Prime Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch so until i have hard, concrete evidence that tells me otherwise, i will believe that palpy is not sidious From the Episode 1 DVD documantary "In the Beginning" Lucas states that he wanted Sidious to appear in this movie in the form of an hologram the same way we discovered him for the first time in the Empire Strikes Back. And since the hologram in ESB is Emperor Palpatine... On the Clones DVD commentary Lucas says quote: "We do reveal that Dooku is Darth Tyranus, he is a Sith lord and that he is in league with Darth Sidious, and Darth Sidious is pulling all the strings and everything is going just the way he wants them to go. The Emperor continues to pull the strings." Now can we please consider this dead horse beaten... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 saying that because ian plays all of them, they are the same, is stupid, because in lots of movies, an actor plays multiple roles just because palpatine is a sith doesn't mean he has to be sidious and there are many times throughout the SW galaxy in which there are multiple sith. GL said that the sith code prohibits multiple sith, but the SWU has not always abided by that code. the reason they don't allow multiple sith, is that they tend to destroy eachother. the two holograms are just clues, but they are not definitive, thus, while i will agree that there is evidence that sidious could be palpatine, i do not seeenough evidence to make me sure enough to argue the cause, or to even agree. untill i can believe beyond shadow of doubt that they are one and the same, i will continue to believe that they are two different entities. but we will not know for sure unles someone comes out and literally tells us, which i doubt will happen, or when we see the movie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpatine Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Prime On the Clones DVD commentary Lucas says quote: "We do reveal that Dooku is Darth Tyranus, he is a Sith lord and that he is in league with Darth Sidious, and Darth Sidious is pulling all the strings and everything is going just the way he wants them to go. The Emperor continues to pull the strings." Now can we please consider this dead horse beaten... Oh my god...did you read THIS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 gee mister, ever thing they could be cohorts? d***, seriously, you need to read some of peoples posts, i have stated over and over again that sidious could very well be palpys master, thus, if palpy is pulling strings, then sidious is pulling those strings, and vis-a-vers-a, they are working together, both pulling string for the same cause Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adillon Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by TK-8252 Now what, will you pull a "they're clones" argument on us? oh man ... you beat me to it, that's what i was gonna say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 WTH do they have to be clones, actors play multiple parts all the time... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannibal Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch and there are many times throughout the SW galaxy in which there are multiple sith. GL said that the sith code prohibits multiple sith, but the SWU has not always abided by that code. the reason they don't allow multiple sith, is that they tend to destroy eachother. You need to know that GL does not follow the Expanded Universe. He created the story and he has specifically stated that there are only 2 Sith at a time. In the EU Boba Fett didn't die. GL says that BF is dead. He says he didn't realize how popular BF was going to be and if he knew he would have had him go out better but he is dead. Don't count the EU as law. I read EU too and the only point where there were more than 2 sith was before Darth Bane created the law of 2. Any other evil jedi you saw were just that dark jedi created to make some EU story more interesting. As shown by GL in the first 2 movies he doesn't care what EU authors think. A couple books say that Owen Lars is Obi-Wan's brother and GL says that is not so. Who you gonna believe the creator of the story or EU authors(even if they are good). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 i'm going to believe all of them so long as their story doesn't conflict, gl says there aren't allowed to be more than two sith, he never says there can't be more than two sith at a time. gotta wait for actuall proof though, we have pretty much beaten this horse dead, nobody is bringing anything useful to this conversation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adillon Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch actors play multiple parts all the time... sure they do, you'll get no arguement here ... just look at eddie murphy in the nutty professor 2. he played the character's entire family. and although we all know ian mcdiarmid played both sidious and palpatine, i think the clone statement referred to the fact that MAYBE sidious cloned himself and infiltrated the senate in order to start the ball rolling ... not that i will go for that theory, and was being sarcastic by quoting it ... but all we're doing is speculating, which is hella fun. everybody's entitled to their opinion, but some opinions are more valid that others because of facts. we'll have to be patient and wait for may to come around to see what the real deal is, because as far as i know none of us here are GL in real life. or maybe i'm wrong ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by adillon because as far as i know none of us here are GL in real life. or maybe i'm wrong ... of course none of us are looks around suspiciously "quiet, or they will find out who i am bah, it doesn't matter, they need to find out sometime BLASHPHEMER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch but we will not know for sure unles someone comes out and literally tells us, which i doubt will happen, or when we see the movie Lucas did come out and tell us, as I indicated above. We know Sidious appears in ESB. We know that the Emperor appears in ESB. We know that the emperor is named Palpatine. So why is Palpatine not Sidious? Originally posted by Jabba The Hutt Oh my god...did you read THIS? And? Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch gee mister, ever thing they could be cohorts? No, because all the evidence (and Lucas) says otherwise. Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch seriously, you need to read some of peoples posts, i have stated over and over again that sidious could very well be palpys master, thus, if palpy is pulling strings, then sidious is pulling those strings, and vis-a-vers-a, they are working together, both pulling string for the same cause Which would make 3 Sith, which Lucas and the movies state is never the case. This quote is from an interview with George Lucas, Time magazine: "Yes. That story also has been retold. Buddha was tempted in the same way. It's all through mythology. The gods are constantly tempting. Everybody and everything. So the idea of temptation is one of the things we struggle against, and the temptation obviously is the temptation to go to the dark side. One of the themes throughout the films is that the Sith lords, when they started out thousands of years ago, embraced the dark side. They were greedy and self-centered and they all wanted to take over, so they killed each other. Eventually, there was only one left, and that one took on an apprentice. And for thousands of years, the master would teach the apprentice, the master would die, the apprentice would then teach another apprentice, become the master, and so on. But there could never be any more than two of them, because if there were, they would try to get rid of the leader, which is exactly what Vader was trying to do, and that's exactly what the Emperor was trying to do. The Emperor was trying to get rid of Vader, and Vader was trying to get rid of the Emperor. And that is the antithesis of a symbiotic relationship, in which if you do that, you become cancer, and you eventually kill the host, and everything dies." And what about Lucas saying that Sidious appears in ESB? If that isn't the emperor, why do they call him the emperor? Do they not know the difference? Does Vader have two masters now? If the the rule of two is no longer improtant, why would the emperor in ROTJ try to replace Vader with Luke? Why not keep Vader with both? Where was Sidious in ROTJ? Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch gl says there aren't allowed to be more than two sith, he never says there can't be more than two sith at a time. If there aren't allowed to be more than two Sith, how can there be more than two sith at one time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 sidious appears in ESB? gee, that doesn't sound right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palpatine Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Well if you would admit to yourself that Sidious is the Emperor/Palpatine, what is true, then he does appear in ESB, when he contacts with Vader through hologram. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch sidious appears in ESB? gee, that doesn't sound right Lucas states that he wanted Sidious to appear in this movie in the form of an hologram the same way we discovered him for the first time in the Empire Strikes Back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 pay closer attention, he says that he wants us to see sidious the same way we say palpatine, and the sidious esb thing is stupid, because that was used as evidence to prove that sid is palp, and you can't prove something by using something you are trying to prove(circular logic) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 In TPM, Sidious tells the Viceroy that he has the Senate bogged down in procedures. How could Sidious bog down the Senate if he's not in it? Maybe because he's Palpatine?! This thread is rapidly dropping my IQ. God help us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannibal Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Lieutenant, do you have the DVDs? Have you listened to the commentary? You should do that. Actually you really don't have to because it seems you've decided no matter what happens your going to believe what you've decided. GLucas himself could tell you(which he does if you listen to the commentaries) and you'd stick with you own opinion. The funny thing is you seem to be using your imagination to decide the story while others are using facts. I could do the same. I think Anakin isn't Darth Vader because they are played by 2 different actors. Also, Darth Vader can't be Luke's father because what woman would hook up with that? It's good to be stubborn. I guess. :shrugs: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant_kettch Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by TK-8252 In TPM, Sidious tells the Viceroy that he has the Senate bogged down in procedures. How could Sidious bog down the Senate if he's not in it? Maybe because he's Palpatine?! This thread is rapidly dropping my IQ. God help us... g** f****** d*****, i have said many times over, palpy could be sids apprentice, in which case, sid could control the senate through palpatine edit: and yes, i have listened to the commentaries, on all the movies, and he never explicitly says they are one and the same, i will freely believe if someone with actual knowledgeexplicitly tells me, or, if someone brings in new info, not just repeating old stuff, or, when i see ROTS, and see differently Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prime Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch pay closer attention, he says that he wants us to see sidious the same way we say palpatine I went back to the TPM DVD commentary to find exactly what Lucas said about Sidious. I quote: "Introducing Darth Sidious as a hologram is the same way that he was introduced in The Empire Strikes Back, which is the first time we actually saw him in the first three films." Is that close enough attention for you? Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch sidious appears in ESB? gee, that doesn't sound right Are you going to stand by that statement? Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch and the sidious esb thing is stupid, because that was used as evidence to prove that sid is palp, and you can't prove something by using something you are trying to prove(circular logic) How is it circular? A. We know that it is the Emperor in the ESB because he is actually called that by one of the officers when he informs Vader to make contact with him ("The Emperor commands you to contact him" or some such). B. We know Sidious is in ESB because Lucas states as much above. C. We know that the Emperor is Palpatine from numerous sources. So since Palpatine is in ESB, and Sidious is in ESB, and there is only one hologram in question in ESB... A=B=C. Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch g** f****** d*****, i have said many times over, palpy could be sids apprentice, in which case, sid could control the senate through palpatine So you are saying that there really is no Rule of Two (Maul/Sidious/Palpatine and Dooku/Sidious/Palpatine)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch i have said many times over, palpy could be sids apprentice, in which case, sid could control the senate through palpatine Cool, you just made that up from your own imagination, with no support at all. That MUST be the truth! <Insert eye-roll here> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coupes. Posted November 3, 2004 Share Posted November 3, 2004 Originally posted by Lieutenant_kettch [...]i will freely believe if someone with actual knowledge explicitly tells me, or, if someone brings in new info, not just repeating old stuff, or, when i see ROTS, and see differently So you must also think 'Puppet Yoda' from the OT and 'CG Yoda' from the Prequels are 2 different characters... I mean they look similar but not quite the same, and they don't even live on the same planet ! Also CG Yoda has a lightsaber, but Puppet Yoda only has a cane ! Di I mention they don't live on the same planet ? We haven't seen the explicit evidence that they are in fact the same... so they MUST be different characters, right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tavion Posted November 4, 2004 Author Share Posted November 4, 2004 :eek: :eek: MY VRIEND "LORD KAISEN"HAS SAD HES NOT WANNA BE FRIENDS WITH ME ANYMORE:eek: :eek: :eek: I KNOW HIM MY HOLE LIFE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nairb Notneb Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Well, if he isn’t going to be your friend over this then he has a problem. I’m sorry to hear that. You will be vindicated when episode Three comes out and you show him that you were right and that Sidious is indeed Palpatine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Originally posted by Tavion :eek: :eek: MY VRIEND "LORD KAISEN"HAS SAD HES NOT WANNA BE FRIENDS WITH ME ANYMORE:eek: :eek: :eek: I KNOW HIM MY HOLE LIFE I now declare that this thread blows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannibal Posted November 4, 2004 Share Posted November 4, 2004 Originally posted by TK-8252 I now declare that this thread blows. Ok, it has the official seal on it now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.