Star Wars DVDs!

[Admiral Vostok]

The version of Empire of Dreams they showed on TV was a greatly cut down version. I watched the one on TV and the DVD one, and let me say the while the TV version was very interesting there are bits in the DVD version that are fantastic. Probably the best behind-the-scenes documentary I've ever seen (though I may be biased).

 

I watched The Empire Strikes Back last night, and there are two notable things they've done to it. First was replacing the monkey-woman-thing representing the Emperor with Ian McDiarmid. There's also a couple of extra lines added to this bit, which I quite like and which would have been great to have in the original version. To be honest I don't know why they didn't fix this in the Special Edition, but I for one welcome it in the DVD Edition. The second big change was re-recording Boba Fett's lines with Temuera Morrison. It was a bit jarring at first because I was so used to the old Boba Fett voice, but the new voice works fine and let's face it, no-one was a big fan of Boba Fett's voice in the first place.

 

The bit with Vader going back to his Star Destroyer are still there, though I think they're edited a bit better to fit in more - could just be me though. There are other little touch-ups too throughout the film.

 

I decided to confirm Christensen's presence at the end of Return of the Jedi, so while I still haven't seen Jedi in it's entirety yet, I can confirm Christensen has replaced Sebastian Shaw. I'm sorry you feel the way you do, LukesDad, I didn't know you were such a fan of Mr Shaw's work. When it comes down to it, does anyone really care that much that an old guy who no-one recognised used to be there instead of a young guy that everyone recognises?

[lukeiamyourdad]

I'm not a Shaw fan, I'm a Christensen hater.

[Admiral Vostok]

Well that's a shame. Any particular reason you hate Christensen? Personally I can't think of anyone who could have done the job better.

 

Finally, my review of Return of the Jedi, which I watched yesterday. Probably the part I was most impressed with was the Rancor scene. Even in the Special Edition it looked too fake. They've completely fixed it up now, so it looks fantastic. They've really cleaned it up, matched the colours properly and even added shadows.

 

The other effects have been touched up as well, but it is certainly the most noticable in the Rancor sequence. The other clightly noticable change is that they digitally removed Sebastian Shaw's eyebrows... I hadn't really thought about it before but it doesn't make much sense that he'd be hairless except for his eyebrows. I think it looks a lot better now.

 

The only other big changes are during the final celebration. The inclusion of Naboo amongst the rejoicing planets at the end fits in nicely. Christensen's appearance with Obi-Wan and Yoda is a little jarring at first, but as I said before there is apparently a good reason for it. I don't mind it at all, he just stands there and has no lines. It certainly doesn't spoil the movie or anything.

[DarthMuffin]

I bought the DVDs last week, but I still haven't managed to look at the movies I'm kind of really busy these days...

 

Only one thing disappoints me : I had heard somewhere on the net (I know it's not a very good source, but still) that they added a scene with Palp dissolving the senate. Well, the review of the DVDs at digitalbits.com didn't mentioned this scene (can anyone confirm? (Vostok)). I think it would have been a great idea to show this. That way, we would have seen Palp in all the movies (continuity), and we would officially "see" that he now controls everything. Of course it might have screwed the pace a little, but if I remember correctly, the beginning of ANH isn't that interesting.

 

On the other hand, the ESB scene with Palp would also have been screwed a little, but it wouldn't have been that bad.

 

I don't have any problem with Hayden at the end of RotJ, except the fact that he looks young... I mean, Obi's still Alec Guiness (and even though Ewan does a fine job, we want to keep Alec for sure), but Anakin still has the look of AotC and RofS. I know he "died" when he became Vader, but it does look odd to me anyway.

 

I'll post my opinions of the movies as soon as I find the time to watch them.

 

On a side note, I checked the Ep 3 documentary in fast foward, and the duel scene looks very great!

[Kryllith]

There isn't a scene with Palpatine dissolving the senate in the new version. We're still just informed about the dissolving by Tarkin in the Death Star warroom scene.

 

Kryllith

[Admiral Vostok]

As Kryllith said, no such scene of Palpatine dissolving the Senate exists. It is, afterall, not needed since Tarkin says it all with his line.

 

Originally posted by Darth54

I don't have any problem with Hayden at the end of RotJ, except the fact that he looks young... I mean, Obi's still Alec Guiness (and even though Ewan does a fine job, we want to keep Alec for sure), but Anakin still has the look of AotC and RofS. I know he "died" when he became Vader, but it does look odd to me anyway.

That is pretty much the only problem I have with it too. If they're going to replace Sebastian Shaw with Hayden Christensen, why not Alec Guinness with Ewan MacGregor and puppet Yoda with CGI Yoda? Yet I have heard that there is an explicit reason for doing this. Apparently it is to repair a continuity error that will arise from Episode III. So there is apparently reason to what looks like madness... but we'll have to wait before we find out what the reason is...

[DarthMuffin]

Originally posted by Admiral Vostok

Apparently it is to repair a continuity error that will arise from Episode III. So there is apparently reason to what looks like madness... but we'll have to wait before we find out what the reason is...

 

The only reason I can think of is, like I said, that Anakin will "die" when he becomes Vader.

 

But that's not a very obvious reason, and might confuse many people. So lets hope it's something else

[saberhagen]

You'd think they could've just written EpIII so that it didn't make a continuity error. Then again, they created enough continuity errors in I and II, so maybe GL and his yes men just don't have a clue what they're doing.

 

The idea that it's because Anakin "dies" when he becomes Vader doesn't really make much sense, because he comes back at the point where he takes pity on Luke, renounces the dark side and kills the emperor, thereby fulfilling the prophesy that he is the chosen one who will restore balance to the force. If he's been "dead" since EpIII then the climax of the whole saga no longer makes any sense at all.

 

And why didn't they paste Christensen's face into the scene where he takes his mask off?

[Admiral Vostok]

What continuity errors in Episode I and II?

[DK_Viceroy]

Look how BLIND the star wars scholar is

 

Don't forget the Continuity Errors between Ep 2 and 4

 

when your finished Attempting to come up with the answer that does not exist let me know in propably 5 years.

[swphreak]

It's so... beautiful!

 

So clear and crisp. I'm at the begining of Ep4 now.

 

"There will be no one to stop us this time!"

[Admiral Vostok]

Originally posted by DK_Viceroy

Look how BLIND the star wars scholar is

 

Don't forget the Continuity Errors between Ep 2 and 4

 

when your finished Attempting to come up with the answer that does not exist let me know in propably 5 years.

If you're going to challenge my authority at least provide an example of a continuity error. Until then I remain undisputedly a Star Wars Scholar.

[Nairb Notneb]

Man have I missed you guys. I hate hurricanes. Anyway, I got my DVD's thank you very much mister Lucas for the brand new version of the definitive version of the special edition special edition Original Trilogy. Other wise known as Episodes four, five and six. The best part was the bonus DVD, if you hate the rest (I hate the changes by the way because they are not Star Wars in my opinion, but my opinion doesn't matter because I bought it anyway and will continue to because I am a freak) you will love the bonus because you are a fan. I have yet to watch all of ROTJ, but I did watch the ghost change and I can't stand it!

 

LukeIamyourdad, I feel your pain. If I were Georgypoo, and I were gearing up for a SW TV show and wanted a young Anakin for it (my theory behind the change) then I would also change in a young every Jedi that I could sign on the bottom line and create a story line that says their ghosts can appear at any age that they want to justify it and maybe more people would like it. I hate it.

 

ANH. Jabba still looks too small and Greedo should never shoot because Han is a pirate, not a gentle man. If Greedo is an assassin, why is he a horrible marksman? Did he get trained by the Stormtroopers?

 

TESB. When Han and Leia are running to the Falcon with 3-PO behind, Han stops and looks at a door. It has the yellow warning sticker on it. Is this sticker on the original because I have never noticed it before. I ask because this sticker is from a deleted scene in which wampas attack the base and the rebels lock them in this room and put this sticker on the door. While fleeing the incoming stormtroopers C3-PO removes said sticker and the pursuing troopers run into the room and find the wampas. I'll have to check. They replaced the old emperor with the "real" actor (his name escapes at the moment) for the Vader talk scene. The dialog was also changed so that Vader had no idea that he had a son at all, much less that it was Luke. This is a problem for me because right before Hoth he wants so bad to get him, calls him by name and now Palpatine says hey, you're a dad, go smoke a cigar! It doesn't work for me. Bad move. No continuity in this movie's story if you ask me.

 

ROTJ. Arrrrrrrrrrrrggggh. I can't say it enough I HATE THE GHOST CHANGE! There better be a dog gone good reason for the change in ROTS or else I won't be seeing another new Star Wars movie again! I mean it.

[Admiral Vostok]

Nairb, let me address your concerns, though it probably won't do much.

 

ANH

- Jabba looks fine to me. Certainly not any smaller than in ROTJ.

- Again you mistake Greedo's shot as missing accidentally. Although the dialogue between Greedo and Han indicates Greedo wants to kill him, the fact is that at this point in time Jabba wanted Han alive, not dead. This is obvious from the restored Jabba scene. No matter how bad a Bounty Hunter Greedo is (note Bounty Hunter, not Assassin), he's not about to annoy Jabba by shooting Han right in the face. The shot was merely meant to scare Han into co-operation.

 

TESB

- The sticker is in the original, and you are right it is the sticker Threepio removes in the deleted scene.

- I think you're misunderstanding the dialogue between Vader and the Emperor. It's not so much the Emperor telling Vader he's a father and Vader saying "Really?", it's the Emperor confirming Vader's fears that Luke is Anakin Skywalkers son (not Darth Vader's son). In fact, this is my favourite new addition because it works so well. It now gives a reason why Vader was searching for Skywalker. Don't forget at this point in the film it hasn't been revealed that Vader is Luke's father. The Emperor says Luke is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker, who until this point we're under the impression Vader killed. Why is Vader so keen on finding Skywalker? Because this is the son of Vader's nemesis Anakin Skywalker! It's something I never understood, but it works fantastically now.

 

ROTJ

- Again I really don't think a couple of slightly changed seconds in the end of Return of the Jedi is reason enough to swear off Star Wars films. I really think people are over reacting. It barely changes the movie at all, and far from ruins it.

 

Honestly, the only reason I think people reject the changes to Star Wars is because they have this strange concept that changing the look of the film - and it really is just the look, the story has not been altered at all by any of the changes - ruins it. For me, the important thing about Star Wars is the story. It hasn't been changed, and the movies look a bit better, so what's the big deal? I think my biggest evidence for this is the band in Jabba's palace. The character now known as "Sy Snootles" thorugh EU looks pretty darn good in the Special Edition. Now go and get your old taped-from-TV Return of the Jedi and look at Sy Snootles in that version, when she was the worst puppet to ever come to realisation. You can not honestly tell me the old Sy Snootles is any better. Even with the worst CGI possible, the old Sy Snootles still looks way worse. Again, the new scene doesn't change the all-important story, it just improves the look and fell of the film. How can that possibly be bad? Anyone who wants the old Sy Snootles back is really proving my point that for the most part Special Edition critics like the original just for the sake of being a grizzly veteran whose good ol' days were much better.

 

[/rant]

[DK_Viceroy]

I have yet to buy the box set but Sy Snootles didn't seem to be that bad now that Yuzzum looked bad it didn't really seem to fit in at all even if you take into account that it's from the endor moon.

[Admiral Vostok]

Yuzzum being from Endor is purely EU. In the context of the movies it makes no sense. The only reason EU says Yuzzum are from Endor is because originally the Yuzzum design was meant to be on Endor with the Ewoks, but they dropped it when the stilt legs proved too hard to make work. EU decided to make them from Endor anyway, so that when Lucasfilm reused their Yuzzum design for Jabba's band the EU makes no sense.

 

Of course the movies look bad if you think EU is correct, in exactly the same way EU looks bad if you consider the movies correct.

[Nairb Notneb]

EU gets in the way all of the time, I agree. There are some items of it I enjoy if we were to have the luxury of picking and choosing. Anyway, The new Special Edition released to DVD has improved the new scene with Jabba at the Falcon in ANH (though it's not "perfect"), and the addition of Bobba Fett is interesting, though he wasn't in the original deleted scene. A few scenes that I was interested in seeing were with Luke and Biggs meeting at Tashi station. Also Luke, The "Fixer" and Camie meeting there when Luke observes the opening scene of the Tantivie IV being overtaken through his macrobinoculars. There also was another scene of Han in the Cantina sitting with some unknown "woman" with his arm around her. Another scene that I would have liked to seen added was when Gold leader was speaking to Luke before the Battle of Yavin, part of which they did add. In this conversation he says that he knew Luke's father and that he was a great fighter pilot, that would have been a great line. I still think having Greedo shoot his gun is a mistake. The CGI enhancements are great, but in the Battle of Yavin, when the X-wings switch back and forth from models to CGI and back, it really takes away from the authenticity of the look in my opinion.

 

It is entirely possible that I have jumped the gun with a knee jerk type reaction (I don't take change well sometimes) to these two particular changes in the story, referring to Vader not knowing of Luke being his son and the younger Anakin ghost. These two changes were obviously made to fit episode three a little bit better. I hope.

 

One more question. When will the TV Christmas Special come out on DVD?

[Admiral Vostok]

Originally posted by Nairb Notneb

the addition of Bobba Fett is interesting, though he wasn't in the original deleted scene.

He was added for the Special Edition in '97, though. He isn't new to the DVDs.

A few scenes that I was interested in seeing were with Luke and Biggs meeting at Tashi station. Also Luke, The "Fixer" and Camie meeting there when Luke observes the opening scene of the Tantivie IV being overtaken through his macrobinoculars. There also was another scene of Han in the Cantina sitting with some unknown "woman" with his arm around her. Another scene that I would have liked to seen added was when Gold leader was speaking to Luke before the Battle of Yavin, part of which they did add. In this conversation he says that he knew Luke's father and that he was a great fighter pilot, that would have been a great line.

I don't want all the deleted scenes restored, but it would have been cool to add a deleted scenes part to the bonus features DVD. I don't know why they didn't. Hopefully they'll eventually allow them to be downloaded from dvd.starwars.com.

It is entirely possible that I have jumped the gun with a knee jerk type reaction (I don't take change well sometimes) to these two particular changes in the story, referring to Vader not knowing of Luke being his son and the younger Anakin ghost. These two changes were obviously made to fit episode three a little bit better. I hope.

As I said they don't change the story at all. Although the Vader/Emperor conversation is different, it just reveals more about what they know rather than changing what they know. They still know the same information they know in the original versions, it's just we are privy to a bit more of their knowledge this time around. As I said this is my favourite change because it gives justification to Vader's obsession with Luke before we find out they are Father and Son. And the young ghost Anakin doesn't change the story either: Luke sees his dead father in both versions, his apparent age is irrelevant.

One more question. When will the TV Christmas Special come out on DVD?

I think never. Lucasfilm rarely if ever mentions the Holiday Special. It was noticably lacking from the behind the scenes documentary. I think they're of the opinion it should never see the light of day again. Having had the priviledge of seeing it, I agree it should never be released. Though if it was released maybe people would realise there have been far worse additions to the Star Wars franchise than the prequels...

[Darth Windu]

Hi folks, i've just watched ANH and ESB and am, generally, impressed. I've always liked the '97 editions better than the originals, and the DVD's are even better. I do have a few comments though

 

ANH

- FIX THE FRICKIN LIGHTSABRES!!!!! At times during the film, Luke's sabre alternates between light blue, almost white and, at one point, pale green. Why cant they just clean that up? Obi Wan's isnt great either, but not as bad.

 

- The Death Star Battle should have been completely CG. I dont mean remove the actors or anything like that, but as it was said before, mixing the CG and models just looks bad. The CG is great, but the models are so 1970's its not funny.

 

- it might be my imagination, but it seems like the opening battle has been cleaned up quite a bit. Now looks much better.

 

ESB

- Replacing ol' monkey eyes with McDairmond (sp?) was great, but the extra lines really weren't needed. Still good though.

 

- Changing Boba Fett's voice and the sound of Slave 1 was great, makes continuity much smoother.

 

One question i do have though, why are the credits not changed? For example, there is no mention of Morrison as Boba Fett's voice, and the original ESB emporer is still listed in the credits. Doesnt make a whole lot of sense to me, but hey. As for RotJ, hoping to see that soon, and i think the idea of adding Christianson at the end is great. It shows all three heroes as they were when they ended as Jedi.

[Admiral Vostok]

ANH

- FIX THE FRICKIN LIGHTSABRES!!!!! At times during the film, Luke's sabre alternates between light blue, almost white and, at one point, pale green. Why cant they just clean that up? Obi Wan's isnt great either, but not as bad.

They fixed the lightsaber duel itself, but I agree some other lightsaber bits could have used a touch up. In particular I think the part where Luke is training with the remote makes the lightsaber look pure white, no blue at all.

- The Death Star Battle should have been completely CG. I dont mean remove the actors or anything like that, but as it was said before, mixing the CG and models just looks bad. The CG is great, but the models are so 1970's its not funny.

You have got to be kidding. It was that battle scene that defined Star Wars as a revolutionary special effects movie. Some people were upset with the minor additions they made already, they would never get away with an all-out replacement. Besides I don't agree that the CG stands out. Why change the old models when they work so well?

- it might be my imagination, but it seems like the opening battle has been cleaned up quite a bit. Now looks much better.

It's not any different to the Special Edition clean-up, which has only been colour corrected from the original.

ESB

- Replacing ol' monkey eyes with McDairmond (sp?) was great, but the extra lines really weren't needed. Still good though.

As I've said already, I think the new lines are great. The establish the characters and their supposed motives a bit more before we discover Vader is actually Luke's father.

- Changing Boba Fett's voice and the sound of Slave 1 was great, makes continuity much smoother.

For the most part I like it, but I think Temuera Morrison could have put the same tonality in that the original guy did.

One question i do have though, why are the credits not changed? For example, there is no mention of Morrison as Boba Fett's voice, and the original ESB emporer is still listed in the credits. Doesnt make a whole lot of sense to me, but hey.

Yeah that didn't make much sense to me. But there is probably some legal obligation not to remove the original voice of both the Emperor and Boba Fett from the credits.

[Nairb Notneb]

I'll have to agree with Darth Windu on the Battle of Yavin special effects, on some issues. Going back and forth between models and CGI is very obvious and I liked it and hated it in '97. The "new" CGI stuff looks great, but when paired up with the model effects, they just look out of place to me in the same scene. I also agree with the great "Star Wars Scholar" that if you take out the trench run models that you take out of piece of Star Wars. This battle scene was a part of what made this movie great. I would hate to see them leave completely. What's the solution? It won't matter. Once GL altered the plan it was guarantied that somewhere people would not be happy with something and now he has opened Pandora's Box. Lets just pray that he won't alter the plan any further.

[saberhagen]

Models is better than CGI. You knows it.

[DK_Viceroy]

I'm staying out of this because this is an argument now worth fighting and I have no strong desire to actuall;y get involved in it especially since I am at present Scheming on something.

[Admiral Vostok]

Personally I don't think the CGI looks all that different to the models. You can tell if you look close enough but at a glance it all fits together pretty well.

 

George Lucas is welcome to change any part of his movies he wants to, but he understands that there are some parts that are sacred. The Battle of Yavin is one of those things. He can touch it up here and there, but to replace it completely like Windu is suggesting is madness. That's why he didn't completely replace it in the Special Edition, and that's why he never will.

[Darth Windu]

I didnt mean replace the whole battle, just the action up until the trench run. An example of why the models need to be replaced is when Luke does a strafing run - it looks really bad, especially when compared to the CGI dogfight scenes.

 

I should also point out that the engine colours for the fighters and the Falcon are different for the models and CGI which looks rather odd.