lukeiamyourdad Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 Well it is better balanced and more fun then anything that has come out ever since:D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 5, 2004 Author Share Posted February 5, 2004 Well, i dont know about anyone else, but after getting Rise of Nations, i havent touched SWGB for at least a couple of months - it's just too...stiff in terms of gameplay and rather flawed, especially compared to the newer generation of RTS'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saberhagen Posted February 5, 2004 Share Posted February 5, 2004 What are the flaws in SWGB? I played the demo of RoN and it didn't appeal to me. I would have said it was far more "stiff" than SWGB. I found it very slow and tedious. It seems to be designed to make rushing virtually impossible, unless I missed something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 6, 2004 Share Posted February 6, 2004 RoN seems to much like a more fast-paced Civ3. PLay civ3 and you'll know that RoN is rip-off of civ3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 6, 2004 Author Share Posted February 6, 2004 Saber - the flaws in SWGB are that - It was based on an outdated engine - The combat is 'stiff', it is played like Medevil combat rather than WW2 - Units were too generic - Civ bonus' werent good enough - Not enough variation in unit stats and so on. Then we can go through the various defeciences of Airpower and the Air Cruiser. As for RoN, as i said, the combat flows a lot better. There is a greater number of units and unit combinations, as well as the ability to field huge infantry armies, along with some units that can fire on the move. Personally, i find it to be the best RTS i have ever played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 7, 2004 Share Posted February 7, 2004 And RoN isn't based on an outdated engine? All the other RTS are completely 3D but RoN isn't. If that's not outdated, I don't know what is. The units in RoN are also generic. Most of them at least. SWGB doesn't have medieval combat. Formations, yes,heavy weapons, yes, but not combat. RoN by far did not impress me. It's certainly NOT the best RTS out there. Even AoM(which already is a deception IMO) is a whole lot better. AoM's fast pace actually made more sense then RoN. Like I said, it's only a fast paced rip-off of the Civilization serie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 7, 2004 Author Share Posted February 7, 2004 Luke - no, RoN isnt complately 3D, but then the engine does come out with excellent graphics and has to deal with things like the CTW campaign. Do i think it's outdated? No. As for SWGB, it is medevil combat with modern weapons, thats all - and what makes it so blocky and stiff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 You may think what you want, RoN's engine is outdated. I guess you don't really know what medieval combat is. Of course, in AoK we had gigantic AT-ATs mowing down formations of pikemen, AT-TE's slaughtering enemy knights and Storm Troopers shooting down some Cavalry Archers. I'm sure the same tactics are used because of course in medieval times there were dragons who flew around spewing fire on armies... The simple change of tactics and strategy changes the style completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 8, 2004 Author Share Posted February 8, 2004 Luke - you dont understand, im not talking about the units that are medevil, but the style of combat. The problem with SWGB is that it is based on an engine where almost all combat units are melee, and massed infantry formations were the rule. However, in SW, mechs play crucial roles in combat, as do aircraft. You might also want to take a look at some medevil films - ranged infantry stodd back and engaged the enemy at range, while the mell units charged in and attack the other melee units - certainly NOT the same as SW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 8, 2004 Share Posted February 8, 2004 And where do we actually see huge formations of melee infantry in SWGB? There's a few units of course that are melee of course but what else? I've never seen a huge charge of mounties going to fight other mounties. Like I said, change the units, change the tactics and it's a lot different. Which is why, playing AoK(medieval) and playing SWGB(SW) is very different and the combat certainly is NOT medieval way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T10 Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 Ok, RoN adapted 'Conquer the Galaxy' idea. Good. RoN style gameplay. Bad. And no, I don't really think that just having a city as a planet is good. And no. Rebel soldiers don't just fall over and die because they wlaked past a red line on the map. Like the idea, not the gameplay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 T10 - i never intended to use RoN's gameplay. With the 'national borders' that you refer to, i would use that, but slightly altered. I like the idea of borders because then, you cant just build anywhere on the map, you have to literally expand the area you control in order to build further out. HOWEVER i HATE (with a passion) the whole 'attrition' deal. It is one of the things about RoN that irritates me, and i would most certainly not include that in any SW RTS. BTW, what do you mean by 'having a city as a planet'? luke - you missed the point, all SWGB infantry are simply edited melee infantry from AoK, one of the reasons it doesnt play well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 uh... no it's the edited ranged infantry of AoK... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 9, 2004 Author Share Posted February 9, 2004 Regardless, the engine that SWGB is based on has melee units as the main infantry, with no aircraft. SWGB on the other hand has ranged infantry and well as mechs as the main units, with aircraft coming into the mix. It just doesnt mesh right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T10 Posted February 9, 2004 Share Posted February 9, 2004 Well, basically, instead of a rectangleish shape, the overall map is circular, like the Star Wars galaxy. Instead of countires that are linked, there are seperate systems. In these systems, there is an amount of space in which a fleet may be positioned. Oh, this is complicated. Let me start from the beginnging. There is a circular map, with a starry backdrop. However, the foreground is filled by an immense galaxy. In this galaxy, there are planets. You start with one planet, and a small amount of territory around it. You also get a small fleet, which acts as a mobile command centre, carrying troops and construction materials. You capture planets by moving your fleet into their space, if they are unclaimed, you will gain it automatically. If not, you fight a ground battle if there is no fleet present, or a space and ground battle if there are enemy re-enforcements in the vicinity. Ach! I'll tell more later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Quote Originally posted by Darth Windu Regardless, the engine that SWGB is based on has melee units as the main infantry, with no aircraft. SWGB on the other hand has ranged infantry and well as mechs as the main units, with aircraft coming into the mix. It just doesnt mesh right. And your point is? It doesn't "mesh" right? Poor argument. AoK's engine was at the very least modified enough to incorporate these new features which couldn't have been done better considering the engine and it's already very good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted February 10, 2004 Share Posted February 10, 2004 Windu, complaining about SWGB with the 4 people on this Earth who adore it isn't the smartest idea. Quote I played the demo of RoN and it didn't appeal to me. I would have said it was far more "stiff" than SWGB. I found it very slow and tedious. It seems to be designed to make rushing virtually impossible, unless I missed something. Ditto. Too many restrictions and requirements to do the simplest things. Also, the gameplay controls relied too heavily on artificial elements. Instead of having the game balanced so that having more than one unit wasnt beneficial like most games, they slapped a price hike on making multiple units. instead of designing the game so that you build many units, theyh just made each unit count as three. So your massive battles are really just skirmishes in disguise. Instead of having counters that naturally beat units or have slight mulitpliers, they just slaughter units completely beyond realism. A knight would never have killed 10 longbowmen singlehandedly. Instead of making it militiristically unwise to have a roaming attack force or an unsuppported forward base, they disallowed one and punished the other. The list goes on, and all these make for long drawn out games where you're stuck thinking, I could have won this an hour ago, if the computer couldn't just switch units instantly and massacre me with their much cheaper troops. Or the fact that I have to slowly move with my armies. Most other games like AoM employ a combination of natural and artificial barriers, so the player is more free to improvise and strategize, and games don't forever to accomplish what could have been done in a matter of minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 10, 2004 Author Share Posted February 10, 2004 Sith - i never claimed that RoN was perfect, but there are a LOT of good features in it which could be used in a SWGB sequel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Most of the "good features" were just copied from Ao_ or Civ_. The stuff they added wasn't that great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted February 11, 2004 Share Posted February 11, 2004 Now I haven't played RoN but I have played many other RTS games that have been released since SWGB, and I just keep going back to SWGB. It really isn't as bad as you're making it out to be, Windu. The whole thing meshed perfectly fine for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 11, 2004 Author Share Posted February 11, 2004 Maybe not for you, but it is to me. I suppose the main reason i've stopped playing it, besides the poor gameplay, is the fact that the units are represented very poorly in that their abilities in the game vs films are wrong, and so it doesnt have a proper star wars feel to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted February 16, 2004 Share Posted February 16, 2004 Poor gameplay? If you think the game is so rubbish why do you still post on these forums? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted February 16, 2004 Author Share Posted February 16, 2004 Because i think that the idea of a Star Wars themed ground-based RTS has a lot of merit, and that if done properly (ie from the beginning, not using someone else's engine) it could be a fantastic game, and that is something that i want to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 1, 2004 Share Posted March 1, 2004 Put your trade federation on Lok it was a droid testing facility and was used to transport droids off. Neimondia or however u spell it is just the home world of its leadership. And since Lok was so close to Naboo it was a nice drop off point for droids to be shipped to the Blockade and then shipped down into the swamps of Naboo. And well after the Republic's fall droids still exist in this desert world deativated and malfuntioning some even still working and attacking travellors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 1, 2004 Author Share Posted March 1, 2004 FroZ - the whole point of a homeworld is that it is the POLITICAL center of a particular civ, not a military base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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