leelink Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 I would have to agree, that any tactic in the game is perfectly acceptable and can be beaten. I have fought the best pull/push backstabbers and have won against them, I have fought saber throw and pull spammers and won against them. I havent found a playing style that can consistantly beat someone, I may be taken by suprise the first 2 times, but you can bet by the third match I will have figured out what i am doing wrong and correct. We recently had a really talented pull backstabber on the jhq servers and he won and some players complained, so I joined and showed that he could be beat. I also beat him only useing nuetral forces. I didnt use absorb or heal during our match and he couldnt pull me down. I did exactly what some above suggested. I moved carefully and estimated his force power left and rolled when he did saberthrows with pulls. I didnt even backstab to beat him. So it can be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twins of Doom Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 http://jkhq.ath.cx/pushpullcounter.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadJackMcJack Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 Originally posted by NJE_Etherael The very hardest thing to counter in this entire game if you stick to saber / force powers is absorb + gunners, golan arms or rocket launcher or other explosive projectile weapons, In fact I don't even *know* a counter for that except using dark side (dark rage + blue style cuts them to ribbons in seconds far faster than they can run backward and try to kill you whilst you're pseudo invincible) Gunners: Speed + strafing like a madman. Golan Arms: Same again, although Level 3 sight will ruin their day too. Rockets/Explosives: If you see it in time, push. If you're a 56K (like me), jump like buggery and let them waste the ammo. 1) l3 pull entirely negates l3 pull *knockdown* unless your fingers are on the directional keys, +forward +back +moveleft or +moveright, yes, entirely, that means you can jump at someone without touching the dir keys at the end and you will only be vulnerable whilst your fingers are on those keys, that goes for DFA, roll, medium finisher, backsweep, *everything*. it doesn't matter which goddamn direction you're facing, what sort of momentum you approach your opponent with, nothing matters, if they keep their fingers off the dir keys they don't fall over, no, really, end of ****ing story, try it for yourself, create a server and get a friend to join it so that there are no lag issues, I'm completely right, I have tested this many times and anyone who says different is just plain wrong. So basically, you want us to stand completely still, only jumping up and down? Gonna have to move sometime. Stand still, you you can be sure that someone will hack your butt off! 2) as above, l3 push entirely negates l3 push Same again. Also, this assumes you have a full force pool. Great in duels, unlikely in any other mode. 4) if the above is really too damned hard for you to understand then QUIT BITCHING and stick to the light side of the force, you can be a complete cockwinder, jumping all over the place running back and forth and completely ignoring any passive pull / push counters and *still* not be moved even slightly. If you want to play a dark jedi, GET SKILLS. So you assume anybody using light powers is unskilled? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadJackMcJack Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 Originally posted by Twins of Doom http://jkhq.ath.cx/pushpullcounter.php Egads! You're like an over-persistent salesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twins of Doom Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 Originally posted by MadJackMcJack Egads! You're like an over-persistent salesman lol, it was related to exactly what this topic was about, so i figured i'd put it here;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJE_Etherael Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 Originally posted by MadJackMcJack Gunners: Speed + strafing like a madman. Golan Arms: Same again, although Level 3 sight will ruin their day too. Rockets/Explosives: If you see it in time, push. If you're a 56K (like me), jump like buggery and let them waste the ammo. Speed + strafing like a madman would work vs.... I can't think of any weapon that could not be adequately countered simply by running directly at them that would be helped by employing this tactic, you strafe like a madman from the golan you're still going to get hit by bouncing spam mines, rocket launcher users are going to aim for your feet or thereabouts so it doesn't matter if they hit you directly or not, and any energy based weapon is either deflected or blocked (tenloss), so what is the purpose of this tactic? What will level 3 seeing do vs golan arms? Nothing iirc, it only affects the tenloss fire, you dodge any incoming tenloss fire automatically whilst it's active. I am reasonably sure seeing does not cause your to autododge any other projectiles. Rocket launcher cooldown is far lower than force push, also, at close range (within pull range, but you can't use it because they're absorbing) there is no way you can time a force push to knock their rockets back unless they're spamming and you time the cooldown with your force push or unless you have precognition level reflexes. So basically, you want us to stand completely still, only jumping up and down? Gonna have to move sometime. Stand still, you you can be sure that someone will hack your butt off! What I usually do is maintain situational awareness, use the sounds and use your mental map of your surroundings with regards to where your opponents are, keep a note of a "danger zone" around you where you can be pulled down from, and try to keep people out of this zone unless you're in the process of actively killing them, typically what I'll do vs a charging absorber will be to simply roll away from them, you did read entirely what I said about roll being invulnerable to pull / push except for the small window whilst you're actually pressing the keys right? Same again. Also, this assumes you have a full force pool. Great in duels, unlikely in any other mode. I didn't assume that, I thought I said as long as you had enough force for one push / pull, you could counter, and your force would not be affected, not the regen, not the current, etc etc etc. if I didn't say that, I meant to say that, that's how it works, it doesn't matter about having a full force pool, keep three bars. you're safe. So you assume anybody using light powers is unskilled? Not at all, merely that as the game currently stands it is more difficult as a dark jedi, in 1.02, it was more difficult as a light jedi, in 1.02 I played as a light jedi all the time because I found it more challenging. That doesn't necessarily mean anyone that chose the dark side in 1.02 was an unskilled drainwhore spammer, nor that anyone that chooses the lightside in 1.03 is necessarily an absorb whore with a total repoirte of pull bs only.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twins of Doom Posted July 2, 2002 Share Posted July 2, 2002 actually i think the two are pretty damn close to even Drain: sure the force power drained ratios aren't as good as they used to be, but thats because you get HEALTH from it Lightning: Major Damage, do it in short bursts to counter the absorb so that they can't protect themselves from it fast enough Grip: Dropping off ledges is still possible, even though you walk instead, just stand closer to the ledge, watch out; makes you vulnerable to push/pull Dark Rage: move fast, don't take much damage, get up fast, etc Absorb: Counters all force powers and gives you force pool from their force powers..but it can be easily heard! Heal: Takes half the force pool, still good though ProtecT: Drain them, then your lightsaber will work again Mind Trick: takes 2 points for the other player to counter this, takes at least 4 for the user...works good in non duel situations such as ctf because they don't know anybody is mind tricking them the powers are balanced in my opinion: light side is defensive; dark side is offensive; neutral can be used for both Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
its420onthedot Posted July 4, 2002 Share Posted July 4, 2002 I totally jumped to the end of this thread and didn't read a lot of the replies so this might be overkill Bottom line is that the pull/push backstab/sweep can be countered. I suggest to all that enter into a fight, know how to counter this move because 99% of the ppl are doing it. Once you learn how to counter it, and once THEY see that you can counter it, then it becomes a whole other ball game. They will try to kick you now. KICK EM BACK!!!! It's pretty easy to kick someone. And if you do get kicked to the ground, dudes, you have plenty of time to jump up and miss the kill that's coming. MY SUGGESTON (and yes, I play with madskillz) If you want good clean fights, learn how to do the move yourself and counter them. Or, go to a nf duel server and stfu!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.