RichDiesal Posted July 23, 2002 Author Share Posted July 23, 2002 Weeell... here is an early shot of one side of the lower level. Look at the floor and the bookcase... and tell me what you think. Open opinions, suggestions, etc, etc. Keep in mind that I haven't even thought about lighting yet. http://richdiesal.jedioutcastmaps.com/images/archives001.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 hmmm. . .you're right on the blandness, but it's not that far from the movie still. it is this point that we all wish quake supported full reflections without doubling polycount (ouch). i like the "books". they look pretty good. maybe if they could sparkle. i'm not sure how you animate textures in quake (you can in theory, right?) but maybe a sparkle to those would be good. as for the floor, i think a marble grain would make it good, and maybe that shimmer effect that some metal things have in different quake based games. that and a marble grain on them would be a wonderful addition, and i think that would liven it up a lot. the ceiling. . .that's a different story. i don't imagine the ceiling being too interesting, but at the same time, it seems like it really needs something. possibly adding some noise to the texture, and again, that metal glistening effect. other than that, i think it looks good. i think the main thing is to keep it organic with some shape to it in some form. that's all, but i think all that would fix a lot of blandness problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eklin Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 I suggest that you take the basic bespin texture, without ANY of the lines added, and throw that on your wall. It'll give it a little bit of a particle effect so it isn't so plain. And if you want, you can put your own dark lines on it in whatever form you want. Edit: HOLEY ####!! I just looked at the fps on that screenshot and it said 71!!! How do you get it that high? The most I can get is 30, and that's VERY rare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldenFrog Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 maybe if they could sparkle. i'm not sure how you animate textures in quake (you can in theory, right?) but maybe a sparkle to those would be good In elite force(a game using the q3 engine) there are tons of animated textures! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pakmannen Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 um, animated textures = shaders.. i get 70-90 fps btw.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 same here. patches are the only trouble makers for me, and they probably are for anyone when you get enough of them. anyway. . .i didn't know that's what a shader was. i actually don't map myself, so i just learn the terms from things i read; tutorials (yes, i read them even though i don't map. i like learning weird stuff), posts, stuff like that. i hadn't read a texture tutorial yet, so i didn't know. thanks. learning is always good. and with that i'll edit. . . rich, i think you should throw in some sparkly. . .shaders. . .for the books to help the effect . and also, i don't know how hard this would be and i know it's not what you showed us or are probably even working on yet, but i just got this idea that you could use. do that "ray of light" thing on the windows, and then on the floor have a very evident shape of the light through the window. you could even go beyond that and do like some of the RtCW maps do and have that. . .shader-ed. . .so that it's like clouds are floating past the window. of course, use normal lights so that characters light up when they step into this light, but have the. . .shader. . .on the floor to add an extra bit of atmosphere. sorry. just me going off on ideas again. hopefully the. . .shader. . .idea will help with adding some organic quality to the "bookcases". that is all. . .for now. lo5t_h0pe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eklin Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by pakmannen um, animated textures = shaders.. i get 70-90 fps btw.. Would you mind posting your system specs so that I know what I need to upgrade on my comp? (sorry to get off topic, but the game sucks when it's running at 15 fps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darth_micke Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 heeello.... First of all: Rich, wonderful job, keep it up.... And second: Does anyone know where to find book textures?? I kinda need it for my new project...please? Thats all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xzzy Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by RichDiesal Look at the floor and the bookcase... and tell me what you think. Open opinions, suggestions, etc, etc. Try staggering the book texture on the vertical slider so it's not so obviously repeating. Books aren't in proper scale either, in the movie shot there's 11 rows, in your image there's only 8 (plus a single book is about as big as your character's torso). Floor looks good but to be true to the reference image you'll need a reflective shader on it. This would also help solve any detail problems.. if folks can afford the fps hit. You could also try blending in a marble type texture into the floor to give it some detail.. at a very low opacity though. I'm not a photoshop god but I am decently capable (two years of myth map making = lots of photoshop time) so if you don't mind making your textures available I can try playing around with things for a bit. Not being condescending, just short and to the point. i like those poly counts too.. how high are they maxxing and how close to finished is your brushcount? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karshaddii Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 DOOODS--it's a preliminary screenie--it's not the final version. I have faith in you Rich--go get 'em! But now that I take a good look---no, kidding. Lookin' good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichDiesal Posted July 23, 2002 Author Share Posted July 23, 2002 Try staggering the book texture on the vertical slider so it's not so obviously repeating. We're not looking at overall texture placement here, just texture design. I will be changing the vertical height of each from bookcase to bookcase to make them seem more random, but I just haven't done it yet. Comment on what you're supposed to comment on. Books aren't in proper scale either, in the movie shot there's 11 rows, in your image there's only 8 (plus a single book is about as big as your character's torso). Again, just haven't done it yet. I didn't want to go to the effort to line up the texture to 11 rows (the texture itself is 4 rows high, incidentally), and if I was going to be completely changing the shader I used, I didn't want that effort to be for nothing. Thus, not done yet. Floor looks good but to be true to the reference image you'll need a reflective shader on it. This would also help solve any detail problems.. if folks can afford the fps hit. I was actually thinking of using an environment map on the shader, like the the semi-reflective-but-not-really floor effect on Kejim... Not sure how that'll work, but I'll look into it. You could also try blending in a marble type texture into the floor to give it some detail.. at a very low opacity though. Hmm... I hadn't thought of actually blending a texture into it. I've just been adding Noise to make it appear a little rough. I will try that, though I'm not sure where to find a marble texture. i like those poly counts too.. how high are they maxxing and how close to finished is your brushcount? I swear I wrote all that out many many posts ago. Brushes are 95% done, and maxing around 11-12k when standing in the very center, looking up at the windows at the far side... on average it runs 8-9k, although adding a reflective floor will do who-knows-what to that count. I suppose we shall see. Would you mind posting your system specs so that I know what I need to upgrade on my comp? Actually, the reason framerate is so high is because of the low tris count... notice it's only about 5k in that shot. I've only got a Pentium 3 800 (I'm upgrading soon myself). Most maps released nowadays have unreasonably high tris counts... that may be why you see such low framerates in most places. Does anyone know where to find book textures?? I kinda need it for my new project...please? Huh? do that "ray of light" thing on the windows, and then on the floor have a very evident shape of the light through the window Yup, that is in the works. See, the reason I haven't been posting too many updates is because this always happens, just like in Kamino. I have all this stuff on the backburner, taking one task at a time, and then everyone complains that it's not in the pre-alpha version. In any case, I'll be working on it a bit tonight after work. If anyone can find me a good tilable marble texture to mess around with, that would be mucho helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winner_rex Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 I could make you some textures![/joke] Use the filters, Rich Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 i'll look for some marble textures after work if no one has found any by then. i think i have one, actually. if not, i have a fire that i know will convert to marble fine. well, better than fine. it would be beautiful. other than that, why do people not read what was already said? could you not just say "i agree with lo5t_h0pe on the marble texture"? seems like it would save some space and you wouldn't sound redundant. what about the sparkly book shader idea? i don't think that was commented on. i think that would help the bookcases more than anything. and yes, if you CAN add a reflection that doesn't add a big poly hit, go for it. that would help, but i will agree with the other guy and myself: light marbling would mucho. that's all. . .for now. lo5t h0pe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xzzy Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by RichDiesal We're not looking at overall texture placement here, just texture design. Gotcha, you weren't terribly specific about what kind of critique you wanted so I just commented on it all. With that in mind, the book texture is close, but not quite "fuzzy" enough. The edges are too harsh. Now I know the reference image is fuzzy due to conversion from film to jpg but even from what I recall in the movie the "books" weren't exactly books like we'd think. Fade each book towards black at the top and bottom and you'd be close enough for jazz. Floor texture/coloring looks fine, it washes out badly though with the light that the books are emitting though. I was actually thinking of using an environment map on the shader, like the the semi-reflective-but-not-really floor effect on Kejim... Not sure how that'll work, but I'll look into it. This would probably be a better illusion anyways, and be much more kind to fps. The reflections that the mirror surfaces produce are far too sharp. I will try that, though I'm not sure where to find a marble texture. Webpage background sites are going to have a ton of marble textures. Creating your own works too, but might take longer to get results like you want (if copyright issues bother you). General idea would be to use the cloud filter function to get your basic image, add in some random noise with the noise filter, blur it, and play with ripples. I swear I wrote all that out many many posts ago. sometimes i'm not the most observant of individuals. See, the reason I haven't been posting too many updates is because this always happens, just like in Kamino. Then be more specific in what kind of advice you're looking for. When you posted that screenshot the only thing you told us not to do was comment on lighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manquesa Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Lot's of textures here -- http://www.grsites.com/textures/ It's got like 150 or so marble textures and I believe they're all tileable, there's bound to be one you could use. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xzzy Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 Originally posted by Manquesa Lot's of textures here -- http://www.grsites.com/textures/ hah, that's the exact same marble texture I used on my very first website, back in 95/96 just after netscape 1.1n came out: http://www.grsites.com/cgi-bin/tile.cgi?dir=marb&fn=marb034&ext=jpg too funny that it's still around. Incidentially it was the first texture that popped into my head for this map. drop it to greyscale, tweak the contrast, put it in it's own layer, set the filter to overlay, and cut the opacity in half. presto, ugly old bespin texture has a marbled corner now. http://tru7h.org/files/foo.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 23, 2002 Share Posted July 23, 2002 i believe what rich was referring to in the kamino thread was people calling what he was going to do like i just did with the light on the floor idea. the same thing happened to kamino,. people would give an idea and rich would already be using it. that's all that he meant, i think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichDiesal Posted July 23, 2002 Author Share Posted July 23, 2002 Excellent texture...I will use that. And yes, that's what I was talking about. Every time I come up with something neat and clever and cool that will seem innovative when I grandly show it to everyone after it's done, someone else mentions it in my thread before I have a chance. Not that it's a bad thing, necessarily - it just makes it seem like I did nothing original! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 WHAT ABOUT SPARKLES?! i think there was light bleed-through in the movie beside the rows and stacks of "books". if a shader was made with this "sparkle" fading across the spaces between the "books," i think it would add a lot of life to that texture/shader. might be neat. no? yes? "lo5t h0pe, you're stupid," SOMETHING?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RichDiesal Posted July 24, 2002 Author Share Posted July 24, 2002 GAH, I will look into it, but I'm afraid I don't really know enough about shaders to make one SPARKLY. I will see what I can do, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emon Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 Sparking shader? That's pretty easy. Define "sparkle". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lo5t_h0pe Posted July 24, 2002 Share Posted July 24, 2002 aaahhhh. . .attention. . .finally. . .sorry. anyway. . . what i mean by that is have the light fading around the colored portions of the "books". instead of having just black outlines around the "books", have super-white "blead-throughs" of light that travel around them. the closest i can come to compairing it to something is the falling letter of the matrix. kind of like that with that same kind of trail traveling around the "books", except sideways and up and down rather than just falling like in the matrix. i think that was in the movie. could be wrong. even if it wasn't, it would make sense and make a good environment. and if you're going to do that, maybe have books that fade to different shades of blue, like they're getting accessed or something. my ideas might just sound dumb, but to me, it seems like a good way to add some personallity to the "bookcases" and environment to the entire level. let me know what you think, and anyone that can, maybe give rich some help on how exactly to do these sort of things. by the way and off topic: does your dual raid drives help with load times a lot? i'm looking at doing that when i rebuild in a couple months, and i was just wondering if you've been happy with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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