Best of: "What new civilization would you like?"

[jcb231]

Windu....Bespin IS a planet...the name of the city is Cloud City.

 

Cloud City is much more than a mining colony, although that is what they started out as and is their major purpose....they have their own security forces (akin to the Naboo for defense) they have major tourist destinations and their own government and so on...they are a fully functioning civilization that is run like a business.

 

And why can't a civilization be run like a business? The Trade Federation is, so are the Confeds.

 

On another note, I'm not a huge Yuzahn Vong fan, but why can't an organic civ be in a RTS game? Ever played Starcraft? The Zerg were organic and weird and fit into that game really well.

 

Also, are you against ewoks, I take it? Ewoks are one of my top four most-wanted civs.

[Darth Windu]

As i said though, cloud city isnt a civilisation! All it is, is a place for miner's to work and as a sorta 'hideout'. As for the ewoks, im not so sure about them, i just dont see how ewok's would be able to, for example, battle the Republic on Sarapin.

[jcb231]

Why is a thriving, large, powerful organization not a viable civilization for the game? It has its own distinct styles of technology and architecture, which could be extrapolated upon for the game....its probably got more raw material to work with for game developers than some of the civs currently in the game.

 

Oh, and the Ewoks could battle the Republic the same way they battled the Empire in Return of the Jedi.

[Kryllith]

I don't have a problem with "Bespin" being a civilization, though I probably wouldn't call it the "Bespin" civilization but something more generic, like The Mining Guild. And certainly, if there can be a civilization based around trade (Trade Federation) there shouldn't be any problem basing it on mining (which also constitutes trading).

 

As for the Ewoks, I think Windu's point was to focus on Serapin, not who they were fighting. The Ewoks can fight decently on Endor because it's in an environment conducive to their style of fighting (ie, lots of trees). In a barren world like Serapin, Tatoonie, or Hoth, they'd have problems...

 

Kryllith

[Lord Fergie]

the bounty hunters would be good

ugly mean loking creatures with a special ability each kind

like the rocket packs, hey even one that when he kills peole he earns money for you as he collects his bounty

[jcb231]

Yeah...Bespin civ needs a better name. However, they are not part of the mining guild...they say so in the movies. Howabout "Bespin Security" or some such?

 

Regarding Ewoks...why would they have any more problems than Gungans do on a non-water world? The game could establish Ewok civ characteristics so that they offer a balanced play option on any map. I would propose traits include fast worker creation, hunting and fishing and berry gathering bonuses, much cheaper but less powerful mech and heavy weapons units, weak air, reasonably strong troopers and fantastic mounties, great scouts with advanced scout options such as stealth, an average navy, great fish collecting units, and devious trap setting unique units. Medicine Men could also be highly effective medics that could also be used as combat units, and workers in general could have slightly stronger hand to hand combat bonuses than most civs, as all Ewoks should have hunting and fighting skills. A building stealth tech could reflect the Ewoks camoflage and hiding abilities...it could be applied to certain structures such as prefab shelters.

 

Ewoks could also have a campaign that pits them against the Marauders (seen in the Ewok movies) in an attempt to secure their lands against attack, and then follows through to some initial skermishes with the Imperials as they establish the Death Star shield base. The Marauders could be incorporated into the game in much the same way that the Trandoshan Slavers are now....as toybox units and campaign enemies. Endor animals could also be added to the mix, such as the Gorax, Condor Dragon, or Boar-Wolves. These could be placed on Endor maps to add some wildlife.

 

Ewoks

Medics=Medicine Men

Assault and Strike Mechs=variations on Ewok Battle Wagons

Mounties=Ewok Ponies

Unique Units=Trap-Setters and Yuzzums

Troopers=Ewok Warriors

Heavy Weapons=variations on Catapults and siege weapons

Navy=rafts and sailing ships with catapults and fire weapons

Air=gliders, baloons, and dirigibles

 

Above all, I think this civ would be tons of fun to play. And isn't that the whole point? Yes, the "realism" may be stretched a little, but that's already done throughout the game.

[Compa_Mighty]

You know, there are so many different races in Star Wars, but not everyone can make this game. Remember a civ for this game must have:

 

-Workers

-A Fixed economy

-Buildings

-A settled group

-Organized military with different ranks

-Defensive structures

 

Hutts, Black Sun could have this thiings made up, but they wouldn't be convincing.

 

Bounty Hunters are simply impossible.

 

Bespin..... I don't like it, cause they don't have an army just a body of police men. Anyway it could be done.

 

Yuuzhan Vong: they'd need some adaptation ti make them playable, but are a great choice.

 

Chiss, Mon Calamari, from my point of view are the two civs that stick to gameplay the most, even the Noghri and Ewoks could make it.

 

When you suggest a civ, take into account the points at the beginning of this post.

[CorranHorn328]

I'd like to see the Chiss. They are very interesting. Buy you could combine the Imperial Remnant with the Chiss. The New Republic is good, too, and I like the Peace Brigade idea. Vong are a must for an EU expansion, I must say. Mon Calamari are too. Another X-Pack without Mon Cals as a civ, and many people will be unhappy... for more ideas for civs, visit this SWGB Heaven thread:

 

http://swgb.heavengames.com/cgi-bin/forums/display.cgi?action=ct&f=1,1381,0,10

 

The Mandalorians from The Sith War could really be expanded on. Also, Hapes would be good, and so would the Bothans, I think.

[jcb231]

Why is fixed economy a requirement?

 

Anyway...Ewoks, Bespin, Mon Cals, and Hutts have all those things.

 

So the Hutt army is a group of mafia thugs....they're still highly organized. A Hutt civ would be convincing...far more so than many other proposed civs.

 

And I hate to break it to you, but the Naboo have no army either, just a band of security volunteers...says so in the movie. Therefore Bespin would be in about the same situation.

 

Bespin/Ewoks/Mon Cal/Hutts

 

Workers? Ugnaughts, Ewok Workers, Mon Cal Workers, and Droids

 

Fixed Economy? Not sure how this applies to gameplay, as the economic dealings in the game really just extend to spaceport trading and tributes, which any civ can do....so Yes, Yes, Yes, and Yes

 

Buildings? Cloud City Structures, Ewok Huts and Tree Forts, Mon Cal style Water Buildings, and Hutt Palace/Tatooine style structures

 

Settled Group? Yes, Yes, Yes, and Yes

 

Organized Military with Diff Ranks? I'm not sure how the ranks come into play as that is not a factor in the current version of GB, but all four have armies of some sort. Bespin=Security Forces, Ewoks=Ewok Army, Mon Cal=Mon Cal Army/Defense Force, Hutts=Hutt Clan Crime Organization Army

 

Defensive Structures? Cloud City Turrets, Ewok Traps and Watchtowers, Mon Cal Turrets, and Hutt Turrets

 

So basically, I'm not seeing how this limits any of my civ choices...it also doesn't eliminate Black Sun, or Yuzahn vong, or the Corellians, or New Republic, or Imperial Remnant, or many other discusssed civs. It does eliminate Chiss if you want to have anything to pull from, EU wise. Same with Noghri....the source material would be scarce indeed. While I never like to say that any civ is impossible, I do think that the Chiss and the Bounty Hunters Guild would not be good civs....too much would have to be fabricated for the game and it wouldn't feel like SW after a point. And besides, the Bounty Hunter's Guild isn't really a true civilization as they have no home bases or many of the other civ characterisitics or central leadership, in the sense of the others discussed here.

 

People downplay Ewoks because they don't like them, but they really are a well developed civ in the movies....certainly as much as the Gungans or other GB civs.

[Darth Windu]

For the Hutts

 

Workers = Jawa's, moisture farmers, droids

A Fixed economy = gambling, trade

Buildings = very unique Tatooine architecture

A settled group = Hutts, Tusken Raiders, Jawas

Organized military with different ranks = Sandpeople, bounty hunters

Defensive structures = made up for every race

[jcb231]

I don't like the idea of incorporating jawas and tuskens into the Hutts....they work better as wild people I think.

 

The Hutts have plenty of troop types shown in ROTJ. They don't need tuskens and jawas too.

[CorranSec]

Hutts shouldn't include jawas and tuskens. Where did that crazy idea come from?

I've already shown my support for Ewoks, but not over my other favorite civs.

What's the Peace Brigade?

Chiss and Bounty Hunters are the most impossible.

 

Bespin..... I put this as a favorite, but I agree, don't call it "bespin" or "cloud city". Cloud City got toppled anyway, I think. By Ninedenine. Or did they fix that?

maybe the "tibanna gas mining people.." ok maybe not.

"Bespin Security Force" is too bespin-ish. They would stay at bespin.

"Bespin Mining Guild?" what exactly did they say in the movie that showed them not as a mining guild? Anyway names can be changed, nobody said every single naboo was royalty but they're still the "Royal Naboo."

 

Imp Remnant and New Republic are.... updated versions of the Rebels and Empire. It incorporates a third time period into the GB timeline.

If New Republic vs. Rebels is weird, how about Old Republic vs. rebels!? or confederacy vs. empire!?

Reality can be stretched for gameplay reasons.

[Darth Windu]

With the Hutt's in ROTJ, there are Jawa's and Tusken Raiders in Jabba's palace, besides they are very tatooiney and the tusken could provide the troops, mounted troops etc, while you could also use the sandcrawler.

 

With the Rebels, New Republic, Empire, Imperial Remnant. This is stupid. Sorry to have to say it but i cant think of any other word that would describe it that well. Why have carbon-copies of civs already in the game? Besides, as i have said before, it should be more movie, not EU based.

[jcb231]

Windu....there are indeed jawas seen in Jabba's palace (or at least just one Jawa), but they are merely hangers-on of the court, out to scavenge and pick pockets. Jawas seem as common on Tatooine as rats on earth. They are not part of his employ. There are no Tusken Raiders in his palace and I challenge you to find proof that there are. Jabbas forces have plenty of troops and units to pull from without needing Tusken Raiders and Jawas as filler.

 

I agree that movie based civs should come before EU civs, but the New Republic is not a carbon copy of Rebels or Old Republic...it is a distinctly different civ, just as Imperial Remnant is distinctly different from Galactic Empire. To say they are the same does nothing but reveal an unfamiliarity with the source material. While I admit they're not my first choices and that I am not a huge EU expert, I know enough about them to realize how different they are, and that it's not stupid to want a different civ.

 

Oh, and CorranSec, in answer to your question...in ESB Leia asks Lando if Cloud City's part of the Mining Guild...he says no, they prefer to stay independent...or something along those lines. Also, just because every Naboo citizen is not royalty doesn't mean they don't live in a monarchy...hence they are all citizens of a crown state and their forces can rightfully be christened "Royal."

[Darth Windu]

Look, as i said adding the New Republic and Imperial Remanant to a game that already has the Rebel's and empire WILL NOT WORK. Also, the Hutt's would represent a tatooine civilisation, just as the Republic is coruscant, so why not add things like tusken raiders and Jawa's? In my opinion it would give them a more unique and tatooine feel to them.

[CorranSec]

Jcb, thankyou so very much. You took the words right out of my mouth. You're completely right. Thanks for clearing up that "mining guild" issue as well. do you have any other ideas for names for the Bespin civ?

 

Windu. Please.

The hutts are not Tatooine! I've seen about 5 hutts on tatooine! That's all the movies and EU!

Jawas and tuskens don't work with anyone. Jawas might trade, but tuskens are solitary. It's impossible to imagine them with the Hutts.

The stuff the hutts live in on Tatooine is not 'theirs'. Jabbas palace was originally the home of the B'omarr Monks. So it's the b'ommar architecture anyway.

Hutt home planet is Nal Hutta. Not even their original home planet- i think it's dead, stripped of its resources by the Hutts.

Coincedentally, right next to Nal Hutta is Nar Shadaar, a possible home of the Smugglers Union. Ahh.... campaign ideas forming already......

Read the Han Solo trilogy. Lots of hutty info in there.

Speaking of that, in those books, the hutts- at least Desiljic, which i think is jabba's clan... maybe not.... seem to work closely with the t'landa Til, eg. Teroenza, who are there fellow inhabitants of Nal Hutta.

They would be a reasonable part of the Hutts.

 

You think Imp Remnant, New Rep, Rebels and Empire is crazy? What we've already got- Old Rep, Gungans, Rebels, Empire, etc. is crazy. But everyone's dealing with it.

This has been said before.... New Rep and Imp Remnant are completely different to the Rebels and Empire. Different time period. Well, not completely different, but completely different situation.

 

Enough said. For one post anyway.

 

Edit: nobody has answered my question!

(and my post was after Jcb's. Odd. )

Anyway....

What Is The "Peace Brigade"!?

[Darth Windu]

Look, as Qui-Gon says in episode 1 'tatooine is controlled by the hutts' - there is the evidence. Also, civs are built around planets.

Republic/Empire = Coruscant

Naboo/Gungans = Naboo

Wookies = Katishak (their home)

Confederacy = Geonosis

The only ones who arent are the rebels and TF, that is why i said the hutts would be a good tatooine civ, and it should therefore include tusken raiders, bounty hunters, the hutts, and jawa's.

 

As for the Imperial Remnant/Empire, New Republic/Rebel issue, THEY ARE TOO SIMILAR. Also, the NR and IR are just slightly updated versions of the civs in the game (dont even think about arguing Republic/Empire, completely different). Also, this game should and will be MOVIE BASED and since the NR and IR dont appear, why put them in?

 

PS: reason i say movie based is everyone knows the movies, only devoted fans know EU which means there is a larger market for movie-based.

[CorranSec]

Windu. Honestly.

 

"There are jawas and Tuskens in Jabbas palace"....

 

If a Naboo was in the Reupblic (imperial) Palace, or a Gungan in Theed Palace, does that automatically mean that naboo are part of the Republic's army and the Gungans are the Naboo mounted troopers? give me a break........

 

Tatooine is one of many planets that the hutts happen to have dug their claws- err, umm, fat fleshy fingers- into.

Nal Hutta is their homeworld. It is the world they are 'based around,' so to speak.

Thousands of worlds are 'controlled by the Old Republic, Empire, New Republic,' so to speak, but that doesn't mean that they come from there.

 

On the topic of 'based around'-

Coruscant- Empire, Republic, New Republic

Naboo- Royal Naboo, Gungans

Kashyyk- (katishak? what the..) Wookies

Confederacy- soorta Geonosis I guess. The confederacy is actually the Confederacy of Independent Systems, so it's more like the Republic in that it's lots of worlds. Geonosis i don't believe is their actual 'seat of government'- it's just where there staunchest allies, the Genosians, are. I think.

Nemoidia and, sorta, Geonosis- Trade Fed.

Unlocated- Rebels, Imperial Remnant, black sun (bs maybe coruscant)

 

I could go into great detail about 'home planets', eg....

Bespin- Bespin people (unnamed)

The chissy place in Hand of Thrawn, I guess- Chiss

Nal Hutta- Hutts

Nar Shaddar, possibly- Smugglers Union

Mon Calamari- Mon Cal. duh.

 

Et cetera.

 

but the point i'm trying to make is that

Hutts

Aren't

Tatooine!

[jcb231]

Windu, do you even read posts before you reply?

 

I have said many many times that I think movie civs should come first, but AFTER the movie civs were added I would have no problems with adding in New Republic, Imperial Remnant, Smugglers Union, etc.

And regarding Imperial Remnant/Empire and New Republic/Rebels.....THEY ARE NOT TOO SIMILAR!!!!!...I scream for the eight billionth time....

The New Republic is as different from the Rebels as the Old Republic is from the Empire, likewise with the Imperial Remnant and Empire. So yes, I am going to argue it that way, because its the logical way to argue it. Yes, I agree that your average gamer doesn't have a huge familarity with non-movie civs, but I have clearly said that EU civs would be reasonable to add only after movie civs were dealt with, as a way of further expanding the civs in the game. Also, Wookies as shown in GB ARE an EU civ.... Besides a couple Wookie senators that appeared in Ep I, only one Wookie appeared in the movies, and no elements of his civilization appeared at all.

 

Also, CorranSec AND Windu (weird, never thought I'd lump the two of you together) civs do not need to be based around a planet at all...Trade Federation isn't really, neither is Confederacy...they take up many worlds. Even the Republic and the Empire are only capitalled on Coruscant, not totally based around it.

 

Oh....and I have no clue what the Peace Brigade is, by the way.

[jcb231]

NO....jeez.

Tuskens and Jawas are not part of the Hutt organization, any more than stormtroopers are part of the gungans. Convenient how you ignore any points made previous to your post.

 

Hutts are not a Tatooine exclusive civ....that's just a good choice for their architectural style, as they live and work in those types of buildings and seem to like them. Tatooine is not the Hutt homeworld at all, just a planet they control to some extent.

Republic isn't just a Coruscant civ....it is a GALACTIC republic.

 

And why wouldn't adding two completely different civ from Rebels and Empire to the game work? For the millionth time, New Rep and Imperial Remnant are completely different from Rebels and Empire. As different as Republic is from Empire or Trade Federation is from Confederacy.

 

EDIT: Why, no matter how many posts are added, does this post seem to keep being the most recent? Weird.

[CorranSec]

Yeah, jcb. I know. Planets of origin, whatever, don't have anything to do with the civ.

[Compa_Mighty]

Mon Calamari are winning the Poll, so as you may see they're the most wanted Civ

 

 

 

Edited: Sorry, I had to take a way a stupid thing I said, thanks for pointing it out CorranSec

[ibballin]

i think the jawas would be a cool idea. also im not to fimilar with all the civilizations but i think where ever darth maul comes from would be cool. a whole civilization of mauls? that would be cool

[Darth Windu]

Hutts-

-unique architecture (so i cant spell, sue me...)

-different from any other civ

-represent a very important planet is star wars (Tatooine)

-heaps of unique 'people' such as the bounties, jawas, tuskens etc

 

New Republic-

-rebel units

-rebel architecture

-overall, same as rebels

 

Imperial Remnant-

-Empire units

-Empire architecture

-overall, same as Empire

 

so i ask, why include the New Republic and Imperial Remnant, which are the same as two existing civs, where you can add completely different civs such as the Hutts, Black Sun, and Mon Calamari? (yes Compa, you convinced me its a good idea)

[CorranSec]

Eizo... maybe. I've heard of the Mandalorians. But that's a bit out of the time zone of all the GB civs existing, and it would be really odd to balance properly without it seeming weird... and is there a lot of existing material about it?

 

Windu. As jcb said. Do you even read other posts before you post?

Hutts....

- what is their architecture? Not Tatooine, certainly... we've been over this before... and i think you spelt it right... architecture...

- all civs are different. Did you not notice this?

- do NOT represent Tatooine, as this is one of many planets they control, and their homeworld, if any, is Nal Hutta

- 'unique' people... ALL civs have unique kinds of units etc, and the ones you proposed are incorrect, not Hutt if any civ, and plain crazy.

Bounties... huh? bounty hunters? why do hutts have them? everyone has bounty hunters......

Jawas... we've been over this before! Hutts are not Tatooine, Jawas would not form an organised fighting force, let alone work with the hutts.

Tuskens!?

Same thing! Hutts are not Tatooine, Tuskens (though they may fight together) would fight against the Hutts if anything, and would definitely not work for them in the slightest, let alone take orders from them.

 

 

New Rep-

- NOT rebel units, an example could be having the E-Wing as a fighter, different troops (many possibilities there), R5s as workers (real R5s not r2s named r5s), more varied and different looking Jedi, if Jedi are ever modified, Mon Cal or some kind of cruiser for the Air Cruiser, some kind of SoroSuub ship or a K-Wing for the bomber, maybe Quarren-ish ships (this is assuming Mon Cal is not a civ), any new kinds of mechs (the Rebel ones aren't canon anyway, as far as I know)... etc.

- NOT rebel architecture, more like Coruscant-ish, Old Rep architecture if like anything, could incorporate architecture from all the different cultures in the New Rep as according to what building produces.. eg. Sullustan looking airbase (for SoroSuub production), Quarren shipyard.... etc.

Overall, unless Windu completely ignores this post, nobody can deny that the New Republic has major differences to both the Rebels and the Old Republic.

 

Imp Remnant-

- NOT empire units, an example could be having the Assault Gunboat as a fighter, guys that look like the Commandos/Officers out of JK2 as troopers, differently designed Mechs, Ships, everything else... LA can think of anything!

- NOT empire architecture, it would be more of the 'guerrila warfare' look of the original Rebel architecture, if anything.

Overall, unless Windu completely ignores this post... you know the drill.