Guest Toothless-OMO Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 OK, guys here goes. I have Never Played the Demo, nor Have I played any AoE Games or the Like. Pros: 1. Tons of units to build. 2. A Huge Tech Tree that would take one long game to reach the end of. 3. Easy Control Interface. 4. Nice Surroundings and Wildlife. 5. 6 Races to Play This is my first impression list so it might change in the future. Cons: 1. Way to much Resource Gathering. This game requires Way to Much Micro-management with 4 Separate Resources. 2. (Related to Number 1) The Darn limit of 5 units at a time until you build more homes. It really is like another Resource that you have to track all the time. They should have eliminated it and just had a unit cap instead. 3. The Tech Tree Poster with the game. Who in their Right Mind Plays a Game with a HUGE Poster unfolded in front of them? 4. Graphics are about acceptable. But things like engine flames look stuck on the ships. 5. No way to Rotate the map (Well at least I do not know how) 6. No Way to Select All of the Same Type of Unit. No Way to Select All Military Units. No way to Set the Factories so Units Come out Already Part of an Assigned Group. 7. Rather Slow Game Play, with 75 Workers Running Around and 25 Attack Units. (OK, Maybe a Little Over Statement but workers many times out number Fighting Units by a lot. . . . Sad Really) 8. No Easy Way to Connect to GameSpy in Menu. Only the Ever so Intrusive Zone. I refuse to Play there. OK, as a New User until I get my feet a bit wetter with this game, I would give it currently a 6 out 10 for a rating. That's enough for Now. Flame Away. Ahh, You Can't Any Longer Flaming on these Boards!!! Maybe they will make an exception in this case!!! :D Toothless-OMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Compa_Mighty Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 You ask for things that can only be done in 3-D. All units of the same kind are selected if you double click a unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB_StormTrooper Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 they should make somthing like this 3-d, it would be cool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorpiuscat Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 I would like to have the ability to set units to guard an area instead of them running after enemy units leaving an area vunerable. Can you do this? (I know I should read the directions) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kudar Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 I'm new to this too and My advice - don't play experienced Age of King players - they make your life hell, right Leon? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest darkmaster Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 Originally posted by Scorpiuscat I would like to have the ability to set units to guard an area instead of them running after enemy units leaving an area vunerable. Can you do this? (I know I should read the directions) you have to set the interface in advanced mode, then select the unit and select the Defense mode Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dvlos Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 the manual neatly explains unit formations and guarding bldgs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest kennymaster Posted November 16, 2001 Share Posted November 16, 2001 i dont agree with this cons...for me the game is perfect but they should put more races...but we cant call races, cause rebels r not a race even empire.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagobahn Eagle Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 2. (Related to Number 1) The Darn limit of 5 units at a time until you build more homes. It really is like another Resource that you have to track all the time. They should have eliminated it and just had a unit cap instead. When you get the full game, play the TF who do not need houses. Oh, and a strategy game has been made in 3D: Force Commander. And 3D strategy just isn't fun. 3D tactics, however.. *Cough*Ground Control*cough* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TarlSS Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Your complaints are unfoundered. Houses, resource gathering, and tech trees are not that hard to do. Just learn to use hot keys and resources and houses are a breeze. You don't need to memorize tech trees, the whole thing is rather intuitive. Or just build lots of houses when you have excess wood. You ARE getting excess wood, aren't you? Three, the thing about fighters and workers- raise the unit cap. Secondly, in any civilization, workers always out number fighters. Despite China having 1 Billion people, their army is just under 1 million people. Thats 1/100 of the population.... Four, factories have waypoints. Use the I key. Gamespy sucks Rotating the map requires a 3d engine. I liked Force Commander, but many folks didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Influenza Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Rotating a map does NOT require a 3d engine, Tarl. Play SimCity 3000. Factories may have waypoints, but that's not what Toothless said. He wants units to be presassigned to a control group as they are built from a factory. It's a very nice feature found unfortunately in few strategy games. So before you treat someone like a child, make sure you fully understand what they said. Unit caps are ridiculous, they're only something programmers use to hide the fact that their game can't process too many units at once. Honestly, why would the Empire or TF be limited in how large its army was? It just doesn't make sense. But that's a feature of the AoK engine, not something LA has any control over. Gamespy: Zone sucks harder. And until more people in this "community" get the game, it's hard to find a multiplayer game anywhere, unless you sell your soul to Microsoft and sign up for Zone. Population sizes: point being? SW is not real-life. I doubt 1 in 100 Rebel members were military...more like 1 in 2. Houses are a pain in the rear. It's not something that actually adds to gameplay at ALL, or makes the game any more enjoyable. Resource-gathering isn't too bad, but things go VERY slowly until you've got 15-20 workers goin' at it. And then things stockpile immediately...there's no real "intermediate" resource-phase, where you have enough resources to build an attack force, but not enough to fund a massive army. That's a huge chunk of potential strategy that the game lacks. As for assigning a/many worker(s) to a hotkey...well...that's one more hotkey you can't use for your attack force. I really wish that LA had allowed the use of numeral 0 in attack groups... "Intuitive" tech trees? Not really. Why do my advancements in "Mech" (I think it's a terrible disgrace to call AT-ST/AT/AV's "Mechs") armoring not apply to my battle droids? I don't see why they'd be made of different armor. Or why such advancements wouldn't apply to ships. Do you really think that ground and sea-based armorings are so radically different that a drastic improvement in one would have 0 effect on the other? So, it seems, your response is "unfoundered." ------------------- What things can only be done in 3D, Compa? I see nothing that Toothless mentioned. And double-clicking on a unit only selects all of that type on the screen. There's no way to actually select ALL or your units of X type, something I sorely miss, coming from Total Annihilation, where Control+Z selects all units of the current type. Even if SWGB allowed selecting up to the max # of one type of unit.... it would be very convenient. But that wouldn't work because of the limitation on group-selection-size. ------------------- Dagobahn: that's an absurd statement to make. Only play TF? Why not eliminate the need for housing altogether? It's a stupid concept that should have died with Warcraft. Honestly...what does it add to a game? Oh, I know, you get to allow one race to ignore housing concerns as an excuse for their wimpy troopers. You ever play Earth 2150? Marvelous game. And guess what? IT WAS IN 3D! How is that possible, when 3D strategy != Fun? Just because LA screwed up with FC doesn't mean a 3D game is un-doable. ------------------- This game is far from perfect. It's fun, but there are a lot of things that could have been done much better. Like unit formations (which should have been dropped, or at least able to be dis-abled), pathfinding (keep seeing pummels that just stop in front of their targets and don't attack), auto-firing issues (often units don't fire at nearby enemies, even on aggressive, until you move them, tell them to Stop, or force-fire), shooting through walls with lasers, and naming conventions (I understand the desire for the 6 races to appear homogenous, but naming an animal with a cannon a "strike mech", or an AT-AT an "assault mech"? Puh-leeeze). Don't let your excitement at an (actually) good LA/SW game make you ignore the flaws. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisw_30 Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Yes there are some flaws in this game...but I would prefer to have great gameplay over graphics anyday... Just look at Commando's..thats a great game....and Commando's 2 doesnt seem to have any new graphics (please put me in my place if i am wrong) The major point of games is that they are fun....and let me tell you as will every other GB fan out there...this game is fun!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Toothless-OMO Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Influenza, thanks for the supoport. Chrisw, I think it is fun as well, but that it could be better. Hey guys, thanks for all the response. I do understand some of your points, but you need to realize that I come at this game as a RTS Player, not a Star Wars Fan, not a Aok, or AoE Player, not even a strict 3D Gamer. With out quoting let me just a few things, please. Not all games require vast amounts of units gathering resources to be effective, realistic, or enjoyable. Games such as Homewold, Homeworld:Cataclysm, Red Alert 2, Submarine Titans (btw ST had 4 resources as well, but hardly any micro-management in it), and most recently Conquest Frontier Wars. Just so you know, I have played Dark Reign, DR2, Battlezone 2, RA2, RA2 YR, TA, TA:Kingdoms, Z:Steel Soldiers, Far Gate, Earth 2150, The Moon Project, Ground Control, and others. So I do understand RTS gamming a bit. All use a lot less units to harvest and the game still remains very fun. All I am saying in the resource area is that this game requires to many units devoted to it, and to much oversight of it. For example: Farmers just stand around after a field is used up. Why not make it so they "auto-replant" or make it so the field never stops producing. (and please do say that is unrealistic. We are after all playing a game that is totally unrealistic!) Fruit pickers stop picking after bushes are used up, even if more area has been explored and other bushes are now in sight. They should automatically move to any plants within LOS, Line of Sight of any unit. It just seems way to much effort to gather resources, when the player could be focusing more on the game play of attack and strategy. I submit that building a ton of workers is not a strategy of this game it is a necessity!!!! Also, about the 3D engine. Conquest Frontier Wars is a 2D playing field, with 3D units that is very smooth in rotating the map. Submarine Titans was 3D playing field with 2D Units that had map rotation as well. It can be done. This game seems to have a ton of objects that things can get behind, and unless you see the little outline of the unit there they will stay. Again, these are first impressions, but I do not think I will ever change my mind on the resource issue of to many needed, nor the issue of needing housing for every 5 units created. To much watch care where it is NOT needed. Toothless-OMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EndSub Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 About the resource thing....that isn't really a game issue....its more of a player issue.....not saying your wrong....just diffrent people have diffrent tastes....and maybe the resource side of this game doesn't suit your tastes perfectly...... The game is built for you to have to manage your resources, which introduces a whole new plain of stratagy......ok, that may sound lame, this game is not about war, not farming. But if you can get your economy going then you can get that army crunching up rebel scum in no time (unless, of course, your the rebels ) but if your opponent can't get his going...then he is in a whole lot of trouble....this means you can do raids, killing his workers, therefore stopping his economy, and in turn stopping his army TIP: there is a farming queue. Look under food procesing plant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Destroyer Droid Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Reading your post the vibes i pick up tell me you find the game to hard. Your use to ra2 or something like that which requires little or no economic skill. This game isnt just some put down magical farms and forget about it type. It takes great practice to master this game. I suggest you play TF on Dm because that would suit the kind of game you want. (You Are able to build an army and villagers at the start and not have to worry about your economy for a long time) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Com Raven Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 3. The Tech Tree Poster with the game. Who in their Right Mind Plays a Game with a HUGE Poster unfolded in front of them? Uhmm, sorry, but this is really bull**** !!! You complain about ppl giving you something for free ?? Btw, just hang it over your pc and you'll be fine .... And 4 Ressources give the game much more depth : I don't much of ressource x, but a lotta y ! So I have to adjust my strategy according to it .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Toothless-OMO Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 It makes no difference if you get something "free" after paying $50.00 for it! The fact remains it is useless in the way it was made. It would have been better and more useful if they were 2 page foldouts in the manual. One for each race. Oh, btw about hanging the Poster over your computer. I don't have that ability, nor can you see both sides if you have it hung there. Also, I do not find the game to hard. What is so hard about building 50 workers. My entire point is that it is to much micro-management that is not needed. If you have never played Submarine Titans you ought to give it a try. It had 4 resources as well, Metal, Corium, Oxygen, and Gold. The last 2 were collected by structures not units. You still had to build the correct number to have a good amount of them but they never stopped working. I get the sense that some just do not like that I think there is a flaw in the game. Maybe, I will change my mind, but I think if you look at it more objectively I think you are a bit harder pressed to give a good reason why the player should have to watch their workers so closely, and build so many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TieSolo Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Toothless, although I am enjoying the game quite a bit, I agree with you on several points. This game with an Earth 2150 style of resource management would have been incredible. I think the designers stuck a little too much to the AOK model. I mean, "carbon" instead of wood....its a bit lame. But overall I don't mind micromanagement and it makes sense that you have to get some kind of economy up and running before pumping out the units. -TieSolo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duder Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Give toothless a break...he is just giving his opinion on the game!!! If it is any help, you can play death match games where you have high resources and start in tech 4. A lot of AoE players did this as the micromanagement aspect becomes more of routine than any kind of fun....saying that though I think its an important aspect of the game. As for a few other of your criticsims, you should read up on the hotkeys as they will allow you to do some of the things you thought you couldnt, such as selecting all the same type of unit is simply done by double clicking on one of that specific unit and all we be selected! Hope this is some use to you, and I'm sure that you will continue to find the game more rewarding Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisw_30 Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Thats a good point duder.. Toothless if you dont like the resources and resource collecting work (I dont care either way).....just play your games post tech lev 4 and high resources...as Duder says Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Influenza Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 duder: And double-clicking on a unit only selects all of that type on the screen. There's no way to actually select ALL or your units of X type, something I sorely miss, coming from Total Annihilation, where Control+Z selects all units of the current type. Even if SWGB allowed selecting up to the max # of one type of unit.... it would be very convenient. I submit that building a ton of workers is not a strategy of this game it is a necessity!!!!I second that .The game is built for you to have to manage your resources, which introduces a whole new plain of stratagy......ok, that may sound lame...Yeah, it did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagobahn Eagle Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Dagobahn: that's an absurd statement to make. Only play TF? Why not eliminate the need for housing altogether? It's a stupid concept that should have died with Warcraft. Honestly...what does it add to a game? Oh, I know, you get to allow one race to ignore housing concerns as an excuse for their wimpy troopers. You ever play Earth 2150? Marvelous game. And guess what? IT WAS IN 3D! How is that possible, when 3D strategy != Fun? Just because LA screwed up with FC doesn't mean a 3D game is un-doable. I meant in the beginnning of the game. Personally, I like TF, but I play other civs just as much. Okay, I take my 3D case back . You win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TarlSS Posted November 17, 2001 Share Posted November 17, 2001 Actually, the AOK engine was built specifically so you would have to micromanage the nuances of trade and economics. AOK was supposed to be an "Empire-Building game" with heavy RTS elements. It's not specifically a war game, and the multiple resources and trading elements were stuck in to reflect that. So the engine was specifically designed for the resource micromanagement, and that translated into SWGB. What can you do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Influenza Posted November 18, 2001 Share Posted November 18, 2001 Complain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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