Darth Windu Posted March 15, 2004 Share Posted March 15, 2004 Vostok - the problem with having the seperate buildings for both Naboo and Confederacy is that you have an excess of buildings, and you are really making it so that you are fighting as about 6 or 7 civs as the Confed's, when you should be fighting as one. Ditto for the Gungans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted March 16, 2004 Share Posted March 16, 2004 Actually, since the buildings have other purposes aside from just building units, you end up with the same number for each civ. Same with the Naboo, only this time its cause both sides only have 2 unit production buildings each. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 16, 2004 Share Posted March 16, 2004 sith - i suppose it might work, i still object to it but then it's your template. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted March 16, 2004 Share Posted March 16, 2004 Its not my "template". Its just my idea. In my template (the one I already did) the Naboo and the Gungans were separate. Although I think I prefer it the new way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majin Boba Fett Posted March 19, 2004 Author Share Posted March 19, 2004 just leave the two seperate.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Leave them seperate Naboo only joined Gungans in that one battle nothing else. The Gungans were only bought into the senate as a royal commitee with Jar Jar representing the Gungans in that commitee they Naboo did not get control over Gungan military and Gungans did not get control over Naboo military. So they are 2 seperate and by no means should be one. Its like 2 countries on the same planet you don't see the US joining forces with Iraqi extremest now do you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithmaster_821 Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 I did it not for realism reasons, but for gameplay reasons. The current number is jut too high, and people would complain if the naboo and the gungans were left out entirely, so it was best to just combine them. It also circumnavigates the problem of gungan air or naboo heavies that look completely stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 19, 2004 Share Posted March 19, 2004 Originally posted by FroZticles Leave them seperate Naboo only joined Gungans in that one battle nothing else. The Gungans were only bought into the senate as a royal commitee with Jar Jar representing the Gungans in that commitee they Naboo did not get control over Gungan military and Gungans did not get control over Naboo military. So they are 2 seperate and by no means should be one. Its like 2 countries on the same planet you don't see the US joining forces with Iraqi extremest now do you. and you know all of this exactly how? There is absolutely no evidence to support what you just said, in fact the evidence points to the opposite conclusion. Also, your analogy of the US and Iraqi Extremists is way, way, way out of the ball park. Anyway, the reason i chose to merge the Royal Naboo and Gungans are- 1. It allowed me to add another civ to the game (Hutts) without removing 'essential' civs. 2. It is representative of the alliance on Naboo seen at the end of Ep1, and witnessed by both a Royal Naboo and Gungan representing Naboo in the Senate. 3. As Sith said, it removed the problem of having having Naboo mechs and Gungan aircraft. In addition, the two civs actually blend well in all respects, with the Gungans providing Heavy Infantry with the Royal Naboo providing supporting strike mechs and aircraft. 4. Logically, both the Royal Naboo and Gungans would have seen after the events of Ep1 that neither could defend their planet by themselves, and so would have at least begun co-ordinating their forces in the event of planetary attack, particually with the outbreak of the Clone War. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 20, 2004 Share Posted March 20, 2004 Yes I do have evidence..... If you have ever bothered to play SWG which I take it you haven't since you never play games online and think you know what is best for the "windu" ohhhh sorry I mean the public. The you would know after the fall of the republic and the rise of the empire the Naboo government and military crumbled. The gungans howver did not there military still stands and there leaders are still on Naboo. And if this merger ever took place which you have no evidence it ever did except the parade at the end of episode 1 which you assume that is a merger but you make sure I can provide some. 1)Thinking about a Hutt civ just shows how clueless you are. 2) Gungan and Naboo senators Padme and Jar Jar were in the royal commitee Padme represting naboo and jar jar gungans if they were merged into 1 there would only be need for 1 there not both. 3)Naboo and Gungans blending well in all aspects is the problem Gungans good ships,mech,troops Naboo good air,jedi,economy where the weakness? 4) Naboo defended itself quite well. If they did not have the aircraft power to shut off the droids then the Gungan army would have ment nothing. The Clone Army protects the Republic including Naboo which is apart of it so there is the security so a Gungan merger is not required. You think after hundreds of years of isolation from the outside world the Gungans will just let the Naboo enlist there troops...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 Originally posted by FroZticles Yes I do have evidence..... If you have ever bothered to play SWG which I take it you haven't since you never play games online and think you know what is best for the "windu" ohhhh sorry I mean the public. The you would know after the fall of the republic and the rise of the empire the Naboo government and military crumbled. The gungans howver did not there military still stands and there leaders are still on Naboo. And if this merger ever took place which you have no evidence it ever did except the parade at the end of episode 1 which you assume that is a merger but you make sure I can provide some. 1)Thinking about a Hutt civ just shows how clueless you are. 2) Gungan and Naboo senators Padme and Jar Jar were in the royal commitee Padme represting naboo and jar jar gungans if they were merged into 1 there would only be need for 1 there not both. 3)Naboo and Gungans blending well in all aspects is the problem Gungans good ships,mech,troops Naboo good air,jedi,economy where the weakness? 4) Naboo defended itself quite well. If they did not have the aircraft power to shut off the droids then the Gungan army would have ment nothing. The Clone Army protects the Republic including Naboo which is apart of it so there is the security so a Gungan merger is not required. You think after hundreds of years of isolation from the outside world the Gungans will just let the Naboo enlist there troops...... LOL you are using SWG to justify your position?!?! Getting back from lmao, SWG is completely EU, whereas i take my evidence from the films. 1. This is completely irrelevant to the point 2. Your grammer is pretty bad, but i think you mean there would only be one representative if they were merged? Not true. There are two representatives, with Padme being superior, to represent both peoples. Remember, the races havent merged, they've become friends/allies with resulting co-operation 3. They are weak in terms of siege and heavy weapons. Unlike the Empire, with the AT-AT, and the Republics SPHA-T, the Naboo's heavy mechs are infantry support units, rather than weapons unto themselves 4. Uh...they were defeated. You did watch TPM right? Panaka says at the beginning 'we have no army', and later, Qui-Gon says 'the weapons on your fighters might not be strong enough to penetrate their shields'. The only reason the fighters were successful was because of Anakin (which is the whole point of that sequence). Also, i never said that the Royal Naboo would 'enlist' gungan soldiers, just that they would TRAIN them - big difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 1)Its definately alot more evidence then what you have based on speculation which you think happened after ep 1. Everything that goes in SWG goes through lucas first if he doesn't approve of things they don't get added. This coming from someone who wants Hutts as a civ.......... 3) Gungans have great seige the catapult, large creatures firing there electro balls. Naboo has air bombers they could be seige. 4)Yea Windu they were really defeated thats why the doid control ship was blow up along with some of the Trade Federation commanding officers. This isn't another CtW game Windu just because Theed was taken does not mean the Battle is over. And on this point you totallly took it and turned it into something it's not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 21, 2004 Share Posted March 21, 2004 We don't enlist them, we just "train" them lol. Let riflemen teach gungans how to use slingers! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Froz - although I'm taking your side I should clear some of your points up: Nothing on SWG goes through George Lucas personally, just like all EU. While the Gungans do have good seige weapons in the catapult, in the movies they do not have large creatures firing electroballs, and the Naboo do not have bombers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 I know they don't have those units I'm jsut throwing things out no civ can be balanced with canon units its impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 FroZ - and the whole reason the Gungans dont have 'big creatures that shoot balls' and the Royal Naboo dont have bombers is because siege is their weakness. They are great and some things, and suck at others - which is pretty much the whole point of balancing. As for the defeat of the Naboo - Theed was taken, the Queen was captured, and Otah Gunga was made into a ghost town - yeah, and 'we are in complete control of the planet now' - yeah, doesnt sound like they were defeated does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 Theed was taken The Queen was captured for what 10 mins? She escaped and took her planet back didn't she, that does not sound like defeat to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 22, 2004 Share Posted March 22, 2004 If the Naboo were defeated, Windu, how were they able to overthrow the Federation and claim their planet back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeiamyourdad Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 He's yet again talking about real life wars... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Vostok - the Naboo WERE defeated, because their governmental, economic etc installations and their people were captured by the Trade Federation. Although the Queen escaped and re-took Naboo, you have to remember that she RE-TOOK Naboo. Hence, to re-take something, it must have been taken from you. As a real life example, take Yugoslavia in WW2. This area was conquered by the Germans rather quickly, but Tito and other leaders resisted the invasion and eventually regained control of their country. The fact is, though, that it was captured by the Germans. Same goes for the Naboo (except no Germans). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Windu we don't want your real life examples they have nothing to do with Star Wars at all. Winning a battle is far from winning the war, Naboo knew they were gonna get it back eventually the Trade Federation's acts were completely illegal. But the Queen did not want to risk her people for a commitee to investigate the matter so she took matters into her own hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Vostok Posted March 23, 2004 Share Posted March 23, 2004 Exactly. The Naboo were invaded, not defeated. I would call defeat the inability to fight back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 24, 2004 Share Posted March 24, 2004 When another power has complete and utter control of your people and possetions, i would call that being defeated. Anyway, Naboo WAS defeated, it's just that some of the people refused to accept that. That doesnt change the fact that the Federation had control of the planet, and had hence defeated the Naboo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FroZticles Posted March 24, 2004 Share Posted March 24, 2004 Not just people the friggin Queen didn't accept that and took what is rightfully hers back. Just admit Windu they were not defeated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Windu Posted March 24, 2004 Share Posted March 24, 2004 Forzo - first of all, i didnt say 'people', i said 'the people' - there's a difference. As for Amidala, so what? Here government had collapsed and she fled to Coruscant (kinda sounds like the Netherlands in WW2 doesnt it...). Just because a ruler escapes doesnt mean the country hasnt fallen. Just accept that Naboo fell and was then re-taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saberhagen Posted March 24, 2004 Share Posted March 24, 2004 Originally posted by Darth Windu As a real life example, take Yugoslavia in WW2. This area was conquered by the Germans rather quickly, but Tito and other leaders resisted the invasion and eventually regained control of their country. The fact is, though, that it was captured by the Germans. Same goes for the Naboo (except no Germans). I could poke so many holes in that, but this forum is about Star Wars. My opinion is that Naboo and Gungans shouldn't be combined. I don't have any particular reason for that, it just seems wrong. However, if you must combine them, it would be entirely possible to make it a balanced civ without contradicting canon too much. So what's this argument about? Er, sounds like nothing to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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