Tommycat Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 And even more people watch and believe MSNBC. That would be a lie. Far fewer people watch MSDNC than Fox News. Kinda for the same reason Air America fell flat. Conservatives chose not to listen to it because all they heard was "You're stupid, heartless and evil." Liberals watch Fox so they can look for the one or two stories that have a factual error. Conservatives don't watch MSDNC to hear the next time their journalists make a backhanded comment at them, because it happens so often, they don't have to watch long enough to matter. 10 seconds after a commercial break. Okay, lets switch back to Fox. Back to the topic: Actually, I think we spend far too much time on things outside of the scope of what schools should be teaching. Reading, Writing, Mathematics, history and science. My granddad only attended up to the 4th grade(until he had to work on the farm more than attend school), and was better at math than most kids in high school today(and a fair writer too). They fill the schools with so many extraneous things that the actual learning takes a back seat to social interaction. So teachers give parents the task of teaching their kids stuff the parents have no clue on. Or they give the kids piles of homework that doesn't get done. They dumbed down the learning to the point that kids can fail the tests and still pass the course by turning in the homework(I was the opposite, I was failing classes because I refused to do homework, even though I would get 100% or more on the tests). Of course kids today have a whole bunch more distractions. TV, Video games, the intarwebz, Phones, texts, all contribute to kids not learning(no not blame, because parents are kinda to blame). Then we have the two income families. It used to be that one parent was home to help the kid with their homework(please note I am not saying go back to just stay at home moms, as I think it's possible that a guy could do it too). It would be nice if we had that again, but the proverbial genie is out of the bottle on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totenkopf Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 That would be a lie. Far fewer people watch MSDNC than Fox News. Actually, Q can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the key word in his statement is here.....as in LF. Might be the reason that mim put a qualifier on his jab from a few posts earlier. As to OP, I think that Astor is essentially right to point out that stupidity isn't exclusive to just the US.....only you mostly don't see the other countries (or at least hear about it) report on how "stupid" their own people are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mimartin Posted March 30, 2011 Author Share Posted March 30, 2011 1. I don't watch MSNBC. 2. I don't watch FalseNews to see the one or two that have factual errors per story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommycat Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 As to OP, I think that Astor is essentially right to point out that stupidity isn't exclusive to just the US.....only you mostly don't see the other countries (or at least hear about it) report on how "stupid" their own people are. Actually, we do have a pretty dumb population. Go to a high school and ask them these three questions. How many senators does the state have? What are the three branches of government? If I use a $10 bill to pay for an item that cost $6.36, how much change should I get back? Heck people are more likely to label a picture of Obama as Tiger Woods than as the president... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMaster12 Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Actually, we do have a pretty dumb population. Go to a high school and ask them these three questions. How many senators does the state have? What are the three branches of government? If I use a $10 bill to pay for an item that cost $6.36, how much change should I get back? Heck people are more likely to label a picture of Obama as Tiger Woods than as the president... Sadly I would agree with you on your astute questioning. My mom teaches second grade and half of the kids...well, let's just say my mom loves to wallow in buckets of tea when she gets home. Education here in the States is way different than it was back when my generation was just an idea. But as others have pointed out, stupidity isn't exclusive to the US. It is glamorized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommycat Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 But as others have pointed out, stupidity isn't exclusive to the US. It is glamorized. Actually, we seem to almost idolize it. We put it up on a dang pedestal. We slam the smart kids in school, and as a society tend to stigmatize those that are intellectuals, while the complete morons are raised to celebrity status.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Totenkopf Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Actually, we seem to almost idolize it. We put it up on a dang pedestal. We slam the smart kids in school, and as a society tend to stigmatize those that are intellectuals, while the complete morons are raised to celebrity status.... Snooki and Sitch come to mind (nevermind Paris Hilton, the late Anna Nicole Smith, ad nauseam...). Every society has it's stupid, we're just very open about exposing (but not sufficiently chastizing/shaming) it. @mim---noticed your smiley ( )......just figured you for taking the obligatory LF shot at Fox and its audience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediMaster12 Posted March 30, 2011 Share Posted March 30, 2011 Actually, we seem to almost idolize it. We put it up on a dang pedestal. We slam the smart kids in school, and as a society tend to stigmatize those that are intellectuals, while the complete morons are raised to celebrity status.... I agree. I thought we sunk to an all time low with reality tv series like Survivior. Seems to me that even if those are staged, it brings out the worst in people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liverandbacon Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 To be fair, I'd say that the UK is at least on par with the US when it comes to turning stupidity into celebrity. Visiting some people I know there reminded me of the trashiness of many of the newspapers, and some UK television makes Jersey Shore look positively classy. Tommycat: Someone who learned the way you did, not doing homework but still understanding the material very well, would probably prefer the UK system of education. No grades matter except tests, and by tests I pretty much mean final exams only (at least that was my experience in university, and my native friends there gave me the impression that high school worked the same way). Of course, that does mean that if you screw up on one of them, it's very hard to end with a good average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommycat Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Tommycat: Someone who learned the way you did, not doing homework but still understanding the material very well, would probably prefer the UK system of education. No grades matter except tests, and by tests I pretty much mean final exams only (at least that was my experience in university, and my native friends there gave me the impression that high school worked the same way). Of course, that does mean that if you screw up on one of them, it's very hard to end with a good average. Heh. when I was going through school, I slept through the classes until they told me it was test time. I usually already understood the material before the teacher was presenting the information. I tried AP classes, and they fell into the same trap of overloaded homework... So I got by helping my older sisters with their college level work and slept through my regular classes. I loved challenges, but the teachers were just throwing mountains of busy work at me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabretooth Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 Tommycat: Someone who learned the way you did, not doing homework but still understanding the material very well, would probably prefer the UK system of education. No grades matter except tests, and by tests I pretty much mean final exams only (at least that was my experience in university, and my native friends there gave me the impression that high school worked the same way). Of course, that does mean that if you screw up on one of them, it's very hard to end with a good average. Or alternately, India: it doesn't matter whether you get the material or not, you memorise it ("by-heart it" in Indian English) and replicate it word-for-word in the exam paper. Final exams matter only and every element of the educational institution is geared towards getting a good score on those exams, hook or crook. Studies for the 10th grade exam start two years in advance, for some entrance exams, 3 years. After school, head to a cram school where you study for 3 hours on weekdays, and 6-8 on weekends. On vacations, cram schools with the 6-8 shift everyday including weekends. Topping exams is fetishised thanks to cram schools, with your photo appearing in newspapers, on bus banners, hoardings and being gifted cars, laptops, phones and other goods. Answers are marked out on your textbooks, often dictated, cramming and memorisation is key (hence why you have people passing with flying colours, but having absorbed practically nothing). Often, sums in the question papers will be lifted as they are from the textbook, so solving textbook sums over and over to memorise them is a bright idea. Exam preparation tips are nothing short of a marathon guidebook, with instructions on time management, which questions to drop, which to solve first and so on. The course material itself will often be filled with grammatical mistakes, inaccuracies and outdated information. The better teachers may correct these on their way, but will remind you to write as per the textbook in the exam. Writing in your own words is discouraged, writing exactly as given in the textbook, with proper formatting, is a mark of brilliance. No lockers in schools and long schooldays means your schoolbags will be demonically heavy, your notebooks will be checked regularly and you will be punished for being behind in your schoolwork or not doing your homework. Corporal punishment is acceptable. Humiliation is even more acceptable. You'll see now why I thought it was endlessly amusing when Obama said he wants the American education system to be more like China's and India's. American schools look more or less utopian to Indian students: no uniforms or restrictions, emphasis on projects and problem-solving, no evil teachers or corporal punishment, lockers, etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q Posted March 31, 2011 Share Posted March 31, 2011 And even more people watch and believe MSNBC. By this I meant "In addition to". I probably should have worded it differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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