Amidala from Chop Shop Posted March 13, 2005 Author Share Posted March 13, 2005 Originally posted by Slider744 your reasonment on new player would be good if only the top list of server would be JA+ and no other mods or basejka servers.... this is not the cases, a new player tend to sort all the servers in its UI that come with the game to go on the server with the higher number of player and the best ping..... I know slider, you would think so. You and I and other experienced gamers sort servers by number of players or ping, but a suprising number of people, especially new players, apparently don't know they can do that. They sort servers alphabetically by name, because that is the default way they are sorted in the server browser. That's why so many servers, including your CTF server, have so many "€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€" in front of their names, trying to get to the "top of the list" alphabetically. I see questions about it from server operators in the forum that I moderate: Originally posted by Zimrann How do you get your server to appear at the top of the server list in the in-game menu of JKA. I know it is this symbol you use:€ But whenever I upload this onto my server cfg. and reset it it doesn't appear at the top of the list. Well, I just asked because some of my clan members asked for it to be at the top so they could own some noobs, just to make them feel better. Sometimes having a server at the top helps in recruiting, as some people that play JKA for the first time atually are not all lamers and noobs. Originally posted by vexir Okay it shows up now. You're right, it took half a day though. Thanks. My only concern is that its quite low on the list. I guess thats okay, But other servers with similar name are much higher. And, most of the busy "FFA" servers are running JA+ mod AND are "no laming" servers. So whether new players sort by name or by number of players, they are likely to end up on a JA+ 2.2 "no laming" server. They will go there, maybe notice a MOTD that says "No laming", or maybe not notice it, either way the new player doesn't know what "No laming" means. They start to play "Free For All" and the next thing they know: amslap-amsleep-ampunish-amslay-amtele into lava, while several people on the server say "lol" and "lol, look at that noob lamer, lol". Often they aren't even told what they did "wrong", the admins are just so eager for a chance to "feel important" (you were right on with that observation) by using their admin powers. Originally posted by Slider744 then a new player as you say learn quickly what are the server rules.... this is displayed when you enter the server... perhaps at first comen he does not know what laming is.... but he learn quickly seeing how other player are playing onthe server.... then all people who have a minimum in their brain are aware of the fact that when they come in a server whch are not their server, they have to flollow the rules of the server.... when you follow the rules you are not abused... A CTF player that plays on both of our servers, Mith, did a survey. He and some of friends went to different "honor" FFA servers and pretended to be new players who didn't know what "no laming" meant, to see what would happen to a typical new player. He described what he found here http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1731864post1731864 Originally posted by Mithie I've gotten a few of my friends to do a survey. We took the role of being new JKA players and visited about 60 FFA servers. (It was very thorough. We each went to about 5 servers.). We went in to these servers, asked(politely) some stupid questions, and killed 2 players who had sabers down. Normally, I'd hope (since this is JUST A GAME, and your character getting killed doesn't mean you're dead in real life), that people would take it less seriously and take the time to explain "no, that's called laming. Please don't do that, it disrupts our role playing and chatting session." Instead: here were the results: 22 servers kicked us without an explaination. 12 servers /amslapped, /ampunished, /amslept us around and make lewd comments, like (omg, laming fag and haha n00by lam0rz) 9 servers made snide remarks, THEN banned us. 6 servers banned us immediately without explaination. 3 servers teleported us into the lava on taspir... repeatedly while making crude remarks. 1 server called me a jew and said I should be gassed, then kicked me. Only 2 servers (thank you very much) bothered to explain to us what we were doing wrong. We apologized, and had a fun time playing there. That is what happens to new players to this game. People often say "well, if a server abuses you, go to another one". They do, and they are abused there too. And the next one, and the next, and the next, until they say "forget this" and give up, long before they get to a non-abusive server, JA+, or Movie Battles, or ForceMod, or basejka, or whatever. That's how the abusive (overwhelmingly) JA+ servers hurt basejka servers (and non-abusive JA+ servers). It hurts the game, it hurts everyone. This has been going on since Jedi Academy Mod in JK2, and JA+ just carried on where it left off. And, as you well know, players aren't abused just for "breaking rules". They are abused for beating a clan member fair-and square in a duel (that even happened to you) or FFA, for having the name "Padawan", or just because the admin is in a bad mood: Originally posted by Vicodin Members of my community have been visiting POS JA+ servers for reasons of chronicling the destruction of our game. Imagine my surprise when on my 37th server visit I happened upon a JA+ saber only server where all of its 10 members were FFAing. Yep, I couldnt believe it either. Stunned I joined the fray with the name of ANGRY JA GUNNER. This drew some rude comments but the game went on. I havent played sabers in a long time but within minutes I began climbing the leader board. When I got into the Top 3 with 5 minutes to go they began to gang up on me after one of the clanmen on the server boldly stated : 'We cant let this noob win' I didnt reply but kept going. With 5-6 players chasing me around FFA5 I drew into a tie for first. This apparently, was all they would tolerate. Some ass on the server used his admin powers to put me to sleep. Frozen in mid air I was laughed at and taunted. When I protested (very angrily with many choice phrases) the guy who put me to sleep says: 'Are you going to win tough guy? No so stfu' I finished second and the winner had the balls to say 'hahaha f***in loser' Not too suprisingly I was kicked from the server. I have seen this crap all too often. Was the admin judicious? Did the players play fair ganging up on me? Were they worried about having fun or having a rusty saberist whoop their asses at their own game? The one server out of 100 that actually has a game going on and the little whiny bitches were still concerned about their own weasley repututations than playing a game for fun. The JA+ mod makes it possible. It is because of this s**t that most legit JKA fraggers are gone. Originally posted by Knight I was once like you, im not biased at all. I used to enforce laming rules, HARD. But once I understand that this is a FIRST PERSON SHOOTER that raven inteded to be, I understood how wrong I was. You're treating us like we have a mental illness. You know, after all my time of being an a**hole admin by treating lamers like s**t, the most common responses were: " What is laming? " and " What did I do?!" the reason they asked me those questions weren't apparent back then, I just thought it was because they were noobies. And of course, after all, it was the reason. But because of that, that meant that they have never encountered a video game where there were laming rules. Originally posted by Trauma Sensei lol yes Buffy, I know exactly what you mean, ppl say admin powers are gay, but they dont see these as the only way to "enforce law" on a server, I mean you cant just tell someone "would you plz stop laming?" because they wont *believe me ive tried* heh I have also my really evil days when I get pissed at anything *i tele lamers to lava or to a locked place with a few desanns muwhahahahaha* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 *fixing* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 Amidala a sruvey means nothing .... FIrstable as you may know a survey only can mean something if first : --- you go on all servers and not just a few because to have good statistic you have to test high number of servers ---- describe exactly what you do on each server.... a new player have no skills and iwill hardly kill someone quicly i think during the survey when you come to kill someone, it is abious you are not a beginner.... it is easy to recognize a beginner in a game... secondly even a new player is not stupid.... when he see on a server that all people are only dueling and no attacking each others... even the new player is wondering to himself this is strange this is not like UT.... the new player may ask why all people are dueling and not attacking everybody..... for the one who just said i stole the code.... if you had moding skills, you should know this is impossible to steal code.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 Slider...I had to edit a few things to make it make more sense. Re-read this. Originally posted by Slider744 with all the respect i have to you, before to say wrong things, you should take time to isntall the lastest version and check all you just said... if you are speaking to me, I'm basing all of that off the version I downloaded from your site 2 days ago....the beta version. Is there a release that was put on the website since yesterday? The questions still stand. Slider. I realize this is currently beta...so I have a few things to ask. 1. Will the twirl up and get stuck for 3 seconds move be able to be CLIENT SIDE deactivated? (the one where you forward, jump, attack, near someone). I friggin hate that going off. I know there are commands to disable the other two. I tried turning everything off and I was still doing that twirl into the air move. 2. Will you be touching up on the "new" kick moves? Just seems so buggy and choppy animation right now. 3. Will you be removing the free "stun" moves everyone is currently spamming over and over and over? (he raise them in air and stab, or in duels...the single/duals kick and jump in air and come down and slice away). It REALLY removes a LOT from duels. Stuns are never a good idea. It's understandable if the other person could at least attempt to get out of the way. 4. Why was single/duals given 2 new kick moves when staff was given one? Staff was originally supposed to be the only one to even get the kick ability in the first place. I don't understand why you've taken unique things from staff and gave them to others. Flipkick was the original one. Flipkick is far more effective and very easy to spam (and exploit with pull/grip)....so what's the advantage of using staff kick? Now you're giving single/duals 2 kicks. 5. Is the "everyone can kick" move going to be balanced and given to staff only? single and duals gets two, while staff gets one. If you limit to staff only, everyone gets 1 new kick. 6. Is the "everyone can kick" move going to be changed to stop after the first kick? The 2nd kick in that move is kind of pointless. You just get stuck. How about an option to stop the move immediatly after the first kick...and an option to continue starting the 2nd kick? I know you can "somewhat" stop the 2nd kick...but you still have an unneccessary pause after the first kick. *NOTE* The alt dem I saw when I didn't have latest version. Also, the whole alt demension is just...annoying. You have people running around with it on and freaking people out because people think someone is trying to lame someone and then all hell breaks lose as everyone chases after someone who can't hurt or be hurt. How about giving alt dems a "dim" or something that shows they are in another deminsion. Also...people with it abuse it and annoy the crap out of others by swinging inside of them over and over and you have to take time just to be able to get them. Normally you can handle a lamer easy until they get bored and leave after being owned so much. and on top of that, while dueling people, sometimes they have it on for some reason and my attacks just go right through them and I still take dmg from their swings. and a bug I've found so far: Sometimes people's sabers are completely invisible, but still do damage. I've had it happen to me personally a few times, as well. Are you ever...going to make any moves that don't require you to be locked in place and unable to move for "some" reason? Also, a suggestion. How about putting grapple/jetpack under abilities to "buy" with force points? That way you don't have every single person grappling all over the place all the time like it is now. Lamers will still buy it, of coarse...but at least they'll be at a disadvantage. People jump in, lame, grapple away. Very annoying. Why was grapple even implemented in the first place? It just promotes the ability to lame risk-free. Also, it removes all map navigation skills. How about putting grapple into "merc items"...so only those with merc enabled have it? How about forcing grapple to not be instant like it is now? At least people would have the chance to stop lamers from getting away by force pushing it backwards. As it stands, most servers make the grapple instant...which lets lamers literally zip all over the place. If it's truly to map navigate...then making the grapple fire towards a wall over time wouldn't defeat the purpose. It would only make it have a weakness to use during combat. Whether or not slider stole something, you know, it doesn't matter anymore. People love "easy mode" and are attracted to JA+ because of how "easy" it is to do anything. Spam anything you want with minimal risk. No worries about force regen, no worries about missing a flipkick, no worries about getting caught laming when you can grapple away, etc... People are going to use his mod. People don't care who made it. I'm just hoping that Slider gets with it and realizes that every thing he adds needs to be balanced. That is why I bring up a lot of questions. Not to say he sucks, it's to try to make him realize that his "fun" features are extremely unbalancing. I talked to Buffy and she said all this "fun" stuff doesn't matter if it's unbalancing or not because it's "fun". Problem: What about those who find it fun to have some real fights and real skill? It's not fun for us when all the other people do is lame and grapple away. It's not fun when all people do is sweep spam since it does 180+ damage. It's not fun when people just spam butterfly since their force regen recharges instantly. It's not fun when people are running around /amhugging and /amkissing you and you can't do anything to stop it. It's not fun to have someone run up and do some lame "stun" move that you can't get away from. Fun is fine...but it has it's limits. When fun starts to overule gameplay....then your product is starting to fail. You MUST maintain a balance! Grapple for example. It wouldn't be unbalancing if you at least had the chance to let's say.....throw yoru saber and cut the cord....or people to force push it away (currently that's in BUT 90% of servers make grapple INSTANT....so it's impossible to push). If you want to balance grapple... try one of these four. 1. Give it to merc only 2. Give it delays 3. Make it destroyable 4. Have a SET amount of speed the grapple can travel to give a chance to force push it away. Flipkick....it's overpowered because there's nothing to balance it. Normally missing or messing up a flipkick would cost you precious force. In JA+, 99% of servers have insta regen so you can pull/flipkick until the day you die without risk. Heck, you can't even used a skilled-timed STAFF normal kick to kick someone off. Why? POOF they instantly vanish because of an insta grapple hook. If you're adding features, you MUST balance them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amidala from Chop Shop Posted March 13, 2005 Author Share Posted March 13, 2005 slider, as I already mentioned, there are only around 200 servers that aren't totally empty (of course the number fluctuates, but it's approximate, and even counts servers that have only bots) so if they actually went to 50 or 60 of the most active "honor FFA" servers that's a pretty representative sample. It wasn't meant to be a "scientific" survey. And it is way more evidence than simply saying "i know a lot of JA+ server where this is alll the taime real gaming and no rules of antilaming set..." and "i also see a lot of basejjka servers with hnour rules" with no names or IP addresses or any data at all to back it up. And even a new player can "kill" someone pretty quickly if the person being "lamed" just stands there, saber off, and doesn't fight back. And that's exactly what many of them do. They are so suprised that someone is attacking them, or they are so used to just crying out "stop laming!" and waiting for an admin to amslap-ampunish-amslay-amsleep-amtele the "lamer", they don't do fight back or even turn on their saber. In fact, many servers have rules forbidding "laming back" a "lamer", players are told to let the admins handle it. And by the way slider, I saw this post by *VaS*Buffy: Originally posted by Buffy the new ja+ makes it somewhat impossible to *lame* if it's being admined correctly. You see in the new ja+ you have 2 dimensions in which 1 you can have honour rules and in the other you can fight as much as you like. Even though right now it's set that the first dimension is the rules dimension and the second fight dimension. I prefer it the other way around which i suggested to Slider and he will make an option where you can pick if u prefer the rules dimension first or the fight dimension. Even though she and I are on opposite sides of the "honor" fence, I think it is significant that both of us think that the default dimension (that a new player would enter) should be the "no rules" dimension, and the alternate dimension should be the "exclusive" "rules" dimension. I know you want to make it configurable, but I hope you will listen to her since you hate listening to me (lol) and make the default setup entry dimension = no rules\competitive dimension, alternate dimension = exclusive\no laming\RPG dimension. That would minimize the amount of abuse and misunderstandings regarding new players. The alternate dimension would be the "cool people's" dimension, and the "lamers" wouldn't be allowed in and would be forced to stay "outside" until they understood and agreed to the server rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 Originally posted by Slider744 the new player may ask why all people are dueling and not attacking everybody..... Most new players don't even know how to chat. Trust me when I was a JK3Files admin, most people "caught laming" were totally clueless that rules like that could exist and didn't even know how to ask what was going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amidala from Chop Shop Posted March 13, 2005 Author Share Posted March 13, 2005 Originally posted by TK-8252 Most new players don't even know how to chat. Trust me when I was a JK3Files admin, most people "caught laming" were totally clueless that rules like that could exist and didn't even know how to ask what was going on. That's right. And is it reasonable to expect new players (kids) who don't know how to sort servers by ping or number of players, don't know how to change their name from Padawan or know how to put colors in their name (another frequently asked question), don't know what "laming" is, or even know how to chat so they can ask why they are being amslept and amslapped to know that they should open the console (another thing that many of them don't know how to do) and enter /amaltdim or /refusetele??? How would a new player know they were supposed to do that, even if they knew how to open the console?? That's why *VaS* Buffy is right, the first\initial\entry\default dimension should be the "lamer's" dimension, and the special\reserved\exclusive\no laming\"cool" dimension should be the alternate dimension. Server operators can change it if they want, but that makes the most sense as the "default" condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 RpTheHotrod when i see your long post... well you probably spent 10 min to write it... if you had spent the same time to play the lastest version of JA+, you would see that all the things you say are already made and, for several of them, since a long time... you should play more instead of spending time to write in forum and whinning about nothing for things you even didn't try.... The person i prefer in life are the one who always speak about things they don't know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 Slider..... I guess you're a moron..simply put. I'm talking about the version I downloaded TWO DAYS AGO...and again I asked if there was a new one released yesterday...and you havn't spoken up about it. So you can go shove it. I'm talking what's currently IN. I can join a server with you and show you all the numerous problems I've seen in the release I downloaded again...since you are slow...I will spell it out for you T W O D A Y S A G O so I assume it's the "latest" release...and AGAIN...I am asking if you released a "new" version yesterday. I play the game everyday, not just writing up stuff. Keep up your insults here...you won't like it. All those I posted are in the version of this file japlus_Plugin_V1.3beta2.zip is that your latest? If so...then shut the frick up until you know what you're talking about. Since you are again slow, I will REPOST what I said so you can read it again and hopefully understand. I really do not want to report it in the language a 4 year old might understand. Let's see...I guess I'll have to break this down for someone as unintelligent as you. Slider. I realize this is currently beta...so I have a few things to ask. 1. Will the twirl up and get stuck for 3 seconds move be able to be CLIENT SIDE deactivated? (the one where you forward, jump, attack, near someone). I friggin hate that going off. I know there are commands to disable the other two. I tried turning everything off and I was still doing that twirl into the air move. You have yet to answer. I have disable every single option in your mod and my guy CONTINUES to do the dumb twirl. 2. Will you be touching up on the "new" kick moves? Just seems so buggy and choppy animation right now. I am using japlus_Plugin_V1.3beta2.zip and the "new" kick moves are very buggy and choppy 3. Will you be removing the free "stun" moves everyone is currently spamming over and over and over? (he raise them in air and stab, or in duels...the single/duals kick and jump in air and come down and slice away). It REALLY removes a LOT from duels. Stuns are never a good idea. It's understandable if the other person could at least attempt to get out of the way. I am using japlus_Plugin_V1.3beta2.zip and stuns STILL exist. I am asking will you be removing them or making them at least coutner-able. You have yet to answer. 4. Why was single/duals given 2 new kick moves when staff was given one? Staff was originally supposed to be the only one to even get the kick ability in the first place. I don't understand why you've taken unique things from staff and gave them to others. Flipkick was the original one. Flipkick is far more effective and very easy to spam (and exploit with pull/grip)....so what's the advantage of using staff kick? Now you're giving single/duals 2 kicks. You have yet to answer 5. Is the "everyone can kick" move going to be balanced and given to staff only? single and duals gets two, while staff gets one. If you limit to staff only, everyone gets 1 new kick. Again, you have yet to answer 6. Is the "everyone can kick" move going to be changed to stop after the first kick? The 2nd kick in that move is kind of pointless. You just get stuck. How about an option to stop the move immediatly after the first kick...and an option to continue starting the 2nd kick? I know you can "somewhat" stop the 2nd kick...but you still have an unneccessary pause after the first kick. You have yet to answer. You still get stuck in the ground for no apparent reason...and the 2nd part of the kick is very unneccessary. *NOTE* The alt dem I saw when I didn't have latest version. Also, the whole alt demension is just...annoying. You have people running around with it on and freaking people out because people think someone is trying to lame someone and then all hell breaks lose as everyone chases after someone who can't hurt or be hurt. How about giving alt dems a "dim" or something that shows they are in another deminsion. Also...people with it abuse it and annoy the crap out of others by swinging inside of them over and over and you have to take time just to be able to get them. Normally you can handle a lamer easy until they get bored and leave after being owned so much. and on top of that, while dueling people, sometimes they have it on for some reason and my attacks just go right through them and I still take dmg from their swings. Again, this was before I installed japlus_Plugin_V1.3beta2.zip for the alt dem part. and a bug I've found so far: Sometimes people's sabers are completely invisible, but still do damage. I've had it happen to me personally a few times, as well. This is using japlus_Plugin_V1.3beta2.zip and this bug happens often. I reproduced it several times. No one else could see my saber but it did damage. Are you ever...going to make any moves that don't require you to be locked in place and unable to move for "some" reason? You have yet to answer. Also, a suggestion. How about putting grapple/jetpack under abilities to "buy" with force points? That way you don't have every single person grappling all over the place all the time like it is now. Lamers will still buy it, of coarse...but at least they'll be at a disadvantage. People jump in, lame, grapple away. Very annoying. Why was grapple even implemented in the first place? It just promotes the ability to lame risk-free. Also, it removes all map navigation skills. A suggestion. Currently your mod foolishly makes grapple a free get out of jail free card that you can use at any time you wish...WITHOUT risk. Any gaming programmer knows that this is a massive flaw in any game. How about putting grapple into "merc items"...so only those with merc enabled have it? another suggestion How about forcing grapple to not be instant like it is now? At least people would have the chance to stop lamers from getting away by force pushing it backwards. As it stands, most servers make the grapple instant...which lets lamers literally zip all over the place. If it's truly to map navigate...then making the grapple fire towards a wall over time wouldn't defeat the purpose. It would only make it have a weakness to use during combat. yet another suggestion Whether or not slider stole something, you know, it doesn't matter anymore. People love "easy mode" and are attracted to JA+ because of how "easy" it is to do anything. Spam anything you want with minimal risk. No worries about force regen, no worries about missing a flipkick, no worries about getting caught laming when you can grapple away, etc... People are going to use his mod. People don't care who made it. I'm just hoping that Slider gets with it and realizes that every thing he adds needs to be balanced. That is why I bring up a lot of questions. Not to say he sucks, it's to try to make him realize that his "fun" features are extremely unbalancing. just a fact I talked to Buffy and she said all this "fun" stuff doesn't matter if it's unbalancing or not because it's "fun". Problem: What about those who find it fun to have some real fights and real skill? It's not fun for us when all the other people do is lame and grapple away. It's not fun when all people do is sweep spam since it does 180+ damage. It's not fun when people just spam butterfly since their force regen recharges instantly. It's not fun when people are running around /amhugging and /amkissing you and you can't do anything to stop it. It's not fun to have someone run up and do some lame "stun" move that you can't get away from. another fact Fun is fine...but it has it's limits. When fun starts to overule gameplay....then your product is starting to fail. You MUST maintain a balance! Making Games 101 that you seemed to have failed Grapple for example. It wouldn't be unbalancing if you at least had the chance to let's say.....throw yoru saber and cut the cord....or people to force push it away (currently that's in BUT 90% of servers make grapple INSTANT....so it's impossible to push). If you want to balance grapple... try one of these four. 1. Give it to merc only 2. Give it delays 3. Make it destroyable 4. Have a SET amount of speed the grapple can travel to give a chance to force push it away. an example Flipkick....it's overpowered because there's nothing to balance it. Normally missing or messing up a flipkick would cost you precious force. In JA+, 99% of servers have insta regen so you can pull/flipkick until the day you die without risk. another example Heck, you can't even used a skilled-timed STAFF normal kick to kick someone off. Why? POOF they instantly vanish because of an insta grapple hook. A fact If you're adding features, you MUST balance them. Again, Making Games 101 that you seemed to have failed And cut out the noob comments about "omg omg omg play teh g4m3 n00b!" I havnt placed top 20 worldwide in jka because I don't play the game. I know what's in your mod...and I know what flaws it has. If you were smart, you'd listen instead of being an ignorant person and coming in here insulting people at LucasForums. Heck, I was in charge of working on the final JKA patch until my main coder got "unhappy" with how the community was because of your mod. If we released a patch, people would have a heart attack seeing that their exploits wouldn't work anymore and that duels would require more than just sweeping or BF spamming. If the patch was released...most of the playerbase would vanish because they've gotten so lazy playing your mod expecting to get away anytime they get into trouble by using grapple or jetpacks! 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slider Posted March 13, 2005 Share Posted March 13, 2005 just give me your MSn to test what you tell..... mine is in the readme you will find it as you downloaded the mod 2 days ago right? if you really downloaded the mod and really tested it more then 3 second, so it means the server you played is not well isntalled or is not the lastest version of the mod.... i didn't insult people this is just i am mad seeing people speaking about things they didn't tested carefully or pople bashing all the time JA+ or complaning about everything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amidala from Chop Shop Posted March 13, 2005 Author Share Posted March 13, 2005 RpTheHotrod, you are probably already aware of them, but I still feel the need to make sure you are aware of Movie Battles II and ForceMod III. Both are class-based mods that restrict jetpacks and grapples to "merc" classes, and both have reworked saber combat in different ways, with additional styles, revised blocking, etc. You are probably aware of them, but if you haven't actually tried them out, I urge you to download them and try them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Originally posted by Slider744 The person i prefer in life are the one who always speak about things they don't know Huh?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achilles87 Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Originally posted by TK-8252 Huh?? Yeah, I'm as confused as you... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Originally posted by Slider744 just give me your MSn to test what you tell..... mine is in the readme you will find it as you downloaded the mod 2 days ago right? if you really downloaded the mod and really tested it more then 3 second, so it means the server you played is not well isntalled or is not the lastest version of the mod.... i didn't insult people this is just i am mad seeing people speaking about things they didn't tested carefully or pople bashing all the time JA+ or complaning about everything Believe me, out of anyone in jka...I go through things in and out. I know what I'm talking about, and bunching people into one big group isn't a very smart thing to do. You have my MSN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop RpTheHotrod, you are probably already aware of them, but I still feel the need to make sure you are aware of Movie Battles II and ForceMod III. Both are class-based mods that restrict jetpacks and grapples to "merc" classes, and both have reworked saber combat in different ways, with additional styles, revised blocking, etc. You are probably aware of them, but if you haven't actually tried them out, I urge you to download them and try them. Movie Battles I didn't like because of the weird blocking system. As long as you have block points and hold down the block key, you can block incoming attacks....even if the incoming attacks is nowhere near your saber. Tested it a lot. I'd have someone standing AWAY from me with their saber as far as possible from me. I'd think attack and they'd magically block every single attack. I prefer to have manual blocking than a magical block bubble until you run out of "points". As for ForceMod....I REALLY liked that one. A lot of fun I still stand by the statement that Blademod (BWN) is "the" best combat mod out there at the moment. If they were to mix blademod's combat system (block rates, hitboxes, damages, force regen, etc...) and a few things from ja+ (ie RGB colors, some admin control, etc...), we would have a very good mod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nokill Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 MMMMM ForceMod III *druel* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 ok RpTheHotrod let me appologize if i speak a little rude toward you.... but when you will play on a real 2.3beta2 server using your plugin1.3beta2 that you already have you willl see that most of the things you said are already made Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Movie Battles I didn't like because of the weird blocking system. As long as you have block points and hold down the block key, you can block incoming attacks....even if the incoming attacks is nowhere near your saber. Tested it a lot. I'd have someone standing AWAY from me with their saber as far as possible from me. I'd think attack and they'd magically block every single attack. Not intending to de-rail this thread, but just want to quickly reply to this: 1. I dont' know what verison of MBII you were testing here, but it must have been a very early beta build. In all latest builds if you attack someone in the back regardless of whether their blocking or not, it should be a 1-hit kill regardless of current BP points, unless perhaps you have a very unclean hit and you've only nicked them... 2. If your attacking them within their frontal blocking arc, and their holding block then yes, if you manage to get past their saber they may still block the attack depending on their current BP level. But 2 things to consider. First is that getting past their saber drains far more BP's then hitting their saber. So you keep getting past their saber, their going to be dead pretty quickly... Secondly, in early builds we did have a system where if you got past their saber, there was no 'magical blocking' as you put it. But with the higher saber damage we have in MBII, fights were far to quick. Over in a few seconds usually... in terms of keeping duals reasonably paced, the system works well. Not to say their aren't still problems with the system - which were currently working through for the latest release - but I don't think your apprasial was that representitive of what's happenning on MBII servers at the moment. I would suggest trying the latest build... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RpTheHotrod Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 I'm more than willing to give it another try Biggest thing that bothered me was when I clearly would hit them (ie...they have their saber one way) and I go completely behind that saber, it still blocks. Like you said, it reduces their BP...but it's still annoying That's how I fight in normal FFA. I attack them in their undefended spots for a hit. ie Yes, I know they are attacking in these shots but it's the only ones I have offhand that shows how I mostly attack. Even if the are standing there trying to block, I'll go at the side and hit somewhere they arn't blocking. Timing timing and more timing...butin MB...if they hold down their magic block key, timing means nothing... Slider. I know the kicks are "in"...but what im saying....are they going to be made to look less choppy? Are you ever going to balance grapple? Also, are you going to balance the free-stun moves? Also, the kick that everyone can use, there is a big kick....then a pause, then a little kick, then a pause. What is the reason the 2nd kick is there? Also, there's an unneccessary pause in that kick where you guy just stands there afterwards. There's a few more things, but I'll show you ingame soon. I'll go through the stuff in post ingame. btw...I have "always" been a fan for non-saber combat martial arts ever since jk2. I've always been wanting to be able to give up my force powers to be able to go pure saber and martial arts combat (minus push and pull, of coarse...to prevent it). IE some stuff that most won't use because they are naturally attracted to the force powers....but some very cool extra martial arts stuff that is very useful if one bothers to become skilled with it. Why am I saying this? I dunno! Hoping maybe some martial arts hand to hand (or leg, heh) will be maybe put in someday...but needing it to be bought. That way, not everyone is running around able to do it. Heck, why not give the "new" kicks into some martial arts slot just for starters? I just woke up so I'm just throwing stuff out there that might not even make sense in an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Yes, I know they are attacking in these shots but it's the only ones I have offhand that shows how I mostly attack. Even if the are standing there trying to block, I'll go at the side and hit somewhere they arn't blocking. Timing timing and more timing...butin MB...if they hold down their magic block key, timing means nothing... Hang on Hotrod - I honestly think your disatisfaction is only coming from not understanding the MB system well enough... I assure you, timing and control are JUST as important in MB as in base jka... Like you said, it reduces their BP...but it's still annoying Do you complain when you get 'under' your opponents saber in base JKA, but they don't die, they only get shields / or health removed? ..the equivalent of a 'hit' in MB IS reducing BP! Holding block doesn't stop them getting reduced... Once BP is gone, your next hit (assuming it's clean) will be fatal - duel over! Jedi have no shields in MB, and when a saber actually hits someone - i.e. get's past their block cos their out of BP's, they will die in 1 hit ...just as base JKA rewards you for getting past their saber by knocking off their shields / health, MB rewards you for getting past their saber by reducing their blocking potential. ...once their blocking potential is gone, one hit is instant-kill (regardless of health) ...just like removing shields and health in base JKA means your opponent is dead... ...you can just as much call JKA shields and health 'magic' shields and 'magic' health, as much as call MB BP 'magic'. But you can't say MB doesn't reward timing and attacking away from the enemy's blocking saber, cos it blatently does... in fact, MB is unarguably 'better' in that regard then base JKA in one aspect - a 'back' attack does actually perform a 1-hit kill in MB, regardless of health OR BP, whereas in base JKA, back attacks are 'magically' blocked by shields and health... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slider Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 RpTheHotrod i added you MSN but i don't see you so it would be great that you show me the things your don't like on a server well installed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
razorace Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 I think it's interesting that Phunk, who hasn't been on the forums for a long time, decides to post in a thread complaining about JA+. Seems almost like a waste of a good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RenegadeOfPhunk Posted March 14, 2005 Share Posted March 14, 2005 Hey Razor ...I dont' post much these days, but I still lurk sometimes Just popped in to answer Hotrod's 'concerns'. I don't think I have much to contribute to the main topic here, it's all been said before. ...I'd listen to Amidala and co on this one Slider old boy. But I'm sure my opinon isn't gonna mean anything to you... btw Razor, I haven't forgotten what I said I'd send you. Just waiting for the B17 release. You know how it is - always takes longer than you think, but it should be on it's way to you pretty soon... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeskywalker1 Posted March 16, 2005 Share Posted March 16, 2005 Originally posted by Achilles87 Yeah, I'm as confused as you... I'm confused about half of what slider says. Slider are you from another country (besides the US, or the UK?)... I don't mean that as an unsult, I just want to know why your typing and grammar skills are so low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TK-8252 Posted March 17, 2005 Share Posted March 17, 2005 Originally posted by lukeskywalker1 I'm confused about half of what slider says. Slider are you from another country (besides the US, or the UK?)... I don't mean that as an unsult, I just want to know why your typing and grammar skills are so low. He's french. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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