. Couple this with the fact that the risk vs. reward for using kick was waaaay out of whack (ie. zero risk, very good reward), and that the difficulty of use vs. reward was WAAAAAY out of whack (anyone who could spam a spacebar can be good with kicks, and again, very good reward) and maybe you start to see the problem?

 

I would be all for bringing kick back if it was implemented like a kata (or, frankly, like the staff jumpkick, only slightly more effective). What I like about katas is that they well balanced in risk and difficulty of use vs. reward. You need to be a little clever when using them to both hit people and avoid ending up in an ugly situation. This was most definitely not the case with kick. Make it the case and I'd be happy to have it back, otherwise keep it the hell out of the new game.

[JaledDur]

Originally posted by [div3rse.jello]

tell me one scene where you see them change saber styles, do a dfa, lunge, yellow dfa, any kata, a cartwheel

 

Well, Anakin has to win in Ep3 SOMEHOW....

[m_skywalker]

Sorry, I need to add one more thing...

 

I expect a response along the lines of "this is only for s/o CTF, shove off!", "it would be toggleable, so you don't have to worry if you don't like it", and "kicks won't be spammed since there are so many other moves now".

 

That last one I already dealt with in my previos post, so I'll only add that to honestly believe that kick wouldn't be spammed is a joke. If it can be spammed, it will be spammed.

 

As for the first two, I reiterate what some have said already: if it is toggleable, I suspect we will soon find that nearly every server will have it toggled on. You might say that this reflects the will of the players, but I disagree. This may sound inflammatory, but I suspect that for the most part, 90% of servers are run by the sub-18 year old script kiddie crowd. I don't want to promote any unfair stereotypes, but I'm going to say that these are exactly the type of people who like things like kick, rocket launchers, instagib, and spammy gameplay in general. And as far as playing JA goes, I am at their mercy. I have to play on their servers, since I don't have one of my own. And I'm more likely not to play JA at all than do what it takes to put up my own server. BUT I DON'T WANT IT TO COME TO THAT. I want to be able to play the game the way I like it (and, frankly, the way I think it was designed to be played), without having to get my own server or without having to spend unreasonable amounts of time tracking down the few servers that run the game sans spam.

 

All in all, having it as a toggle makes puts the power of spam in the hands of the server admins, and I don't think the will of the server admins = the will of the players. If we just keep kick out, we don't have this problem. Yes, some people will be upset and stop playing. But for ONCE, PRETTY PLEASE, could it be the spammers, script kiddies, etc., that are forced out, rather than the regular shmucks like me that just want to play a damn game the way it was designed to played? I'm so tired of having to give up on perfectly good games that have degenerated into spamming inanity because, for lack of a better description, the "kids" have taken over.

[Jello123]

stop spamming walking...omg omg cheator lamer noob

[Ardent]

Originally posted by FurionStormrage

Ah, yes. Turn it down on MY server. I think I play on PUBLIC SERVERS; logically I do not control said servers.

 

Then you're in the same position we've been. You have to hunt down a server with the settings you like. Hopefully soon we'll have enough servers up that we can set them up how we like, but it still doesn't address a lot of the "balance fixes" that ruin ff s/o gameplay.

 

Has it occured to you that adding kick back in AS IS in JO requires a rebalance elsewhere? If you want kick as it is then my suggestions are what I would like to see if you get what you want. I compromise; you compromise; we both win.

 

Why would it? They had to remove it in the first place and that created an imbalance. They can just toss whatever it was they decided "balanced out" the loss of 33% of our arsenal.

 

If you can't take the time to watch for anything from your opponent you have no business being in the ring, tournament or otherwise. If you or I were to use swords and you tried to kick me I can vouch for the fact that your leg would be twitching on the ground because I would CUT IT OFF. As JO is now, the only way out of a kick is to move. That doesn't track.

 

Hardly. If you're paying attention to something as petty as a kick (at worst a takedown if you have the first clue about defense...usually little more than a bruise otherwise) then you're leaving yourself open to an attack from your opponent's primary mode of offense: their weapon. If you and I were to use swords, you'd quickly find yourself sorely out-classed, I think. In order to compete in a freestyle tournament you need to be an acknowledged master of at least one form. As far as my kicking you...if you saw it coming, it wouldn't be coming (if you'll excuse the Tzuism). I'd be attacking where you weren't looking. As JO is now, there are plenty of ways to avoid a kick. Probably the best is to learn how to kick better than your opponent.

 

Kinetic energy (when you get down to the physics of it) is a combination of mass and velocity. Weight (in your example) is just a translation of mass impacting a body "at rest". If you can deflect the mass then you can reduce the kinetic energy.

 

Impact of mass against a body at rest, if you want to get into the nitty-gritty, is more than enough to cause damage most of the time. When you're talking about 50-100kg individuals, it's more than enough. A kinetic barrier which isn't at the layer of the skin (and it's obviously not...it's a spherical barrier surrounding the Jedi) can't protect someone against the impact of mass against their being. It can't even reduce the velocity noticeably at that point, as it's primary plane of deflection is outside of where most of the motion takes place. You really don't want to get into physics with me.

 

Then I'd rather see them FIX blocking with a patch than introduce a potential gameplay imbalance with a requested feature.

 

Do you ask for less on your plate when you're hungrier?

 

I understand you want kicking back. I personally don't want it back as it was implemented in JO. I guess we're in partial agreement. Well, it's a start if compromise is going to work.

 

Of course I want kicking back. It's integral to ff s/o ctf which is a significant share of the JO community (dare I say -- at least 33%). Which is a significant portion of sales LA/Raven was counting on.