They way to a jedi

[The Punisher]

Originally posted by Xx_Patman_xX

Anyways back to the jedis

 

On a side note, the plural of Jedi is Jedi. I don't know why, but when people say "Jedis" it bugs the crap outa me...Thanks

[Xx_Patman_xX]

Originally posted by The Punisher

On a side note, the plural of Jedi is Jedi. I don't know why, but when people say "Jedis" it bugs the crap outa me...Thanks

 

 

Sorry I knew that... it was a typo, wont happen again.

[The Punisher]

Originally posted by Xx_Patman_xX

Sorry I knew that... it was a typo, wont happen again.

It better not!!! heh, j/k

[-=ReApEr=-]

Lets try to stay on topic guys. Just return this thread to the discussion.

[True Neutral]

"jedis"... heh, sounds like Chiss off JK2. Anyway, there's been alot of hype about being a jedi and there (to my knowledge) hasn't been any official conformations about how to become one... so... SHUT UP AND JUST BE PATIENT!

[Mujahid]

Originally posted by Prince Xizor

i bet there's some dude in the game that makes you FS once you talk to him & open ups your force sensitivity slot. maybe some old guy on the outer rim or something, & he only shows up occasionally. & in different places, but if you get to meet him, he'll do it for you. just a guess ..

 

they say i'm quite strong w/ the force so..

 

Something about what the devs have said in the past about opening up the FS slot makes me disagree with this (and I'm paraphrasing here): A power gamer will open up the FS slot long before the typical casual gamer, but the casual gamer will eventually be able to as well.

 

That tells me that there isn't any "one thing" in the game that you can do to open up the slot. If it were just a matter of being in the right place at the right time, then EVERYONE would have an equal chance of opening up the slot, regardless of whether you were a casual player or power gamer. But the devs have been quite specific that there is *at least* a small amount of "time element" involved.

 

Given that, I don't think we're going to see a quest, or series of quests, that are designed to open up the FS slot.

 

My personal gut feeling, as a developer myself (not of games), is that there is probably a "bit flag" or some such thing stored on each character. Perform certain actions (calculated by your account key, datetime of creation, whatever) and those bits get "flipped" from 0 to 1. When all bits turn "on", then you have an open FS slot. Each of the actions involved in flipping the bit from 0 to 1 probably have NOTHING to do, in game, or in context, with The Force, or Jedi, or opening the FS slot (other than "behind the scenes"), etc. They are probably, at some level, completely random and based upon some of the things I listed above.

 

Since at the end of the day a human being created the system, then in the final analysis a human being will "break" the system. Eventually a pattern will emerge. A pattern MUST emerge. They are not using super-computers. They don't have enough processing power to hide the pattern indefinitely (by creating one sufficiently complex to achieve that). But they can hide it for "pretty long".

 

Eventually, you WILL see the following subject header on an SWG bulletin board: "Method of opening up your FS slot discovered!!!"

 

It just boils down to time. The power-gamers will discover it first, probably after several months. Then the rest of us will know.

 

But you know what? It just doesn't matter. Progressing up the Jedi ranks is next to impossible anyway. My bet is if you GAVE everyone a free FS slot to start with, and each of 5000 players on a server started an FS character, only a handful of those players would ever actually become Jedi. Force Sensitive <> Jedi

 

Oh, and expect the following scenario to occur also

1. Player inadvertantly discovers method to open up FS slot within 1 month of game launch.

2. Player spreads word, causing others to open their FS slot.

3. Within 15 minutes of the "umpteenth" FS slot being opened, the servers are brought down for an "emergency patch".

4. Method to open up FS slot drastically changed

 

Remember, the devs have said, time and time again, in public forums, that the Jedi system is not going to be beta-tested publicly (I include those non-SOE employees under NDA in that category). You just KNOW that they're not going to get it right the first time. They will undoubtedly underestimate the tenacity of a group of 13 year olds with delusions of grandeur

[Jan Gaarni]

If their smart, this is how I see them doing it:

Player selects species (while it gets the standard species spec, it also picks the pre-requesets for opening the FS slot)

 

Pick 6 out of these requirements:

it then has a list of ****loads of requirements to select from, anything from skills, whole professions, faction joining, meeting certain character, time in faction, time in game, etc........................................ basically whatever you can think about.

No system, other than pick 6 prereqs.

 

Oh, and expect the following scenario to occur also

1. Player inadvertantly discovers method to open up FS slot within 1 month of game launch.

2. Player spreads word, causing others to open their FS slot.

3. Within 15 minutes of the "umpteenth" FS slot being opened, the servers are brought down for an "emergency patch".

4. Method to open up FS slot drastically changed

If they are dumb, this will happen.

[Mujahid]

Originally posted by Jan Gaarni

If their smart, this is how I see them doing it:

Player selects species (while it gets the standard species spec, it also picks the pre-requesets for opening the FS slot)

 

Pick 6 out of these requirements:

it then has a list of ****loads of requirements to select from, anything from skills, whole professions, faction joining, meeting certain character, time in faction, time in game, etc........................................ basically whatever you can think about.

No system, other than pick 6 prereqs.

 

 

If they are dumb, this will happen.

 

I don't think it's a matter of them being dumb. Rather, it's a matter of computers being dumb.

 

With a computer program, you have to have a list of *concrete* things. A computer doesn't understand ambiguity. If there are "6 things" that need to happen in order to unlock the FS slot, then you had better, from a programming perspective, make those 6 things easily identifiable and categorizable.

 

In programming, some of the most process-intensive events are iteration, function calls and flow control (decision making). If you have ambiguity in the requirements to unlock an FS slot (i.e., if the 6 things required differ not only in degree, but in kind as well), then you are going to *drastically* increase the processing cycles due to the need to place flow control in any place that could potentially be on the list of FS prereqs. As a programmer, you just don't do that.

 

Look at it this way:

If the prereqs for ONE person are:

1. Choose a certain race

2. Choose a certain profession

3. Start in a certain place

4. meet a certain NPC

5. Kill a certain critter

6. Possess a certain object

 

...while the prereqs for ANOTHER person are:

1. Find a certain location

2. Eat a certain food

3. Use a certain mission terminal

4. Wear a certain armor

5. Learn a certain language

6. Join a specific faction

 

.... then you've just created a big old CF in terms of the programming required. This is because not only are the prereqs specifically different, they are also categorically different.

 

In other words, you NOW have to put special flow control in the following sections of code:

1. Starting profession selection

2. In-Game profession selection

3. Starting location selection

4. Code that executes when an NPC comes into range

5. Code that executes when an NPC is killed by a player.

6. Code that executes when an item comes into a player's inventory (and there are multiple ways that can happen).

7. Code that executes, essentially, whenever a person moves (for item #1 under the 2nd person, the world would have to report every time a player set foot on "a" location. A check would have to be made to see if "location" is one of the prereqs for that specific player, etc.)

8. Code that executes when you eat.

9. Code that executes when you drink.

10. Code that executes whenever you accept a mission from a mission terminal. (could be a nightmare in and of itself, depending upon how modular their "mission booth" code is).

11. Code that executes when you equip an item.

12. Code that executes when you learn a new skill/language (another one that could be a nightmare, depending on existing code.)

13. Code that executes when you join a faction

 

And that's just to handle the two scenarious above. What about the other 499,998 people (yes, there will have to be some crossover).

 

Of course, this is all just "hand waving", but I think you see where I'm going with this. If the requirements to open up the FS slot are THAT ambiguous, then you will need flow control placed, for all intents and purposes, in almost every function of the game.

 

All I'm getting at with this long-winded stuff, is that the prerequisite list for doing ANYTHING, in a game not being run on anything less than a supercomputer, needs to be discrete for processing reasons (and programmatic reasons)

 

Now, let's say they DO have some SERIOUS processing power (distributed processors, whatever) and they DO decide to have requirements that are THAT ambiguous. The equation doesn't change.

 

Why? Because at some point the software needs to decide what your prereqs are. And that decision is based on something. It's *precisely* that "some point" and "something" that the initial power-gamers will concentrate on. If you can determine how the system will make its decision (and we eventually will be able to. It's a computer.), then you will know with a certainty what the steps to opening up that FS slot will be.

 

....Just like the tapers in AC1.

 

Somewhere, in the rusty innards of the SWG code, exists a list of prerequisites to draw from in deciding who gets an FS slot and who doesn't. THAT is where the gamers will concentrate their efforts, and not on the seemingly random prerequisites themselves.

 

All IMHO, of course

[Jan Gaarni]

I hear ya.

 

See, they shouldn't even bother to put Jedi into the game. It's just a waste of time.

[Mujahid]

Originally posted by Jan Gaarni

I hear ya.

 

See, they shouldn't even bother to put Jedi into the game. It's just a waste of time.

 

You know, Jan, I have to admit (much to the shagrin of some of the other posters on this board, I'm sure) that I feel the same way. At the end of the day, I just think they should have left that "profession" out entirely.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'll probably do my best to try and open the slot. And if/when I do, I'll definitely give it a try to see what it's like. But I have this gnawing feeling that they really just should have made that skillset "NPC only".

 

<ducks for cover>

[Jan Gaarni]

*puts up flame-retardant shield*

Get behind this! Quick!

[Donnie Darko]

Well, this is what I plan to do about the "Jedi situation." I have full intensions on being a Jedi eventually so this is how I will go about it: basically I am going to construct my character as if I was a Jedi. For instance I am going to put more into mental attributes than physical, I am going to have a variety of class, say, for some reason, I am going to start as a Scout, I will then go to Brawler (for melee *lightsaber*), then Marksman (ranged, dur, *you see the "new Jedi" with blasters), then to Artisan (for crafting, again dur, *crafting a lightsaber*), and of course, and most of all, act like a Jedi and not some n00b l00td00d. And if I don't become Jedi at least I will have fun developing a "Jedi-like" character that may possibley gain faction with the Jedi and just be active in their society.....which is just as good as being a Jedi *minus force sensativity*

[-=ReApEr=-]

Maybe not include it, but i think it's ok. Where some people will be one, not alot only some.

 

But earlier this month, there was a Jedi flame war. I just hope the Jedi wannabes wake up and relise, that it isn't as easy when daddy taught them to ride there bikes.

[Jackrabbit]

I don't mean to be rude -=ReApEr=-, but I didn't understand a word you just said .

[-=ReApEr=-]

Originally posted by Jackrabbit

I don't mean to be rude -=ReApEr=-, but I didn't understand a word you just said .

 

I was talking about Jedis, i said they should have the jedis in the game. But the Jedi wannabes must relise it isn't as easy as they think it will be.

[Donnie Darko]

Well, a lot of people that are going to play SWG are looking forward to playing Jedi so if they just got rid of it they will loose a lot of "customers" or whatever you want to call them. It would just upset so much people it would be catastrphic to the game. And if they decided not to even have Jedi there would be the people who will think "No Jedi? F*** this game* And then there's the people who are looking forward to RP with Jedi...you just have too look at all aspects of Jedi in the game and how important it will be to a lot of players.

 

P.S.

 

- Is there an option to "ignore" someone posting (like the option in chat rooms) because I think I am going to start ignoring reapers posts...and I've only been here like a day -

[True Neutral]

I agree with Donnie. I'm going to look forward to meeting rp jedi. Personally i think the people who will end up unlocking their fs will be those who won't abuse the power of it. You never know, dev might have done a really good job at hiding the way of unlocking fs. One more thing, who's to say that the first person to unlock their fs will tell everyone. They might want to keep it all to themselves and not tell anyone. This is probably unlikely, but there may be some... and you can only hope.