Majin Boba Fett Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 ive seen this topic brought up several times, so i figured id give it its own thread even though there has most likely already been one. i hink the two should be seperate becasue they are totally different civs. But im ok with the idea of the combining occasionaly (like scenarios and stuff) to form something like a grand naboo army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Well, my position is that they should be merged, with players able to use Royal Naboo only or Gungan only units for senario's. The reasons i think they shoud be merged are- 1. We see at the end of Ep1 that the Royal Naboo and Gungans had put aside their differences. In addition, we see that in Ep2 the planet Naboo is represented by both the Royal Naboo and Gungans, rather than just the Royal Naboo. 2. It allows other, more diverse civs to be added to the game without overcrowding and reducing civ uniqueness. In my template, this allows the addition of the Hutt Cartel. 3. It removes some of the, for lack of a better word, 'dumb' units. By this i mean Royal Naboo assault mechs and Gungan aircraft. Also, as i have mentioned before, going by canon units, the Gungans have a Navy, Infantry and a few 'mechs'. The Royal Naboo on the other hand have no Navy, light infantry, a few mechs and aircraft. Put these together and you get a full compliment. 4. It really does make sense. After the events of Ep1, the Royal Naboo and Gungans would have realised that neither could defend their planet, and hence would have begun co-operation and military co-ordination in order to better defend their planet, particually during the Clone War. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbguy1211 Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Originally posted by Darth Windu Well, my position is that they should be merged, with players able to use Royal Naboo only or Gungan only units for senario's. The reasons i think they shoud be merged are- 1. We see at the end of Ep1 that the Royal Naboo and Gungans had put aside their differences. In addition, we see that in Ep2 the planet Naboo is represented by both the Royal Naboo and Gungans, rather than just the Royal Naboo. 2. It allows other, more diverse civs to be added to the game without overcrowding and reducing civ uniqueness. In my template, this allows the addition of the Hutt Cartel. 3. It removes some of the, for lack of a better word, 'dumb' units. By this i mean Royal Naboo assault mechs and Gungan aircraft. Also, as i have mentioned before, going by canon units, the Gungans have a Navy, Infantry and a few 'mechs'. The Royal Naboo on the other hand have no Navy, light infantry, a few mechs and aircraft. Put these together and you get a full compliment. 4. It really does make sense. After the events of Ep1, the Royal Naboo and Gungans would have realised that neither could defend their planet, and hence would have begun co-operation and military co-ordination in order to better defend their planet, particually during the Clone War. 1. Big deal. 2. More diverse civs? Such as the Hutt Cartell? That just be some good weed. Please share. You have just contradicted yourself in your first two points. In point 1 you refer to the movies as an example of a Gungan-Naboo civ. So by that logic the Hutt Cartell would then be Jabba, Boba Fett a few other bounty hunters and what else? Troops? Mechs? Air? This leads to... 3. All you'd be doing is creating 'dumb units.' Which then makes this a 'dumb' idea. 4. Is a re-hash of point 1. And if you want to talk about the diverse crap, then they should both be kept in. Your EU stuff will never make it in. So keep dreaming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 20, 2004 Author Share Posted March 20, 2004 windu - u make a good point. its like they complete each other. i like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pbguy1211 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 to quote a fellow forumer: gameplay > realism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 20, 2004 Author Share Posted March 20, 2004 an unrealistic star wars game defeats the purpose of it being star wars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 But the destruction of gameplay defeats its purpose to be a good game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 pbguy - if you're going to try to refute my arguments, at least make an attempt to relate your rebuttles to the films, or at least EU. As for the Hutt Cartel, we actually see many units in the films that can be used as their forces. Some of the possible units for the Hutt Cartel include- - Weequey Infantry - Gamorean Guards - T-16 Skyhoppers - V-34 Speeder - X-35 Speeder (or whatever their designations are) - Swoop Bikes - Cargo Skiff's - Sandcrawlers and so on. As i said, this civ would play differently to the other civs due to their lack of a navy, and would also have a very unique art look, being from Tatooine. I would also like to point out that Boba Fett was NOT the only Bounty Hunter with Jabba, and Gardula the Hutt was also seen in Ep1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 pbguy-although I think that the two should be either merged (or cut entirely), its for far different reasons than Windu. Personally, I feel that there is, even with 8 civs, too many civs for the game to be sufficiently balanced in MP (in that I mean there isn't an OP civ and a crap civ) and remain both versitile (how fun would the game be if the rebs could only trooper rush, or the naboo boom) and unique (not these lame 5% bonuses where everyone is the same til t4). So I decided to cut out the extraneous stuff. The Wookies went out the window, along with the TF, with the Confeds stealing some of their concepts and units. As for the Naboo and Gungans, it seemed excessive to have them as two separate entities, and I know if I advocated dropping them, all the other people on this board would go nuts, so I took the middle road, and merged them together but still kept them apart (see other thread). Windu-The Hutts are a bad idea on so many levels I don't know where to begin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 pbguy makes all valid points which I back entirely Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 20, 2004 Author Share Posted March 20, 2004 hutt cartel should be a civ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Hutt cartel is the mafia of Star Wars and in all the games based on real life armies have you seen the mafia being added as a civ I dont think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 froz - lol, feel like coming up with something original anytime soon? I actually wouldnt be suprised if you and pbguy were the same person... As for the Hutts, you dont see the Naboo and Gungans running around killing and pillaging now do you? They stick to their planet, the Hutts stick to theirs. Hence, why should the Hutts be denied because of their prominance? As i said before, they would bring a unique playing style, and would look very different to every other civ. sith - start at the beginning, i would like to know why you think they are a bad idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 21, 2004 Author Share Posted March 21, 2004 yea froz. gameplay>realism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 In this case both gameplay and realism are out the door so nitro has no idea. Maybe because Tatooine is not there planet for one they are nothing more than common thugs. Next youll be saying jawas and tuskens can be there own civ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 21, 2004 Author Share Posted March 21, 2004 froz - think back to episode i and the words of qui gon jin. "tatoonie is run by the hutts". therefore, its practically theres. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 The Hutts don't have the man-power and cash to compete against the other civs. Realistically, they'll be crushed because they're just a bunch of undiscipline thugs who won't work together like a real army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Despite Froz's poor grammar and punctuation he is saying what I have been saying all along. The Hutt's are an underworld power and never in the history of this world or the Star Wars Universe has a force like the Hutt Cartel or the Mafia marched to battle. This is what an RTS is about, sending armies to battle. The Hutt cartel just doesn't do that, so despite their importance in the Star Wars Galaxy as a whole, they should not be included as a playable civ. It would make for both bad realism and gameplay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 The Hutts don’t want there illegal activities exposed and a military strike would not be a good idea. The Hutts would never dare come up against the Empire if Vader thought they were a huge military threat he would have wiped them out already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Froz - i have never, and would not, suggest that Jawa's and Tuskens have their own civ. However, the Hutt Cartel is a powerful organisation with a lot of resources at it's disposal, and controlling at least one world. luke - the Naboo dont have the manpower to compete against other civs, and WERE crushed in Ep1 - does that mean we shouldnt include them either? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Windu, I know you love telling people to read your posts, so let it be known I take great satisfaction in telling you the same thing. You seem to be ignoring the best argument against the Hutts - they don't march to battle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Originally posted by Darth Windu luke - the Naboo dont have the manpower to compete against other civs, and WERE crushed in Ep1 - does that mean we shouldnt include them either? Shouldn't that be why you're combining them with the Gungans? Who are you going to combine the Hutts with for them to have enough firepower to go up against any of the other civ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 23, 2004 Author Share Posted March 23, 2004 hey, with the kinda money the hutts have, they could hire an army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 They could hire some mercenaries, but none of them are capable soldiers nor are they disciplined enough to fight in a war. Mercenaries don't make a good army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Vostok, luke - what does it matter if they go off to war on other planets? As i said, the Naboo are the same. With the Hutts though, their forces are basically made up of mercenaries (with Bounty Hunters as a unique unit) and their strength is in their economy - their unique building means that they dont need to collect resources in order to generate credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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