DannyJAllTheWay Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 I personally don't like absorb. I didn't like it in 1.02 and I really don't like it in 1.03. They made it worse in 1.03. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwyng Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 Absorb should NOT be nerfed. It is fine as it is. What needs to happen is the dark side needs some sort of counter to it - in JK1, both grip and throw were great counters to absorb. I'd like to see them put throw back in, but integrate it with grip - you grip an item, then hold your crosshair over an enemy and it throws it at him. And actually, decreasing the mana cost for drain WOULD affect absorb slightly - right now, you actually use more mana than you drain, nullifying any force advantage you have over your enemy. In 1.02, drain left you with FAR more force than your enemy, preventing him from pulling/pushing, etc. If drain is unnerfed so that it can be used to put the force advantage in your favor, which is pretty much what absorb does (since the enemy can't use force against you). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinflames Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 absorb is the only power that makes the light side even worth taking. even mind trickers max absorb. why? cos absorb prevents the following: push-pull backstab(dont get me started) Lighting(remeber the LLamers on 1.02? so many of them) drain(irritating) choke(the single most irritating bitch of a move ever) ppl who h8 absorb r the same ppl who lack the skill to kill without offensive forcing sum1 to point of death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutek Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 Oh good grief. I knew this would happen. This would have been the complaints had an official patch been released, which modified the backstabs. Always they will find something to complain about. Methinks I may just hang up my f***ing lightsaber and go play something else. Sure I'll miss the great fun I had with the quite excellent melee combat (try playing Morrowind sometime...you begin to appreciate JK2 even more after combat in that game), and some of the people I've met online. But the rest of you? Not a whit - I'm sick to death of seeing "this is overpowered", "that 's too powerful...this suxors", "patch it Raven, my willy's too small". Just stop it, act like adults and then maybe you'll be treated like them. If you're only a kid, try acting like an adult - you'll find people respect your opinions more. This game is *NOT* Quake 3, but this community has become all that I hated about that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurgan Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 THE FORCE is cheesy, get used to it. That's why Jango Fett got his ass handed to him twice by Jedi !! Then again, this probably should go in "Game Feedback" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrion Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 I dont mind absorb...except when they pull-backstab with it.Dark Users have no way to counter that....sure, if the guy didnt have absorb I could push him back or grip him...but with absorb your only way to survive is to run like hell.... Edit-and I agree without absorb light users would be toast... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutek Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 Technically three times if you include Boba Fett's death in RotJ, but then that's a VERY technically :> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossil25 Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 ...... absorb has no faults... see...if it wasn't invisible when not absorbing, everybody knows you are using it and they won't even attempt to use force on you. Also, absorb is passive and it shouldn't let the world world know...protect has a green beam because it's a shield...lightning looks like lightning...in the fan's mod, grip doesn't have the crappy red light...why should absorb beam out blue light? No one complains about absorb unless they are darksiders who rely heavily on their force powers. And i was one of them, still am but less i hope. AS for rolling...everyone can roll...and it's made faster (than in SP) to allow escape...otherwise it'll be useless... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edinflames Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 if mp has sp rolling then there wud be no point cos ud just get booted about wen ur on the floor. sp rolling is good for single player but as u may hav noticed sp is not mp dispite the exelent saber combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackDove Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 Absorb is great. Nobody can't do anything to me with force, so I can easily pull/backslash them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwing Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 Originally posted by Redwyng Absorb should NOT be nerfed. It is fine as it is. What needs to happen is the dark side needs some sort of counter to it - in JK1, both grip and throw were great counters to absorb. I'd like to see them put throw back in, but integrate it with grip - you grip an item, then hold your crosshair over an enemy and it throws it at him. And actually, decreasing the mana cost for drain WOULD affect absorb slightly - right now, you actually use more mana than you drain, nullifying any force advantage you have over your enemy. In 1.02, drain left you with FAR more force than your enemy, preventing him from pulling/pushing, etc. If drain is unnerfed so that it can be used to put the force advantage in your favor, which is pretty much what absorb does (since the enemy can't use force against you). A) Your name scares me. B) I don't get drain...but that's just me I guess... C) Be glad there's no Reflect that Yoda used in Ep 2. That would be interesting to see against lightning. I think Yoda in AotC basically showed the advantages of the Light side... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossil25 Posted June 18, 2002 Share Posted June 18, 2002 yes...be glad there is no reflect as i said earlier :D besides, erflect is technically easier than absorb...absorbing is taking in the dark side force powers and converting them to the light side force powers...that requires skill to take it in, and skill to convert the raging force to passive calm force...without the converting, it's just taken in and wasted...BUT BUT BUT as Newton's law of conservation of energy states, energy is neither created or destroyed...uh...so if not converted, u could actually return it back to the darksider... now if that was available in the game, then i won't mind the whining cause yeah it's gonna be pretty powerful... also, i don't think absorb had to be toggled ON and OFF in star wars...if you're some light side jedi master, absorb is probably always surrounding you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelFury Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 absorb is fine as it is thank you very much. seeing as its the most offective way of combating the pull/backstab lamers. i h8 those ppl. its been said b4 on here above too. if im using absorb then the only way my opponant is gonna get anywhere is to fight toe to toe with me. lol and they usually lose like that. SteelFury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewie Bakker Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Attack of The Clones, P347 More lightning poured forth from Dooku's hand, but Yoda continued to catch it and turn it, and seemed to become even more settled in his defensive posture. "Much to learn you still have," Yoda remarked. Dooku disengaged the futile lightning assault. "It is obvious this contest will not be decided by our knowledge of the Force, but by our skills with the lightsaber." Yoda reverently drew out his lightsaber, its green blade humming to life. Absorb is a Jedi's only defence against the offensive Sith powers. Any respectable lightsider wouldn't use absorb and the pull+back-stab/-swing. Seems to me that the pull + backstab's the problem. Perhaps the auto-defense against pull should be jacked up rather than taking away a lightsider's only defense against the dark offensive powers. Jedi are all about defense after all. The Force will be with you always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightningRod Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Well, This is just my opinion but.......... Absorb is a bit overpowered, and doesn't really have a counter force. Light side users can just slap on absorb, and run around without a worry of getting pulled or pushed, and thats fine. But the problem is... when you use absorb in ctf or ffa, and the game is saber only, there really isn't much of a way to stop someone from turning 180 and backing themselves up like cars about to park. Another problem is..... when you use absorb with guns like flechets and rockets....... try playing ctf or ffa against others that use guns and slap on absorb. Unless you do the same.......there is no real way to stop them. Absorb needs some more balance to it. That or introduce a new force power that could counter it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutek Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 The simplest way to counter such people is to pund the living sh** out of them. On the other hand, I tend to play on saber only servers, so I don't consider myself too qualified to comment on vs guns w/absorb. On saber only servers, people who turn on absorb and run backwards towards me suffer the same fate as those who simply run backwards towards me - I use a wide variety of tactics from a quick swipe and flip backwards on their sade as they go past, to kicking them onto their arse and backswinging them into last month. I don't use pull/backstab because I don't find it to be very effective, combined with the fact that I enjoy "proper" saber combat. Absorb is the only useful power against power like grip, drain and lightning - all the offensive DS powers. It provides almost no protection against pull/push while in the air (so if you are alert you can still use them), or against other LS powers. That being said, it *might* be too cheap to use, but I'd prefer to see some of the dark side powers upped first before passing judgment. I'd like to see the damage on grip pushed up a lot more, but it's maneouverability rate (speed of moving victim) dropped some (you're CHOKING them, not playing swings). It still needs to retain enough speed to move them sideways to drop them off a ledge. Drain's cost should be reduced to it's original level, but then the rate of force drain decreased as well. In other words, it drains the same amount for the same cost, but it takes longer to do it. There should be enough time for ordinary human reflexes to react to it. Lightning is fine. Probably. It's pretty damn powerful as it stands. The only other power I'd adjust is heal - IMHO, EITHER increased cost or decreased healing was enough, both makes it less than useful, especially against my suggestion for Drain. Compare those changes, which all up DS powers significantly, to Absorb - at worst it might want a *slightly* increased rate of force use (between current and 1.02 levels). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronJedi Kaga Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 The problem with absorb which I have felt was overpowered since day 1 is that it neuters the darkside to the point where the lightside player has more offensive options. All of the offensive darkside powers are blocked, as well as the offensive neutral powers. Forcewise this leaves the darkside player with saber throw, and kicking from force jumps. The lightside player on the otherhand has the same options as the darkside player, as well as being able to use push and pull. As for the push/pull effect in the air, its reduced a great deal when absorb is on. Dark rage, sure I can use it if I want to lose a great deal of health and be slower after using it. For those of you arguing, it makes light and darkside fights about the saber, your in denial. I'm sure that the lighsider wont take advantage of being the only one able to push/pull in a duel. In weapons vs saber, its still unbalanced as the lightsider can fire away without worrying about having to lose the weapon while the darksider will get the weapon pulled right away. If absorb had the reverse ysmalri effect, aka cant use any other force while its on, it would be more balanced. The lightside player still has the defensive advantage as all the neutral offensive powers and the offensive darkside powers are still negated. They still get force back from the negated attacks. They just wont gain the offensive ADVANTAGE that the current version of absorb gives. Also there's no need to alter drain, it was intended to be used for healing, which it does just perfectly now. Changing it back towards 1.02 would just make people go around using it for offense, not for healing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Masonis Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Only problem with that argument is that with absorb constantly on, lightsiders will run out of force very quickly if they try to pull/backstab repeatedly. When this happens the lightsider will be helpless if the darksider has refrained from lashing out with force powers while absorb was up; he can now attack because the lightsider will have exhausted his mana and either cannot activate absorb or can only run it for a few seconds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celedhel Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Just do what I do! JOIN SERVERS WITH ONLY JUMP AND SABER THROW! its the only wait to stop the bitching and complaining I have found out. Cuz then what is anybody gonna be complaining about.. "You sUx0rz! You wouldn't win so much if you weren't a pansy hitting me in the back and all!" ?? ya know!? so just find some servers with just JUMP and SABER THROW and things will be alll niiiiiceee! whoope.. BTW THIS IS IMO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guardian Omega Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Heh, I have a counter to that absorb and gunning trick, although not that effective. I just crank up speed and rage at max and go chase their ass! Since they dont have the defensive edge with the saber, they wont block the hits. Recommend using medium though................(AND MUST HAVE FAST REFLEXIVES!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solo2070 Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 I am a dark jedi and i don;t see any problem with force absorb i have usesd the light side maney times just to try it anad in ctf or team ffa it is nice to have team heal so i get it and in the proces i get to use force absorb and sure it takes cvery little force to use. but if you use push or pull of speed (in ctrf to get away) your force goes bye bye and i still get killed by the lighting adn caught by choke when it shuts off and still get drained so don;t ever get to use it but i have found to be a light jedi you muset use your saber aonly to win teh batles and some people have found there move that kills others faster and alot ofpeople use that back stab so waht why don't we all just quit complaining about all of theis and just play the game and let your sabers do the talking i love to challenge because you can;t use the force and it is nothinf but yoru sabers that do the talking. but any way me as a dark jedi i go up againts light siders ll the time adn i the force absorbe is not that big of a problem. one reason is that i am not a baby that hast to rely on lighting and grip to win i use my saber i just use the force to stop them or hurt but it is not my primary way of atacking i just every so ofton push my lighting button adn if i don;t hear theat very noticable noise i drain as much as i can so they can;t use it any more then i hit them with my saber wich i had been doing all along all teh while i still draqin them so they can't use it . so every body there is teh way i conter it so why don;t you all quit acting like a bunch of wusses and find yuou r own way or jsut use that shiney object in your hand called a light saber and just deal with the parts of the game that you don't like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronJedi Kaga Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Originally posted by Masonis Only problem with that argument is that with absorb constantly on, lightsiders will run out of force very quickly if they try to pull/backstab repeatedly. When this happens the lightsider will be helpless if the darksider has refrained from lashing out with force powers while absorb was up; he can now attack because the lightsider will have exhausted his mana and either cannot activate absorb or can only run it for a few seconds. The thing is absorb is invisible so odds are that some force power will be used on them prior to the lightside running out of power. In addition it only takes 1 successful pull backstab to kill a person. This is also pointless in several game modes such as CTF. Waiting for the person to run out of mana often means its too late to stop a cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skuttle24 Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 Hey...Ya know what's happening here? all u darkside lightening/grip spamming wussies are just going to complain about every lightside power that actually works until u can get Raven to patch it so it's as weak as heal is now. However, for fairness, methinks that drain should cost less mana but drain slower, so it actually has a use. Heal should also be put back to its original position in the amount of HP healed, though not in force cost. Don't try and kill the power just cuz u can't spam lightning. U must learn balance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterD-LeyAmas Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 This whole argument seems to be getting really old about now, but just as a suggestion: -drain should still work while absorb is on, only at about 1/4 the power, so a dark jedi can still heal *a little bit* while dueling, less than heal, but enough to work -push and pull should work as they normally would while absorb is on, therefore eliminating the pull-backstab unbalance This way, it would make absorb simply about leveling the field. I use absorb myself, and because it does leave a dark jedi helpless to heal while saber dueling, it does create a *very* small inbalance just for while it is being used. It seems that the main complaint of the darksiders is the cheap lightsiders who use the pull-backstab, so if you make it so that push/pull can be used against the cheap lightsider, it should make all things equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewie Bakker Posted June 19, 2002 Share Posted June 19, 2002 LightningRod might have a point about Absorb and guns. I use Absorb for defense so am unsure. If Absorb takes away the ability to push away rockets then that's just wrong, but I'm unsure on the matter. I use Absorb only to counter Drain, Grip, Lightning, etc... <shrug> The Force will be with you, always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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