TornSoul Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/28/22113.html [ October 21, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlowbieOne Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 Very Interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 And so it begins. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kurgan Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 "Cannot find server" ; p Now that that's accomplished, let's start a movement to make Highlander a recognized religion over there. Kurgan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Vagabond Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 Of course, if Jedi is a religion, the implication would seem to be that Sith is a religion as well. Where do I get my mitochondrian injections at? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Boba Rhett Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 Jeeez.... And I thought I was a Star Wars freak... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonkH8er Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 vag, were you actually referring to injections of extra sites of cellular respiration...... or did you mean midichlorians? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bsbuckeye21 Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 I bet even George Lucas is looking at them like they're nuts! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Man1587246496 Posted October 10, 2001 Share Posted October 10, 2001 Ah, I thought mitochondrians sounded familiar from somewhere other than star wars... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt-- Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 Very nice, but did anyone read this As such, Jedi Knight is not officially recognised as a religion Then again, neither is Christianity. Does the jedi religion have an official website where you can get info about it? Curious: You need a priest to perform a conversion. Is there a Jedi Master on the East Cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 Originally posted by matt-windu: Does the jedi religion have an official website where you can get info about it? The only thing I can find so far is this forum. The idea of the Jedi as a religion isn't really as bonkers as it first seems. All belief systems started somewhere...and are invariably propagated by 'disciples' or 'prophets' in their early stages. From small acorns, oak trees grow, and it would not surprise me in the least if the Jedi code becomes the basis of a wide-spread religion in a couple of hundred years. The concept of Star Wars itself has captured the imagination of not just one, but several generations, with millions of dedicated fans world-wide. It is probably as popular today as when the first film was released. Who is to say that in a few hundred years time, the movies are not viewed in the same way as religious texts today? The Force was never really a new concept anyway - GL just decided to bundle up everything paranormal and telekinetic, and give it an umbrella name...The Force. The power of the mind has never satisfactorily been explored, and it is a subject that has fascinated me for some time. I am inclined to believe that some people do have the capacity for telekinesis. As we advance as a race, we may begin to actively encourage the development of such abilities (remember the experiments within the US and other places that used people to see other locations around the world etc.). In the future, who is to say that some people do not become proficient in the use of such abilities? If such was the case, it might also be appropriate to have a structure or code in place to determine how these people should act and react within their environment. There is always the danger that someone with a telekinetic power could have criminal tendencies...a concept that has been explored time and time again in films and comics, all the way back to the first super-heros and super-villains. What GL introduced in Star Wars was borrowed from many different sub-genres, and some of those genres touch on very real areas of science and parapsychology. So as a concept, a Jedi religion may not be a bad thing. There is a moral code, a sense of honour, justice and duty that comes across in the films, and as basic tenets, these are very positive. Just some thoughts. ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G.P LeChuck Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 I can't believe I'm reading this. You guys are FRUITCAKES! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 That's right. Taste all that extra-fruity goodness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GonkH8er Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 Fruitcakes? well..... we are devilishly delicious....... and as evidenced by the photos thread....... we're quite tasty looking too. What other links can we establish? There will be a lot more of us as xmas approaches We're are a bit..... nutty, even fruity at times. Sometimes we sit around, not doing much at all.... Some of us get better with age..... other just turn seedy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormHammer Posted October 11, 2001 Share Posted October 11, 2001 Heh. Well, a lot of us keep up on currant affairs. Many of us go out on dates Some of us nuts live in Brazil Many of us have lost our cherries We occasionally get iced when we play games. We all like a slice of the action. I think I should stop now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hito-Kage Posted October 12, 2001 Share Posted October 12, 2001 One thing that the World has in common is religion. What is religion? you ask does any one actually know the answer. Well from what I have studied it means "Mans attempt to worship God". I dont know of any God in in star wars. Another question, Some of you think that it is possible to be in such a state of mind that telekintics is possible. That there are places of the mind we have not tapped. So would it be fair to say that there once was a man who was so intune with a higher power that he walked on water, raised his hand and a raging storm calmed down to stillness. Raised a dead child back to life, Gave sight to the blind, made the cripled walk, Casted out evil spirits of those who believed. I dont know you tell me is it possible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt-- Posted October 12, 2001 Share Posted October 12, 2001 I'll be as blunt as possible. God and the Force are synonymous. Example: Moses. He was a jedi. He had a staff(ok, it wasn't a lightstaff, but it was headed for the right direction). God gave him the power to move the water, etc... and he protected the innocence. The Bible is full of people that, in the star wars universe, would be considered jedi. Their called saints, and they perform miracles. Just have a little faith and it becomes so obvious it's hard to miss. Many people have special abilities that make them seem super-human. Through thought, I can ignore pain, coldness, and most other "bad" feelings. Guess what. We have to evolve into something greater than ourselves sooner or later. Why not now? I'm anxious as to what comes after chimp and present-day man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurt Plummer Posted October 15, 2001 Share Posted October 15, 2001 Worshiping fiction requires a break in the linear if not lineal chain to inspire 'dramatic editorialship' without such a loss of media production/display capability and comprehension as to lose the ability to project to others the concepts under discussion. One way or t'other we would either: Confront _massive_ reality breaks that were simply laughable. Lose the electrical, manufacturing or mathematical coding capabilities to reproduce the 'book' of largely visual effects. Or NOT lose (refuse to gain) the simplification of complexity ethic that is putting all of creations randomness upon a higher power. Hence if the copyright says 20th Century Fox and the Original Screenplay is by George Lucas you will have a good idea that this is a work (for better or 'else') by _MAN_. As for the Force and 'Jedi in General'. The first thing a man does to get himself into grief over some idiocy of religion is to differentiate, by name, among 'gods'. In some ways this can be useful as it allows individual expressionism among the mooing herd using pantheonic representation, by class, gender or elemental association. As soon as you get to the level of social ennui as demands a 'unified theocracy' (my god is the best and not only the best but the only) you start interrupting the linear paths of mythic representation that are the textual or vocal 'history' or participant relevance of a people. This usually leads to wars of selective alliance and ultimate annihilation between given religious 'furvenants'. The smart leaders of which attempt no directing of or interference in the base viciousness of militantly expounded ignorance and instead simply ensure that somewhere, somehow, there is a designated external victim. Once 'resolved' this in turn leaves one relatively wealthy, profit centerred (the only survivors being equal-handed death merchants) 'realist' pov gentile society which finds no great interest in the extant superiority of any singular monotheistic that is an absolute of ANY given moralism (one of the few enduring lessons of religion is that it must be both entertaining and polar personality faulted to survive) and finds that that's really 'okay'-convenient because he can now negotiate with the physical limits of himself and society to a better more rapidly developed social end. This continues until overpopulation and/or the caste/race based moral entropy consequences of same meet an environmental 'resource opportunism' depletion threshold ceiling. Which int turn usually leads to a micro extinction event, one of the base preconditional indicators of which being a desire to return to, you guessed it, Simplification Theorem as represented by one or many godheads. Conflict follows next, together with a reduction to base-form devolution. Bioengineering 'magic' is one way to exist past this MEE with a form of genetically certain psionics that may require selective breeding and/or developmental (nutrition for instance) constraint obeyance but is not mechanically leveraged to the presence of any given technology legacy. The problem with this is pocketing vs. travel times which may involve diverse cultural route pathing and/or maintenance of varying degrees of 'old world' capability. The fact that while the governments of the world are strict in their public remonstrations against GE, they are also the only ones with the wealth and restricted materials access to make it happen also is a beach of separate-evolution 'enhancement, not equality'. The final results of all this, whether we can hold onto our technology specialist social integration or not, is something between a B-V Psi Corps, Star Wars 'Force Machines' and MZB's Darkover World Setting. Depending on how strictly the elite must be self policing for internal power structure maintenance vs. how hard it is to breed perfect-prefects in comparison to simply physics-of-biology comprehension harvesting of an engineered equivalent and lastly how much the desire to elevate the 'special' from the masses can be unified to a practical elitism (which almost always must, ultimately be interdependent through a slave-religious linkage) Using the above described elevation-to-annihilation cyclative curve theory where the only separation of total vs. partial destruction will be by-degrees based on the governmental organizational (logistical and corporate memory intel as much as 'actualized' technology) of what could quickly become breed-specific 'magic'; I have no confidence in the notion of a world wide Jedi 'honor system' ever being viable. Only the exploitation of specific capabilities into weapons-unique throwbacks to earlier and earlier (smaller and smaller responsibility chains) levels of non-cognitive action and reaction. The losers of which would be 'norms' who must vulnerably think-then-build to act instead of achieve instinctively-instantaneous do-magic And one where the 'remembrance' (a surprisingly important and oft-ignored element of time awareness enhancement) of past-action by mechanical record to avoid consequence repetition and encourage growth is lost by those to whom it has little importance. Such societal cloistering until and unless the magic would again be forgotten or lost to our genetic-touch would be a recipe for disaster not rejuvenance via the knowing of ANY 'greater reality' school of universal wisdom. Gee, thanks but I'll pass. If you want to be an elite, be it at the ultimate level: your-self and sole through random genetic miracle or personal enlightenment. At least then the holier-than-thou or devil-drives image you create is a valid (singular) representation of the good or ill put forth by _your own actions_. Not those of some muddy, uncertain and ultimately hypocritical 'social order' you are created by. Kurt Plummer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kurgan Posted October 15, 2001 Share Posted October 15, 2001 I can see a spiritual group using Star Wars as myth or metaphor for their ideology, that's perfectly fine (in fact several people have already done that, and none of them worships starwars, they just see in it religious metaphors, which were intended by Lucas and his people when he made the whole franchise). But to believe (as real literal truth) in something that was clearly intended and repeatedly admitted to be pure fiction by the AUTHOR HIMSELF is just plain silly. I can for example take the story of King Arthur (who may or may not have existed, but most of the stories about him are probably pure hokum) and apply it to my life in such a way as to try to become a better person by following the heroic ideals in his story, or to take Paul Bunyan or Pecos Bill, etc or the Jolly Green Giant and use it in a positive way in my life, but I don't have to for one minute say "yes they really did exist exactly like the story says" or worship them as gods, etc. Most people (except maybe Unitarians) who worship something, believe that it exists in reality, else what is the point of worshipping it? That would get into the realm of idealism perhaps. Could you worship an ideal you know doesn't exist, just as something to strive for? But if you knew it didn't exist, then it would be a metaphor, more along the lines of what some Unitarians would use (and if there are any UU's out there who can correct my understanding of your beliefs, fire away). I'm sure many folks know this by now, but "Jedi Knight" is NOT an official religion, all that was done was that it was put as a category on the census form for organizational purposes (to assist with counting the census forms that used it as a write in) it will not appear on future forms as an official option and it is not a state recognized "religion" etc, according to all official spokespeople. You can check out the various Urban Legends debunking pages for more data (about.com, snopes, etc). Sorry guys... Anyway, the whole point isn't that people are worshipping starwars (well other than a few lunatic fans do with any fandom, heh), it's that the whole thing was a joke/political statement deal on the census. It was like if everybody got together and where it asked your "color/race" you put "Purple" and told all your friends to do so. It's not like there really is a purple "race" just that everybody wanted to show how they thought the question was silly and wanted to protest it in an amusing way, or else just like putting "yes please" for "sex," ie: a lame joke. Update(links): http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/weekly/aa041601a.htm http://www.snopes2.com/religion/jedi.htm http://news.excite.com/news/r/011012/08/odd-jedi-dc (especially the last article) PS: Numerous people sent me the UK article (which I was unable to access until recently) as news, I was not going to post it, since it was a false rumor/debunked item, plus it's not gaming related. It's a curiosity and conversation starter though, I'll admit. Kurgan [ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt-- Posted October 15, 2001 Share Posted October 15, 2001 Now that you mention it, A nearby Catholic high school has been showing clips of star wars films, using them as metaphors. Most prominent is the "coming of age film". I saw the new one, this one is actually a fan film. The effects are pretty badly done though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hito-Kage Posted October 15, 2001 Share Posted October 15, 2001 Being a Christian I can see some Similarities, between the the Jedi Knights of Star Wars and the Christian people. I consider Myself an apprentice, a man in training and in study of God(the Force in Star Wars terms). I have a teacher, The Holy Spirit. Like Yoda and Obi-Wan tought Luke Skywalker I am tought discernment, to reconize between good and evil,and self discipline to name a few. The more and more I listen and learn from my teacher and through daily repentance, The more Gods Power(or the Force in Star Wars terms) flows throuh me. Jesus is like the Perfect Jedi, an offspring of God(the Force)himself. and he has defeated for use the greatest foe of all, death. With his light sabre of rightousness he Severed the chains of Sin(the Dark side) allowing us to fully become one with God(the light side of the Force). Lastly Christianity, is not a religion but a relationship. [ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Hito-Kage ] [ October 15, 2001: Message edited by: Hito-Kage ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
access_flux Posted October 21, 2001 Share Posted October 21, 2001 good way of thinking Hito-kage, i agree with you there, i being the star wars nerd that i am - i dun look like a nerd tho - i follow stuff like the Jedi Code, because some of it relates very closely to the commandments, and i know it sounds stupid but i consider my self an apprentice too. PLUS I TOLD YA IT WOULD BECOME A RELEGION!! HA! [ October 21, 2001: Message edited by: Access_fluX ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hito-Kage Posted October 21, 2001 Share Posted October 21, 2001 The funny thing is that we all have this part inside us that wants to be good, to do the right thing, as you said, to follow the jedi code. The Jedi code is just basically a set of personell guid lines that one must follow in attemps to keep from straying to the dark side. Another thing that I find interesting is the similarities between jedi knight code and the code of the bushido. Samurais were very much like the jedi knights of star wars. The essence of being a true samurai is the death of one self, for if the self has not been sacraficed then one cannot serve his master commpletely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kurgan Posted October 21, 2001 Share Posted October 21, 2001 Making a distinction between "relationship" and "religion" or "spirituality" and "religion" is an artificial one. While the intention may be to differentiate between somebody who grows up in a tradition and just goes through the motions, and somebody who earnestly follows the spirit of a tradition they believe to be true, it sets up the problem of saying that "religion" is really something negative, while what religion is, is something other than what it is. I've heard many people disparage the word "religion" because they don't know what it means. One person even told me "Jesus hates religion" (of course if you refer to the Bible Paul appears to be encouraging "true religion" so I guess the message was lost on him??). While everyone has their own opinion, I think that a little analysis is in order. Most people have "a religion." According to anthropologists, if you say you're a Christian, then Christianitiy is your "religion" even if you call it something else, etc. If you just take into account claimed adherence to various world religions (the ones we know about) about 4 of the six billion+ people on earth belong to some religion. The other two billion are divided into "Atheist/Agnostic" and "No Religion." Now there are varieties of Atheists and Agnostics and "No Religion" can probably include a myriad of things, from Atheism to doing in the church short of putting "Christian" on your census form. Many people do not belong to a so-called "organized religion" (ie: don't visit a particular church, recite a specific creed, etc) but may have their own beliefs about how the world/life works. They may believe in fate, luck, destiny, providence, souls, or pseudo-occult stuff. Recently the term "New Age" has come about to include some of the free-forming mysticist types of religion that in prior times might be simply called "superstition" or "not religion." But these beliefs may be held as ardently and faithfully as any "official" belief system out there. Some people may even ascribe religious qualities to typically non-religious (in common thinking) activities, like fishing, or golf, or sex. Even secular humanism in a sense has a base in thought that we should help people because it's the right thing to do, even if you're not saying it's because a God or wise sage told you that you should do it, etc. The definition of "religion" (dictionary.com): 1) a. Belief in and reverence for a supernatural power or powers regarded as creator and governor of the universe. b. A personal or institutionalized system grounded in such belief and worship. 2. The life or condition of a person in a religious order. 3. A set of beliefs, values, and practices based on the teachings of a spiritual leader. 4. A cause, principle, or activity pursued with zeal or conscientious devotion. Notice the definition includes both INSTITUTIONALIZED (ie: organized) and PERSONAL, so Joe Blow who loves Jesus, and Cardinal Bernadine are both following "Religion." I would confer with Eliade by saying that 'religion' is somehow an innate quality of human existence, perhaps an evolved characteristic, perhaps not, but there's something about religion that is part of being human (and no I'm not saying people who don't claim to have a religion are not human, just that they may not call it that, but in some sense they still have it). Kurgan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kurgan Posted October 21, 2001 Share Posted October 21, 2001 Oh and for the last time, "Jedi Knight" is NOT an officially recognized religion, to date, anywhere on earth that I know of. Sorry to disapoint you! See the links I provided above, and even if you re-read the initial posted "The Register" article, they posted an UPDATE clarification at the bottom. Btw, another fun way to look at this would be to think of the GAME whenever you see these articles. Now there's a religious following if I ever saw one (complete with all its various sects and denominations). ; ) Kurgan [ October 21, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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