jaybiggspr Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 I know this belongs in the requests but I'm sure this wouldnt get any attention there. I'm sure some of you are familiar with a little project called "Tenebrae" for Quake 1. It implements such features as seen in the upcoming DooM III, such as bump mapped textures and real time stencil shadows to the existing Quake source. I understand that we already HAVE the jkii MP source code and I think this would really breathe new life into JKII if someone were to take this up. Cant remember the URL for the official Quake 1 Tenebrae Mod but if you are interested, try it out. (Tenebrae even works with the quake demo) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASk Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 You are wrong on one thing here: Tenebrae modified the 3d engine that quake1 used. Since Quake1 engine was released as GPL code, a guy got it and added stencil shadows and per-pixel lighting to it. JK2 MP code and Quake3 engine code have nothing in common. JK2 MP code does not even deal with rendering graphics, rather telling Quake3 engine what to render when. So no, this thing is impossible to do now. Maybe when Quake3 will become GPL.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tchouky Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 Maybe when Quake3 will become GPL.. you'll have to wait a little quake2 was released last christmass as a christmass gift from our god john carmack. so i'd say maybe in 2 or 3 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybiggspr Posted November 4, 2002 Author Share Posted November 4, 2002 Huh? Quake 2 source was only released this Christmas?? Holy crap. Does ID really think they can still liscence the Quake 3 engine for anything? With the Unreal Warfare engine and the LithTech 2 engine or whatever, I highly doubt anyone would invest in this aging engine we lovingly call Quake 3. Although, SOFII was a pretty recent release so I can see why they dont want us "gamers" (you know, the ones who pay for their shiny cars and fat houses) to mess with their pretty little toy. This sucks. I know I'm not stating anything revolutionary here but software companies really need to START LISTENING TO THEIR CONSUMERS! anyone agree? P.S. Wow. John Carmack looks and talks nothing like I ever expected. He's still a god, but a nerdy one.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 Hey, if you want your mouth to start watering, start reading some of what John Carmack is going to give us in Doom3's engine. He even says that Quake3's engine is really just a pimped out Quake engine (ok, he just says that they stretched that code as far as they could). Doom3 will be real-time vis'd and light'd, which is sexy enuff. Another thing, what are you talking about when you say that JK2 doesn't have bumpmapping and stencil shadows? pay attention to what this engine has done and can do before you go saying stuff like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tchouky Posted November 4, 2002 Share Posted November 4, 2002 Originally posted by wudan Doom3 will be real-time vis'd and light'd, which is sexy enuff. whoo that's sexy ,indeed ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commodus Posted November 5, 2002 Share Posted November 5, 2002 Originally posted by Tchouky you'll have to wait a little quake2 was released last christmass as a christmass gift from our god john carmack. so i'd say maybe in 2 or 3 years What the engine source for Quake 2 is available for free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybiggspr Posted November 5, 2002 Author Share Posted November 5, 2002 Originally posted by wudan Hey, if you want your mouth to start watering, start reading some of what John Carmack is going to give us in Doom3's engine. He even says that Quake3's engine is really just a pimped out Quake engine (ok, he just says that they stretched that code as far as they could). Doom3 will be real-time vis'd and light'd, which is sexy enuff. Another thing, what are you talking about when you say that JK2 doesn't have bumpmapping and stencil shadows? pay attention to what this engine has done and can do before you go saying stuff like that. Already played Doom 3, it rocks. JKII's stencil shadows are bull****. They make the characters look way too jagged and blocky. Even the Quake Tenebrae mod did the shadows WAY better. [Edit by ASk: sentence removed - do not flame people next time] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaybiggspr Posted November 5, 2002 Author Share Posted November 5, 2002 You know what? YOU are wrong. There may be bump-mapped textures but they do NOT allow light to be reflected on those "bumps" the way DooM III's lighting reflects on things to make them look as though they are actually 3D (which is what I meant). And as for the stencil shadows, they are only used for characters, and not the environment. These "stencil shadows" cannot be simply generated by a moving light source, as in DooM3. This isnt true when it comes to the characters itself, however, but the map structure in the games does NOT allow for moving stencil shadows. Period. Come to think of it, I dont even thing there can be such things as moving lights in a map(jkII) in the first place. Another thing, in Quake1, the player models had to be all of what, 600 polys, as opposed to jkii's 1500-2000 (?) and the TRUE volumetric shadows look significantly better on Q1 models compared to jkii's player models with your supposed "same effect". Sorry bout the last line, I'm a little tired and getting lazy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASk Posted November 5, 2002 Share Posted November 5, 2002 A) Calm down B) Both JK2 and Doom3 use stencil buffer for shadows. Both JK2 and Doom3's shadows can be called stencil shadows. True, they use different methods, but this was not mentioned in the start of the discussion. As for bump-mapping, you are right, Quake 3 engine does not have bump-mapping support. Not that we can code it in now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tchouky Posted November 5, 2002 Share Posted November 5, 2002 Originally posted by Commodus What the engine source for Quake 2 is available for free? yep : http://www.fileplanet.com/files/80000/83000.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted November 6, 2002 Share Posted November 6, 2002 If I was LucasArts and I had a great series like Jedi Knight, and I wanted the next installment to be just about as sexy as could be, I'd ask myself, "Do I want to spend a lotta money and make my own engine?" And I'd say "no" to myself. Then I'd say, okay, what 3d Engine are you gonna use? Well, you've really got 2 good choices (well, 2 good popular choices, there are other 3d engines that are sexier), Unreal and Quake3. And so, if you pick Unreal, you still gotta do the hard work of making the game and making it rock by yourself, something LucasArts game department couldn't do (nothing personal, just not their forte), at the very least, it was commitment to the fans of the series that led them to say, ok, Quake3 engine, who can pimp it out just right, and keep a true star wars feel? Well, Raven's worked on the Quake3 engine, and they rocked it all over the town, and they are even very close with id, the creators of the Quake3 engine, so they were the natural choice. I guess my point is, what do you want? This is a good game - if you don't like the gameplay, get the code and get to crackin'. A game is not about graphics anyway. I've only seen sexy graphics for Doom3, but I don't know if it'll better than the original Dooms, which made me pee my pants in my pre-teen years. For myself, it's about gameplay, with some sexy-effects thown in for good measure. I love Tenebrae, btw, and I'm sure we can do the same cool thing - in a few years. Don't flame me when I'm not lookin - this thread should've been in the requests forum anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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