Model file (.alo) format

[Grompie]

well i have an amd sempron 3000+ and it workd 4 me it didn't work at start but then i reinstalled it on the c drive(default path) and it works

 

Did you reinstalled the game or the program?

[jonesyjonez]

Ok, i placed the program on my C: drive instead of on my desktop and ran the command:

 

C:\>AloViewer.exe "C:\Games\Empire at War\GameData"

 

since my directory is not the default directory.

 

Now it's reporting "C:\AloViewer.exe is not a valid win32 application.

[Mike.nl]

Okay, for all those getting .\managers.cpp:81 errors, this is because the Empire at War directory has not been properly specified and it can't find the master index file.

 

I have updated the program to remedy this problem. It is now more "intelligent" in finding the Empire at War directory so you should have less problems starting it.

 

Download it here: http://alpha1.dyndns.info/eaw/

 

Again, let me know when something goes wrong. I really appreciate all the feedback so far.

 

PS: whiteflash: no, so far there is no other purpose then viewing. Originally I just wanted to crack the .ALO format and made a simple viewer to test my findings. Then people wanted that viewer, so I gave it to them (after making it a bit more user-friendly)

My idea was that someone could use the information I uncovered to create an ALO exporter or importer. But if that someone ends up being me, so be it (which won't be soon, as far as I can tell).

[Grompie]

Okay, for all those getting .\managers.cpp:81 errors, this is because the Empire at War directory has not been properly specified and it can't find the master index file.

 

I have updated the program to remedy this problem. It is now more "intelligent" in finding the Empire at War directory so you should have less problems starting it.

 

Download it here: http://alpha1.dyns.net/eaw/

 

Again, let me know when something goes wrong. I really appreciate all the feedback so far.

 

PS: whiteflash: no, so far there is no other purpose then viewing. Originally I just wanted to crack the .ALO format and made a simple viewer to test my findings. Then people wanted that viewer, so I gave it to them (after making it a bit more user-friendly)

My idea was that someone could use the information I uncovered to create an ALO exporter or importer. But if that someone ends up being me, so be it (which won't be soon, as far as I can tell).

 

Program runs now! It's a really good program, only to bad of the red shine. But I love to see if you can expand this program!

[Sithman1138]

Thanks for the update. Do you have any news...ANYONE...on making this a exporter/importer? Just asking.

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

I'll write it when there's enough information on the file format to export models that work reasonably well into the game. For that to happen the rest of the geometry has to be figured out, such as the meshes and things like that. The models you could put in game right now would just be static meshes (nothing but geometry). I'm also worried about that red/blue glow...

 

***Edit***

Also, it'll be for 3Ds Max 7, unless someone wants to buy me a copy of the program they want me to write it for

[Epytron_Omega]

@ jmac, if you could just make it compatible with lower levels of max as well as 7+ that would be great, as I have 5.0 at the moment...

 

@ Mike.nl, it works finally... but some of the meshes dont show up as in when I select the parts that should be visable, they dont appear... which is weird... only think I can look at for the most part are fighters, except for the Virago... so just thought I would let you know of the errors Im discovering.

 

EO

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

I don't know if it'll work with 5.0, and I can't test it on 5.0, because I only have 7.0 (SP1) at the moment. I'll do my best to try and make it compatible and fix any bugs there may be with 5.0, but I can't make any guarantees.

[Sithman1138]

I have 8....Will it work with 8?

[Andycaccia]

Are you sure they will release a model editor with the official tools??? I mean...editing a map is a thing...but creating a new unit is different. Besides..I'm struggling to find a way to make an Acclamator as Landing ship for the empire. I changed the model in <Company_Transport_Unit> line in the GROUNDCOMPANIESEMPIRE.XML file but the game crashed.

I've also created a new "custom" landing vessel in the TRANSPORTUNITS.XML using the Acclamator model and the properties of the standard landing craft but it didn't work.

I suspect that landing units need a spacific model. See this:

 

Land_Model_Name>EV_IMPERIALCRAFT.ALO</Land_Model_Name>

<Space_Model_Name>EV_IMPERIALCRAFT_SPACE.ALO</Space_Model_Name>

 

They have two specific models. How can i make a land-compatible model file for a ship that doesn't have it???

Is It possible???

[Admiral Sith]

Thats because it doesnt have a landing animation, so it will crash when you try to.

[Andycaccia]

Thank you Admiral Sith, do you have any suggestion??

[Sithman1138]

Do we even know where these animations are? I can't find them...PLUS!-Did you know some of the models crash in the alo viewer

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

@Sithman1138-

It will most likely be compatible with 3Ds Max 8, as it should have all the features of 3Ds Max 7 SP1.

[Sithman1138]

okay, that's good. Do you have a progress report?

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Like I said before, I'm waiting for the file format to be fully documented before I even start writing the plugin (what's the sense of having a Super Star Destroyer if it can't do anything?).

[JediBdm]

any chance on getting a pollygon counter built into the viewer?

[Epytron_Omega]

Like I said before, I'm waiting for the file format to be fully documented before I even start writing the plugin (what's the sense of having a Super Star Destroyer if it can't do anything?).

 

Well we know that some of the hardpoints are easy enough to mimic, all we have to do is use the same lines that are on the standard meshes as a base,

 

IE: HP_F-L_BONE, HP_F-R_BONE, HP_M-L_BONE, HP_M-R_BONE, HP_M-C_BONE, HP_E_BONE , SPAWN_00

 

And collision meshes wouldnt be hard either, just simply follow the same rule for doing those, Im not going to post the code cause everyone has the code already... but if you want, I can help you test your plugin with Max 5... its just an Idea.

 

EO

[darkthunder]

Any progress on a model viewer and or export/importer?

[Mike.nl]

Some progress, yes.

Of course, I have other responsibilities IRL as well, but I try to code on this whenever I have free time. The point is that the first steps were probably the easiest. I can give a heads up on progress so far though:

 

* I have figured out a couple of additional bytes of the mesh as well as discovered completely new chunk types in certain mesh files that need to be figured out as well.

 

* I've also looked at animations; the structure of those files is the same as that of the model files, but I still need to figure out how to interpret the actual animation data.

 

* The viewer now also displays the mesh' bounding box (located in previously unknown data), almost displays bones correctly, and a dialog that shows the model's detailed information is almost finished as well.

 

I'll see about making that new version public when those things work because it contains bones and polygon counts, something I'm sure plenty of modelers are interested in.

 

However, an importer/exporter is still quite some time away. Particularly because I need to understand every bit of both model files and animations files.

 

PS: I thought I'd mention this: it turns out my viewer showed all models mirrored. I found out about this when looking at the Stormtrooper. The bones say the gun is connected to his right hand, but when looking at the rendering, the gun was connected to his left hand. Didn't take long to realize I needed to use a right-handed coordinate system instead of the left-handed one I was using.

And by the way, 3D Studio Max also uses a right-handed coordinate system. Coincidence?

[wolfshadow]

Mike.nl: Thanks for the update, and the hard work. Guys like you are the ones who make super mods possible. Glad to see the co-operation on this forum.

[Grompie]

nice work dude!

[Epytron_Omega]

Very nice Mike.nl! Its been awhile since I have been able to view this, didnt see that it was on the second page, i have a new Video card, so I can now see everything with the viewer, excellent news about the newer version. If you need some help testing out a basic importer/exporter, Ive got both Max 5 and 7 now, so give me a hollar via PM and I will see what I can do.

 

EO

[Det. Bart Lasiter]

Some progress, yes.

Of course, I have other responsibilities IRL as well, but I try to code on this whenever I have free time. The point is that the first steps were probably the easiest. I can give a heads up on progress so far though:

 

* I have figured out a couple of additional bytes of the mesh as well as discovered completely new chunk types in certain mesh files that need to be figured out as well.

 

* I've also looked at animations; the structure of those files is the same as that of the model files, but I still need to figure out how to interpret the actual animation data.

 

* The viewer now also displays the mesh' bounding box (located in previously unknown data), almost displays bones correctly, and a dialog that shows the model's detailed information is almost finished as well.

 

I'll see about making that new version public when those things work because it contains bones and polygon counts, something I'm sure plenty of modelers are interested in.

 

However, an importer/exporter is still quite some time away. Particularly because I need to understand every bit of both model files and animations files.

 

PS: I thought I'd mention this: it turns out my viewer showed all models mirrored. I found out about this when looking at the Stormtrooper. The bones say the gun is connected to his right hand, but when looking at the rendering, the gun was connected to his left hand. Didn't take long to realize I needed to use a right-handed coordinate system instead of the left-handed one I was using.

And by the way, 3D Studio Max also uses a right-handed coordinate system. Coincidence?

Do you have any idea what that blue/red glow is yet?

[Mike.nl]

Do you have any idea what that blue/red glow is yet?

 

Nope, but honestly, I came to the opinion that I don't care

The game can render those models just fine (duh), and that's the point here, isn't it? The same goes with the shadow mesh. I may not know yet how to use that to render a shadow, but the game does. All the modeler would need to do is supply the mesh, nothing more. So these are minor issues.

 

The main problem is still that I need to understand everything of the files.

I have figured out some additional data since last time, including:

- A collision box tree chunk. Certain meshes (notably collision and shield meshes) contain this chunk that defines a spatial tree that can be traversed to get a triangle at a given location. This is probably used in collision detection.

- Particle files (Pxxxxx.ALO) are not regular meshes. In fact, particle files and model files are completely different in terms of what chunks appear in them. Again, to create models this is not really important, but would be nice if figured out.

- It would also appear that it is also possible for a model to define what particle effects appear where. For instance, the ISD model defines what bones particle effects such as p_hp_imperial_damage.alo and pe_stardestroyerengines.alo are attached to.

 

And again, animations still puzzle me. So there's no revolution just yet

 

Too bad though that the mod tools will be coming out soon (if we can believe what we hear); looks like this information won't be in time to create our own converters or plugins.