Dest Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 Dest has returned. JediAcademy seems very similiar to JediOutcast... doesn't seem like they even added many new animations. I guess moding it will be the same as modding JediOutcast though. I have such an awesome mod planned for it if raven added the ability to move bones around in code. If they didn't then I have nothing. If I get the game I'd like to get in on the OpenJedi thing. Also is it just me or does JediAcademy just seem like a polished single player version of JediMod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 14, 2003 Share Posted September 14, 2003 I'm oppenistic about JKA. Well, a lot of the changes sound a lot like some of the JediMod changes but it's mainly because people wanted those types of features in the game. It also sounds like they've put a lot of work into improving the engine and adding new features like the customizeable models and such. As for moving bones around, that's already possible in JKO. I'm surprised you never noticed it with work you did for JediMod. CG_G2SetBoneAngles and G_G2SetBoneAngles. Are you sure you didn't know about that before? I thought you had to have used that to seperate the saber arms for the dual saber animations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 15, 2003 Author Share Posted September 15, 2003 yeah setboneangles changed the angles of the bones but it didn't change their base position so if you rotated someones arm it would come out of the socket and look scary. Guess I really just needed a proper model hiarchy which they didn't do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azymn Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 JediMod certainly was ahead of it's time... Welcome back Dest. =] Ace - the animations are part of Desann's and Tavion's SP one-handed stances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by Dest Also is it just me or does JediAcademy just seem like a polished single player version of JediMod? Just you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by Dest yeah setboneangles changed the angles of the bones but it didn't change their base position so if you rotated someones arm it would come out of the socket and look scary. Guess I really just needed a proper model hiarchy which they didn't do. You're probably right, I don't think I ever tried the function on the bones that weren't in correct hierochy. So exactly what sort of thing were you considering? Maybe we could put our heads together and figure out a workaround. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ksk h2o Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Having looked at the demo, I can say that they have added quite a few things that I wasn't expecting. For one thing there are a lot of melle animations. Besides the puny little punch we had in JKII, they added a normal/side/back kick a roundhouse kick, three grapple moves (gut punch, choke, throw, knee, etc). The saber staff and dual saber stance animations are well made actually. And the fact that you can use the saber staff stance with only the bottom blade lit up (ninja sword style) and not have it look funky is very cool. You can also do the matrix like dodgin at will, in all four directions by keeping a button pressed, and they've added a nice camera motion thingamajig where the action slows down and the camera rotates matrix style. All in all, I find that they put in a lot of "expected" features from well known mods and a lot of popular models (kel dor, jawas, chewie, sand guys, even dark troopers and rancors) On some screen shots I've seen your main character riding the snow-horse thing from empire strikes back and flying speeders. I myslef didn;t expect raven to put this much work into a game which I was considering a simple mod of JKII, so I was pleasantly surprised. On the other hand much of the system seems the same. Most cvars have kept the same names, and the same functions as in JKII. I guess nobody know how much of this is going to be in the full game. In the demo, most of this stuff had to be accessed through the console (the grapples and such). Even less is known of how much of this will be in MP. Since Jedi Mod, first brought us many SP features (sp animations, etc) into MP, I'm quite confident these will show up in MP sooner or later. I san even smell an MP matrix mod day2 after the final release (just about everything you could want for a matrix TC is built into the game). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Dest, it is possible to do new animations entirely. ASk said you weren't coming back, but then again, he suffers from chronic pessimism. This certainly should make things interesting, but this time, let's try to have a more competitive modding community, eh? This, "I'll scratch your back, here's my code, you scratch my back, hey wait, where the hell are you going with my code?" thing didn't work out well, IMHO. If you want to contribute to OpenJedi, that's fine with me, I'm fairly opposed to being directly involved in it, but hey, to each his own. The folks of #jk2coding are going to be in #jkacoding this time 'round - yesterday was the first day the channel saw some real attendance (thanks to Tchouky, who says he'll be back for JA as well.) Good to see you, though I came later in the game than you did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by Dest yeah setboneangles changed the angles of the bones but it didn't change their base position so if you rotated someones arm it would come out of the socket and look scary. Guess I really just needed a proper model hiarchy which they didn't do. I use a little something I like to call "position checking" which should be do-able with that get bone matrix call or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 15, 2003 Author Share Posted September 15, 2003 Yeah I didn't see any grapples or anything in the demo, all I could manage to do was spam random saber attacks and kick occasionaly with the double bladed saber. I don't know what you mean by position checking. What good is checking the position if you cant modify it? As for what I was planning to do, I was going to make saber blocks and stuff actually deflect the sabers in a realistic direction instead of just playing an animation. I was also going to make it so people could design their own moves by giving them a small editor where you just give your saber a path to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASk Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 /me pokes Dest check out my stickie (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=107116), will ya Welcome back by the way. This time BOFH is not around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 15, 2003 Author Share Posted September 15, 2003 sup ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Well, BOFH staged his own 'death' me thinks. He retired OmniMod and it's successor appeared a month or so later, by a new crew, led by someone named 'Phoenix' - which seems pretty shady to me, considering it would seem to be an allusion to rebirth - I really doubt BOFH would hand over his code to someone. Small editor to make your own saber moves, eh? Sounds like a good idea - Sounds like what I'm working on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ASk Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 BOFH = Phoenix if you didn't know it already. As of right now, both Phoenix and his previous nick, BOFH are off the scene, being kicked out of the clan and generally being not accepted among the other modders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by Dest As for what I was planning to do, I was going to make saber blocks and stuff actually deflect the sabers in a realistic direction instead of just playing an animation. I was/am trying to do that as well but I was/am attempting to use more precise animation control to do it. However, there wasn't enough room in the entity data stream sent to the additional data. JKA fixes that (or at least that's what I've been told by Raven). I'd be concerned that doing truely dynamic animations for saber blocks wouldn't look realistic without a LOT of human body modelling work. Plus, the bandwidth would go way up unless you want to do it client side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azymn Posted September 15, 2003 Share Posted September 15, 2003 Originally posted by razorace I'd be concerned that doing truely dynamic animations for saber blocks wouldn't look realistic without a LOT of human body modelling work. Plus, the bandwidth would go way up unless you want to do it client side. And doing it clientside would undermine the realistic collisions in the first place, as the server wouldn't be synced with the client's anims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wudan Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Well, actually, you could rig up some IK stuff, if it's possible, that is, instead of just moving one or two parts, you can rig it up to move several and achieve a more natural effect. I think the animations method is friendlier in some way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Well, yeah. My point was that you'd have to model it correctly to reflect realistic human movement. That's not a easy feat to do, even for the pros (Karma comes to mind). That's why I think using preset animations in creative ways would be easier, look better, and use less bandwidth. But, heck, a really good dynamic system would blow the doors off my system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
appleeye Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Yeah I was talking about using IK, not going to do any modeling or anything. Then I'll get to use some quaternoins! Sorry I like the word quaternoins even though I'm not sure I spelled it right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 16, 2003 Author Share Posted September 16, 2003 Jeeze it said my name was appleeye, thats freaky and a half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Err..by "modelling" I mean "simulating". Just creating a ragdoll system for saber deflections won't look right....unless the player is a super duper quadrupal jointed alien with no muscle mass. In addition, saber deflects don't just fling the sabers away from the point of impact, the duelist normally moves the saber back to the "neutral" position or bounces into another move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 16, 2003 Author Share Posted September 16, 2003 that can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Well, of course. I'm just saying it's going to be very difficult. How devoted to doing this are you? Have you done a lot of prep work yet? Heck, I'm wanting to do dynamic cloak (as the piece of fabric that you wear on your back) physics. I think it would be a fun challenge and would add a lot to the feel of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dest Posted September 16, 2003 Author Share Posted September 16, 2003 I definately haven't done any prep work or anything. I would have to learn inverse kinematics stuff first before I could start. I would probabaly write a small program that loaded an md3 file and did some IK on it before I started with the mod. I was going to do that a while ago but I had to make a quaternoin math library/class or whatever first and changing a quaternoin rotation to a matrix and back blew my mind. Dynamic cloak wouldn't be too hard if you had access to the rendering code. Making a dynamic cloak as a mod might not be possible unless you can move the verticies around somehow... could maybe do it with an opengl wrapper. hmm I wonder if you could just stick some opengl code in a mod and have it work. I always figured the quake3 virtual machine wouldn't allow it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted September 16, 2003 Share Posted September 16, 2003 Well, I was thinking of doing it internally with ghoul2 physics and by constantly moving the "bones" of the cloak model. This would have to be clientside to work correctly. Why does everyone always think you need to have access to the render system to do dynamic cloaks/clothing? I think I'm missing something here. As for putting OpenGL code into a JKA mod, I don't think it's possible. The code we use isn't true C or C++ as it has to go thru a special compiler to be used by the engine. In addition, the QVM isn't designed to be accessed for rendering. You'd have to rewrite the engine source to have the engine do that. Say, you happen to have a IM service? Talking about this on the forums takes a lot time and using IRC only works if you know when someone is online. If so, PM me your contact information and we can discuss it. I'll PM mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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