Guest AcidRane Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 I'm just wondering, because I've tried playing on this difficulty, and it's impossible to keep up with the comp.. unless it uses some insanely effcient building scheme. I'm not the best player in the world, but I've won my fair share of games... there's got to be a way to play that well on a side note... has anyone every won a monument race on hardest? I can't even come close Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kudar Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 Surely the computer has the ability to multi task on all the units, which will be where the problem lies, or maybe yor ain't quick enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DOOR Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 well either way, i like your pic from fallout. have you got the game? have you compleated fallout 1 and 2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gungan_Reble Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 Kudar is right experience with lots of other RTS games, leads me to beleve that although some Ai in games do, shall we say have a built in edge it is the multi tasking early in a new game that let's most of us down, when we get used to the game after a while our abilities then surpass that of the comp, ai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jubjubjub Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 The computer starts with 500-1000 or so extra resources on hardest, which means it can crank out the villagers and advance tech levels very fast. I made a scenario starting them out with only a town center (no workers) and zero resources. Testing it, I saw them crank out villagers non-stop. The multitasking wasn't all that different from what you would do, they just start with a ton of resources. With this scenario, their tech 2 times increased from 4.5 minutes to 12 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IdLe_WorkeR Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 The AI is derived from that included with AoE II TC -- it is part of the "engine" acquired by Lucas Arts from Ensemble Studios. That said, it is clear that LA has made enormous modifications to the AI relative to what they acquired. The AI had to be rewritten to utilize the units in SWBG, instead of those in AoE II TC, and to know how to behave on the new maps provided by LA. So they have done a lot of work. You can get an idea of how much by comparing the sizes of the gamedata.drs files from the two games. SWGBs is 1.2mg, AoE II TCs is .9mg. As for cheating, at Hardest I believe the old AoE II TC AI started with 500 more of each resourse (did wonders for age advancing) and received 500 more of each every 20 minutes. At hard, I THINK it got 100 or 200 of each at 20 minute intervals, but did not start out with more. I could never prove this as I never did learn the trick of editing the ai files... I was using the wrong editor, or something. Hopefully some smart C pgmr will come along and provide us with the tools to mess with the AI and make mod packs to SWBG, as can be done for the age series. P. S. --- the AI does NOT learn --- it just choose strategies at random. It may be capable of responding to attacks, i. e., if attacked by aircraft, make AA turrets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dlayers Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 One way you might be able to test this theory is to RECORD the game and then save out chapters say, every 5 minutes.... Then when you go in and load the saved game, switch to the computer player and see what his resources are at or sit and watch and see how they change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darthfergie Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 Don't worry they are basically all knowing and can do a MILLION things at once...I played most of the OOM-9 campaign on hard and then I stoped doing that because it was taking me forEVER to finish the campaign...but like I said they can use all their troops and still give separate tasks to every single one of them while you can only control a few at a time...well at least this AI isn't a pushover like AoK's was... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest dlayers Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 By the way, 3 of us played against 1 computer (hardest). He picked on me first and I was out in less than 5 minutes. He had 2 cannons, 3-4 mounted troopers, several reg troopers and a jedi master. I had about 10 workers, a fortress, a turret, a few prefabs and a couple other military buildings (mech, troop center) The computer then made quick work of the 2nd guy and the 3rd guy resigned knowing his impending doom. We did have a good game in 3vs3 computers on hard level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Com Raven Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 It cheats with ressources, but it doesn't cheat as SC did with a completely revealed map at the beginning ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zygomaticus Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 a good way to find out is to play a game on hardest record it!! and then watch the computer while viewing the recorded game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gungan_Reble Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 Originally posted by krkode a good way to find out is to play a game on hardest record it!! and then watch the computer while viewing the recorded game krkode Yes I have done that with AOK in the past it's amazing what you can find out watching the comp's side of the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordus1587246506 Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 heh.....ill explain this very simple Human Player- one mind, one keyboard, one mouse, two hands Comuter player- Equivalent of infinite minds, infinite keyboards, infinite mice. and infitnite hands......get the picture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WC_heavyarms Posted November 21, 2001 Share Posted November 21, 2001 good comparison... I'll try the record on a DM sometime... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dvlos Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 No on hardest its obvious the computer is playing on Hard but with like 20% bonus on all resource gathering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest IdLe_WorkeR Posted November 22, 2001 Share Posted November 22, 2001 Wall like there is no tomorrow.... or there won't be. The comp player does not understand walls very well, so it takes a while to go thru Medium walls. Layer the walls two or more tiles deep. Defend against air power. Comp player does not seem to know how to use air transports, but will use sea transports minimally, so expect to defend again mild sea invasions now and then. Build up, and then bleed the computer opponent to death. This is why playing the comp. opponent does not prepare you for online play. The techniques you need are very different. I think a mod to the comp AI scripts would get it to use air, unless a targeting problem exists (where to land...). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AcidRane Posted November 23, 2001 Share Posted November 23, 2001 ugh. It does cheat... well, gets a lot of extra resources. That's pretty crappy AI. I think multi-tasking is definately something the comp uses, but when it starts out with more resources, that just gives it two advantages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Influenza Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 The AI cheats in another way, completely different from resources. It can detect when you tell your units to attack its own and respond properly. Trust me, I've seen it a number of times...telling some of my units to attack a small force of AI units (which are conveniently attacking my ally at the time), only to see the AI's units immediately turn around and head for my approaching army. I mean, immediately. And don't say that cheating AI's are crappy. YOU try translating the human thought process into a meager AI script that will run on everyone's 233 MHz Pentium II . There has never been a "great" AI for an RTS game. They all seem challenging at first, but any serious player can beat the hardest AI without breaking out a sweat. Hell, I beat the AI on Hard the first time I ever played this game, relying on pure RTS skills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bobio Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 Originally posted by Influenza The AI cheats in another way, completely different from resources. It can detect when you tell your units to attack its own and respond properly. Trust me, I've seen it a number of times...telling some of my units to attack a small force of AI units (which are conveniently attacking my ally at the time), only to see the AI's units immediately turn around and head for my approaching army. I mean, immediately. Yep. Today I was playin a game, and I ordered my cruisers to shell some ai troops on the land. The same instant i gave the order, the ai guys ran away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEDI_MASTA Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 yeah but iv never seen an AI actually cheat why should it hafta with multi tasking it shouldnt b able to lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tie Guy Posted November 24, 2001 Share Posted November 24, 2001 Originally posted by JEDI_MASTA yeah but iv never seen an AI actually cheat why should it hafta with multi tasking it shouldnt b able to lose Well, multi-tasking, while very hrlpfull, won't win you games in itself, and on hardest it simply isn't enough to keep up wth the much, much more complex and learned mind of a human. So, it cheats to make it harder for you to win. Besides, multi-tasking in itself is, a cheat, since no person on earth could possibly do this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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